profession\craft skill idea [Archive] - Wizards Community

profession\craft skill idea [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Crebain
10-13-07, 11:44 AM okay, so I was thinking about D&D and all the sudden I began to wonder what if you became so good at your profession or craft that you became famous for it. So, I came up with this idea for my campaign. What if for every five ranks you have in a profession skill, or craft skill you gained a +1 bonus to charisma in all places where you frequently use your profession or craft. For example a level 2 cleric spends the time he's not adventuring making and selling light maces in his home town. He has a rank of 5 in his craft skill for blacksmithing so he gets a +1 in charisma when he's in that area.
jaelis
10-14-07, 10:52 AM The idea sounds reasonable, but I wouldn't apply it to charisma checks in general. (Why would it help with UMD?)

Instead, I'd just grant a circumstance bonuses on appropriate interactions with NPCs who might know and care about your skill. In some cases, I'd start their initial attitudes a step higher... if you're a world-renowned master smith, the local smith in the village would probably feel friendly toward you.
Crebain
10-14-07, 01:28 PM what is UMD
BW0222
10-14-07, 02:25 PM Crebain,

Doesn't really work.

First, 5 ranks is almost nothing. Most no-name assistants (2nd-level experts) have that kind of skill. No one is likely to know there names. In a fair-sized city you would be cutting firewood, manning the bellows, or taking fitting measurements while real experts did the work. In even a tiny village, no one would think you to be in anything special because you can make horseshoes. Every farmer (commoner) has 5 ranks in profession (farmer). You aren't worthy of notice.

Second, ranks is only half the issue. A high intelligence or wisdom, skill focus, magical items, etc. could easily account for a significant amount of your ability. You are hardly special with 5 ranks when there is someone else with 5 ranks, an 18 intelligence, masterwork tools, and skill focus (craft: bowmaking) and three assistants.

Third, even with a lot of ranks, folks don't have any idea (or care) who actually makes most common items or performs mundane tasks. Does anyone really care if the farmer has 5 ranks in profession (farmer) or 10 ranks in profession (farmer) when looking at carrots? Same with horseshoes, barrels, spikes, dishes, etc. Until someone makes something which is noticable (say masterwork), no one is going to care.

Forth, even if you have masterwork items, no one will care unless they actually have an interest in the item or skill. I.e. few folks outside of another swordsmith, military officer, etc. is going to notice a masterwork sword. Most other folks would have no need to be looking at such items. Thus, the number of folks which would know that you are exceptional is extremely limited.

Fifth, even if the person did care... say craft (painting) or someone make a masterwork sword, your item is no more noteworthy than someone who make a similiar item with fewer ranks. You just happen to have made it faster and for (possibly) less materials cost. If you see two paintings worth 100gp - it isn't notable that one better than the other. It isn't until someone makes something so valuable that few others could possible make it... that someone interested in the skill might take notice.

Sixth, in the case of professions, skill is never really noticable. Your ferry captain with 5 ranks in profession (boater) can get the ferry across the river just as well as someone with 15 ranks. It isn't until something extra-ordinary happens (like a flash flood) that anyone (other than another ferry expert) could tell the difference between the two - or would care.

Seventh, your 'fame' depends a lot more on who is talking about you than your ability. If you make an item and someone buys it and puts it in the bottom of their private collection or hauled it away to another province... it really doesn't help you folks talking about you. Even if it is publically available... folks often don't care about who make it, but where they can buy it. I.e. they are just as likely to remember the shop which sold them the masterwork rapier than the person who made it. There is certainly no assurance that they would remember or recognize you. I've got some posters on my walls. If I want to buy more I go back to the store where I purchased them, not to the company that made them, or the artist who drew them.

IMO, if someone walked into town, rented a smithy, made a number of masterwork rapiers, and put them up for public sale in some store window... I'd give the person a +2 circumstance bonus with the store keeper, maybe a +1 circumstance bonus with the local fencing school, and perhaps a +1 circumstance bonus to the Lord who bought one and placed it on his wall. Few other folks would really care.
vorpo
10-14-07, 09:17 PM what is UMD

Use Magic Device.

Also, I agree with BW0222. You have to be like rank 20 to gain some level of fame for you. Even if your suggestion works, it shouldn't be a +1 bonus to Cha. It should be a +1 bonus to Charisma check.
Fireclave
10-14-07, 10:11 PM Use Magic Device.

Also, I agree with BW0222. You have to be like rank 20 to gain some level of fame for you. Even if your suggestion works, it shouldn't be a +1 bonus to Cha. It should be a +1 bonus to Charisma check.
I'd say 20 ranks is a bit much. While it would depend highly on the power level of a campaign (especially how high of level a typical NPC can achieve), 13 ranks would probably be enough to varient some personal fame since that would require you to be 10th level, which is higher than most NPCs. However, the rules don't support really support crafting/pricing an object for artistic value or quantifies artistic taste, which would go a long way from separating a masterwork longsword from a masterwork longsword with a expertly crafted, dragon-shapped sword handle with jeweled eyes, or a masterwork longsword from a masterwork longsword with perfect balance, weight, and sharpness. And like BW0222 pointed out, your extra ranks would go largely unnoticed to most people.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Crebain 10-13-07, 11:44 AM	okay, so I was thinking about D&D and all the sudden I began to wonder what if you became so good at your profession or craft that you became famous for it. So, I came up with this idea for my campaign. What if for every five ranks you have in a profession skill, or craft skill you gained a +1 bonus to charisma in all places where you frequently use your profession or craft. For example a level 2 cleric spends the time he's not adventuring making and selling light maces in his home town. He has a rank of 5 in his craft skill for blacksmithing so he gets a +1 in charisma when he's in that area.
jaelis 10-14-07, 10:52 AM	The idea sounds reasonable, but I wouldn't apply it to charisma checks in general. (Why would it help with UMD?) Instead, I'd just grant a circumstance bonuses on appropriate interactions with NPCs who might know and care about your skill. In some cases, I'd start their initial attitudes a step higher... if you're a world-renowned master smith, the local smith in the village would probably feel friendly toward you.
Crebain 10-14-07, 01:28 PM	what is UMD
BW0222 10-14-07, 02:25 PM	Crebain, Doesn't really work. First, 5 ranks is almost nothing. Most no-name assistants (2nd-level experts) have that kind of skill. No one is likely to know there names. In a fair-sized city you would be cutting firewood, manning the bellows, or taking fitting measurements while real experts did the work. In even a tiny village, no one would think you to be in anything special because you can make horseshoes. Every farmer (commoner) has 5 ranks in profession (farmer). You aren't worthy of notice. Second, ranks is only half the issue. A high intelligence or wisdom, skill focus, magical items, etc. could easily account for a significant amount of your ability. You are hardly special with 5 ranks when there is someone else with 5 ranks, an 18 intelligence, masterwork tools, and skill focus (craft: bowmaking) and three assistants. Third, even with a lot of ranks, folks don't have any idea (or care) who actually makes most common items or performs mundane tasks. Does anyone really care if the farmer has 5 ranks in profession (farmer) or 10 ranks in profession (farmer) when looking at carrots? Same with horseshoes, barrels, spikes, dishes, etc. Until someone makes something which is noticable (say masterwork), no one is going to care. Forth, even if you have masterwork items, no one will care unless they actually have an interest in the item or skill. I.e. few folks outside of another swordsmith, military officer, etc. is going to notice a masterwork sword. Most other folks would have no need to be looking at such items. Thus, the number of folks which would know that you are exceptional is extremely limited. Fifth, even if the person did care... say craft (painting) or someone make a masterwork sword, your item is no more noteworthy than someone who make a similiar item with fewer ranks. You just happen to have made it faster and for (possibly) less materials cost. If you see two paintings worth 100gp - it isn't notable that one better than the other. It isn't until someone makes something so valuable that few others could possible make it... that someone interested in the skill might take notice. Sixth, in the case of professions, skill is never really noticable. Your ferry captain with 5 ranks in profession (boater) can get the ferry across the river just as well as someone with 15 ranks. It isn't until something extra-ordinary happens (like a flash flood) that anyone (other than another ferry expert) could tell the difference between the two - or would care. Seventh, your 'fame' depends a lot more on who is talking about you than your ability. If you make an item and someone buys it and puts it in the bottom of their private collection or hauled it away to another province... it really doesn't help you folks talking about you. Even if it is publically available... folks often don't care about who make it, but where they can buy it. I.e. they are just as likely to remember the shop which sold them the masterwork rapier than the person who made it. There is certainly no assurance that they would remember or recognize you. I've got some posters on my walls. If I want to buy more I go back to the store where I purchased them, not to the company that made them, or the artist who drew them. IMO, if someone walked into town, rented a smithy, made a number of masterwork rapiers, and put them up for public sale in some store window... I'd give the person a +2 circumstance bonus with the store keeper, maybe a +1 circumstance bonus with the local fencing school, and perhaps a +1 circumstance bonus to the Lord who bought one and placed it on his wall. Few other folks would really care.
vorpo 10-14-07, 09:17 PM	what is UMD Use Magic Device. Also, I agree with BW0222. You have to be like rank 20 to gain some level of fame for you. Even if your suggestion works, it shouldn't be a +1 bonus to Cha. It should be a +1 bonus to Charisma check.
Fireclave 10-14-07, 10:11 PM	Use Magic Device. Also, I agree with BW0222. You have to be like rank 20 to gain some level of fame for you. Even if your suggestion works, it shouldn't be a +1 bonus to Cha. It should be a +1 bonus to Charisma check. I'd say 20 ranks is a bit much. While it would depend highly on the power level of a campaign (especially how high of level a typical NPC can achieve), 13 ranks would probably be enough to varient some personal fame since that would require you to be 10th level, which is higher than most NPCs. However, the rules don't support really support crafting/pricing an object for artistic value or quantifies artistic taste, which would go a long way from separating a masterwork longsword from a masterwork longsword with a expertly crafted, dragon-shapped sword handle with jeweled eyes, or a masterwork longsword from a masterwork longsword with perfect balance, weight, and sharpness. And like BW0222 pointed out, your extra ranks would go largely unnoticed to most people.