Post/Author/DateTime	Post
spikegif 06-20-07, 05:09 PM	When power attacking with a 2-handed weapon you double your attack penalty and add that to damage. If you make a critical with that attack is your extra damage from your power attack x3 your attack penalty or x4 your attack penalty? If I power attack for 5, I do 10 extra damage. If I crit, will that extra damage be 15 (5x3) or 20 ((5x2)x2)? (If I have a x2 crit weapon)
Tony Vargas 06-20-07, 05:16 PM	Rules lawyers love this one. The damage you do when power attacking with a two-handed weapon isn't a doubling of your usual power attack damage, it's just a different ratio: 2:1 instead of 1:1. So, it's doubled just like any other not-already-multiplied damage bonus by a x2 critical. Same goes for the x1.5 STR damage - even though it's multiplying your STR mod, it's not treated like other multipliers. This little rules glitch is one reason two-handed weapons are so popular compared to weapon & shield or two-weapon fighting.
tarkin 06-20-07, 05:49 PM	1. It is doubled. Note that they are in fact affecting different things. -1 : +2 is not a doubling at all, it is a trade. Strength also is not a multiplication of the entire damage, just of a set amount of the damage. 2. The reason why people like two handed weapons is that Damage is a straight simple comparison showing the clear advantage of two handed weapon vs one handed weapon and nothing in the other hand. The benefit of sword and shield vs THW or simple one handed sword without a shield, is NOT a straight comparison - it involves thought about the benefit of the shield, including any magical powers, such as Fortification. Similarly, the benefit of two weapon fighting is not in straight weapon damage. Instead it is in enhanced ability to do other things, such as Sneak Attack, Ranger Favored enemey, Trips, Disarms, Sunders. In other words, people like two handed weapons because it is simple. If they did any thought at all, they would see that TWF is a far better strategy, despite the much larger number of feats involved.
Aryxbez 06-20-07, 05:59 PM	Answer is simple really, just double, the powerattack bonus right with the other bonuses to damage you have. Of course depending on the weapon it might be triple, if it is a weapon like a hammer or axe, or even quadruple if it is something like a Pick or the scythe.
Khatoblepas 06-20-07, 06:14 PM	.... they would see that TWF is a far better strategy, despite the much larger number of feats involved.... I didn't think it was o.O. It's less efficient unless you have a source of extra damage, like, say, Sneak Attack. At least, in my experience. Unless... A Righteous Fury Whirling Frenzy Favored Enemy variant Barb/Pally of Freedom with stalker of kharrash levels for Favored enemy (evil wizards)* wielding an keen, maiming orc-double axe? Hell yeah, that's a TWF tank. * I'm joking :P
claypigeons 06-20-07, 06:14 PM	In other words, people like two handed weapons because it is simple. If they did any thought at all, they would see that TWF is a far better strategy, despite the much larger number of feats involved. Or... people like seeing big numbers when they hit. :D :cool: Also, having two weapons enhanced is expensive (as with sword+board). It's much more cost effective (unless your DM tosses out EXACTLY what you're looking for in random treasure) to have one weapon with what you want, than it is to have two weapons (or a sword and shield, as the case may be) enhanced seperately. As a rogue or ranger (that actually gets to fight his favored enemy), two weapon fighting can be amazing (damage-wise). For anyone else, from a damage standpoint, it's not worthwhile. From doing anything tactical in combat, it is nice. But, in my experience, most people don't see the benefits of having disarmed/prone opponents, or having their weapons sundered ("But it's treasure!! :rolleyes: ) As always, your mileage may vary...
Vaelan 06-20-07, 09:47 PM	TWF is good for tripping, disarming, and sundering? Were there massive changes to the rules for said actions that I am not aware of? Disarming: The wielder of a two-handed weapon on a disarm attempt gets a +4 bonus on this roll, and the wielder of a light weapon takes a -4 penalty. You'll need every bonus you can get to disarm a worthwhile opponent. Sundering: The wielder of a two-handed weapon on a sunder attempt gets a +4 bonus on this roll, and the wielder of a light weapon takes a -4 penalty. If you beat the defender, roll damage and deal it to the weapon or shield. A worse chance of succeeding and less damage if you do succeed. Tripping: You give up reach by going with TWF, which means you aren't able to perform anything resembling battlefield control. Also, Improved Trip gives you one attack regardless of how many weapons you wield, pushing TWF even further behind.
Aryxbez 06-20-07, 10:11 PM	Two-weapon fighting with Trip is decent, as with improved trip and a weapon that trips, you could use your off-hand to trip or main hand, or even one trip with each hand. Also if you have the High sword low Axe Fighting style ( One of My favorite styles) then you can make free trip attempts if you hit with both weapons.