The only parrying rule [Archive] - Wizards Community

The only parrying rule [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
kenicolo
03-19-07, 05:12 PM Would you use this is your games? OR What woulsd you change to make it suitable for you??

Parry (New action) req shield
You can ready a standard action to parry a melee attack with a shield you only need to ready a parry «I ready my shield against melee / ranged attack" and when an opponent attack you, you can choose to take the readied action or to wait for another attack. If you choose to parry, you loose you shield bonus to AC until your next round, make a melee attack roll modified by your shield AC bonus opposed by the attack roll of the opponent.

You get a penalty of -8 for projectile weapons and -4 on thrown weapons and ranged spell with attack roll. For each weapon size greater than yours, you gain a -4 penalty on the opposed check. If you are successful your shield has taken a full hit as if targeted by a sunder attempt and you don’t take the hit.

If you fail the opposed check then the attack pass trough and STILL must hit your AC. You can parry only 1 attack per round.
You can also ready against an area attack that has a reflex saving throw. The procedure is the same but instead of making an opposed check, you add your shield bonus to AC to the saving throw.

If you use a secondary weapon, then you can use 1 additional parry against a single attack and you still need the Weapon parry feat. You use the same penalty as for fighting with two weapons and this must be declared in the readied action.
* Any Rage/Frenzy/Rage spell or any similar effect disables the Parry option
**The presence of the parry action may encourage the removal of the combat expertise feat

Weapon Parry (feat) req: Bab+1
You can use the parry action with a normal weapon instead of a shield but doing so is more difficult. Follow the normal steps but you take a penalty of -4 with light weapons and an additional -4 to parry any ranged attack.

Improved parry (feat) req: Bab +6, Int 13
You can substitute one of your attack in a full round attack to parry using the same attack modifier.
ex. Bob the fighter has a BAB of 12 ( +12/+7/+2), Bob makes a full round attack on a mean Ogre but decide to retain the second attack to parry so he strike at +12 and +2. On the Ogre's turn the Ogre decide to attack Bob with his great club and roll a total of 16, Bob use his prepared parry at a bonus of +9 (+7 bab and +2 heavy shield) rolls a 12 for a total of 21 and successfully parry the ogre's attack.
You still can parry only once in a round except if you use a secondary weapon and using two-weapon fighting and the weapon parry feat, you can use one of you offhand weapon as an additional parry against one attack and you still use the normal penalties for fighting with two weapons. Effectively, two weapon fighting allow you to try to parry twice the same attack.

Greater Parry (feat) req: Improved parry, Int 13, Bab +11
You can now substitute any number of attack of your full round attack to parry but still can use only 1 parry against the same attack. If you use a secondary weapon, then you can use 1 additional parry against a single attack and you still need the Weapon parry feat. You use the same penalty as for fighting with two weapons.
You also always add you shield Bonus to any reflex saving throws against area attacks.
Jack Greylock
03-19-07, 06:18 PM Yikes to all of that. It allready exists in the rules, it is called taking a Total Defensive action. It is a standard action that adds +4 to your AC
TheRealOrion
03-19-07, 07:11 PM What he said, also "parrying" is classically done with a weapon, not a shield.

What I'd like to see is some way to enhance the bonus of Fighting Defensively but that is reliant upon your Base Attack Bonus, something like Combat Expertise, but without the penalty. Is there an "Improved Combat Expertise" anywhere in the system?
Nom
03-19-07, 09:42 PM CE already allows you to choose whether to use your BAB for offense or defense, though I believe there is a feat somewhere that removes the -5 limit.

A feat that allows you to use BAB for offense AND defense is (1) a must-have for any full-BAB class and (2) renders iterative attacks useless. In D&D, the defensive equivalent of BAB is hit points.
maxxrox
03-19-07, 10:36 PM Yikes to all of that. It allready exists in the rules, it is called taking a Total Defensive action. It is a standard action that adds +4 to your AC
Total Defense is a full-round action. It encompasses parrying and blocking with a shield: overall defensive behavior.l
kenicolo
03-20-07, 10:46 AM This method makes shield more active and mor fun to have.

With this i do not says that parrying is for shield only but that its much easyer with a shield and that it require a little training to do cerrectly with a weapon.

I already know about fight defensively and total defense and Combat expertise. But WOTC choose to make defence passive using AC as DC to hit you. Yes it make things maybe simpler but much less fun. Saying " i fight defensively and add +2 to my AC!!" Is much les fun than:"I retain one attack to parry...I take my parry (roll) YES i did parry it!!!! ha ha ha better luck nex time Ghoul! "

I think that combat expertise and fight defensivly may not be compatible with these parrying rules and should not be use with this variant.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
kenicolo 03-19-07, 05:12 PM	Would you use this is your games? OR What woulsd you change to make it suitable for you?? Parry (New action) req shield You can ready a standard action to parry a melee attack with a shield you only need to ready a parry «I ready my shield against melee / ranged attack" and when an opponent attack you, you can choose to take the readied action or to wait for another attack. If you choose to parry, you loose you shield bonus to AC until your next round, make a melee attack roll modified by your shield AC bonus opposed by the attack roll of the opponent. You get a penalty of -8 for projectile weapons and -4 on thrown weapons and ranged spell with attack roll. For each weapon size greater than yours, you gain a -4 penalty on the opposed check. If you are successful your shield has taken a full hit as if targeted by a sunder attempt and you don’t take the hit. If you fail the opposed check then the attack pass trough and STILL must hit your AC. You can parry only 1 attack per round. You can also ready against an area attack that has a reflex saving throw. The procedure is the same but instead of making an opposed check, you add your shield bonus to AC to the saving throw. If you use a secondary weapon, then you can use 1 additional parry against a single attack and you still need the Weapon parry feat. You use the same penalty as for fighting with two weapons and this must be declared in the readied action. * Any Rage/Frenzy/Rage spell or any similar effect disables the Parry option **The presence of the parry action may encourage the removal of the combat expertise feat Weapon Parry (feat) req: Bab+1 You can use the parry action with a normal weapon instead of a shield but doing so is more difficult. Follow the normal steps but you take a penalty of -4 with light weapons and an additional -4 to parry any ranged attack. Improved parry (feat) req: Bab +6, Int 13 You can substitute one of your attack in a full round attack to parry using the same attack modifier. ex. Bob the fighter has a BAB of 12 ( +12/+7/+2), Bob makes a full round attack on a mean Ogre but decide to retain the second attack to parry so he strike at +12 and +2. On the Ogre's turn the Ogre decide to attack Bob with his great club and roll a total of 16, Bob use his prepared parry at a bonus of +9 (+7 bab and +2 heavy shield) rolls a 12 for a total of 21 and successfully parry the ogre's attack. You still can parry only once in a round except if you use a secondary weapon and using two-weapon fighting and the weapon parry feat, you can use one of you offhand weapon as an additional parry against one attack and you still use the normal penalties for fighting with two weapons. Effectively, two weapon fighting allow you to try to parry twice the same attack. Greater Parry (feat) req: Improved parry, Int 13, Bab +11 You can now substitute any number of attack of your full round attack to parry but still can use only 1 parry against the same attack. If you use a secondary weapon, then you can use 1 additional parry against a single attack and you still need the Weapon parry feat. You use the same penalty as for fighting with two weapons. You also always add you shield Bonus to any reflex saving throws against area attacks.
Jack Greylock 03-19-07, 06:18 PM	Yikes to all of that. It allready exists in the rules, it is called taking a Total Defensive action. It is a standard action that adds +4 to your AC
TheRealOrion 03-19-07, 07:11 PM	What he said, also "parrying" is classically done with a weapon, not a shield. What I'd like to see is some way to enhance the bonus of Fighting Defensively but that is reliant upon your Base Attack Bonus, something like Combat Expertise, but without the penalty. Is there an "Improved Combat Expertise" anywhere in the system?
Nom 03-19-07, 09:42 PM	CE already allows you to choose whether to use your BAB for offense or defense, though I believe there is a feat somewhere that removes the -5 limit. A feat that allows you to use BAB for offense AND defense is (1) a must-have for any full-BAB class and (2) renders iterative attacks useless. In D&D, the defensive equivalent of BAB is hit points.
maxxrox 03-19-07, 10:36 PM	Yikes to all of that. It allready exists in the rules, it is called taking a Total Defensive action. It is a standard action that adds +4 to your AC Total Defense is a full-round action. It encompasses parrying and blocking with a shield: overall defensive behavior.l
kenicolo 03-20-07, 10:46 AM	This method makes shield more active and mor fun to have. With this i do not says that parrying is for shield only but that its much easyer with a shield and that it require a little training to do cerrectly with a weapon. I already know about fight defensively and total defense and Combat expertise. But WOTC choose to make defence passive using AC as DC to hit you. Yes it make things maybe simpler but much less fun. Saying " i fight defensively and add +2 to my AC!!" Is much les fun than:"I retain one attack to parry...I take my parry (roll) YES i did parry it!!!! ha ha ha better luck nex time Ghoul! " I think that combat expertise and fight defensivly may not be compatible with these parrying rules and should not be use with this variant.