Jump, skill + Dash, feat + base speed 20 = confusion [Archive] - Wizards Community

Jump, skill + Dash, feat + base speed 20 = confusion [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
sithar
03-08-07, 03:00 PM In the PHB it says "If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take a -6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet." In Complete Warrior There is a feat called Dash that gives you a 5 foot bonus to your speed if you are wearing light or no armor. My question is this. If I am a Gnome with the Dash feat wearing no armor do I take a -6 penalty, a -3 penalty or no penalty at all, to my jump check?
Silverthumb128
03-08-07, 03:13 PM You would still be counted as 20 feet for the penalty, by RAW. Although I don't see any reason why you couldn't take the -3. You could ask your DM for it, if you wanted, but as it stands, you've got to take the crummy -6.
sithar
03-08-07, 03:17 PM I'm sorry, but what does RAW stand for? :embarrass
Mindolin
03-08-07, 03:26 PM Rules As Written.
Vegepygmy
03-08-07, 03:31 PM You would still be counted as 20 feet for the penalty, by RAW.I disagree. The rule is: If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take a –6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet. If your speed is greater than 30 feet, you gain a +4 bonus for every 10 feet beyond 30 feet.

So for every 10-foot increment above or below 30, you suffer a -6 penalty or gain a +4 bonus. If your speed is 25, the number of 10-foot increments it is below 30 is zero.

Also note that if you rule that a speed of 25 is low enough to suffer the -6 penalty, a speed of 35 must be high enough to gain the +4 bonus.
jadehawk
03-08-07, 03:33 PM I disagree. The rule is: If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take a –6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet. If your speed is greater than 30 feet, you gain a +4 bonus for every 10 feet beyond 30 feet.

So for every 10-foot increment above or below 30, you suffer a -6 penalty or gain a +4 bonus. If your speed is 25, the number of 10-foot increments it is below 30 is zero.

Also note that if you rule that a speed of 25 is low enough to suffer the -6 penalty, a speed of 35 must be high enough to gain the +4 bonus.

I agree with this. RAW suggests no penalty, but logic dictates -3.
Xeviat-DM
03-08-07, 03:35 PM I've always done it as -3. Halves are important for slow encumbered races, whose speed is 15.
sithar
03-09-07, 10:52 AM I guess what all this means is that it's really up to my DM and I'll have to ask him.
Vegepygmy
03-09-07, 04:00 PM Well, that's always the case...but the rules seem pretty clear.
Goreg Skullcrusher
03-09-07, 05:56 PM I think it's pretty evident that the rules for movement penalties to Jump checks were made without the foresight of possible 5 ft gains to movement speed. I'm not 100% certain, but I believe that Dash is the first WotC printed means of changing movement speed by 5 ft, which came out after the 3.0/3.5 PHB's. Everything else was in 10 ft increments.

This is the argument I'd present to your DM. Additionally, as others have mentioned, RAW 25 ft. movement suffers no movement penalty to Jump checks.
Vegepygmy
03-09-07, 06:19 PM I think it's pretty evident that the rules for movement penalties to Jump checks were made without the foresight of possible 5 ft gains to movement speed.I don't see any evidence at all for this conclusion, especially since the PHB itself says that a creature with speed 20 and a medium or heavy encumbrance has its speed reduced to 15 (page 162).

The possibility of non-10-foot increments was clearly recognized long before Dash entered the picture.
Goreg Skullcrusher
03-09-07, 08:10 PM I don't see any evidence at all for this conclusion, especially since the PHB itself says that a creature with speed 20 and a medium or heavy encumbrance has its speed reduced to 15 (page 162).

The possibility of non-10-foot increments was clearly recognized long before Dash entered the picture.

Ah, good catch. Small characters wearing medium/heavy armor have surprisingly never come up at my gaming table.

There is the slim possibility that the game designer responsible for designing the skills wasn't the same person who dictated the above-mentioned scenario, and simply came to the same conclusion that I did; that all movement changes were plus or minus increments of 10. (I normally pride myself on my memorized rules knowledge, so this is sneak attack to the ego)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
sithar 03-08-07, 03:00 PM	In the PHB it says "If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take a -6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet." In Complete Warrior There is a feat called Dash that gives you a 5 foot bonus to your speed if you are wearing light or no armor. My question is this. If I am a Gnome with the Dash feat wearing no armor do I take a -6 penalty, a -3 penalty or no penalty at all, to my jump check?
Silverthumb128 03-08-07, 03:13 PM	You would still be counted as 20 feet for the penalty, by RAW. Although I don't see any reason why you couldn't take the -3. You could ask your DM for it, if you wanted, but as it stands, you've got to take the crummy -6.
sithar 03-08-07, 03:17 PM	I'm sorry, but what does RAW stand for? :embarrass
Mindolin 03-08-07, 03:26 PM	Rules As Written.
Vegepygmy 03-08-07, 03:31 PM	You would still be counted as 20 feet for the penalty, by RAW.I disagree. The rule is: If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take a –6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet. If your speed is greater than 30 feet, you gain a +4 bonus for every 10 feet beyond 30 feet. So for every 10-foot increment above or below 30, you suffer a -6 penalty or gain a +4 bonus. If your speed is 25, the number of 10-foot increments it is below 30 is zero. Also note that if you rule that a speed of 25 is low enough to suffer the -6 penalty, a speed of 35 must be high enough to gain the +4 bonus.
jadehawk 03-08-07, 03:33 PM	I disagree. The rule is: If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take a –6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet. If your speed is greater than 30 feet, you gain a +4 bonus for every 10 feet beyond 30 feet. So for every 10-foot increment above or below 30, you suffer a -6 penalty or gain a +4 bonus. If your speed is 25, the number of 10-foot increments it is below 30 is zero. Also note that if you rule that a speed of 25 is low enough to suffer the -6 penalty, a speed of 35 must be high enough to gain the +4 bonus. I agree with this. RAW suggests no penalty, but logic dictates -3.
Xeviat-DM 03-08-07, 03:35 PM	I've always done it as -3. Halves are important for slow encumbered races, whose speed is 15.
sithar 03-09-07, 10:52 AM	I guess what all this means is that it's really up to my DM and I'll have to ask him.
Vegepygmy 03-09-07, 04:00 PM	Well, that's always the case...but the rules seem pretty clear.
Goreg Skullcrusher 03-09-07, 05:56 PM	I think it's pretty evident that the rules for movement penalties to Jump checks were made without the foresight of possible 5 ft gains to movement speed. I'm not 100% certain, but I believe that Dash is the first WotC printed means of changing movement speed by 5 ft, which came out after the 3.0/3.5 PHB's. Everything else was in 10 ft increments. This is the argument I'd present to your DM. Additionally, as others have mentioned, RAW 25 ft. movement suffers no movement penalty to Jump checks.
Vegepygmy 03-09-07, 06:19 PM	I think it's pretty evident that the rules for movement penalties to Jump checks were made without the foresight of possible 5 ft gains to movement speed.I don't see any evidence at all for this conclusion, especially since the PHB itself says that a creature with speed 20 and a medium or heavy encumbrance has its speed reduced to 15 (page 162). The possibility of non-10-foot increments was clearly recognized long before Dash entered the picture.
Goreg Skullcrusher 03-09-07, 08:10 PM	I don't see any evidence at all for this conclusion, especially since the PHB itself says that a creature with speed 20 and a medium or heavy encumbrance has its speed reduced to 15 (page 162). The possibility of non-10-foot increments was clearly recognized long before Dash entered the picture. Ah, good catch. Small characters wearing medium/heavy armor have surprisingly never come up at my gaming table. There is the slim possibility that the game designer responsible for designing the skills wasn't the same person who dictated the above-mentioned scenario, and simply came to the same conclusion that I did; that all movement changes were plus or minus increments of 10. (I normally pride myself on my memorized rules knowledge, so this is sneak attack to the ego)