Tips for Quarterstaffs? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Tips for Quarterstaffs? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Cadwyn
09-17-07, 02:40 PM Im planning on creating a char that uses a quarterstaff like theres no tomorrow, but I cant seem to find any feats or abilities that makes special use of 1/4staffs.

Anyone got any ideas for feats/spells/classes that enhances the staffing?

EDIT: I have access to most 3.0 and 3.5 books (Our DM is RICH!!!)
The_Shaman
09-17-07, 02:51 PM There's a sweet li'l spell called Shillelagh: get some oils from it :) . I've tried making a staff-wielding swashie once but the game died on me; I was planning on asking for a slightly-modified Dervish PrC. Other than that... Well, be versatile. The staff can be used as a double weapon or as a two-handed one, which makes it quite useful. Of course, it can also be used as a 6-foot pole, and a few other purposes... But I would probably go TWF with it. If you have feats to burn, remember that it counts as a two-hander when you need it - say for power attack (strangely enough) or disarming.

What else... You might want to check the longstaff from CWarrior, it costs a feat to use it but it can be nice if you get surrounded. Plus, it can be used to access the Exotic Weapon Master PrC for a few tricks (I like exotic trip, but it's mostly because I think it looks very cool to sweep someone's legs underneath him with a staff). There isn't really something that much better: it's not one of the greatest weapons mechanically, just a cool one. There are a few weird druid spells regarding it, as well.
Puca
09-17-07, 02:52 PM Ive always been a bit disappointed with the quarterstaff. Its two-handed, which is nice enough, good for high strength, but the stereotypical image is a light, quick fighter-type, but then you want a high dex. But it isnt finesseable. So it sort of seems, to me, like it isnt the ideal choice for twf or for 2hf.

Anyway, PHBII has a bunch of feats, mostly for fighters, that can improve the attacks and damage with certain weapons, like a bludgeoning one. Not staff specific, but you should look at them. It also has Brutal Strike which allows you to possibly sicken an opponent on a good hit with a staff.

CW has Quick staff, a tactical feat that lets you get dodge bonuses. Something like that. Cant recall for sure.
Vharuck
09-17-07, 02:59 PM There is a case for it being finessable. You may fight with both ends, treating them as light weapons. This could also mean that Weapon Finesse applies when TWF with the staff.
The_Shaman
09-17-07, 03:02 PM BTW, in the game I played the DM houseruled it to be finessable. I don't think that made it overpowered... my character had nearly equal str and dex anyway (ok, 14 str 16 dex, but still).
Feeb
09-17-07, 03:06 PM There is a case for it being finessable. You may fight with both ends, treating them as light weapons. This could also mean that Weapon Finesse applies when TWF with the staff.

The fact that a monk can use Flurry of Blows with a quarterstaff also supports this.

There is a weapon style feat from Complete Warrior that basically gives you an additional +2 to AC when using combat expertise when wielding a quarterstaff, and there are several Two-Weapon Fighting feats in PHB2 that are nice (Two-Weapon Pounce, Two-Weapon Rend).
Fireclave
09-17-07, 03:21 PM There is a case for it being finessable. You may fight with both ends, treating them as light weapons. This could also mean that Weapon Finesse applies when TWF with the staff.

Actually, you only treat one end as a light weapon; the other end is treated as a one-handed weapon. So only one end would actually be finesable.

The fact that a monk can use Flurry of Blows with a quarterstaff also supports this.

And even though monks can flurry with it, the flurry ability makes no mention of the ability somehow being dependent on the weapon being light. It's just a coincidences that most of the monk weapons are light. Technically, the monk could also flurry with larger than normal weapons, such as a Huge-sized kama. Not a smart idea, but it still works.

But arguments of realism aside, I'd allow Weapon Finesse to apply to both ends just for the theatrical movie flavor.

In before "Ho Ha-Ha Guard Turn Parry Spin Thrust!"
Puca
09-17-07, 03:23 PM I have no problem with it being finessable. Doing so seems to fit well with flavor for those of us whos knowledge of the weapon is limited to popular films.

But there is no "case" that allowing that is anything but a house rule.
Weapon Finesse applies to light weapons and those specifically listed. It doesnt apply to monk weapons or any other weapons that seem like they should be allowed.

In addition:
You can fight with it as if fighting with two weapons, but if you do, you incur all the normal attack penalties associated with fighting with two weapons, just as if you were using a one-handed weapon and a light weapon.Double Weapons
You can use a double weapon to make an extra attack with the off-hand end of the weapon as if you were fighting with two weapons. The penalties apply as if the off-hand end of the weapon were a light weapon.All the published information that refers to treating this type of attack as a light weapon are limited quite explicitly to the penalties for doing so. That shouldnt be read as "in all ways treated like a light weapon."

Like I said, I think its fine for DMs to allow.
But its in all ways a house rule.
ToastedAmphibian
09-17-07, 10:52 PM The fact that a monk can use Flurry of Blows with a quarterstaff also supports this.

There is a weapon style feat from Complete Warrior that basically gives you an additional +2 to AC when using combat expertise when wielding a quarterstaff, and there are several Two-Weapon Fighting feats in PHB2 that are nice (Two-Weapon Pounce, Two-Weapon Rend).

Id imagine thoes would only work when actually using 2 weapons. (Two-weapon Rend is particularly silly. "I hit you with both ends of my stick! Now i can disembowl you!")
runestar
09-17-07, 10:59 PM All the published information that refers to treating this type of attack as a light weapon are limited quite explicitly to the penalties for doing so. That shouldnt be read as "in all ways treated like a light weapon."

To be fair, the FAQ does rule that the off-hand is finessable.

Is a double weapon considered a two-handed weapon or a one-handed weapon plus a light weapon, for the purposes of feats such as Weapon Finesse and Power Attack?

A double weapon can be wielded in two ways, either as a one-handed weapon and a light weapon, or as a single twohanded weapon. Either way, it follows the normal rules for using such weapons.

Wielding as Two Weapons: The primary end (the “onehanded weapon”) adds your Strength modifier to damage, and the secondary end (the “light weapon”) adds one-half your Strength bonus to damage.

When using Power Attack, bonus damage applies only to the primary end. If you have Weapon Finesse, you may add your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with the secondary end (but
not with the primary end).
Puca
09-18-07, 09:59 AM To be fair, the FAQ does rule that the off-hand is finessable.I stand corrected.
Mindolin
09-18-07, 10:05 AM I have to disagree with you, ToastedAmphibian. Using a double weapon is fighting with two weapons, so it works just as well for the quarterstaff as for two clubs. Slightly better, actually. I do agree with you, however, that the idea of Two Weapon Rend is strange with the quarterstaff, but then again it is strange to be able to rend someone with a bludgeoning weapon at all.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Cadwyn 09-17-07, 02:40 PM	Im planning on creating a char that uses a quarterstaff like theres no tomorrow, but I cant seem to find any feats or abilities that makes special use of 1/4staffs. Anyone got any ideas for feats/spells/classes that enhances the staffing? EDIT: I have access to most 3.0 and 3.5 books (Our DM is RICH!!!)
The_Shaman 09-17-07, 02:51 PM	There's a sweet li'l spell called Shillelagh: get some oils from it :) . I've tried making a staff-wielding swashie once but the game died on me; I was planning on asking for a slightly-modified Dervish PrC. Other than that... Well, be versatile. The staff can be used as a double weapon or as a two-handed one, which makes it quite useful. Of course, it can also be used as a 6-foot pole, and a few other purposes... But I would probably go TWF with it. If you have feats to burn, remember that it counts as a two-hander when you need it - say for power attack (strangely enough) or disarming. What else... You might want to check the longstaff from CWarrior, it costs a feat to use it but it can be nice if you get surrounded. Plus, it can be used to access the Exotic Weapon Master PrC for a few tricks (I like exotic trip, but it's mostly because I think it looks very cool to sweep someone's legs underneath him with a staff). There isn't really something that much better: it's not one of the greatest weapons mechanically, just a cool one. There are a few weird druid spells regarding it, as well.
Puca 09-17-07, 02:52 PM	Ive always been a bit disappointed with the quarterstaff. Its two-handed, which is nice enough, good for high strength, but the stereotypical image is a light, quick fighter-type, but then you want a high dex. But it isnt finesseable. So it sort of seems, to me, like it isnt the ideal choice for twf or for 2hf. Anyway, PHBII has a bunch of feats, mostly for fighters, that can improve the attacks and damage with certain weapons, like a bludgeoning one. Not staff specific, but you should look at them. It also has Brutal Strike which allows you to possibly sicken an opponent on a good hit with a staff. CW has Quick staff, a tactical feat that lets you get dodge bonuses. Something like that. Cant recall for sure.
Vharuck 09-17-07, 02:59 PM	There is a case for it being finessable. You may fight with both ends, treating them as light weapons. This could also mean that Weapon Finesse applies when TWF with the staff.
The_Shaman 09-17-07, 03:02 PM	BTW, in the game I played the DM houseruled it to be finessable. I don't think that made it overpowered... my character had nearly equal str and dex anyway (ok, 14 str 16 dex, but still).
Feeb 09-17-07, 03:06 PM	There is a case for it being finessable. You may fight with both ends, treating them as light weapons. This could also mean that Weapon Finesse applies when TWF with the staff. The fact that a monk can use Flurry of Blows with a quarterstaff also supports this. There is a weapon style feat from Complete Warrior that basically gives you an additional +2 to AC when using combat expertise when wielding a quarterstaff, and there are several Two-Weapon Fighting feats in PHB2 that are nice (Two-Weapon Pounce, Two-Weapon Rend).
Fireclave 09-17-07, 03:21 PM	There is a case for it being finessable. You may fight with both ends, treating them as light weapons. This could also mean that Weapon Finesse applies when TWF with the staff. Actually, you only treat one end as a light weapon; the other end is treated as a one-handed weapon. So only one end would actually be finesable. The fact that a monk can use Flurry of Blows with a quarterstaff also supports this. And even though monks can flurry with it, the flurry ability makes no mention of the ability somehow being dependent on the weapon being light. It's just a coincidences that most of the monk weapons are light. Technically, the monk could also flurry with larger than normal weapons, such as a Huge-sized kama. Not a smart idea, but it still works. But arguments of realism aside, I'd allow Weapon Finesse to apply to both ends just for the theatrical movie flavor. In before "Ho Ha-Ha Guard Turn Parry Spin Thrust!"
Puca 09-17-07, 03:23 PM	I have no problem with it being finessable. Doing so seems to fit well with flavor for those of us whos knowledge of the weapon is limited to popular films. But there is no "case" that allowing that is anything but a house rule. Weapon Finesse applies to light weapons and those specifically listed. It doesnt apply to monk weapons or any other weapons that seem like they should be allowed. In addition: You can fight with it as if fighting with two weapons, but if you do, you incur all the normal attack penalties associated with fighting with two weapons, just as if you were using a one-handed weapon and a light weapon.Double Weapons You can use a double weapon to make an extra attack with the off-hand end of the weapon as if you were fighting with two weapons. The penalties apply as if the off-hand end of the weapon were a light weapon.All the published information that refers to treating this type of attack as a light weapon are limited quite explicitly to the penalties for doing so. That shouldnt be read as "in all ways treated like a light weapon." Like I said, I think its fine for DMs to allow. But its in all ways a house rule.
ToastedAmphibian 09-17-07, 10:52 PM	The fact that a monk can use Flurry of Blows with a quarterstaff also supports this. There is a weapon style feat from Complete Warrior that basically gives you an additional +2 to AC when using combat expertise when wielding a quarterstaff, and there are several Two-Weapon Fighting feats in PHB2 that are nice (Two-Weapon Pounce, Two-Weapon Rend). Id imagine thoes would only work when actually using 2 weapons. (Two-weapon Rend is particularly silly. "I hit you with both ends of my stick! Now i can disembowl you!")
runestar 09-17-07, 10:59 PM	All the published information that refers to treating this type of attack as a light weapon are limited quite explicitly to the penalties for doing so. That shouldnt be read as "in all ways treated like a light weapon." To be fair, the FAQ does rule that the off-hand is finessable. Is a double weapon considered a two-handed weapon or a one-handed weapon plus a light weapon, for the purposes of feats such as Weapon Finesse and Power Attack? A double weapon can be wielded in two ways, either as a one-handed weapon and a light weapon, or as a single twohanded weapon. Either way, it follows the normal rules for using such weapons. Wielding as Two Weapons: The primary end (the “onehanded weapon”) adds your Strength modifier to damage, and the secondary end (the “light weapon”) adds one-half your Strength bonus to damage. When using Power Attack, bonus damage applies only to the primary end. If you have Weapon Finesse, you may add your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with the secondary end (but not with the primary end).
Puca 09-18-07, 09:59 AM	To be fair, the FAQ does rule that the off-hand is finessable.I stand corrected.
Mindolin 09-18-07, 10:05 AM	I have to disagree with you, ToastedAmphibian. Using a double weapon is fighting with two weapons, so it works just as well for the quarterstaff as for two clubs. Slightly better, actually. I do agree with you, however, that the idea of Two Weapon Rend is strange with the quarterstaff, but then again it is strange to be able to rend someone with a bludgeoning weapon at all.