Question about Hide, concealment and Diversion to hide [Archive] - Wizards Community

Question about Hide, concealment and Diversion to hide [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Uulbaan
04-29-07, 02:23 PM I need clarification concerning Hide given certain situations and spell effects.

1- The spell Blur state that it give concealment to the user and the Hide skill state that such attempt can be made only in the presence of cover or concealment.

If X is in the middle of a large street and use the spell Blur, is he going to be unable to be "seen" by other people if they failed their spot check even though X is in an open area?

Same problematic with the spell Veil of Shadow (p. 228 Spell Compendium)

2- Does the area of magical shadow of a Darkness or Deeper Darkness spell is enough to "hide" someone with a successful Hide check?

3- X is in an open area, he succeed to make a Diversion to hide with his Bluff skill. Then he succeed his Hide check Vs. the opponent Y. Does X is going to be hidden from Y even though if he remain in the open area?

In other words, does X need to move behind cover or concealment outside the open area once he succeed his Diversion check or the Diversion to hide is enough by it self once the Hide check is succeed? In this case, X would be hidden for 1 round, at least, since another Diversion to hide will need to be made on the next round to attempt another hide check Vs Y. Is this correct?

I hope I am clear so to speak ;) I want to understand clearly when the Hide occure in D&D and according which circonstances or spell effects. That's why also I gave these 3 exemples which cover different situations that are not always clear to my mind (especially #1).

Thx for your help and info you can bring concerning this topic.
Everdreaming
04-29-07, 02:36 PM Im not sure about blur or veil of shadow, but using common sense, creating a diversion with bluff allows said person to get out of the open space, without other person seeing where he went.
Perseus_Stoned
04-29-07, 02:57 PM I need clarification concerning Hide given certain situations and spell effects.

1- The spell Blur state that it give concealment to the user and the Hide skill state that such attempt can be made only in the presence of cover or concealment.

If X is in the middle of a large street and use the spell Blur, is he going to be unable to be "seen" by other people if they failed their spot check even though X is in an open area?

...This distortion grants the subject concealment...

Concealment and Hide Checks
You can use concealment to make a Hide check.

While, I believe as a DM I would likely rule they can still see you fine (unless you have a damn good description prepared of how you are planning to hide), this is perfectly legitimate by R.A.W.

Same problematic with the spell Veil of Shadow (p. 228 Spell Compendium)

Sorry don't have that.
Perseus_Stoned
04-29-07, 03:01 PM 2- Does the area of magical shadow of a Darkness or Deeper Darkness spell is enough to "hide" someone with a successful Hide check?

[QUOTE=SRD's bit on "Darkness" the spell]All creatures in the area gain concealment

*see above*

3- X is in an open area, he succeed to make a Diversion to hide with his Bluff skill. Then he succeed his Hide check Vs. the opponent Y. Does X is going to be hidden from Y even though if he remain in the open area?

In other words, does X need to move behind cover or concealment outside the open area once he succeed his Diversion check or the Diversion to hide is enough by it self once the Hide check is succeed? In this case, X would be hidden for 1 round, at least, since another Diversion to hide will need to be made on the next round to attempt another hide check Vs Y. Is this correct?

If your observers are momentarily distracted (such as by a Bluff check; see below), though, you can attempt to hide. While the others turn their attention from you, you can attempt a Hide check if you can get to a hiding place of some kind. (As a general guideline, the hiding place has to be within 1 foot per rank you have in Hide.) This check, however, is made at a -10 penalty because you have to move fast.

This means that the diversion simply allows you to attempt to hide, you still have to find someplace to hide. So your example would not work; you can divert his attention from you, but you must still run somewhere and hide before he returns his attention to you. So no "open area" hiding (unless you're udner the effect of Blur at least ;)).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Uulbaan 04-29-07, 02:23 PM	I need clarification concerning Hide given certain situations and spell effects. 1- The spell Blur state that it give concealment to the user and the Hide skill state that such attempt can be made only in the presence of cover or concealment. If X is in the middle of a large street and use the spell Blur, is he going to be unable to be "seen" by other people if they failed their spot check even though X is in an open area? Same problematic with the spell Veil of Shadow (p. 228 Spell Compendium) 2- Does the area of magical shadow of a Darkness or Deeper Darkness spell is enough to "hide" someone with a successful Hide check? 3- X is in an open area, he succeed to make a Diversion to hide with his Bluff skill. Then he succeed his Hide check Vs. the opponent Y. Does X is going to be hidden from Y even though if he remain in the open area? In other words, does X need to move behind cover or concealment outside the open area once he succeed his Diversion check or the Diversion to hide is enough by it self once the Hide check is succeed? In this case, X would be hidden for 1 round, at least, since another Diversion to hide will need to be made on the next round to attempt another hide check Vs Y. Is this correct? I hope I am clear so to speak ;) I want to understand clearly when the Hide occure in D&D and according which circonstances or spell effects. That's why also I gave these 3 exemples which cover different situations that are not always clear to my mind (especially #1). Thx for your help and info you can bring concerning this topic.
Everdreaming 04-29-07, 02:36 PM	Im not sure about blur or veil of shadow, but using common sense, creating a diversion with bluff allows said person to get out of the open space, without other person seeing where he went.
Perseus_Stoned 04-29-07, 02:57 PM	I need clarification concerning Hide given certain situations and spell effects. 1- The spell Blur state that it give concealment to the user and the Hide skill state that such attempt can be made only in the presence of cover or concealment. If X is in the middle of a large street and use the spell Blur, is he going to be unable to be "seen" by other people if they failed their spot check even though X is in an open area? ...This distortion grants the subject concealment... Concealment and Hide Checks You can use concealment to make a Hide check. While, I believe as a DM I would likely rule they can still see you fine (unless you have a damn good description prepared of how you are planning to hide), this is perfectly legitimate by R.A.W. Same problematic with the spell Veil of Shadow (p. 228 Spell Compendium) Sorry don't have that.
Perseus_Stoned 04-29-07, 03:01 PM	2- Does the area of magical shadow of a Darkness or Deeper Darkness spell is enough to "hide" someone with a successful Hide check? [QUOTE=SRD's bit on "Darkness" the spell]All creatures in the area gain concealment see above 3- X is in an open area, he succeed to make a Diversion to hide with his Bluff skill. Then he succeed his Hide check Vs. the opponent Y. Does X is going to be hidden from Y even though if he remain in the open area? In other words, does X need to move behind cover or concealment outside the open area once he succeed his Diversion check or the Diversion to hide is enough by it self once the Hide check is succeed? In this case, X would be hidden for 1 round, at least, since another Diversion to hide will need to be made on the next round to attempt another hide check Vs Y. Is this correct? If your observers are momentarily distracted (such as by a Bluff check; see below), though, you can attempt to hide. While the others turn their attention from you, you can attempt a Hide check if you can get to a hiding place of some kind. (As a general guideline, the hiding place has to be within 1 foot per rank you have in Hide.) This check, however, is made at a -10 penalty because you have to move fast. This means that the diversion simply allows you to attempt to hide, you still have to find someplace to hide. So your example would not work; you can divert his attention from you, but you must still run somewhere and hide before he returns his attention to you. So no "open area" hiding (unless you're udner the effect of Blur at least ;)).