Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Kazuhiro 09-21-07, 03:44 PM	I've wanted a character that dual-wielded hand crossbows forever, but a bit of research and testing showed that this was impossible by any means. I believe that any build should be feasible in D&D. This may not be realistic, but it's a nice ideal and to some extent we should work towards it. There are a few reasons for my desire to do this. The obvious first reason is flavor. The second is power; combined with other class features this could be a powerful (and possibly munchable, though I haven't looked into that yet) ranged attacker. The final reason is righteous anger. The hand crossbow is a stupid weapon, and I have dedicated myself to creating a build that gives it its due. And don't tell me it's a holdout weapon; it's an Exotic weapon that costs 100 gp. I am fully prepared to beg and debate for my build, and I think my DM will be understanding. A dual crossbow-wielding character would be wicked cool, but there are problems. First off, hand crossbows can't be reloaded with one hand. Even Versatile Combatant from Drow of the Underdark does not fix this, as far as I know. The obvious solution is to put one crossbow away and draw it again, but putting your weapon away is a move action, to my knowledge. Quick Draw does not solve this. Another solution is to carry a whole bunch of crossbows, but again, you cannot sheathe a weapon as a move action-- it might be possible to just throw one crossbow away then draw the next. I believe dropping the crossbow is a move action, but it would be impossible to create a build based on this strategy. At one point I thought Returning Bolts would be a solution, but Returning is applicable only to thrown weapons. Versatile Combatant does make it so that hand crossbow attacks don't provoke AoOs, however-- so I will want to either invent a feat that has this effect, or bite the bullet and take Versatile Combatant. Help, please!
dman11235 09-21-07, 04:02 PM	Well, you're out of luck here. This is why many prefer the bow. There may be a weapon enhancement that automatically reloads a crossbow, but I don't know where it is. You could always make one.
IdleAltruism 09-21-07, 04:02 PM	Quick Loading is a magical enhancement from the MiC that allows you to reload hand crossbows as a free action.
Lord_Cronos 09-21-07, 04:04 PM	I have seen an auto loading hand crossbow with the quick reload enchantment. It was cool flavor wise but not very helpfull in combat...
bkdubs123 09-21-07, 04:34 PM	You could always use Repeating Crossbows in each hand. If they don't count as Light Crossbows (or Hand, or whatever) for penalties, just houserule that they do and fudge around with various damage output... Another thing to do is houserule that no crossbow is an exotic weapon. Hand-Crossbows might still cost more, and Repeating even more, but any commoner could pick one up and fire them exactly the same as he or she would a regular crossbow (a simple weapon right?). I was talking about this with a few fellow DMs a while back, and we had come up with a few other houserules then, but we didn't write them down. I think there was the idea that you could effectively Manyshot with Repeating Crossbows without needing the feat as long as you had a large enough "clip." Again, as expressed above, if you're really deadset on the Hand Crossbow work on magical enchantments that make it more viable. A Quick/Auto reload enchantment is nothing overpowering, perhaps even something like Everloaded to allow for crazy Manyshot shenanigans.
tarkin 09-21-07, 04:49 PM	There are several enchantments for the crossbow that reduce loading time. I believe that the one that also gets rid of the "two hands requirement" for loading is a +2 enchantment.
jaelis 09-21-07, 05:12 PM	Go for a warforged with two armbows?
szilard 09-21-07, 09:23 PM	Attach a thong to each of your hand crossbows and tie the other ends to your wrists. You can drop them as free actions. Get Quick Draw. -Stuart
Saiyamantis 09-22-07, 12:12 AM	Have you tried Thri-Kreen? They have four arms, so you could wield quickloading hand crossbows in two hands while using the other two to draw bolts. They've also got a ridiculous racial bonus on Jump checks, which gives you an excuse to do the "leaping and firing two guns" routine at every opportunity. EDIT: The quickloading property is hands-free, which means four(!) crossbows a-blazin'. Combine with Crossbow Sniper for pointy doom.
yrogerg 09-22-07, 11:17 AM	Have you tried Thri-Kreen? They have four arms, so you could wield quickloading hand crossbows in two hands while using the other two to draw bolts. They've also got a ridiculous racial bonus on Jump checks, which gives you an excuse to do the "leaping and firing two guns" routine at every opportunity. EDIT: The quickloading property is hands-free, which means four(!) crossbows a-blazin'. Combine with Crossbow Sniper for pointy doom. You've just invented the insect version of Nordom. Congrats.
EvilVegan 09-22-07, 11:24 AM	Another solution is to carry a whole bunch of crossbows, but again, you cannot sheathe a weapon as a move action-- it might be possible to just throw one crossbow away then draw the next. I believe dropping the crossbow is a move action, but it would be impossible to create a build based on this strategy. Dropping a weapon is a free action.
The_Unseen_Illusion 09-22-07, 11:35 PM	I've also wanted to do this with a rogue wuild, but the feats it requires is outrageous. TWF, EWP (and Quick Draw and Rapid Reload if you don't have access to the Auto-Reload property), and if you want even more shots, PB and RS... And we all know how much rogues need their feats. And the need of the Auto-Reloading properties which will drive BOTH of your weapons magic value up by 2. And relying on weapon properties for a build makes me uneasy. It might be a good way to do away with EWP because like bkdubs said, any commoner can point aim and shoot. Perhaps the best way you can do it is if you have an Exotic Weapon that works like a hand crossbow and repeating crossbow (something like a pistol) that does like D3 or something.