Post/Author/DateTime	Post
TheRealOrion 03-23-07, 05:08 PM	If you score a critical hit while using a lance during a charge, and employing Spirited Charge, what's the multiplier? Spirited charge grants "triple damage with a lance." Is that a x3, in which case adding another x3 would be a x5? Or is it like bonuses that don't stack? What's up with that? Feat: Spirited Charge [General] Prerequisites Ride 1 rank, Mounted Combat, Ride-By Attack. Benefit When mounted and using the charge action, you deal double damage with a melee weapon (or triple damage with a lance). Special A fighter may select Spirited Charge as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Kradlo 03-23-07, 05:19 PM	You've got the gist of it. With Spirited Charge, a lance deals triple (+200%) damage. A lance has a critical threat range of 20, and deals triple (+200%) damage on a critical hit. So, with Spirited Charge, a lance deals quintuple (+400%) damage on a critical hit. The base damage for the lance (1d8) and all numeric damage bonuses (e.g., Strength modifier, enhancement bonus to damage, weapon specialization) are tripled (or quintupled for a critical hit). Bonus damage dice will not be multiplied (e.g., magical abilities like flaming, shock, frost, holy).
FrostHammer 03-23-07, 05:27 PM	so a Cavalier, who can get quintuple the damage on a charge, who is using a Valorous lance, scores a crit, he would do...x8 damage?
TheRealOrion 03-23-07, 05:56 PM	And how do we know to apply the bonus damage separately instead of compounding it? It's not expressed, in the text, as "plus %X" (even though that would be a LOT simpler). Critical multipliers function as "+100%" or "+200%", but the language is always in terms of doubling or tripling, and the Spirited Charge text says "triple" for Lances. Therefore, it should be either x9: A x 3 x 3 = 9A or +600%: (A x 200%) x 3 = 600% What I don't see is how I'm not supposed to compound the multiplication. (Forgive my highschool math. I'm just trying to explain my confusion.)
jaelis 03-23-07, 10:28 PM	Does this help? Multiplying Sometimes a special rule makes you multiply a number or a die roll. As long as you're applying a single multiplier, multiply the number normally. When two or more multipliers apply to any abstract value (such as a modifier or a die roll), however, combine them into a single multiple, with each extra multiple adding 1 less than its value to the first multiple. Thus, a double (x2) and a double (x2) applied to the same number results in a triple (x3, because 2 + 1 = 3). For example, Tordek, a high-level dwarf fighter, deals 1d8+6 points of damage with a warhammer. On a critical hit, a warhammer deals triple damage, so that's 3d8+18 damage for Tordek. A magic dwarven thrower warhammer deals double damage (2d8+12 for Tordek) when thrown. If Tordek scores a critical hit while throwing the dwarven thrower, his player rolls quadruple damage (4d8+24) be¬cause 3 + 1 = 4. Another way to think of it is to convert the multiples into additions. Tordek's critical hit increases his damage by 2d8+12, and the dwarven thrower's doubling of damage increases his damage by 1d8+6, so both of them together increase his damage by 3d8+18 for a grand total of 4d8+24. When applying multipliers to real-world values (such as weight or distance), normal rules of math apply instead. A creature whose size doubles (thus multiplying its weight by 8) and then is turned to stone (which would multiply its weight by a factor of roughly 3) now weighs about 24 times normal, not 10 times normal. Similarly, a blinded creature attempting to negotiate difficult terrain would count each square as 4 squares (doubling the cost twice, for a total multiplier of x4), rather than as 3 squares (adding 100% twice). Source: PHB
runestar 03-23-07, 10:52 PM	In this case, should you not calculate the total damage done on a successful charge, than multiply that by your crit multiplier?:confused: