Move and still do a full attack? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Move and still do a full attack? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Highwind89
05-26-07, 09:49 PM Is there a feat that allows you to move and still do a full attack. I would actually only have to move 10 ft so I can use skirmish and still rapid shot.
glacialcat
05-26-07, 09:53 PM There's no feat I know that allows you to do this. However there are a number of ways to either gain a second five foot step, or be able to take a single 10 foot step.

Capricious Step: The 7th level Elocator ability allows you to take 2 five foot steps.

Pressing the Advantage: A 5th level White Raven Stance from Tome of Battle also allows 2 five foot steps.

A DC 40 Tumble Check allows you to make a 10 foot step as a free action. (Not sure what book this is from, but I've heard it enough to know it exists.)

1 level in Monk and the magic item Sparing Dummy of the Master allows you to take a 10 foot step instead of a five foot step.

All of these will allow you to fulfill the idea of moving 10 feet and then getting Skirmish to all arrows.
runestar
05-26-07, 11:30 PM Take a few lvs of psywarrior for hustle?:P
tui
05-26-07, 11:43 PM I'm pretty sure Pounce doesn't work with ranged attacks... since it generally requires a Charge, which only allows a melee attack. But you might want to take a look at some of the Pounce sources in the Lists of Stuff (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=662842) to see if any of them do what you want.
Lotus Crane
05-26-07, 11:51 PM Is there a feat that allows you to move and still do a full attack.
Speed Burst, from Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed/Evolved. Note that while it's from a D20 system book, it's technically not the same game as D&D, so it might be too optimistic to expect your DM to allow this.

A DC 40 Tumble Check allows you to make a 10 foot step as a free action. (Not sure what book this is from, but I've heard it enough to know it exists.)
Oriental Adventures.
arjomanes
05-27-07, 06:07 AM I'm pretty sure Pounce doesn't work with ranged attacks... since it generally requires a Charge, which only allows a melee attack. But you might want to take a look at some of the Pounce sources in the Lists of Stuff (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=662842) to see if any of them do what you want.

Just to be really stupid about it, I'll throw this out there: the charge rules don't technically say that it has to be a melee attack, so maybe in some messed-up game, one could attempt to make a ranged attack as part of the charge, taking the aoo for firing in melee. The pounce description also technically doesn't say melee attack.
Witch
05-27-07, 06:52 AM Just to be really stupid about it, I'll throw this out there: the charge rules don't technically say that it has to be a melee attack, so maybe in some messed-up game, one could attempt to make a ranged attack as part of the charge, taking the aoo for firing in melee. The pounce description also technically doesn't say melee attack.
You're right. You're really being stupid about it.
runestar
05-27-07, 07:05 AM Just to be really stupid about it, I'll throw this out there: the charge rules don't technically say that it has to be a melee attack, so maybe in some messed-up game, one could attempt to make a ranged attack as part of the charge, taking the aoo for firing in melee. The pounce description also technically doesn't say melee attack.
You know - there is a really fine line between clever rules lawyering, and just being plain ignorant. The rules for charging explicitly mentions that you are allowed to make only a melee attack at the end of a charge, so I see no way in which anyone can possibly interpret it...:rolleyes:
VrecknidjX
05-27-07, 09:10 AM The Modern rules (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd) allow this. They could be modified or brought into D&D.

Heroic Surge
Benefit: The character may take an extra move action or attack action in a round, either before or after the character’s regular actions. The character may use Heroic Surge a number of times per day depending on his or her character level (as shown below), but never more than once per round.

Character Level Times per Day
1st–4th 1
5th–8th 2
9th–12th 3
13th–16th 4
17th–20th 5

In my home campaign, I turned this into a feat that is part of a chain of feats. But, it's a pretty high-powered campaign.

Dave
SunTzuWarmaster
05-27-07, 10:02 AM Witch, there is a line between criticizing and flaming.

If your character is a spellcaster, there are a few swift action spell in the Spell Compendium that grant movement (so you could 5' step, cast a swift spell to move, and then full attack).
Witch
05-27-07, 10:08 AM Witch, there is a line between criticizing and flaming.
He said it himself, and I agreed. It's a literalistic interpretation, completely disregarding sense, along the same lines of "Hey, you don't qualify for Craft Wondrous Item, because Craft Wondrous Item requires a third level caster, and you're a fifth level caster.

And actually, it's also just plain wrong, as the rules don't allow for it (they specify you make a melee attack).

So in short:
The post declared its own stupidity.
The post disregards all sense.
The post was flat out against the rules.
The post was written just to be pedantic.

Excuse me if I don't hesitate to agree with the poster about the stupidity of his post.
Dheran
05-27-07, 12:44 PM Check out the Belt of Battle (Magic Item Compendium, page 73). You can expend 1-3 charges to get an extra move, standard, or full-round action.
Crimson_Concerto
05-27-07, 01:18 PM OH MY GOD, how in the world did the topic get so far without somebody suggesting Greater Manyshot?

Okay, listen closely. Forget about making a full attack after moving. Yes, it can be done, but it's more difficult than what I'm about to tell you. You know the Manyshot feat? The one that lets you make more than one ranged attack on a standard action? Well, the Greater Manyshot feat in the Expended Psionics Handbook allows you to add precision-based damage (e.g. Skirmish) to all of your Manyshot attacks. This is all still a standard action, and the feat is almost absurdly easy to qualify for.

GREATER MANYSHOT [GENERAL]
You are skilled at firing many arrows at once, even at different opponents.

Prerequisites: Dex 17, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, base attack bonus +6.

Benefit: When you use the Manyshot feat, you can fire each arrow at a different target instead of firing all of them at the same target. You make a separate attack roll for each arrow, regardless of whether you fire them at separate targets or the same target. Your precision-based damage applies to each arrow fired, and, if you score a critical hit with more than one of the arrows, each critical hit deals critical damage.

Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats.

Ta-da. Take Greater Manyshot, and you'll be able to take a move action and make multiple attacks, all with Skirmish damage.
utilitarian
05-27-07, 01:32 PM Well, you could take any number of mounted PrCs that allow this.

There aren't a lot of feats that allow you to make a full attack when you movie, but there are plenty that allow you to make a full attack at the end of a CHARGE, which is arguably better in a lot of situations.

Snow Tiger Berzerker Lodge for one.
Crimson_Concerto
05-27-07, 01:34 PM Well, you could take any number of mounted PrCs that allow this.Skirmish doesn't work mounted.
Linklegacy77
05-27-07, 07:38 PM My personal recommendation would be to use Hustle by taking some levels of psychic warrior. Rapid shot after should get you more attacks at a better bonus to hit than greater manyshot.
runestar
05-27-07, 10:48 PM OH MY GOD, how in the world did the topic get so far without somebody suggesting Greater Manyshot?
I am personally not a very big fan of greater manyshot. Yes, it does let you work around the limitation of skirmish somewhat, but it dilutes your combat prowess by forcing you to spread your attacks widely over many opponents. True, in this scenario, it would have been better than nothing, but that is precisely what we are trying to resolve here.:)
Ulandorf_TheBlue
05-27-07, 11:01 PM VrecknidjX, this can be done with action points in eberron with a feat (the exact title escapes me at the moment).
Fireclave
05-27-07, 11:18 PM VrecknidjX, this can be done with action points in eberron with a feat (the exact title escapes me at the moment).
Action Surge
StrongHead
05-28-07, 10:03 AM Hello, everyone! ^_^

I am personally not a very big fan of greater manyshot. Yes, it does let you work around the limitation of skirmish somewhat, but it dilutes your combat prowess by forcing you to spread your attacks widely over many opponents. True, in this scenario, it would have been better than nothing, but that is precisely what we are trying to resolve here.:)

I'm sorry, but how do you figure the attacks are forcibly spread over many opponents? The feat says "you can fire each arrow at a different target", not that you must. :)
runestar
05-28-07, 10:20 AM I'm sorry, but how do you figure the attacks are forcibly spread over many opponents? The feat says "you can fire each arrow at a different target", not that you must.
But then it defeats the purpose of using greater manyshot - to allow skirmish damage to apply to all your arrows. Either way, it still does not really work round the problem of letting you make a full attack and have skirmish apply to all your attacks.:)
Peregrine_Wolf
05-28-07, 10:32 AM You could always ask your DM if he would allow you to make up a feat that does this..... :smirk:
Lecen_of_Mitran
05-28-07, 10:43 AM Manyshot lets you attack ONE enemy with one attack.

Greater Manyshot lets you attack different enemies and each and every one of these enemies get only ONE shot. You can not use this feat to attack only one enemy or to shot more than one arrow to one enemy.
Crimson_Concerto
05-28-07, 12:51 PM runestar and Lecen_of_Mitran, I'm afraid you are both trajically mistaken. Scroll up a bit to the text of Greater Manyshot in my first post in this topic.

Nothing in the text of Greater Manyshot says you can't make more than one attack roll against a single enemy. All it says is that now all the arrows you can fire with manyshot use a different attack roll, you can apply precision-based damage to all of then, and you have the option of speading your attacks out against multiple opponents. Nothing in it suggests you MUST spread your attacks out against multiple opponents, only that you may. The feat even says, "You make a separate attack roll for each arrow, regardless of whether you fire them at separate targets or the same target." Therefore, a Scout can move, gain multiple attacks on a standard action using Greater Manyshot, direct all attacks towards one opponent, and add skirmish damage to each and every attack that hits. It's not a full attack, but it's easy to get, you don't have to multiclass to get it (losing Skirmish damage progression), and it certainly gets the job done.
runestar
05-28-07, 12:56 PM I am not listening...*LALALALA* :embarrass :embarrass :embarrass

Curse you and your flawless logic and mastery of the english language...:P
itwasntme
05-28-07, 01:13 PM OH MY GOD, how in the world did the topic get so far without somebody suggesting Greater Manyshot?

Okay, listen closely. Forget about making a full attack after moving. Yes, it can be done, but it's more difficult than what I'm about to tell you. You know the Manyshot feat? The one that lets you make more than one ranged attack on a standard action? Well, the Greater Manyshot feat in the Expended Psionics Handbook allows you to add precision-based damage (e.g. Skirmish) to all of your Manyshot attacks. This is all still a standard action, and the feat is almost absurdly easy to qualify for.

Ta-da. Take Greater Manyshot, and you'll be able to take a move action and make multiple attacks, all with Skirmish damage.

considering if your target is flat footed or w/e is req for a skirmish/sneak attack type of an attack and dosnt ignore it then yes ... though many things could ignore it

Charge must move at least 10 feet and make a melee attack

Bad thing about Many Shot is the negitive to hit ... inless its realy high its a bad negitive or is that rappid shot? Hm gotta look at it again

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Highwind89 05-26-07, 09:49 PM	Is there a feat that allows you to move and still do a full attack. I would actually only have to move 10 ft so I can use skirmish and still rapid shot.
glacialcat 05-26-07, 09:53 PM	There's no feat I know that allows you to do this. However there are a number of ways to either gain a second five foot step, or be able to take a single 10 foot step. Capricious Step: The 7th level Elocator ability allows you to take 2 five foot steps. Pressing the Advantage: A 5th level White Raven Stance from Tome of Battle also allows 2 five foot steps. A DC 40 Tumble Check allows you to make a 10 foot step as a free action. (Not sure what book this is from, but I've heard it enough to know it exists.) 1 level in Monk and the magic item Sparing Dummy of the Master allows you to take a 10 foot step instead of a five foot step. All of these will allow you to fulfill the idea of moving 10 feet and then getting Skirmish to all arrows.
runestar 05-26-07, 11:30 PM	Take a few lvs of psywarrior for hustle?:P
tui 05-26-07, 11:43 PM	I'm pretty sure Pounce doesn't work with ranged attacks... since it generally requires a Charge, which only allows a melee attack. But you might want to take a look at some of the Pounce sources in the Lists of Stuff (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=662842) to see if any of them do what you want.
Lotus Crane 05-26-07, 11:51 PM	Is there a feat that allows you to move and still do a full attack. Speed Burst, from Monte Cook's Arcana Unearthed/Evolved. Note that while it's from a D20 system book, it's technically not the same game as D&D, so it might be too optimistic to expect your DM to allow this. A DC 40 Tumble Check allows you to make a 10 foot step as a free action. (Not sure what book this is from, but I've heard it enough to know it exists.) Oriental Adventures.
arjomanes 05-27-07, 06:07 AM	I'm pretty sure Pounce doesn't work with ranged attacks... since it generally requires a Charge, which only allows a melee attack. But you might want to take a look at some of the Pounce sources in the Lists of Stuff (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=662842) to see if any of them do what you want. Just to be really stupid about it, I'll throw this out there: the charge rules don't technically say that it has to be a melee attack, so maybe in some messed-up game, one could attempt to make a ranged attack as part of the charge, taking the aoo for firing in melee. The pounce description also technically doesn't say melee attack.
Witch 05-27-07, 06:52 AM	Just to be really stupid about it, I'll throw this out there: the charge rules don't technically say that it has to be a melee attack, so maybe in some messed-up game, one could attempt to make a ranged attack as part of the charge, taking the aoo for firing in melee. The pounce description also technically doesn't say melee attack. You're right. You're really being stupid about it.
runestar 05-27-07, 07:05 AM	Just to be really stupid about it, I'll throw this out there: the charge rules don't technically say that it has to be a melee attack, so maybe in some messed-up game, one could attempt to make a ranged attack as part of the charge, taking the aoo for firing in melee. The pounce description also technically doesn't say melee attack. You know - there is a really fine line between clever rules lawyering, and just being plain ignorant. The rules for charging explicitly mentions that you are allowed to make only a melee attack at the end of a charge, so I see no way in which anyone can possibly interpret it...:rolleyes:
VrecknidjX 05-27-07, 09:10 AM	The Modern rules (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd) allow this. They could be modified or brought into D&D. Heroic Surge Benefit: The character may take an extra move action or attack action in a round, either before or after the character’s regular actions. The character may use Heroic Surge a number of times per day depending on his or her character level (as shown below), but never more than once per round. Character Level Times per Day 1st–4th 1 5th–8th 2 9th–12th 3 13th–16th 4 17th–20th 5 In my home campaign, I turned this into a feat that is part of a chain of feats. But, it's a pretty high-powered campaign. Dave
SunTzuWarmaster 05-27-07, 10:02 AM	Witch, there is a line between criticizing and flaming. If your character is a spellcaster, there are a few swift action spell in the Spell Compendium that grant movement (so you could 5' step, cast a swift spell to move, and then full attack).
Witch 05-27-07, 10:08 AM	Witch, there is a line between criticizing and flaming. He said it himself, and I agreed. It's a literalistic interpretation, completely disregarding sense, along the same lines of "Hey, you don't qualify for Craft Wondrous Item, because Craft Wondrous Item requires a third level caster, and you're a fifth level caster. And actually, it's also just plain wrong, as the rules don't allow for it (they specify you make a melee attack). So in short: The post declared its own stupidity. The post disregards all sense. The post was flat out against the rules. The post was written just to be pedantic. Excuse me if I don't hesitate to agree with the poster about the stupidity of his post.
Dheran 05-27-07, 12:44 PM	Check out the Belt of Battle (Magic Item Compendium, page 73). You can expend 1-3 charges to get an extra move, standard, or full-round action.
Crimson_Concerto 05-27-07, 01:18 PM	OH MY GOD, how in the world did the topic get so far without somebody suggesting Greater Manyshot? Okay, listen closely. Forget about making a full attack after moving. Yes, it can be done, but it's more difficult than what I'm about to tell you. You know the Manyshot feat? The one that lets you make more than one ranged attack on a standard action? Well, the Greater Manyshot feat in the Expended Psionics Handbook allows you to add precision-based damage (e.g. Skirmish) to all of your Manyshot attacks. This is all still a standard action, and the feat is almost absurdly easy to qualify for. GREATER MANYSHOT [GENERAL] You are skilled at firing many arrows at once, even at different opponents. Prerequisites: Dex 17, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, base attack bonus +6. Benefit: When you use the Manyshot feat, you can fire each arrow at a different target instead of firing all of them at the same target. You make a separate attack roll for each arrow, regardless of whether you fire them at separate targets or the same target. Your precision-based damage applies to each arrow fired, and, if you score a critical hit with more than one of the arrows, each critical hit deals critical damage. Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats. Ta-da. Take Greater Manyshot, and you'll be able to take a move action and make multiple attacks, all with Skirmish damage.
utilitarian 05-27-07, 01:32 PM	Well, you could take any number of mounted PrCs that allow this. There aren't a lot of feats that allow you to make a full attack when you movie, but there are plenty that allow you to make a full attack at the end of a CHARGE, which is arguably better in a lot of situations. Snow Tiger Berzerker Lodge for one.
Crimson_Concerto 05-27-07, 01:34 PM	Well, you could take any number of mounted PrCs that allow this.Skirmish doesn't work mounted.
Linklegacy77 05-27-07, 07:38 PM	My personal recommendation would be to use Hustle by taking some levels of psychic warrior. Rapid shot after should get you more attacks at a better bonus to hit than greater manyshot.
runestar 05-27-07, 10:48 PM	OH MY GOD, how in the world did the topic get so far without somebody suggesting Greater Manyshot? I am personally not a very big fan of greater manyshot. Yes, it does let you work around the limitation of skirmish somewhat, but it dilutes your combat prowess by forcing you to spread your attacks widely over many opponents. True, in this scenario, it would have been better than nothing, but that is precisely what we are trying to resolve here.:)
Ulandorf_TheBlue 05-27-07, 11:01 PM	VrecknidjX, this can be done with action points in eberron with a feat (the exact title escapes me at the moment).
Fireclave 05-27-07, 11:18 PM	VrecknidjX, this can be done with action points in eberron with a feat (the exact title escapes me at the moment). Action Surge
StrongHead 05-28-07, 10:03 AM	Hello, everyone! ^_^ I am personally not a very big fan of greater manyshot. Yes, it does let you work around the limitation of skirmish somewhat, but it dilutes your combat prowess by forcing you to spread your attacks widely over many opponents. True, in this scenario, it would have been better than nothing, but that is precisely what we are trying to resolve here.:) I'm sorry, but how do you figure the attacks are forcibly spread over many opponents? The feat says "you can fire each arrow at a different target", not that you must. :)
runestar 05-28-07, 10:20 AM	I'm sorry, but how do you figure the attacks are forcibly spread over many opponents? The feat says "you can fire each arrow at a different target", not that you must. But then it defeats the purpose of using greater manyshot - to allow skirmish damage to apply to all your arrows. Either way, it still does not really work round the problem of letting you make a full attack and have skirmish apply to all your attacks.:)
Peregrine_Wolf 05-28-07, 10:32 AM	You could always ask your DM if he would allow you to make up a feat that does this..... :smirk:
Lecen_of_Mitran 05-28-07, 10:43 AM	Manyshot lets you attack ONE enemy with one attack. Greater Manyshot lets you attack different enemies and each and every one of these enemies get only ONE shot. You can not use this feat to attack only one enemy or to shot more than one arrow to one enemy.
Crimson_Concerto 05-28-07, 12:51 PM	runestar and Lecen_of_Mitran, I'm afraid you are both trajically mistaken. Scroll up a bit to the text of Greater Manyshot in my first post in this topic. Nothing in the text of Greater Manyshot says you can't make more than one attack roll against a single enemy. All it says is that now all the arrows you can fire with manyshot use a different attack roll, you can apply precision-based damage to all of then, and you have the option of speading your attacks out against multiple opponents. Nothing in it suggests you MUST spread your attacks out against multiple opponents, only that you may. The feat even says, "You make a separate attack roll for each arrow, regardless of whether you fire them at separate targets or the same target." Therefore, a Scout can move, gain multiple attacks on a standard action using Greater Manyshot, direct all attacks towards one opponent, and add skirmish damage to each and every attack that hits. It's not a full attack, but it's easy to get, you don't have to multiclass to get it (losing Skirmish damage progression), and it certainly gets the job done.
runestar 05-28-07, 12:56 PM	I am not listening...LALALALA :embarrass :embarrass :embarrass Curse you and your flawless logic and mastery of the english language...:P
itwasntme 05-28-07, 01:13 PM	OH MY GOD, how in the world did the topic get so far without somebody suggesting Greater Manyshot? Okay, listen closely. Forget about making a full attack after moving. Yes, it can be done, but it's more difficult than what I'm about to tell you. You know the Manyshot feat? The one that lets you make more than one ranged attack on a standard action? Well, the Greater Manyshot feat in the Expended Psionics Handbook allows you to add precision-based damage (e.g. Skirmish) to all of your Manyshot attacks. This is all still a standard action, and the feat is almost absurdly easy to qualify for. Ta-da. Take Greater Manyshot, and you'll be able to take a move action and make multiple attacks, all with Skirmish damage. considering if your target is flat footed or w/e is req for a skirmish/sneak attack type of an attack and dosnt ignore it then yes ... though many things could ignore it Charge must move at least 10 feet and make a melee attack Bad thing about Many Shot is the negitive to hit ... inless its realy high its a bad negitive or is that rappid shot? Hm gotta look at it again