Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Andramadus 06-30-07, 03:44 PM	I want to make a feat that slowly recharges magic spells or psionic powers similar to sacred healing or fast healing. You recharge 2pp/1 spell level per round for 5 rounds + your intelligence modifer may be used 3 plus your intelligence modifer per day. Any variants welcome, negative imput overpowered complaints are not welcome so don't post here
Radijs 06-30-07, 05:44 PM	Well looks like I won't be posting then. Nah its a public forum, you can't stop me. A wizard of conveniently high level could get some serious extra spells per day with something like that. A 1st level wizard with an int score of sixteen could recover up to 8 spell levels per use six times per day. So instead of having 2 spells per day (or 3 if he specializes) he could have up to 50 1st level spells per day (or 51 if he specializes). The closest thing to this feat would be Extra Spell Slot from complete arcane which gives you 1 spell slot of the highest level you can cast -1. There is a bit of a power gap there. Ok now you can reason that a lvl 1 wizard could not actually get all those 48 bonus spells from your feat but it still gives him quite the advantage by being able to fling off all his spells in an encounter, activate his ability during the encounter and keep slinging and then after its over still be ready for more. Five times more.
Chimaera2000 06-30-07, 07:49 PM	...negative imput overpowered complaints are not welcome so don't post here It's a public forum, baby! I'll post wherever I want to. And yes, this feat is overpowered. :) I am definitely being cheeky, but it's to draw attention to the fact that this feat would severely affect game balance. For example, let's say that you've got a 6th-level wizard with 18 Int (15 base +1 level increase +2 item) who takes this feat. When he uses this feat, he recovers nine spell levels. He can likewise use this feat seven times per day, recovering sixty-three spell levels total. How many spell levels does a sixth-level wizard typically have (bonus spells included)? 4 0-level: 2 spell levels 4 1st-level: 4 spell levels 4 2nd-level: 8 spell levels. 3 3rd-level: 9 spell levels. Total: 23 spell levels. In other words, this feat nearly quadrupled his spellcasting capacity. A feat like this just doesn't fit very well into the game as written. I'm not against the idea of recharge magic (I personally dislike the spells/day system), but the entire spellcasting system is balanced against it. A feat like this is easily a must-have for any spellcaster, even more so than Natural Spell is for a druid. If you want to use it in a game, it could use some scaling back at least.
Vaelan 07-01-07, 12:27 AM	This only works if you run a ridiculous number of encounters per day. Working out the math so that a Wizard's contributions come out similarly to what they do normally, the number of encounters you need to run per day starts at about 60 at level 1 and drops to 15 at level 20. When you need to run more encounters in a day for the game to even resemble working than it takes to gain a level, you have some work to do adjusting.
Fireclave 07-01-07, 01:16 AM	You recharge 2pp/1 spell level per round for 5 rounds + your intelligence modifer may be used 3 plus your intelligence modifer per day. As others have already illustrated, this would be completely broken as a feat. Maybe as a Salient Divine ability, because at the point you can them, balance doesn't matter anymore :P On a serrious note, it seems that your last few threads were created in the search for unlimited magical power. Have you checked out the Warlock class in the Complete Arcane. They get unlimited, all will magical abilities and do so in a way that doesn't break the game.
Andramadus 07-01-07, 01:38 AM	Not infinate power but something that allows wizards & clerics to catch up with tome of battle I personally dislike warlocks due to their limited ability selection. This feat would only be usefull after you had a serious battle, and the group needs to move on. Recharge as you go. Yes it up's the encounters per day which I don't consider to be a bad thing. But regaining 1 spell level a round won't really help in a fight. Only after the said fight is over can you replenish your spells or pp. Doesn't change anything about the game, but does allow you to have more than one encounter.
Fireclave 07-01-07, 02:55 AM	Not infinate power but something that allows wizards & clerics to catch up with tome of battle I personally dislike warlocks due to their limited ability selection. Wizards and clerics definitely don't need to catch up to the tomb of battle classes. They're already far ahead of just about everybody in terms of raw power. The cleric and wizard rank among the top five most power classes in the game. They don't need a boost. This feat would only be usefull after you had a serious battle, and the group needs to move on. Recharge as you go. Yes it up's the encounters per day which I don't consider to be a bad thing. Then you must be considering upping the encounters per day by alot. A dedicated spellcaster with a 20 int can easily net an extra 80 spell slots per day...at 1st level. That's staggering. You should present this as a variant spellcasting system for a variant encounter per day system and move it to the House Rules boards, because the changes you want to make to the system far outstrip the scope of a single feat. Perhaps you are thinking it would only be useful because a psion would need time to get enough PP back to power a decent level power and because a wizard would need to go back over their spellbooks. However, a) this feat disproportionately favors spellcaster, b) there are several different ways for prepared casters to spontaneously prepare spells on the fly, and c) spontaneous casters don't have to wait to put free spell slots to use. But regaining 1 spell level a round won't really help in a fight. It will if you're regaining a top level spell slots. A spellcaster can always use more top level spell slots. Also, even if this feat was balanced with the core rules, the benefits of this feat aren't balanced between manifesters and spellcasters. As written, this feat allows a spell caster to replace any of their spent spell slots while a manifester recieves a static 2PP per round. While 2PP are enough to power a single 1st level power, a free floating spell slot can be used to power any spell slot level a caster chooses. So if the spell caster wants to recharge all of his spent 7th, 8th, and 9th level spell slots, he can. Meanwhile, the manifester would be getting enough PP for about 1.5 9th level powers (Assuming a int of about 24, which is easily possible for high level characters). The gap between manifesters and spellcaster is even bigger when you consider that, because spell slots autoscale in power, each spell slot is effectively a full manifested power. When a 10th level wizard regains a 3rd level spell during a single round, he is regaining the equivalent of a 10th level psion's fully agumented Energy Ball. But when that same psion regain his 2pp during a single round, he only gains enough PP to power the equivalent of a caster level 1 spell. Not simply a 1st level spell, but a first level spell at 1 CL. Only after the said fight is over can you replenish your spells or pp. Doesn't change anything about the game, but does allow you to have more than one encounter. It changes a lot. One of the main balancing factors of casting classes is that casting is that they are very potent in effect, but finite and must be rationed. The effects that casters can produce far outstrip what a melee character of the same level can accomplish, including ToB melee classes. And spell slots are already balanced to last for more than one encounter. If you or your players are using up all of their spell slots in a single encounter, a) you're fighting stuff way above your CR, b) you're using your spell slots frivolously when a skill check, meat shield, or crossbow could do the same job at the cost of fewer resources, and/or c) you need to start carrying around some wands or starves.
pinkbunny 07-01-07, 03:57 AM	fireclave, while this is exceedingly overpowered, you misread, it's not a floating spell slot, it's a spell level, so: 1 round= 2pp/1st level spell 2rounds=4pp/2nd level spell but, it's still broken I personally dislike warlocks due to their limited ability selection. let's get this straight, you like a class ability, but dislike the biggest limitation of the class, so you want to give the classes strongest point to another class, at the cost of a feat, without imposing the limitations... this is balanced how?
Fireclave 07-01-07, 04:48 AM	fireclave, while this is exceedingly overpowered, you misread, it's not a floating spell slot, it's a spell level, so: 1 round= 2pp/1st level spell 2rounds=4pp/2nd level spell but, it's still broken Ah. I see now. Not as broken as I initially thought, but yes, it's still broken.
Radijs 07-01-07, 07:36 AM	Only after the said fight is over can you replenish your spells or pp. Doesn't change anything about the game, but does allow you to have more than one encounter. At higher levels it may seem to matter less but it still takes away just about the only limiting factor that holds spellcasters back in the general area of the fighter. You saw my example for a first level wizard, He would cast, activate the fast charge and keep casting until his hands where little stubs. A dedicated wizard at level 20 can have at least 30 INT but probably akin towards 40. This gives you 18 uses of this feat per day each netting 20 spell levels per usage. Ok in a single encounter it will seem to matter less but it will still let a wizard spam the battlefield with his 9th level spells every single encounter. I haven't played a lot at level 20 but the times that I have I found that a challenging encounter can last well over 10 rounds. Which gives the wizard acces to yet another 9th level spell during that encounter. And if he continues to recharge he can recover pretty much all his spells without breaking a sweat.
Andramadus 07-01-07, 11:49 AM	So guys what home brew recharge feat can you think of for gamers that just can't afford to sleep and need to move, perhaps fight or be killed? Suggestions?
Radijs 07-01-07, 12:42 PM	Nothing that would even hold a candle to your initial proposal. Such are the limits of the game. I mentioned the feat Extra Spell earlier and there are Rings of Wizardry which will give you some more extra slots but thats about it.
Chimaera2000 07-01-07, 12:55 PM	Though this probably isn't what you're looking for, the reserve feats from Complete Mage allow you to cast powered-down supernatural abilities all day. If you want to completely revamp the game, check out Unearthed Arcana's Recharge Magic variant. (www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/rechargeMagic.htm) It's a powerful variant, but at least it applies to all magic users.
orangevoodoo 07-01-07, 03:01 PM	I would also add that the Diablarie variant sorcerer (however it was spelled, the "How to Play Diablo in DnD" book) had an ability called Warmth that could be used a few times per day to get spell slots back. It is a 3.0 book that has not been updated, so it should still be valid, if you can find it. All the aura based classes owe a tip of the hat to the Diablarie variant paladin as it was the first one to have a continual aura ability that I can remember. If you can find that book somewhere, it'd give you a fairly balanced idea to start from. Alas, I don't have the one we used a while ago, since it wasn't mine.
dungeoneerphil 07-01-07, 04:29 PM	So guys what home brew recharge feat can you think of for gamers that just can't afford to sleep and need to move, perhaps fight or be killed? Suggestions? Suggestions? Easy! And there's no need to recharge to do so. 1) Hide 2) Run away 3) Negotiate 4) Scare the enemy off 5) Bribe 'em 6) Stock up on hirelings and cannon fodder 7) Stock up on scrolls, potions and/or wands beforehand. 8) Think carefully before burning up all your spells in the first place.
Vaelan 07-01-07, 09:41 PM	I agree with Chimaera2000's suggestion. Try Recharge Magic. With a few minor tweaks, such as getting rid of that ridiculous table of specific recharges and putting a new mechanic in place to keep buffing spells moderately balanced, the system can work quite well.