pulling a dagger with quickdraw [Archive] - Wizards Community

pulling a dagger with quickdraw [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
dredok
02-04-08, 02:34 PM hi guys, i have a question that I was hoping that you could help me out with.

if i am using a short sword as my main weapon, on attacks of opportunity can I quick draw a dagger to stab someone and release the dagger? i have multiple daggers and don’t mind loosing one. the reason i want to do this is my daggers have a poison on them and it will help me out if i can poison my opponent. will I take a penalty for doing this on my attack roll and if so how much of a penalty?

Thanks much for your help

a little more spicific: in an attack of oppertunity if i have 2 weapond out but can only make one attack with my off hand, what if any are the penalties?

thanks again guys
Howie23
02-04-08, 02:59 PM if i am using a short sword as my main weapon, on attacks of opportunity can I quick draw a dagger to stab someone and release the dagger?

Per the RAW, no. Per DM houserule, that's pretty much up to your DM.

Edit: This is probably worth some disclaimers. :)

Per the Raw, no, unless you have resources that override the general rules as either specific rules or exceptions.
EvilVegan
02-04-08, 03:21 PM Poison your sword.
InkBlot
02-04-08, 03:29 PM Free actions can only be taken on your turn. So even though Quickdraw lets you draw a dagger as a free action, you still can't draw a dagger when it isn't your turn.

Only immediate actions and attacks of opportunity can be taken when it isn't your turn. I don't know of anything which allows you to draw a weapon as an immediate action, or as part of an AoO.
TifRhal
02-04-08, 03:38 PM in complete scoundrel there is a skill trick it costs 2 skill points
it is called sudden draw you must have quick draw and 8 ranks of slight of hand 8 ranks it lets you draw your weapon as part of an attack of opportunity.
InkBlot
02-04-08, 07:18 PM Ah, I overlooked that one. Aren't Skill Tricks wonderful?

In case the OP is unfamiliar with Skill Tricks, I'll clarify:

Skill tricks are not feats. They are not spells. They do not require you to be any certain class or race.

Skill Tricks are an expansion of the core skill system. Any character can learn a skill trick by spending 2 skill points to buy it, instead of spending those two skill points to buy ranks in a skill.

However, you can only learn one Skill Trick at each level (unless you use feats or prestige classes to learn extra).
ultimate_tracker
02-07-08, 01:24 AM theres also mercurial strike (i believe thats what its called) iot states that if an oppenent provoke an aoo then you can draw a weapon and attack with it, not sure what book its in but look it up in feat section in crystal keep
1 ton ghost
02-07-08, 03:21 PM the skill trick in question is very very nice. recommended.

you are wise to poison your dagger and not short sword usually:

-easier to conceal than your sword (consider legality of poison)
-you always have the option to go ranged if need be which is typically a rogue's strong suit baring Weapon Finesse in melee.

if you are dual wielding and an AoO comes up, there is no penalty for attacking. that is, you're only getting 1 attack, hence 1 blade, not both.
kalstrand
02-07-08, 04:58 PM Expanding on skill tricks you can't have more than 1/2 character level skill tricks known and they can only be used once per encounter.
jaelis
02-07-08, 05:07 PM So if you had this skill trick, and weren't initially holding a weapon at all, could you still use it? Because normally you wouldn't get an AoO if you weren't threatening to begin with. Seems a little weird.
1 ton ghost
02-08-08, 11:26 AM you'd have to.
ok, simply put, if you have this skill trick, this is how it works if i remember correctly:

subject draws an AoO from you. provided you have successfully concealed a weapon via Sleight of Hand, the trick in question allows you to draw it immediately and attack them; to be considered "loss of Dex" bonus, perhaps flat-footed, can't remember which. either way, they are elligible for Sneak Attack and you proceed normally.

typically, these can only be used 1/encounter, but i think provisions have been made to abjucate their use after 10rnds i think. best to just peruse Comp.Scondrel anyway. it is one of the better "Complete" books anyway.
jaelis
02-08-08, 12:05 PM Guess I'm stuck on the fact that if you aren't threatening, the subject doesn't provoke.

You could say something like: if the target performs an action that would provoke if you were threatening him, you get to draw your weapon and attack. But then you have to worry about things like whether you could throw your weapon, and what if you have two weapons with different reaches, etc.

Maybe all you have to do is limit it to melee attacks, and then there's no problem. I guess that must be how it works. Still, would it work with a whip?

(I'd have picked up Complete Scoundrel, but I'm saving up for the 4e books instead.)
icuall
02-09-08, 07:45 PM If you had Two-Weapon Fighting, you could without worry.

In my opinion, as the DM, I'd let you try but apply all the penalties that apply without the appropriate feats.

Keep in mind you can try almost anything in game, you just have to incur the penalties.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
dredok 02-04-08, 02:34 PM	hi guys, i have a question that I was hoping that you could help me out with. if i am using a short sword as my main weapon, on attacks of opportunity can I quick draw a dagger to stab someone and release the dagger? i have multiple daggers and don’t mind loosing one. the reason i want to do this is my daggers have a poison on them and it will help me out if i can poison my opponent. will I take a penalty for doing this on my attack roll and if so how much of a penalty? Thanks much for your help a little more spicific: in an attack of oppertunity if i have 2 weapond out but can only make one attack with my off hand, what if any are the penalties? thanks again guys
Howie23 02-04-08, 02:59 PM	if i am using a short sword as my main weapon, on attacks of opportunity can I quick draw a dagger to stab someone and release the dagger? Per the RAW, no. Per DM houserule, that's pretty much up to your DM. Edit: This is probably worth some disclaimers. :) Per the Raw, no, unless you have resources that override the general rules as either specific rules or exceptions.
EvilVegan 02-04-08, 03:21 PM	Poison your sword.
InkBlot 02-04-08, 03:29 PM	Free actions can only be taken on your turn. So even though Quickdraw lets you draw a dagger as a free action, you still can't draw a dagger when it isn't your turn. Only immediate actions and attacks of opportunity can be taken when it isn't your turn. I don't know of anything which allows you to draw a weapon as an immediate action, or as part of an AoO.
TifRhal 02-04-08, 03:38 PM	in complete scoundrel there is a skill trick it costs 2 skill points it is called sudden draw you must have quick draw and 8 ranks of slight of hand 8 ranks it lets you draw your weapon as part of an attack of opportunity.
InkBlot 02-04-08, 07:18 PM	Ah, I overlooked that one. Aren't Skill Tricks wonderful? In case the OP is unfamiliar with Skill Tricks, I'll clarify: Skill tricks are not feats. They are not spells. They do not require you to be any certain class or race. Skill Tricks are an expansion of the core skill system. Any character can learn a skill trick by spending 2 skill points to buy it, instead of spending those two skill points to buy ranks in a skill. However, you can only learn one Skill Trick at each level (unless you use feats or prestige classes to learn extra).
ultimate_tracker 02-07-08, 01:24 AM	theres also mercurial strike (i believe thats what its called) iot states that if an oppenent provoke an aoo then you can draw a weapon and attack with it, not sure what book its in but look it up in feat section in crystal keep
1 ton ghost 02-07-08, 03:21 PM	the skill trick in question is very very nice. recommended. you are wise to poison your dagger and not short sword usually: -easier to conceal than your sword (consider legality of poison) -you always have the option to go ranged if need be which is typically a rogue's strong suit baring Weapon Finesse in melee. if you are dual wielding and an AoO comes up, there is no penalty for attacking. that is, you're only getting 1 attack, hence 1 blade, not both.
kalstrand 02-07-08, 04:58 PM	Expanding on skill tricks you can't have more than 1/2 character level skill tricks known and they can only be used once per encounter.
jaelis 02-07-08, 05:07 PM	So if you had this skill trick, and weren't initially holding a weapon at all, could you still use it? Because normally you wouldn't get an AoO if you weren't threatening to begin with. Seems a little weird.
1 ton ghost 02-08-08, 11:26 AM	you'd have to. ok, simply put, if you have this skill trick, this is how it works if i remember correctly: subject draws an AoO from you. provided you have successfully concealed a weapon via Sleight of Hand, the trick in question allows you to draw it immediately and attack them; to be considered "loss of Dex" bonus, perhaps flat-footed, can't remember which. either way, they are elligible for Sneak Attack and you proceed normally. typically, these can only be used 1/encounter, but i think provisions have been made to abjucate their use after 10rnds i think. best to just peruse Comp.Scondrel anyway. it is one of the better "Complete" books anyway.
jaelis 02-08-08, 12:05 PM	Guess I'm stuck on the fact that if you aren't threatening, the subject doesn't provoke. You could say something like: if the target performs an action that would provoke if you were threatening him, you get to draw your weapon and attack. But then you have to worry about things like whether you could throw your weapon, and what if you have two weapons with different reaches, etc. Maybe all you have to do is limit it to melee attacks, and then there's no problem. I guess that must be how it works. Still, would it work with a whip? (I'd have picked up Complete Scoundrel, but I'm saving up for the 4e books instead.)
icuall 02-09-08, 07:45 PM	If you had Two-Weapon Fighting, you could without worry. In my opinion, as the DM, I'd let you try but apply all the penalties that apply without the appropriate feats. Keep in mind you can try almost anything in game, you just have to incur the penalties.