Is this legal? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Is this legal? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Daehan
08-10-07, 03:39 PM I am trying to make a pure fighter and want to know if this combo is legal.

Overpowering Attack to activate Driving attack? Also having combat reflexes and defensive sweep.

So you take a full round action to use overpowering attack, using a full round action to make a single attack then allows you to use Driving attack at which point knocks your target prone (most likely). So the poor sap has to get up, you get your AoO (which still deals double damage from overpowering attack). So now this guy used a move action to stand up, he now can attack, or move away. If he attacks, then you get to make a defensive sweep dealing double damage again from overpowering attack, or if he moves, you get another AoO (again dealing double damage).

So, if this works, you pretty much shut one target down and will likely get 3 attacks against them all at double damage?

Oh, but to get to the guy I'd first shield slam them as part of a charge, hopefully dazing them and the next round initiate the overpowering attack and driving attack madness.

Will this work?
tarkin
08-10-07, 04:52 PM The feat Driving Attack from the PHBII requires you to use a a full round action to do it.

So no you can not do another full round action to then initate it via a single attack.

Not sure about the rules for Overpowering attack, but that seems not possible to combine with Driving Attack from the PHBII.

P.S. It is better to specifically mention when discussing stances/maneuvers etc. so that people know exactly what you are talking about, instead of lookign for feats.
Daehan
08-10-07, 05:52 PM Without quoting Driving attack, nowhere does it state that driving attack is a full round action or any action at all. It simply says that if you use a full round action to make a single melee attack, that you can then do the driving attack portion.

Since overpowering attack is a full round action in which you make a single attack, I would say that then activates driving attack.

It seems to fit into the three alternate fighter abilities, since those are all full round actions to make a single attack. Otherwise, are you just going to say that you want to drag out an attack that is a standard action to make it a full round action in which case then you took a full round action and can't use driving attack?
Daehan
08-10-07, 06:04 PM After reading the feats again, I'd say that this is indeed how it works. Though the only way to do this is to be a fighter of at least level 16, so I guess someone who puts that many levels into something had better get some kind of payoff.

I mean compare that combo to anything a cleric or wizard can do at level 16.
SolenVlos
08-10-07, 07:19 PM I plan to use this, taking overpowering attack next level. combining it with robilard's gambit, and deft opportunist.

having a high dex and combat reflexes, you can make as many attacks as you receive, with double damage.
...

now thinking on my character, I have a lot of doubling.

double str from Exotic weapon master
double bonus from power attack
double total damage from criticals (which is pretty often, I have 17-19/x2 and a lucky dice ritual)
and soon, double damage from overpowering attack.

I know EWM and PA both doubles with criticals, but will overpowering work too?
so on criticals, I'll triple my damage, since 2 doubles = a triple?
zorgling25
08-10-07, 07:24 PM Without quoting Driving attack, nowhere does it state that driving attack is a full round action or any action at all. It simply says that if you use a full round action to make a single melee attack, that you can then do the driving attack portion.

I think you are misinterpreting the wording of Driving Attack.
It says "If you use a full-round action to make a single melee attack...". Generally, I think this wording means that you use a special action defined by the feat to make the attack, you gain its benefit, not any time a full-round action has you make a single melee attack.
Daehan
08-10-07, 11:42 PM I'm not so sure about that, many things say for example "As a full-attack action, make such and such", Driving attack states it differently as you pointed out.

Not too mention the tremendous amount of prerequisites, for a 15th level fighter only ability, I don't see why it wouldn't work that way. If Driving attack was a full-attack action it would say so, which it doesn't.
zorgling25
08-11-07, 12:32 AM I'm not so sure about that, many things say for example "As a full-attack action, make such and such", Driving attack states it differently as you pointed out.

Not too mention the tremendous amount of prerequisites, for a 15th level fighter only ability, I don't see why it wouldn't work that way. If Driving attack was a full-attack action it would say so, which it doesn't.

Most of those abilities (maneuvers), however, didn't exist when PHB II came out. It could be that between PHB2 and ToB they found a better way to word a poorly worded mechanic, and decided to change it.
tenguroEd
08-11-07, 12:41 AM what book is overpowering attack in? this is the first time i've heard of it.
wizarddog
08-12-07, 05:55 PM So the poor sap has to get up, you get your AoO (which still deals double damage from overpowering attack). So now this guy used a move action to stand up, he now can attack, or move away.

This will probably work a few times before the Dm has creatures not getting up, feats and skill tricks to avoid AoO, or other such tactics. At 16th level the creatures have feats to burn. ;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Daehan 08-10-07, 03:39 PM	I am trying to make a pure fighter and want to know if this combo is legal. Overpowering Attack to activate Driving attack? Also having combat reflexes and defensive sweep. So you take a full round action to use overpowering attack, using a full round action to make a single attack then allows you to use Driving attack at which point knocks your target prone (most likely). So the poor sap has to get up, you get your AoO (which still deals double damage from overpowering attack). So now this guy used a move action to stand up, he now can attack, or move away. If he attacks, then you get to make a defensive sweep dealing double damage again from overpowering attack, or if he moves, you get another AoO (again dealing double damage). So, if this works, you pretty much shut one target down and will likely get 3 attacks against them all at double damage? Oh, but to get to the guy I'd first shield slam them as part of a charge, hopefully dazing them and the next round initiate the overpowering attack and driving attack madness. Will this work?
tarkin 08-10-07, 04:52 PM	The feat Driving Attack from the PHBII requires you to use a a full round action to do it. So no you can not do another full round action to then initate it via a single attack. Not sure about the rules for Overpowering attack, but that seems not possible to combine with Driving Attack from the PHBII. P.S. It is better to specifically mention when discussing stances/maneuvers etc. so that people know exactly what you are talking about, instead of lookign for feats.
Daehan 08-10-07, 05:52 PM	Without quoting Driving attack, nowhere does it state that driving attack is a full round action or any action at all. It simply says that if you use a full round action to make a single melee attack, that you can then do the driving attack portion. Since overpowering attack is a full round action in which you make a single attack, I would say that then activates driving attack. It seems to fit into the three alternate fighter abilities, since those are all full round actions to make a single attack. Otherwise, are you just going to say that you want to drag out an attack that is a standard action to make it a full round action in which case then you took a full round action and can't use driving attack?
Daehan 08-10-07, 06:04 PM	After reading the feats again, I'd say that this is indeed how it works. Though the only way to do this is to be a fighter of at least level 16, so I guess someone who puts that many levels into something had better get some kind of payoff. I mean compare that combo to anything a cleric or wizard can do at level 16.
SolenVlos 08-10-07, 07:19 PM	I plan to use this, taking overpowering attack next level. combining it with robilard's gambit, and deft opportunist. having a high dex and combat reflexes, you can make as many attacks as you receive, with double damage. ... now thinking on my character, I have a lot of doubling. double str from Exotic weapon master double bonus from power attack double total damage from criticals (which is pretty often, I have 17-19/x2 and a lucky dice ritual) and soon, double damage from overpowering attack. I know EWM and PA both doubles with criticals, but will overpowering work too? so on criticals, I'll triple my damage, since 2 doubles = a triple?
zorgling25 08-10-07, 07:24 PM	Without quoting Driving attack, nowhere does it state that driving attack is a full round action or any action at all. It simply says that if you use a full round action to make a single melee attack, that you can then do the driving attack portion. I think you are misinterpreting the wording of Driving Attack. It says "If you use a full-round action to make a single melee attack...". Generally, I think this wording means that you use a special action defined by the feat to make the attack, you gain its benefit, not any time a full-round action has you make a single melee attack.
Daehan 08-10-07, 11:42 PM	I'm not so sure about that, many things say for example "As a full-attack action, make such and such", Driving attack states it differently as you pointed out. Not too mention the tremendous amount of prerequisites, for a 15th level fighter only ability, I don't see why it wouldn't work that way. If Driving attack was a full-attack action it would say so, which it doesn't.
zorgling25 08-11-07, 12:32 AM	I'm not so sure about that, many things say for example "As a full-attack action, make such and such", Driving attack states it differently as you pointed out. Not too mention the tremendous amount of prerequisites, for a 15th level fighter only ability, I don't see why it wouldn't work that way. If Driving attack was a full-attack action it would say so, which it doesn't. Most of those abilities (maneuvers), however, didn't exist when PHB II came out. It could be that between PHB2 and ToB they found a better way to word a poorly worded mechanic, and decided to change it.
tenguroEd 08-11-07, 12:41 AM	what book is overpowering attack in? this is the first time i've heard of it.
wizarddog 08-12-07, 05:55 PM	So the poor sap has to get up, you get your AoO (which still deals double damage from overpowering attack). So now this guy used a move action to stand up, he now can attack, or move away. This will probably work a few times before the Dm has creatures not getting up, feats and skill tricks to avoid AoO, or other such tactics. At 16th level the creatures have feats to burn. ;)