Profession Cook: DC Adjustments [Archive] - Wizards Community

Profession Cook: DC Adjustments [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
HolyGrenadeFrenzy
06-24-07, 01:52 AM This is about using the Profession-Cook for more than just earning income although I do hope that others leave more comments about how to spread the reputation and bring in higher pay for a great chef as well.

Now, many things leave impressions with others and affect their well being in more than one way when it comes to food; balanced diet, dinning both fine and standard, campfire delights, lover's cuisine, exploritory recipes of the finest chefs and the home cooked meal all serve their purposes and should have a variety of DC's associated with them.

Should these be compared to the Craft skills or is there a better way?

Should there be an additional Craft skill for food orientated work including the making of new and traditional entrees, meals, snacks and deserts?

Taking 10 or 20 may be appropriate on some occassions and not on others. For instance taking 10 or 20 for any kind of cook during a diner rush at a resturant should be difficult to impossible unless they make a concentration check and stick to just the one meal batch. Cooking for just one or the same meal for several may allow one to take 10 or 20 representing the time neccisary not just for cooking but also for prep time. In fact the cooking time should be figured first and then applied to an additional multiplier depending on the number of people being served and the food being prepared.

Deciding on the numbers for this is work, indeed, and at this point I am willing to listen to input of others. Now, I do have 10 years experience in the food industry from fast to fine dinning yet am not committed to any numerical absolutes about things at this point. I could still go take the tests and become a chef myself if I choose to but am busy with other things at this point.

Any ideas or references in the forums or elsewhere to assist is appreciated.

Can we demonstrate how a good meal can effect reactions with an appropriate DC?

What about when combined with Gather Information to find someones favorite foods or curiosities?

What about using cuisine to show appricaition for heroes or to make friends?

How about cooking a fine meal for some creature to aviod being eaten? Surely this technique has been used by the halfling race on numerous occasions. It has in campaigns I have been in and although from the hip with the DC success advantages it would be better if some results were worked out for other Campaigns and other gamers.

Synergy for Alchemy and Apothicary seems quite approriate for those skills from ranks in Profession Cooking but not for Profession Cooking which would serve better with a synergy benefit from Knowledge Nature and perhaps Craft Brewing and Profession Herbalist are better choices. But alas synergy bonuses may also be left out if neccisary and they are not as important to me at this point as a set of DCs are.

Scores and Effects for different consumption consequences positive and negative would be excellent.

Food can actually assist with healing in addition to relaxation which are both of important note in a RPG as well as any strategic situation be it domesticly civil, financially decisive or impendingly militant as an issue of morale for example.

How can these issues be addressed?

Thanx and best regards, I hope the next meal you eat is one you enjoy even if at the gaming table!
Kouk
06-24-07, 03:23 AM I think just some kind of Profession check would do, you don't need to make it into a Craft skill.

Gather Information should work OK for finding a person's favorite food, but that would likely have an absurdly high DC. It would probably be better to ask someone they know directly.

I'm don't think that synergy for Alchemy would work, you have to be a spellcaster to even take Alchemy, and it seems like it would be "cheating" to cook with magical substances. You might be able to produce some sort of flavor packs with Alchemy though, that grant a bonus to your cooking.

I'm not sure with Herbalism, it makes sense, but you could create many other Professions and argue that they also make sense for giving bonuses to cooking, and so might just be very circumstantial depending on what you were trying to make.

If you want to work with your DM about making cooking give bonuses the way it does in other games, that's probably fine. I can't imagine it coming up much in a normal game though. Charging Minotaurs and Giants aren't likely to let you cook for them, unless you were cooking yourself.
Neutronium_Dragon
06-24-07, 03:46 AM Making an impression on someone by cooking them a decent meal? DC A 15 Profession: Cooking check gives you a +2 Circumstance bonus on your Diplomacy check. That's simple and in keeping with the rest of the system.

The rush hour wouldn't prevent Take 10. If an angry customer came in and started waving one of your cleavers at you, fine. But just having a large workload (which is all the rush hour is - a lot of work all at once) now and then is a normal part of the job, so it won't have any impact on Take 10.

Take 20 generally isn't going to be doable with Profession in any circumstance.

It's fine to use food as a theme element in events, but by and large that's all it should be. D&D handles things abstractly; trying to develop an intricately detailed food-based subsystem is more than skills were meant to do.
HolyGrenadeFrenzy
06-24-07, 04:18 AM My interest isn't just for my DMs (Plural) or myself as a DM as well but for a reference conserning these possiblities.

I could figure it all myself (with another DM if neccisary) but I was curious about the forums possible contributions to any whom could find the thread. I have spent about 8 hours online looking at hits on the topic and found very litttle. So a few links or suggestions from someone would be appricaited.

The only way such things come up in a campaign is by strategy and design of both players and DMs alike. As a creative DM you can deny your PCs from having oppurtunity to urinate or defficate....fun times all round.
With elbow high in bodies and most of the PC's bodies covered in grime and gore but that is not a long term realism and countering monsters is only a small issue here.

But when you are already preparring food and something shows up and it is sentient enough to recognize the smell of a good meal other options could be available if some numerical basics are available. As is the "Craft Reference" is only to try and measure the quality of work unless some Culinary Craft Skill would be relevant.

By the way, I would prefer just the one skill anyway. However from a historical perspective a great cook whom can be trusted is quite valuable to the powerful, prestigious and base alike. Why kill the cook when you crave their food. Tasters for royalty is all about cooks being turned by advesaries, being adversaries or food interception and tampering. It is still an issue today. And there are things worse than poisoning.

So one cook burns the meat and it stays bloody and often people get sick from his cooking. Often this is blamed on the consumer as something they have done to offend spirits or the gods. But when a cook shows up whom makes someones "tongue slap their brains out" as the cliche goes, then their survival becomes important to others and their skills are desired greatly.

If anyone doesn't understand how this can enrich a game consider not eating anything you enjoy for a week or two but just basic rations instead. Then go eat a meal in a fine dinning establishment of your choice and eat slowly while paying attention to your food. Please, reflect on this thread then and note the following statement. See what I mean.

Here is a list I have slammed together.

Indigestion Material DC 4
Food Statis of Decomposer DC 5
Everday food Preparation or simplest of meals DC 8
Basic Meals DC 10
Decient Meal 12
Good Meal DC 15
Best local food stop DC 20
Great Meal DC 25
Fabulous Meal DC 30
Chef DC 35
Top Chef DC 40
Master Chef DC 50
Armies kill to eat this food DC 75
The gods visit this establishment DC 100
The gods wait in line llike everyone else DC 125
The gods invite you to stay with them DC 150
The gods invite you to live as one of them DC 175
A god accuses you of impersonating him and challenges you to a contest DC 200 (snicker)

But this list is by no means complete although I would suggest a second column.

Mythology has many such stories of cooks, bards, tailors, cobblers, strategists, game players, brewers, sculptors and many other proffessions in many different mythologies world wide of Earth or Terro of Sol if you will.

Neutronium Dragon has a good point and I wouldn't suggest any different about systems and sub systems. Yet a list like the one above or something less extravegant would be nice and has been done for other skills including Profession skills all over. A second skill may be or may not be neccisary. A few Prestige Classes have been made as well to this sort of affect but I haven't delved into those at this point of this thread.

As I have said and demonstrated, I don't need to rely on others for this but choose too because conglomerations and group dynamics on any project buff out the shine on such a gaming topic/item. As the saying goes "More heads are often better than one." Assuming they are civil and generous as this thread has been so far.
Kevin Andrew Murphy
06-24-07, 06:37 PM As I see it, "Profession Cook" and "Craft Cooking" are two separate skills. The first lets you run a restaurant or palace kitchen, planning menus, dealing with suppliers and making certain the clientelle is happy. The second deals with the actual preparation of food. And of course one is Wisdom based, the other is Intelligence based.

You can certainly let one default to another for minor tasks, but you should likely have both depending on what you're doing. It's the different between Profession Milkmaid and Craft Cheesemaking.
Grave_Accomplice
06-24-07, 06:53 PM MGP has two 5 level PrC's for cooks, one for halflinf and the other for gnomes. Can't remember the particulars except that one creates a commune effect at high levels (the food was so good, I saw GOD!!).

They're OGL, so I can type these up if you'd like.
HolyGrenadeFrenzy
06-28-07, 06:05 AM MGP has two 5 level PrC's for cooks, one for halflinf and the other for gnomes. Can't remember the particulars except that one creates a commune effect at high levels (the food was so good, I saw GOD!!).

They're OGL, so I can type these up if you'd like.

I am kinda tired now and am about to crash. Anyone have a link?
Sylvaroth
06-28-07, 07:15 AM SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/)

revamped profession (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=856661&highlight=cook)

Hope that helps?
HolyGrenadeFrenzy
07-06-07, 07:43 PM MGP has two 5 level PrC's for cooks, one for halflinf and the other for gnomes. Can't remember the particulars except that one creates a commune effect at high levels (the food was so good, I saw GOD!!).

They're OGL, so I can type these up if you'd like.

I am still trying to find these PrCs. What is the product name, please? The PrC's name too would be appricaited. I am abit busy pulling things together at the moment but if someone knows, please do tell. Thank you.

EDIT: I found it.....I thought I had read it before. Man, that is a very sweet PrC. Perhaps I will post it here with the other one. They are in the Quinsitential Halfling and Quinsitential Gnome books.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
HolyGrenadeFrenzy 06-24-07, 01:52 AM	This is about using the Profession-Cook for more than just earning income although I do hope that others leave more comments about how to spread the reputation and bring in higher pay for a great chef as well. Now, many things leave impressions with others and affect their well being in more than one way when it comes to food; balanced diet, dinning both fine and standard, campfire delights, lover's cuisine, exploritory recipes of the finest chefs and the home cooked meal all serve their purposes and should have a variety of DC's associated with them. Should these be compared to the Craft skills or is there a better way? Should there be an additional Craft skill for food orientated work including the making of new and traditional entrees, meals, snacks and deserts? Taking 10 or 20 may be appropriate on some occassions and not on others. For instance taking 10 or 20 for any kind of cook during a diner rush at a resturant should be difficult to impossible unless they make a concentration check and stick to just the one meal batch. Cooking for just one or the same meal for several may allow one to take 10 or 20 representing the time neccisary not just for cooking but also for prep time. In fact the cooking time should be figured first and then applied to an additional multiplier depending on the number of people being served and the food being prepared. Deciding on the numbers for this is work, indeed, and at this point I am willing to listen to input of others. Now, I do have 10 years experience in the food industry from fast to fine dinning yet am not committed to any numerical absolutes about things at this point. I could still go take the tests and become a chef myself if I choose to but am busy with other things at this point. Any ideas or references in the forums or elsewhere to assist is appreciated. Can we demonstrate how a good meal can effect reactions with an appropriate DC? What about when combined with Gather Information to find someones favorite foods or curiosities? What about using cuisine to show appricaition for heroes or to make friends? How about cooking a fine meal for some creature to aviod being eaten? Surely this technique has been used by the halfling race on numerous occasions. It has in campaigns I have been in and although from the hip with the DC success advantages it would be better if some results were worked out for other Campaigns and other gamers. Synergy for Alchemy and Apothicary seems quite approriate for those skills from ranks in Profession Cooking but not for Profession Cooking which would serve better with a synergy benefit from Knowledge Nature and perhaps Craft Brewing and Profession Herbalist are better choices. But alas synergy bonuses may also be left out if neccisary and they are not as important to me at this point as a set of DCs are. Scores and Effects for different consumption consequences positive and negative would be excellent. Food can actually assist with healing in addition to relaxation which are both of important note in a RPG as well as any strategic situation be it domesticly civil, financially decisive or impendingly militant as an issue of morale for example. How can these issues be addressed? Thanx and best regards, I hope the next meal you eat is one you enjoy even if at the gaming table!
Kouk 06-24-07, 03:23 AM	I think just some kind of Profession check would do, you don't need to make it into a Craft skill. Gather Information should work OK for finding a person's favorite food, but that would likely have an absurdly high DC. It would probably be better to ask someone they know directly. I'm don't think that synergy for Alchemy would work, you have to be a spellcaster to even take Alchemy, and it seems like it would be "cheating" to cook with magical substances. You might be able to produce some sort of flavor packs with Alchemy though, that grant a bonus to your cooking. I'm not sure with Herbalism, it makes sense, but you could create many other Professions and argue that they also make sense for giving bonuses to cooking, and so might just be very circumstantial depending on what you were trying to make. If you want to work with your DM about making cooking give bonuses the way it does in other games, that's probably fine. I can't imagine it coming up much in a normal game though. Charging Minotaurs and Giants aren't likely to let you cook for them, unless you were cooking yourself.
Neutronium_Dragon 06-24-07, 03:46 AM	Making an impression on someone by cooking them a decent meal? DC A 15 Profession: Cooking check gives you a +2 Circumstance bonus on your Diplomacy check. That's simple and in keeping with the rest of the system. The rush hour wouldn't prevent Take 10. If an angry customer came in and started waving one of your cleavers at you, fine. But just having a large workload (which is all the rush hour is - a lot of work all at once) now and then is a normal part of the job, so it won't have any impact on Take 10. Take 20 generally isn't going to be doable with Profession in any circumstance. It's fine to use food as a theme element in events, but by and large that's all it should be. D&D handles things abstractly; trying to develop an intricately detailed food-based subsystem is more than skills were meant to do.
HolyGrenadeFrenzy 06-24-07, 04:18 AM	My interest isn't just for my DMs (Plural) or myself as a DM as well but for a reference conserning these possiblities. I could figure it all myself (with another DM if neccisary) but I was curious about the forums possible contributions to any whom could find the thread. I have spent about 8 hours online looking at hits on the topic and found very litttle. So a few links or suggestions from someone would be appricaited. The only way such things come up in a campaign is by strategy and design of both players and DMs alike. As a creative DM you can deny your PCs from having oppurtunity to urinate or defficate....fun times all round. With elbow high in bodies and most of the PC's bodies covered in grime and gore but that is not a long term realism and countering monsters is only a small issue here. But when you are already preparring food and something shows up and it is sentient enough to recognize the smell of a good meal other options could be available if some numerical basics are available. As is the "Craft Reference" is only to try and measure the quality of work unless some Culinary Craft Skill would be relevant. By the way, I would prefer just the one skill anyway. However from a historical perspective a great cook whom can be trusted is quite valuable to the powerful, prestigious and base alike. Why kill the cook when you crave their food. Tasters for royalty is all about cooks being turned by advesaries, being adversaries or food interception and tampering. It is still an issue today. And there are things worse than poisoning. So one cook burns the meat and it stays bloody and often people get sick from his cooking. Often this is blamed on the consumer as something they have done to offend spirits or the gods. But when a cook shows up whom makes someones "tongue slap their brains out" as the cliche goes, then their survival becomes important to others and their skills are desired greatly. If anyone doesn't understand how this can enrich a game consider not eating anything you enjoy for a week or two but just basic rations instead. Then go eat a meal in a fine dinning establishment of your choice and eat slowly while paying attention to your food. Please, reflect on this thread then and note the following statement. See what I mean. Here is a list I have slammed together. Indigestion Material DC 4 Food Statis of Decomposer DC 5 Everday food Preparation or simplest of meals DC 8 Basic Meals DC 10 Decient Meal 12 Good Meal DC 15 Best local food stop DC 20 Great Meal DC 25 Fabulous Meal DC 30 Chef DC 35 Top Chef DC 40 Master Chef DC 50 Armies kill to eat this food DC 75 The gods visit this establishment DC 100 The gods wait in line llike everyone else DC 125 The gods invite you to stay with them DC 150 The gods invite you to live as one of them DC 175 A god accuses you of impersonating him and challenges you to a contest DC 200 (snicker) But this list is by no means complete although I would suggest a second column. Mythology has many such stories of cooks, bards, tailors, cobblers, strategists, game players, brewers, sculptors and many other proffessions in many different mythologies world wide of Earth or Terro of Sol if you will. Neutronium Dragon has a good point and I wouldn't suggest any different about systems and sub systems. Yet a list like the one above or something less extravegant would be nice and has been done for other skills including Profession skills all over. A second skill may be or may not be neccisary. A few Prestige Classes have been made as well to this sort of affect but I haven't delved into those at this point of this thread. As I have said and demonstrated, I don't need to rely on others for this but choose too because conglomerations and group dynamics on any project buff out the shine on such a gaming topic/item. As the saying goes "More heads are often better than one." Assuming they are civil and generous as this thread has been so far.
Kevin Andrew Murphy 06-24-07, 06:37 PM	As I see it, "Profession Cook" and "Craft Cooking" are two separate skills. The first lets you run a restaurant or palace kitchen, planning menus, dealing with suppliers and making certain the clientelle is happy. The second deals with the actual preparation of food. And of course one is Wisdom based, the other is Intelligence based. You can certainly let one default to another for minor tasks, but you should likely have both depending on what you're doing. It's the different between Profession Milkmaid and Craft Cheesemaking.
Grave_Accomplice 06-24-07, 06:53 PM	MGP has two 5 level PrC's for cooks, one for halflinf and the other for gnomes. Can't remember the particulars except that one creates a commune effect at high levels (the food was so good, I saw GOD!!). They're OGL, so I can type these up if you'd like.
HolyGrenadeFrenzy 06-28-07, 06:05 AM	MGP has two 5 level PrC's for cooks, one for halflinf and the other for gnomes. Can't remember the particulars except that one creates a commune effect at high levels (the food was so good, I saw GOD!!). They're OGL, so I can type these up if you'd like. I am kinda tired now and am about to crash. Anyone have a link?
Sylvaroth 06-28-07, 07:15 AM	SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/) revamped profession (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=856661&highlight=cook) Hope that helps?
HolyGrenadeFrenzy 07-06-07, 07:43 PM	MGP has two 5 level PrC's for cooks, one for halflinf and the other for gnomes. Can't remember the particulars except that one creates a commune effect at high levels (the food was so good, I saw GOD!!). They're OGL, so I can type these up if you'd like. I am still trying to find these PrCs. What is the product name, please? The PrC's name too would be appricaited. I am abit busy pulling things together at the moment but if someone knows, please do tell. Thank you. EDIT: I found it.....I thought I had read it before. Man, that is a very sweet PrC. Perhaps I will post it here with the other one. They are in the Quinsitential Halfling and Quinsitential Gnome books.