Post/Author/DateTime	Post
kcinlive 08-30-07, 12:46 PM	I'm in a champaign right now and I'm planning on trying out the Wiz3/Master Specialist 10/Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil 7 build. I was just wondering if anyone had any recommendations for what feats I should take. I'm really looking for suggestions for my two first level feats and my third level feat. Assume any WotC book is available. Thanks.
Puca 08-30-07, 01:18 PM	Well, obviously, you must take Spell Focus (abjuration) at either first or third level. You dont have to take any of the other IoS-FV feats, since MS gives them as bonus feats. With a wizard, I like to have a crafting feat and Craft Item is a good one. Collegiate Wizard is probably one of the best feats ever for the wizard, and it has to be taken at level-one. Level 1: Spell Focus (abjuration) Human Bonus: Collegiate Wizard Level 3: Craft Wondrous Item
ChosenofAzuth 08-30-07, 02:32 PM	Spellcasting Prodigy (Int) at 1st level if you can use Realms material (Player's Guide). It's that good.
The_Shaman 08-30-07, 02:41 PM	I think given your bonus to dispel checks from MS and Iof7V, eventually you can try being the dispel freak through improved counterspell and/or reactive counterspell (Faerun material iirc), possibly PHBII's Elven Spell Lore if you really want to be mean. Seriously, you end up with +9 or something to your dispel checks. Ideally, I'd look for a way to get 1 level of archmage (mastery of counterspelling, a.k.a. make them cry), but that may not be possible without taking the last level of Io7fV into epic levels. At lvl 1 and 3, it's a bit too early for itemcrafting and SF abjuration (though you need the latter for the PrC). Improved initiative might be a good option, even if it's outshined by later feats - spellcasters pack a heavy punch yet tend to be somewhat frail, and going first helps for both. Oh, and IIRC it was a prerequisite for reactive counterspell, and THAT is one badass feat for a mage-on-mage fights.
ChosenofAzuth 08-30-07, 02:48 PM	Reactive Counterspell is in a 3.0 book (Magic of Faerun). That said, I think Sorcerers are much better counterspellers than Wizards, as their spontaneous casting works greatly to their advantage. If you want a Counterspeller character, make it a Sorcerer.
Blacksworddragon 08-30-07, 02:54 PM	In what book can I find Master Specialist, Complete Mage?
The_Shaman 08-30-07, 02:57 PM	Well, with enough dispels readied and improved counterspell, you can start doing some dispeling. As for Mspecialist, yes, it is in complete mage.
kcinlive 08-30-07, 05:10 PM	Ok, Spellcasting Prodigy (Int) is amazing. Not sure if my DM'll let it through, but I'm going to try. I'll also have to see about reflective counterspell, that could be useful as well. Could be very cool at keeping enemy casters locked down. Thanks for the advise!
tiercel 08-30-07, 06:18 PM	This is just a thought, but traditional (readied-action) counterspelling is generally not very productive. If you're *not* fighting an enemy who casts spells (including enemies who use (Sp) and (Su) abilities instead), the counterspelling is not useful... and if you are fighting a powerful enemy spellcaster, you could instead be "counterspelling" him by readying something else (a Big Gob o' Damage, a barrier, etc.) which is useful in its own right as well as interrupting your enemy's spell. Yes, if you are willing to spend the feats/class abilities/spell slots/items to allow you to reactively (immediate-action) counterspell, then it can be a useful tool, but you still might want to consider how large a fraction of your likely foes actual spellcasters will represent. That, and even immediate-action counterspelling has an opportunity cost -- every time you reactively counterspell, you deny yourself the chance for other immediate actions (e.g. raising a IotSV veil or casting the higher-level improved mirror-image spell from PHB II) as well as the possibility of swift spell in the next round (which is a bigger deal with the increasing number of swift-action casting time spells in supplement books, not to mention the possibility of using Quickened spells usefully at higher levels). Let's face it, as a Master Specialist (Abjuration) / IotSV, you are pretty defense-heavy... it is probably not best to put all your eggs in one basket, given that counterspelling only works on certain kinds of foes. Diversifying slightly, even for such a specialized character, might give you and your party better results in the end.
Nightshade 08-30-07, 06:49 PM	Ok, Spellcasting Prodigy (Int) is amazing. Not sure if my DM'll let it through, but I'm going to try. Thanks for the advise! Actually, if you visit the Optimization boards, most of the Wizard creators there think that Spellcasting Prodigy sucks!!! Why? Because you can duplicate it with magic items and past a certain intelligence score, which can be reached through items and ability score adjustments, it is no longer useful. Collegiate Wizard can also be duplicated through treasure so most guys say nay to that. I'm a fan, however, because unlike spellcasting prodigy it never loses utility. I'd love to pick up 4 9th level spells rather than 2 from level 17 to 20.
zorgling25 08-30-07, 07:22 PM	Actually, if you visit the Optimization boards, most of the Wizard creators there think that Spellcasting Prodigy sucks!!! Why? Because you can duplicate it with magic items and past a certain intelligence score, which can be reached through items and ability score adjustments, it is no longer useful. This is incorrect. The reason it sucks is because it applies only to bonus spells, not to save DCs, contrary to what the table says. The actual description trumps the table, due to the primary source errata rule. Effectively, this nerfs it to being worse than Extra Spell. Spellcasting Prodigy is worthless, don't take it.
Puca 08-31-07, 10:10 AM	At lvl 1 and 3, it's a bit too early for itemcrafting and SF abjuration (though you need the latter for the PrC).I would assume that he planned on entering Master Specialist as soon as possible, at level 4. That means you have to take Spell Focus at level 1 or level 3. If you wait until level 6 to take Spell Focus, youll only have 3 levels of MS by the time you can enter IoS-FV, as opposed to 7. You cant craft a hell of a lot at level 3, but you can craft. The sooner you get the feat, the sooner you can use it. The sooner you start using it, the more you save in the long run. Just my opinion. When it comes to Collegiate Wizard, you can duplicate its effects with money and time, but by the time you are an IoS-FV 1, 11th level, the feat will have saved you over 9000 gp (at 150 gp per spell level, 50 for access and 100 to scribe.) Thats a pretty nice chunk of change, and it never stops paying off.
KnH 08-31-07, 06:20 PM	If you want to go dispelling at all, I'd be tempted to go Abjurer 5 / Master Specialist X / etc... . Why? Because of Complete Champion. An alternate class ability at 5th, 10th etc allows you to swap the feat for a granted power of one Domain. Pick the Inquisition domain for a +4 to dispel checks. For those two levels you get +3 to dispel checks over the Master Specialist, by losing one caster level (Dispel spells get capped anyway) and some stuff that isn't quite as awesome if you want to dispel stuff. But thats only if you really want to do a whole lot of dispelling.