Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Droma 04-26-07, 02:40 PM	Im looking to add to add levels of swordsage to a lvl10 rogue but im a little confused as to what level of manuevers I can take. After reading the initiator level rules a rogue10/swordsage1 would have initiator level 6. However im specifically looking to get assasins stance which is a 3rd level stance. Under the description of the requirements under level it says swordsage 3. Does this mean I need 3 levels in swordsage or just an initiator level equal to a level 3 swordsage?
Archangel_Arcanis 04-26-07, 02:48 PM	it would be initiator level 5 which you would have with your current set up at SS lvl 1. It is listed in this format [initiator class(s) with access to that school] [lvl of maneuver] and it has a table with what initiator lvl you have to be to select a certain lvl of maneuver, happens to be same as wiz/clr spell lvl equivalents.
NoldorForce 04-26-07, 02:52 PM	A_A is correct. However, I believe that you still cannot take the stance at your first swordsage level by RAW, considering that all of the initiator base classes explicitly give out a 1st-level stance at 1st level, not a stance that you qualify for. It seems like an oversight, however, so talk to your DM about it.
Nadaka 04-26-07, 03:00 PM	Noldor force is correct, you must pick a level1 stance when you pick up that first level in a martial class. However, I would point out that the island of blades stance is level 1 and is gravy for getting flanking much more often. IMO you should pick up 2 levels of swordsage. Its well worth it.
Droma 04-26-07, 03:24 PM	I planned on going for 2 levels in swordsage to get assasins stance and island of blades. I just wanted to clarify if I qualified for assasins stance with my first level of swordsage which it looks like I dont if im understanding you guys correctly.
mostholy2 04-26-07, 04:04 PM	In each of the martial class stance descriptions, it states specifically that the stance that you take at lvl1 of the class must be first level. Stances Known:You begin play with knowledge of one 1st-level stance from any discipline open to you. At 2nd, 5th, 9th, 14th and 20th level you can choose additional stances. After first level, the Level descriptor in the maneuver descriptions are NOT pre-requisites to learn the maneuvers. They are only for reference. You are only limited in your choice of maneuvers (stances included) by your initiator level and the pre-reqs required to learn them. So at Rogue10/Swordsage2 you could choose Assasin's stance.
Xaxor 04-26-07, 04:15 PM	No, the first level in any martial adept always gives a first level stance. Stances Known: You begin play with knowledge of one 1st-level stance from any discipline open to you.
Droma 04-26-07, 05:18 PM	Thanks for the info I think I was just skimming and read it as at 1st level you gain a stance and at levels x, y, z, etc. you gain an additional stance known. Alright so ill be taking island of blades first followed by assassins stance.
Nezkrul 04-26-07, 08:19 PM	you can always take a stance you qualify for as one of your maneuvers known.
Scribbler 04-26-07, 08:44 PM	The "swordsage 3" thing is the maneuver level, not the initiator level needed. Kinda like the difference between spell level and caster level. So as a 3rd-level sworsage maneuver, you'll need to initiate as a 5th-level swordsage to use it, which you will. The thing about needing to take a 1st-level stance at first level still applies (I never noticed that.. I agree that it's probably an oversight. Doesn't say that for normal maneuvers, though, so you can take a 3rd-level one as long as you meet the prereqs.
Nadaka 04-26-07, 09:10 PM	you can always take a stance you qualify for as one of your maneuvers known. no. You can not select stances with maneuvers known, they are gained through stances known.