Weapon Finesse: One weapon? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Weapon Finesse: One weapon? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Ebonarc
07-08-07, 10:35 PM I have a running disagreement with one of my friends. He says that when a character takes Weapon Finesse, it applies to only one weapon of the player's choice, just like Weapon Focus.

I say it applies to all light weapons, rapiers, whips, and spiked chains, the weapons mentioned in the description. It doesn't say "Choose one type of weapon" like it does for Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization.

Who's right?
StevenO
07-08-07, 10:40 PM You both are or were.

In 3.0 you had to specify a weapon to use with finesse. The 3.5 upgrade removed that so taking the feat once now allows it to apply to all finessable weapons.
NoldorForce
07-08-07, 10:41 PM You are. The text gives out the bonus as a blanket effect on all eligible weapons. Some classes in 3.5 get it as a bonus feat, such as the Swashbuckler. No associated weapon is ever mentioned.

Your friend may have been used to the 3.0 version, in which you did choose one weapon.
Ebonarc
07-08-07, 10:44 PM You both are or were.

In 3.0 you had to specify a weapon to use with finesse. The 3.5 upgrade removed that so taking the feat once now allows it to apply to all finessable weapons.

Thank you both. I couldn't think of a reason why it would apply to only one. I didn't know the 3.0 version was one-weapon-only. My friend started out with 3.5, so I still have to figure out how he got that notion.

As a sidenote, can it apply to melee touch attacks (such as for touch spells)?
runestar
07-08-07, 11:04 PM As a sidenote, can it apply to melee touch attacks (such as for touch spells)?
Yes.

Thank you both. I couldn't think of a reason why it would apply to only one. I didn't know the 3.0 version was one-weapon-only. My friend started out with 3.5, so I still have to figure out how he got that notion.
I seem to recall someone mentioning that the summary for weapon finesse in the 3.5 PHB stated that it applied to only 1 weapon, the actual feat desc states that it applies to all finessable weapons. Could that be where the confusion lies?
mad_man0816
07-08-07, 11:44 PM I seem to recall someone mentioning that the summary for weapon finesse in the 3.5 PHB stated that it applied to only 1 weapon, the actual feat desc states that it applies to all finessable weapons. Could that be where the confusion lies?

You're definitely on the right track. In the 'Prerequistits' column of Table 5-1: Feat in the PHB next to Weapon Finesse it says "Proficiency with weapon" which may be what is confusing people. It does not mean you have to choose a single weapon that you're proficient with, it means that you can finesse with ALL light (or otherwise finessable) weapons that you are proficient with.

The 'Benefit' column confirms this fact by saying "Use Dex modifier instead of Str modifier on attacks with light melee weapons"....note the bold letter.
Frugal
07-09-07, 08:12 AM If memory serves, didn't the 3.5 PHB have the footnote next to Weapon Finesse in the feats table stating that you select a specific weapon for it to apply to? Of course the feat text itself (the primary source) doesn't state this and I think it was fixed in newer printings of the PHB too.
Leilond
07-09-07, 08:13 AM If memory serves, didn't the 3.5 PHB have the footnote next to Weapon Finesse in the feats table stating that you select a specific weapon for it to apply to? Of course the feat text itself (the primary source) doesn't state this and I think it was fixed in newer printings of the PHB too.

Your memory doesn't serve ;), that footnote is only for "weapon focus" but it isn't present for the weapon finesse
Frugal
07-09-07, 08:40 AM Your memory doesn't serve ;), that footnote is only for "weapon focus" but it isn't present for the weapon finesse

As I said, I think that it was fixed for later printings of the PHB. I'm away from my books so I can't check if it's in mine or not. It would also be a footnote for improved critical and other similar feats.
Leilond
07-09-07, 08:58 AM As I said, I think that it was fixed for later printings of the PHB. I'm away from my books so I can't check if it's in mine or not. It would also be a footnote for improved critical and other similar feats.

Ok... that sounds possible... The italian version doesn't possess the footnote for "weapon finesse", nor the "english version" of the manual I have... pheraps it was fixed
snakeman830
07-09-07, 10:45 AM You're definitely on the right track. In the 'Prerequistits' column of Table 5-1: Feat in the PHB next to Weapon Finesse it says "Proficiency with weapon" which may be what is confusing people. It does not mean you have to choose a single weapon that you're proficient with, it means that you can finesse with ALL light (or otherwise finessable) weapons that you are proficient with.

The 'Benefit' column confirms this fact by saying "Use Dex modifier instead of Str modifier on attacks with light melee weapons"....note the bold letter.

Mine says the prereq's are: BAB +1. That's it. You don't even have to be proficient in any weapon!.
Ebonarc
07-09-07, 11:38 AM Yes.I thank you, and my friend (who likes playing sorcerers with STR penalties) thanks you.

Mine says the prereq's are: BAB +1. That's it. You don't even have to be proficient in any weapon!.That's what mine says, too.
Wolf72
07-09-07, 12:45 PM wow, learned something today! ... I always thought it was choose one weapon too. (then again my version of updating to 3.5 is using the SRD and not rereading every single rule).

so it applies to all light weapons as long as your are proficient with them.
Frugal
07-09-07, 01:05 PM wow, learned something today! ... I always thought it was choose one weapon too. (then again my version of updating to 3.5 is using the SRD and not rereading every single rule).

so it applies to all light weapons as long as your are proficient with them.

Yep, and the few one-handed weapons that are finesseable (like the rapier) and if memory serves, the Elven Courtblade is a 2-handed exotic weapon that works with it as well.
AAB
07-09-07, 01:46 PM and the good ol' spiked chain.
Scion of Coldshard
07-09-07, 01:50 PM Be careful about using a shield though, weapon finesse can really hose you there.
AAB
07-09-07, 05:49 PM just get a mithral heavy shield and you're fine.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ebonarc 07-08-07, 10:35 PM	I have a running disagreement with one of my friends. He says that when a character takes Weapon Finesse, it applies to only one weapon of the player's choice, just like Weapon Focus. I say it applies to all light weapons, rapiers, whips, and spiked chains, the weapons mentioned in the description. It doesn't say "Choose one type of weapon" like it does for Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization. Who's right?
StevenO 07-08-07, 10:40 PM	You both are or were. In 3.0 you had to specify a weapon to use with finesse. The 3.5 upgrade removed that so taking the feat once now allows it to apply to all finessable weapons.
NoldorForce 07-08-07, 10:41 PM	You are. The text gives out the bonus as a blanket effect on all eligible weapons. Some classes in 3.5 get it as a bonus feat, such as the Swashbuckler. No associated weapon is ever mentioned. Your friend may have been used to the 3.0 version, in which you did choose one weapon.
Ebonarc 07-08-07, 10:44 PM	You both are or were. In 3.0 you had to specify a weapon to use with finesse. The 3.5 upgrade removed that so taking the feat once now allows it to apply to all finessable weapons. Thank you both. I couldn't think of a reason why it would apply to only one. I didn't know the 3.0 version was one-weapon-only. My friend started out with 3.5, so I still have to figure out how he got that notion. As a sidenote, can it apply to melee touch attacks (such as for touch spells)?
runestar 07-08-07, 11:04 PM	As a sidenote, can it apply to melee touch attacks (such as for touch spells)? Yes. Thank you both. I couldn't think of a reason why it would apply to only one. I didn't know the 3.0 version was one-weapon-only. My friend started out with 3.5, so I still have to figure out how he got that notion. I seem to recall someone mentioning that the summary for weapon finesse in the 3.5 PHB stated that it applied to only 1 weapon, the actual feat desc states that it applies to all finessable weapons. Could that be where the confusion lies?
mad_man0816 07-08-07, 11:44 PM	I seem to recall someone mentioning that the summary for weapon finesse in the 3.5 PHB stated that it applied to only 1 weapon, the actual feat desc states that it applies to all finessable weapons. Could that be where the confusion lies? You're definitely on the right track. In the 'Prerequistits' column of Table 5-1: Feat in the PHB next to Weapon Finesse it says "Proficiency with weapon" which may be what is confusing people. It does not mean you have to choose a single weapon that you're proficient with, it means that you can finesse with ALL light (or otherwise finessable) weapons that you are proficient with. The 'Benefit' column confirms this fact by saying "Use Dex modifier instead of Str modifier on attacks with light melee weapons"....note the bold letter.
Frugal 07-09-07, 08:12 AM	If memory serves, didn't the 3.5 PHB have the footnote next to Weapon Finesse in the feats table stating that you select a specific weapon for it to apply to? Of course the feat text itself (the primary source) doesn't state this and I think it was fixed in newer printings of the PHB too.
Leilond 07-09-07, 08:13 AM	If memory serves, didn't the 3.5 PHB have the footnote next to Weapon Finesse in the feats table stating that you select a specific weapon for it to apply to? Of course the feat text itself (the primary source) doesn't state this and I think it was fixed in newer printings of the PHB too. Your memory doesn't serve ;), that footnote is only for "weapon focus" but it isn't present for the weapon finesse
Frugal 07-09-07, 08:40 AM	Your memory doesn't serve ;), that footnote is only for "weapon focus" but it isn't present for the weapon finesse As I said, I think that it was fixed for later printings of the PHB. I'm away from my books so I can't check if it's in mine or not. It would also be a footnote for improved critical and other similar feats.
Leilond 07-09-07, 08:58 AM	As I said, I think that it was fixed for later printings of the PHB. I'm away from my books so I can't check if it's in mine or not. It would also be a footnote for improved critical and other similar feats. Ok... that sounds possible... The italian version doesn't possess the footnote for "weapon finesse", nor the "english version" of the manual I have... pheraps it was fixed
snakeman830 07-09-07, 10:45 AM	You're definitely on the right track. In the 'Prerequistits' column of Table 5-1: Feat in the PHB next to Weapon Finesse it says "Proficiency with weapon" which may be what is confusing people. It does not mean you have to choose a single weapon that you're proficient with, it means that you can finesse with ALL light (or otherwise finessable) weapons that you are proficient with. The 'Benefit' column confirms this fact by saying "Use Dex modifier instead of Str modifier on attacks with light melee weapons"....note the bold letter. Mine says the prereq's are: BAB +1. That's it. You don't even have to be proficient in any weapon!.
Ebonarc 07-09-07, 11:38 AM	Yes.I thank you, and my friend (who likes playing sorcerers with STR penalties) thanks you. Mine says the prereq's are: BAB +1. That's it. You don't even have to be proficient in any weapon!.That's what mine says, too.
Wolf72 07-09-07, 12:45 PM	wow, learned something today! ... I always thought it was choose one weapon too. (then again my version of updating to 3.5 is using the SRD and not rereading every single rule). so it applies to all light weapons as long as your are proficient with them.
Frugal 07-09-07, 01:05 PM	wow, learned something today! ... I always thought it was choose one weapon too. (then again my version of updating to 3.5 is using the SRD and not rereading every single rule). so it applies to all light weapons as long as your are proficient with them. Yep, and the few one-handed weapons that are finesseable (like the rapier) and if memory serves, the Elven Courtblade is a 2-handed exotic weapon that works with it as well.
AAB 07-09-07, 01:46 PM	and the good ol' spiked chain.
Scion of Coldshard 07-09-07, 01:50 PM	Be careful about using a shield though, weapon finesse can really hose you there.
AAB 07-09-07, 05:49 PM	just get a mithral heavy shield and you're fine.