What's the Point of Skill Tricks? [Archive] - Wizards Community

What's the Point of Skill Tricks? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
jadehawk
03-20-07, 06:02 PM Granted I haven't given them too hard a look, but they just look like feats to me. This suggests that its just a way to give rogue and bard types featlike abilities at a lower cost (swapping a few of their many skill points to gain "feats"). Am I wrong? What am I neglecting?
Dead_Weasel
03-20-07, 06:39 PM They have a much lower level of power than feats, and are usable only once per encounter. Outside of combat, each one can be used once per minute. Unless you use feats or a skill trick PrC to get more, you can only have your level/2 (rounded down) skill tricks. The skill requirements on the better ones help to ensure that only mid- to high-level characters can take them.
Note that I'm not disagreeing with you; personally I think of them as mini-feats.
jadehawk
03-20-07, 06:41 PM ahh...thanks.

So basically they are just toppling on a entirely new pseudo-feat ability based on skills with restrictions to keep the amount known and used down.
Dead_Weasel
03-20-07, 06:44 PM Essentially. As if things weren't complicated enough already, right?
Dead_Weasel
03-20-07, 06:44 PM Oh, and some of them require a swift action, on top of everything else. Most of them piggyback though - they are skill tricks, after all.
o_b_livion
03-20-07, 08:38 PM Well, actually White Wolf had these in their skills as well. Where you expend experience to specialize in one area. Yes their are skill tricks, only tricks. Not that big of a deal and adds more flavor to your character. Sorta like, if you are knowledgable about driving but you know how to do a quick U-turn if you're pursued (Can learn that in specialized driving school).
UnknownMourner
03-20-07, 09:00 PM The movement ones are alright.

My favorite is the corner climbing one. It can really tip the balance in doorjam battles.
arjomanes
03-20-07, 09:07 PM They are pretty potent abilities when compared to some of the weakest feats and are a strong boost to skills-based characters. I think skill feats increase the power curve for skills characters (and those with average skill points) somewhat. The poor fighter isn't helped any by the advent of skill tricks.

The restriction on once-an-encounter still leaves them pretty potent compared to many feats, since often you only need to be able to use an ability once an encounter. Many feats only get used once an encounter too - like alertness (sure you may need spot or listen throughout an encounter, but for most it determines whether or not you get to play in the surprise round).

Skill tricks won't compare to Power Attack or Metamagic, but they can compare to Toughness, Alertness, Nimble Fingers, etc.
Dead_Weasel
03-20-07, 09:32 PM White Wolf's skill specialization wasn't anything like skill tricks.
The specialization was just a couple extra dice when you attempted a task within your specialization; skill tricks are, for the most part, minor abilities that require the skill check to have already succeeded, or allow you to use a skill in a way that's normally outside of the rules.
Assuming, of course, that I'm thinking of the same mechanic; if I'm mistaken, my apologies.

I will agree that skill tricks win vs. weak feats, and that the once per encounter isn't particularly limiting. Pick up two or three skill tricks that let you squeeze in more sneak attacks and you're ready to slaughter the unprepared.
Josephvaile
03-21-07, 07:44 AM I kindo of think of them as giving your character more cool visual effects, think about it, a Frost Mage cast wall of ice. Flashy sure but. Ex. Frost mage casts Wall of Ice then runs up the side of it and lands on top. Basically they put them in there for the game to become more like an action movie. Just as 0-Level spells were put into the game because players were upset that there wizards could not to magical tricks like Gandalf or whatever. Now characters can do extremly dramatic actions.
Flan
03-21-07, 09:34 AM Yes, they'r basically free feats. They were running out of ideas on how to power up characters because they already have about every "I win" spell they could think of so they started working no skills.
Seldriss
03-21-07, 09:36 AM The idea is nice but not so necessary.
Personally i use Action Points and i come to the same results, even more, as i give more options with AP.
NoldorForce
03-21-07, 11:55 AM Part of the point of them is that there have been a number of feats that do this sort of thing (albeit more often) that just don't get taken because they're not worth the precious feat slots. But skill points are generally more plentiful, hence the introduction of skill tricks to accomplish similar things without forcing an inflated price that few people will pay.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
jadehawk 03-20-07, 06:02 PM	Granted I haven't given them too hard a look, but they just look like feats to me. This suggests that its just a way to give rogue and bard types featlike abilities at a lower cost (swapping a few of their many skill points to gain "feats"). Am I wrong? What am I neglecting?
Dead_Weasel 03-20-07, 06:39 PM	They have a much lower level of power than feats, and are usable only once per encounter. Outside of combat, each one can be used once per minute. Unless you use feats or a skill trick PrC to get more, you can only have your level/2 (rounded down) skill tricks. The skill requirements on the better ones help to ensure that only mid- to high-level characters can take them. Note that I'm not disagreeing with you; personally I think of them as mini-feats.
jadehawk 03-20-07, 06:41 PM	ahh...thanks. So basically they are just toppling on a entirely new pseudo-feat ability based on skills with restrictions to keep the amount known and used down.
Dead_Weasel 03-20-07, 06:44 PM	Essentially. As if things weren't complicated enough already, right?
Dead_Weasel 03-20-07, 06:44 PM	Oh, and some of them require a swift action, on top of everything else. Most of them piggyback though - they are skill tricks, after all.
o_b_livion 03-20-07, 08:38 PM	Well, actually White Wolf had these in their skills as well. Where you expend experience to specialize in one area. Yes their are skill tricks, only tricks. Not that big of a deal and adds more flavor to your character. Sorta like, if you are knowledgable about driving but you know how to do a quick U-turn if you're pursued (Can learn that in specialized driving school).
UnknownMourner 03-20-07, 09:00 PM	The movement ones are alright. My favorite is the corner climbing one. It can really tip the balance in doorjam battles.
arjomanes 03-20-07, 09:07 PM	They are pretty potent abilities when compared to some of the weakest feats and are a strong boost to skills-based characters. I think skill feats increase the power curve for skills characters (and those with average skill points) somewhat. The poor fighter isn't helped any by the advent of skill tricks. The restriction on once-an-encounter still leaves them pretty potent compared to many feats, since often you only need to be able to use an ability once an encounter. Many feats only get used once an encounter too - like alertness (sure you may need spot or listen throughout an encounter, but for most it determines whether or not you get to play in the surprise round). Skill tricks won't compare to Power Attack or Metamagic, but they can compare to Toughness, Alertness, Nimble Fingers, etc.
Dead_Weasel 03-20-07, 09:32 PM	White Wolf's skill specialization wasn't anything like skill tricks. The specialization was just a couple extra dice when you attempted a task within your specialization; skill tricks are, for the most part, minor abilities that require the skill check to have already succeeded, or allow you to use a skill in a way that's normally outside of the rules. Assuming, of course, that I'm thinking of the same mechanic; if I'm mistaken, my apologies. I will agree that skill tricks win vs. weak feats, and that the once per encounter isn't particularly limiting. Pick up two or three skill tricks that let you squeeze in more sneak attacks and you're ready to slaughter the unprepared.
Josephvaile 03-21-07, 07:44 AM	I kindo of think of them as giving your character more cool visual effects, think about it, a Frost Mage cast wall of ice. Flashy sure but. Ex. Frost mage casts Wall of Ice then runs up the side of it and lands on top. Basically they put them in there for the game to become more like an action movie. Just as 0-Level spells were put into the game because players were upset that there wizards could not to magical tricks like Gandalf or whatever. Now characters can do extremly dramatic actions.
Flan 03-21-07, 09:34 AM	Yes, they'r basically free feats. They were running out of ideas on how to power up characters because they already have about every "I win" spell they could think of so they started working no skills.
Seldriss 03-21-07, 09:36 AM	The idea is nice but not so necessary. Personally i use Action Points and i come to the same results, even more, as i give more options with AP.
NoldorForce 03-21-07, 11:55 AM	Part of the point of them is that there have been a number of feats that do this sort of thing (albeit more often) that just don't get taken because they're not worth the precious feat slots. But skill points are generally more plentiful, hence the introduction of skill tricks to accomplish similar things without forcing an inflated price that few people will pay.