Midnight Character R&D [Archive] - Wizards Community

Midnight Character R&D [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
TwistedShadow
03-02-08, 01:48 AM Ok everyone I need your help
I am building a character for the Midnight Campaign setting. I have alot of interesting Idea's but some of them revolve around Feats that generally require DM approval. However My DM has limited time to spend on this so he asked that I present the idea's that on the board so I could get the input of other experienced DM's and players so he can see what they have to say to help shorten his consideration.

So here is the concepts for te character which I need your help with. It is important to have a general knowledge of the Midnight champaign setting for a few of these.

Please noe that this is not for a character a first level but a 12th level Channeler character.

Ok Idea #1:
I intend for the character to have a Pseudo Dragon companion who serves as both his cohort and his familiar by using the Feats Leadership, Improved Familiar, and Dragon Cohort feats. This will allow the Pseudo Dragon to also be a 9th level Channeler in its own right. What needs consideration is that because of the background I put together i wanted the pseudo dragon to be able to easily shapechange between its normal form and two other forms one being something akin to a dragon of equivallent hit dice (about the size of horse or bear.) but it would actually be an enlarged version of her normal form. The other form would be a human form.

The idea I have for doing this was by using the feat: Spell Graft with somekind of polymorph spell
The Feat: Spell Graft is presented in Dragon 337 on page 101 and the general description is that a character gives up the ability to cast a certain spell and gains a supernatural ability based on that spell (usually of a more limited nature then the spell its based on)

Idea # 2:
The character his discovered a way to mask his spells from detection (thi has to do with the campaign setting where those who hunt magic users have special spirits much like familiars who can sense magical energy such as active spells) But I had two idea's of how to do this.
The first is to have him have a meta magic feat that does allows him to do this but at a +1 spell level
The second is to again use the Spell Graft feat but this time with a spell like dispell magic. with this version the super natural ability would allow him to turn some of his caster level to mask the spell. (ie. if he cast a spell at half his full caster level it would be undetectable while if he cast it at a slightly higher the spell could be sensed but only as a spell of the caster levels not covered by the cancelling caster levels. so for a 12th level character to cast a spell undetect he could only cast it with a caster level of 6th but if he cast it with a caster level of 7th it would be detectable as 2nd caster level spell.)

please i would really like some feedback on this

thanks
Kouk
03-02-08, 08:19 AM For a Pseudodragon Familiar/Cohort, I don't see why you would need the feat Leadership. Dragon Cohort by itself overrides Leadership, for purposes of gaining a dragon as a cohort.

Assuming the DM is willing to let you have a Familiar who is also a Cohort, just Improved Familiar and Dragon Cohort should be enough.

I don't know what your Leadership score is, but a standard Pseudodragon would start at ECL 4 according to chart 3-14 in the Draconomicon, so ECL 1 if you have the Dragon Cohort feat.

I can't comment specifically about the Spell Graft feat you are referring to, but if the DM is willing to let you do it, sure...

I'm not sure what you mean by wanting to mask your spells. Do you want your spells to be invisible, silent, etc. or do you want it so that if someone had Detect Magic on and was looking at you casting spells, they wouldn't detect anything? Or did you want it so your magical buffs only don't show, or magic items?

The main consideration is whether the DM is willing to let you circumvent one of the unique aspects of his campaign setting (as far as I am understanding this). If you want to be a spellcaster in a world which hates spellcasters, you of course would risk being discovered.

If he is fine with you making up custom things to mask your magic from detection then maybe you could just get away with some kind of lesser artifact or expensive item or something which lets you go unnoticed?

If you want to make it so magical effects do not appear magical, I would direct you to Nystul's Magic Aura, which can be cast on an item so as to have something appear to be nonmagical. Perhaps you can research a higher level version which can be cast on yourself, allowing you to not appear to be magical when inspected by Detect Magic in a similar way as Nystul's Magic Aura. I would think at least a 4th level spell would be appropriate.

However, even if you make it so your magical auras are not visible, you would still have the problem that spells tend to require Verbal, Somatic and/or Material components. If you start wiggling your fingers and chanting strange things, people will assume you are casting spells. In addition, a fireball is still going to make an explosion of fire, which would be clearly magical whether it Detected as such or not.

You can go into Metamagic feats like Still and Silent spell (or metamagic rods or other items of that kind), and get the Eschew Materials feat so you don't have to have a pouch right on you most of the time. In Cityscape I believe is a Metamagic feat called "Invisible Spell", which makes it so your spell effects are invisible to the naked eye (IIRC).

There is also a Skill Trick in Complete Scoundrel which allows you to appear as if you were not actually casting a spell when you cast a spell I believe.
TwistedShadow
03-02-08, 01:24 PM Ok the first thing is that Dragon Cohort does not in its self provide the benefits of the leadership feat but rather makes it easier to have a dragon as your cohort.

as far as the masking his spells from detection.
in the campaign setting the creatures who are used to detect the spell casters can detect the spells at ranges of miles based on the caster level of the spell. causing spell casters to cast spells at lower then their full caster level to reduce their chances of detection. magic items too have this effect where the caster level of the item determines how many miles away the ite can be sensed.

The ability I am planning would allow him to negate this range of sensing, while someone within sight of him would still be abe to tell that he is casting a spell, however things like the creatures used for sensing magic, and spells like detect magic are unable to detect the magical sgnature of sorts from his spells or any items he has crafted using this method.

It is part of his background that he has developed this ability

What i am really looking for is some arbitration on balancing so that i can present this to my DM for his consideration because he has limited time to research this to make his judgment.
Kouk
03-02-08, 06:45 PM I really disagree that Leadership is required to make use of Dragon Cohort, unless your DM is requiring it.

Dragon Cohort (at least in Draconomicon) is a general feat, with the only prerequisites being, "Character level 9th, Speak Language (Draconic)". It does not say Leadership is a required feat.

Additionally, on page 139, it says, "Alternatively, the Dragon Cohort feat (see page 104) allows you to attract a draconic cohort. In this case, you can treat the dragon's ECL as if it were 3 lower than given, allowing you to gain a more powerful dragon than with the Leadership feat...

Regardless of of which feat is used, the method by which..."

You can gain a dragon as a cohort with just the Leadership feat, but you don't get to lower its ECL. If you use Dragon Cohort instead of Leadership, you get a stronger dragon than you could with Leadership, but you don't gain any Followers.

Note that just plain Leadership allows you to get a normal PC race with full class levels, which can often be more useful than just a big old dragon as a cohort. For instance, a Wizard or Cleric cohort of high enough levels could easily be more useful than a dragon of equivalent ECL.
TwistedShadow
03-03-08, 10:24 AM Cool well that free's up a fat the :D

What ireally need now is someone to take a look at the other two issues and give me some feedback on what would be balanced or if shuc things can be balanced

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
TwistedShadow 03-02-08, 01:48 AM	Ok everyone I need your help I am building a character for the Midnight Campaign setting. I have alot of interesting Idea's but some of them revolve around Feats that generally require DM approval. However My DM has limited time to spend on this so he asked that I present the idea's that on the board so I could get the input of other experienced DM's and players so he can see what they have to say to help shorten his consideration. So here is the concepts for te character which I need your help with. It is important to have a general knowledge of the Midnight champaign setting for a few of these. Please noe that this is not for a character a first level but a 12th level Channeler character. Ok Idea #1: I intend for the character to have a Pseudo Dragon companion who serves as both his cohort and his familiar by using the Feats Leadership, Improved Familiar, and Dragon Cohort feats. This will allow the Pseudo Dragon to also be a 9th level Channeler in its own right. What needs consideration is that because of the background I put together i wanted the pseudo dragon to be able to easily shapechange between its normal form and two other forms one being something akin to a dragon of equivallent hit dice (about the size of horse or bear.) but it would actually be an enlarged version of her normal form. The other form would be a human form. The idea I have for doing this was by using the feat: Spell Graft with somekind of polymorph spell The Feat: Spell Graft is presented in Dragon 337 on page 101 and the general description is that a character gives up the ability to cast a certain spell and gains a supernatural ability based on that spell (usually of a more limited nature then the spell its based on) Idea # 2: The character his discovered a way to mask his spells from detection (thi has to do with the campaign setting where those who hunt magic users have special spirits much like familiars who can sense magical energy such as active spells) But I had two idea's of how to do this. The first is to have him have a meta magic feat that does allows him to do this but at a +1 spell level The second is to again use the Spell Graft feat but this time with a spell like dispell magic. with this version the super natural ability would allow him to turn some of his caster level to mask the spell. (ie. if he cast a spell at half his full caster level it would be undetectable while if he cast it at a slightly higher the spell could be sensed but only as a spell of the caster levels not covered by the cancelling caster levels. so for a 12th level character to cast a spell undetect he could only cast it with a caster level of 6th but if he cast it with a caster level of 7th it would be detectable as 2nd caster level spell.) please i would really like some feedback on this thanks
Kouk 03-02-08, 08:19 AM	For a Pseudodragon Familiar/Cohort, I don't see why you would need the feat Leadership. Dragon Cohort by itself overrides Leadership, for purposes of gaining a dragon as a cohort. Assuming the DM is willing to let you have a Familiar who is also a Cohort, just Improved Familiar and Dragon Cohort should be enough. I don't know what your Leadership score is, but a standard Pseudodragon would start at ECL 4 according to chart 3-14 in the Draconomicon, so ECL 1 if you have the Dragon Cohort feat. I can't comment specifically about the Spell Graft feat you are referring to, but if the DM is willing to let you do it, sure... I'm not sure what you mean by wanting to mask your spells. Do you want your spells to be invisible, silent, etc. or do you want it so that if someone had Detect Magic on and was looking at you casting spells, they wouldn't detect anything? Or did you want it so your magical buffs only don't show, or magic items? The main consideration is whether the DM is willing to let you circumvent one of the unique aspects of his campaign setting (as far as I am understanding this). If you want to be a spellcaster in a world which hates spellcasters, you of course would risk being discovered. If he is fine with you making up custom things to mask your magic from detection then maybe you could just get away with some kind of lesser artifact or expensive item or something which lets you go unnoticed? If you want to make it so magical effects do not appear magical, I would direct you to Nystul's Magic Aura, which can be cast on an item so as to have something appear to be nonmagical. Perhaps you can research a higher level version which can be cast on yourself, allowing you to not appear to be magical when inspected by Detect Magic in a similar way as Nystul's Magic Aura. I would think at least a 4th level spell would be appropriate. However, even if you make it so your magical auras are not visible, you would still have the problem that spells tend to require Verbal, Somatic and/or Material components. If you start wiggling your fingers and chanting strange things, people will assume you are casting spells. In addition, a fireball is still going to make an explosion of fire, which would be clearly magical whether it Detected as such or not. You can go into Metamagic feats like Still and Silent spell (or metamagic rods or other items of that kind), and get the Eschew Materials feat so you don't have to have a pouch right on you most of the time. In Cityscape I believe is a Metamagic feat called "Invisible Spell", which makes it so your spell effects are invisible to the naked eye (IIRC). There is also a Skill Trick in Complete Scoundrel which allows you to appear as if you were not actually casting a spell when you cast a spell I believe.
TwistedShadow 03-02-08, 01:24 PM	Ok the first thing is that Dragon Cohort does not in its self provide the benefits of the leadership feat but rather makes it easier to have a dragon as your cohort. as far as the masking his spells from detection. in the campaign setting the creatures who are used to detect the spell casters can detect the spells at ranges of miles based on the caster level of the spell. causing spell casters to cast spells at lower then their full caster level to reduce their chances of detection. magic items too have this effect where the caster level of the item determines how many miles away the ite can be sensed. The ability I am planning would allow him to negate this range of sensing, while someone within sight of him would still be abe to tell that he is casting a spell, however things like the creatures used for sensing magic, and spells like detect magic are unable to detect the magical sgnature of sorts from his spells or any items he has crafted using this method. It is part of his background that he has developed this ability What i am really looking for is some arbitration on balancing so that i can present this to my DM for his consideration because he has limited time to research this to make his judgment.
Kouk 03-02-08, 06:45 PM	I really disagree that Leadership is required to make use of Dragon Cohort, unless your DM is requiring it. Dragon Cohort (at least in Draconomicon) is a general feat, with the only prerequisites being, "Character level 9th, Speak Language (Draconic)". It does not say Leadership is a required feat. Additionally, on page 139, it says, "Alternatively, the Dragon Cohort feat (see page 104) allows you to attract a draconic cohort. In this case, you can treat the dragon's ECL as if it were 3 lower than given, allowing you to gain a more powerful dragon than with the Leadership feat... Regardless of of which feat is used, the method by which..." You can gain a dragon as a cohort with just the Leadership feat, but you don't get to lower its ECL. If you use Dragon Cohort instead of Leadership, you get a stronger dragon than you could with Leadership, but you don't gain any Followers. Note that just plain Leadership allows you to get a normal PC race with full class levels, which can often be more useful than just a big old dragon as a cohort. For instance, a Wizard or Cleric cohort of high enough levels could easily be more useful than a dragon of equivalent ECL.
TwistedShadow 03-03-08, 10:24 AM	Cool well that free's up a fat the :D What ireally need now is someone to take a look at the other two issues and give me some feedback on what would be balanced or if shuc things can be balanced