Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Asmodeur 03-17-07, 10:48 AM	Hey all One of my players has been playing a trip-happy fighter in my newest campaign. We talked about it earlier today, and I found myself saying that I might change trip, so that the opposed check is no longer str (+4 from IT) vs str/agi, but also incorporates the BAB of the persons involved. Any of you guys had any experience trying that? Pros and Cons?
primemover003 03-17-07, 10:54 AM	Don't do that... what's the point of his investing in feats if you're merely going to underpower them??? Change up your enemies. Not everything is trippable. Try throwing quadripeds, large creatures, Strong or Dexterous creatures at him. Dwarves stability plus a good strength works wonders. How about creatures that can't be tripped like snakes, oozes, swimming creatures. If the player uses a reach weapon try sundering or disarming it once in a while. A timely Grease spell is nice. Use Creatures with Spring attack and Tumble ranks that can approach and escape without provoking AoO's. Monks and Rogues can be especially hard to trip with good dex scores and high mobility. Use enemies with ranged attacks against him. Try those first before you change the feats. Remember though you should throw creatures he can trip at him too. He bought the abilities and should be allowed to use them, just not ALL the time.
Asmodeur 03-17-07, 11:23 AM	Thanks for the advice, but I am not having any problems with him tripping the opponents, in fact he has had little luck so far, on his attempts. Also, I have no issues with the fact that he uses it, in fact, I adviced him to grab that feat, seeing as we are running a urban campaign, and mediumsized humanoids make up a big chunk of the opposition. The reason that i am considering changing the move is simply that it makes no sense to me that a 20 lvl fighter with 18 str is no better at tripping a_random_guy than a lvl 1 fighter with 18 str. Ofc, the lvl 20 could have the feat, but then again, so could the lvl 1.
ShinAkuma2 03-17-07, 02:43 PM	The reason that i am considering changing the move is simply that it makes no sense to me that a 20 lvl fighter with 18 str is no better at tripping a_random_guy than a lvl 1 fighter with 18 str. Ofc, the lvl 20 could have the feat, but then again, so could the lvl 1. But he IS better. His initial touch attack hits nearly every time, and his follow-through hits much more often, as well. The fact that 18 Str = 18 Str is not a problem of the mechanics.
jaros 03-17-07, 03:03 PM	I suggest adding half fighter level to trip check (and only fighter levels count).
Asmodeur 03-17-07, 07:03 PM	But he IS better. His initial touch attack hits nearly every time, and his follow-through hits much more often, as well. The fact that 18 Str = 18 Str is not a problem of the mechanics. Yeah, guess you are right on the initial touch attack.. Anyway, was just a thought, might try tinkering with a few different possibilities, and if it doesnt work, its fairly easy to revert back to the original rule
Southernskies 03-20-07, 07:32 AM	Trip by itself is fine, balanced and useful. The big problem is the free attack of Improved Trip. If you want to bring it in line with comparable feats, simply remove the free attack after a successful trip. It is still extremely useful, but there is now an opportunity cost (ie: loses the chance to deal damage with the attack) for the benefit. This makes the +4 bonus and no AoO comparable to Improved Disarm and Improved Bull Rush (which have the same heirarchy in the feat chains). I think the writer was on something mind-altering when they wrote that feat.