Post/Author/DateTime	Post
SpudMaster 11-27-07, 01:01 PM	Persistent spell confuses me. Is there some errata to clear it up? spells that are instantaneous are no good. and things that are discharge are no good. So is wraith strike and true strike viable persistent spells? what feat really benefits from this outside the realms of a regular stat boosters?
Danmation 11-27-07, 01:45 PM	I don't remember the stat block for true strike, but I remember wraith strike is a round/lvl spell, right? That qualifies. Persistent spell isn't too hard if you follow these rules of thumb: 1) It only affects things you can cast only on yourself 2) It only extends the time duration on an effect (to 24 hrs) Discussion: Touch spells are out. Targeted spells are out. What are in are spells that emanate from you at a fixed range or target 'YOU'. Spells with instant effects don't have a time duration. You can't extend that spell; you can't make the spell persistent. If the duration is in rounds, minutes, hours, you can make the spell persistent. If it is 'instantaneous', you can't. A tougher question is the '1 round' spell-- I'm inclined to say 'yes', but maybe that has been discussed elsewhere.
RobbyPants 11-27-07, 01:54 PM	Persistent spell confuses me. Is there some errata to clear it up? spells that are instantaneous are no good. and things that are discharge are no good. So is wraith strike and true strike viable persistent spells? what feat really benefits from this outside the realms of a regular stat boosters? Also, it only works on personal spells, so the stat boosters (Bull's Strength, Bear's Endurance, etc...) are out. Wraith Strike is an excelent candidate for this spell. All your attacks are touch attacks for a day! Power Attack for the win! One of the more popular uses of Persistant Spell is to use it in conjunction with Divine Metamagic, which allows you to forgo raising the spell's level by six levels at the cost of seven Turn Undead attempts. This allows you to persist spells above 3rd level and be able to use the feat before you normally could. Some potent choises include Divine Power and Reightoues Might. You can effectively turn yourself into a fighter for a day and have your full casting for the cost of a 4th level spell and seven turn attempts.
Danmation 11-27-07, 02:03 PM	Oy: popular but a path to broken-ness! If my cleric liked to do this, as a DM I would throw undead at my PCs all day. Or I'd just rule that you can't use Divine metamagic on a spell above 3rd level.
RobbyPants 11-27-07, 02:32 PM	Oy: popular but a path to broken-ness! If my cleric liked to do this, as a DM I would throw undead at my PCs all day. Or I'd just rule that you can't use Divine metamagic on a spell above 3rd level. Oh, I agree, it is powerful. A popular fix is similar to what you said about limiting it to 3rd level spells. You basically don't allow a spell to be affected unless the caster could normally persist it without DMM. Thus, once you can cast 6th level spells you can DMM persist a 0-level, once you can cast 7th level spells you can DMM persist a 1st level, etc... Still, for an 8th level spell slot, persistant Wraith Strike is awesome, especially for a good gish. By that point, your BAB should be high enough to Power Attack foes into oblivion.
risner 11-27-07, 04:16 PM	Persistent spell confuses me. Is there some errata to clear it up? spells that are instantaneous are no good. and things that are discharge are no good. So is wraith strike and true strike viable persistent spells? what feat really benefits from this outside the realms of a regular stat boosters? Wraithstrike is. Did you even read the spells before posting? True Strike is a discharged spell. There are hundreds of spells that are very useful for Persist.