What skill(s) can you use to smell? [Archive] - Wizards Community

What skill(s) can you use to smell? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Maldrin
05-04-07, 10:19 AM There have been many times throughout my life when an odd odor catches my nose and I wander about the house tracking down the source. I'm not listening for anything, I'm not trying to spot anything, per se. But I do usually manage to find the source of the smell.

What skill or skills would best be used to simulate this in-game? I know that a creature with the Scent feat can use survival to track via scent trail, but this isn't quite the same thing.

So what say the forums? Here's your chance to decide: you are the DM, your player has just announced that they will attempt to find where the odor is eminating from by their sense of smell. What do you tell them to roll?
tarkin
05-04-07, 10:22 AM It should be a Spot check.

Also, you really need the feat Scent, that is not supposed to be available to everyone.
Maldrin
05-04-07, 10:56 AM I suppose I could understand it being a Spot check. I don't feel 100% happy with that, but at the same time I can't thing of anything to make a better fit.

And just to clarify, I'm not asking about tracking a creature via smell or picking up a scent trail or anything like that. I'm asking more in regards to the that's a funny smell, I wonder where it's coming from and subsequent colder/warmer/red hot game of figuring out where it's coming from.
magicmike660
05-04-07, 11:22 AM I would say survival. It wouldn't be spot becuase that relies entirely on your eyes.
Ulandorf_TheBlue
05-04-07, 12:27 PM So in essence a Wis check (those with no ranks in Survival) to judge where its coming from and what not, but I agree with a Survival check.
Maldrin
05-04-07, 12:33 PM I can agree with the Survival/WIS check. It makes sense. You're trying to deduce where the smell is coming from. I think that's how I'll rule on this question from now on. House rule ahoy!
Jaxgaret
05-04-07, 03:01 PM Using a Survival check sounds good to me.
tarkin
05-04-07, 03:02 PM If I did not do a Spot check, I would use a Survival check.

It sounds almost as good to me.
EvilVegan
05-04-07, 03:11 PM I'd say a wisdom check for anyone without scent and a survival check for anyone with. There's only so much you can do with a mundane nose.

I'd give gnomes +2. And the ability to detect scents when not actively searching. . . :)
Jaxgaret
05-04-07, 03:19 PM I'd give gnomes +2. And the ability to detect scents when not actively searching. . . :)

Auto Detect Odors? ;)
StevenO
05-04-07, 07:48 PM A Smell (Wis) check. Of course it can be used untrained.

I'd actually recommend Spot to detect the smell as few people would ever take the Smell skill. To locate the source would require Seach although the DC may be modified by the strength of the smell.
Fireclave
05-05-07, 02:52 AM I would say that in the absence of the Scent ability, mudane, human ability to smell would fall under the search skill. Spot is sight oriented, but Search includes anything and everything you do to find what it is you are looking for in that 5ft x 5ft squire (feeling, tapping, kicking, poking, scraping, prodding, brushing, dusting, and in this case, smelling). If the source of the smell is particulary strong, perhaps having additionals DC to notice the presense and strength of the scent at a distance.

Exmample of a normal scent - The slightly strong odor of an particular alchemic agent admist other alchemic substances in a wizard's lab. You can smell the presense of the agent when you enter the lab, so you're sure there's something to be found in the room, but can't determine the exact location of the source. Otherwise, the normal search DC applies.

Example of a strong scent

60ft - DC 20 - A smell something
20ft - DC 10 - It's over here somewhere
05ft - DC 05 - It's so close, I can taste it
00ft - DC 00 - Cookies!
EvilVegan
05-05-07, 08:51 AM :cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie:
:cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie:
:cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie:
:cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie:
:cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie:
j3st3r
05-05-07, 09:45 AM Great example from Fireclave. I also would say that smelling is definitely part of a search skill.
BW0222
05-05-07, 04:12 PM Folks,

Simple wisdom check.

Scent already allows tracking by scent using a wisdom check.

It can not be a search or spot check. Search is action only. And creatures with a good spot are not necessarily any better at smelling things. An eagle's good eyesight shouldn't help it smell any better. It is honestly as different from spotting as listen is.

I'm not sure survival should be any help. It seems to far related. Knowing how to dig up roots, determine direction, etc. shouldn't help one smell pies.
the_icon
05-06-07, 07:40 PM To be perfectly honest, I would have them do a search check, since they're actively searching for the source of that funny smell. Searching doesn't necessarily imply direct reliance on seeing, but instead can be loosely interpreted to be the co-operation of all(,some or most) of your senses to locate something.

(Think of it this way: Your bedroom, late at night. You have to pee. You get up, stumble across the room, and use your hands to find the light switch. You're searching for it, but you're not using your eyes.)
JLaurHughes
05-06-07, 08:00 PM Maxis: *Sniffs the air* Guy's what's that smell?
Everyone else: *Sniffs the air*
Juni: *Scrunching her nose* Smells like a wet dog.
Everyone else falls silent and Maxis asks: Ok, where is it coming from?
Juni: *Sniffing the air again and moving in one direction then the opposite* Well, it's hard to tell, I think there are two ways to get to the source, or we're surrounded by many things giving off that smell.
Maxis: *In a whisper* Be on your guard, Juni, take point, we're going to find that source.

And it goes on from there with two possible outcomes. I would say it's more of a Search&spot check, an Int check to determine what the smell is and which direction it comes from, then a spot to see what is making that smell.
Maldrin
05-08-07, 02:33 PM Thanks, everybody, for the feedback.

I think I will leave it open to my players to use either Search or Survival, if they can justify it. One of my PCs is a lycanthrope who has been psioncially barred from shapeshifting, but still has access to the lycanthropic senses. Survival/Scent would work there. But the cleric NPC would probably need to use Search.

I also like Fireclave's DC table. I think that would be pretty useful. And I could also incorporate JLaurHughes' suggestion of an INT check to tell what it is. Perhaps modified by appropriate skills (Craft or Profession) related to the scent?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Maldrin 05-04-07, 10:19 AM	There have been many times throughout my life when an odd odor catches my nose and I wander about the house tracking down the source. I'm not listening for anything, I'm not trying to spot anything, per se. But I do usually manage to find the source of the smell. What skill or skills would best be used to simulate this in-game? I know that a creature with the Scent feat can use survival to track via scent trail, but this isn't quite the same thing. So what say the forums? Here's your chance to decide: you are the DM, your player has just announced that they will attempt to find where the odor is eminating from by their sense of smell. What do you tell them to roll?
tarkin 05-04-07, 10:22 AM	It should be a Spot check. Also, you really need the feat Scent, that is not supposed to be available to everyone.
Maldrin 05-04-07, 10:56 AM	I suppose I could understand it being a Spot check. I don't feel 100% happy with that, but at the same time I can't thing of anything to make a better fit. And just to clarify, I'm not asking about tracking a creature via smell or picking up a scent trail or anything like that. I'm asking more in regards to the that's a funny smell, I wonder where it's coming from and subsequent colder/warmer/red hot game of figuring out where it's coming from.
magicmike660 05-04-07, 11:22 AM	I would say survival. It wouldn't be spot becuase that relies entirely on your eyes.
Ulandorf_TheBlue 05-04-07, 12:27 PM	So in essence a Wis check (those with no ranks in Survival) to judge where its coming from and what not, but I agree with a Survival check.
Maldrin 05-04-07, 12:33 PM	I can agree with the Survival/WIS check. It makes sense. You're trying to deduce where the smell is coming from. I think that's how I'll rule on this question from now on. House rule ahoy!
Jaxgaret 05-04-07, 03:01 PM	Using a Survival check sounds good to me.
tarkin 05-04-07, 03:02 PM	If I did not do a Spot check, I would use a Survival check. It sounds almost as good to me.
EvilVegan 05-04-07, 03:11 PM	I'd say a wisdom check for anyone without scent and a survival check for anyone with. There's only so much you can do with a mundane nose. I'd give gnomes +2. And the ability to detect scents when not actively searching. . . :)
Jaxgaret 05-04-07, 03:19 PM	I'd give gnomes +2. And the ability to detect scents when not actively searching. . . :) Auto Detect Odors? ;)
StevenO 05-04-07, 07:48 PM	A Smell (Wis) check. Of course it can be used untrained. I'd actually recommend Spot to detect the smell as few people would ever take the Smell skill. To locate the source would require Seach although the DC may be modified by the strength of the smell.
Fireclave 05-05-07, 02:52 AM	I would say that in the absence of the Scent ability, mudane, human ability to smell would fall under the search skill. Spot is sight oriented, but Search includes anything and everything you do to find what it is you are looking for in that 5ft x 5ft squire (feeling, tapping, kicking, poking, scraping, prodding, brushing, dusting, and in this case, smelling). If the source of the smell is particulary strong, perhaps having additionals DC to notice the presense and strength of the scent at a distance. Exmample of a normal scent - The slightly strong odor of an particular alchemic agent admist other alchemic substances in a wizard's lab. You can smell the presense of the agent when you enter the lab, so you're sure there's something to be found in the room, but can't determine the exact location of the source. Otherwise, the normal search DC applies. Example of a strong scent 60ft - DC 20 - A smell something 20ft - DC 10 - It's over here somewhere 05ft - DC 05 - It's so close, I can taste it 00ft - DC 00 - Cookies!
EvilVegan 05-05-07, 08:51 AM	:cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie: :cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie: :cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie: :cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie: :cookie::cookie::cookie::cookie:
j3st3r 05-05-07, 09:45 AM	Great example from Fireclave. I also would say that smelling is definitely part of a search skill.
BW0222 05-05-07, 04:12 PM	Folks, Simple wisdom check. Scent already allows tracking by scent using a wisdom check. It can not be a search or spot check. Search is action only. And creatures with a good spot are not necessarily any better at smelling things. An eagle's good eyesight shouldn't help it smell any better. It is honestly as different from spotting as listen is. I'm not sure survival should be any help. It seems to far related. Knowing how to dig up roots, determine direction, etc. shouldn't help one smell pies.
the_icon 05-06-07, 07:40 PM	To be perfectly honest, I would have them do a search check, since they're actively searching for the source of that funny smell. Searching doesn't necessarily imply direct reliance on seeing, but instead can be loosely interpreted to be the co-operation of all(,some or most) of your senses to locate something. (Think of it this way: Your bedroom, late at night. You have to pee. You get up, stumble across the room, and use your hands to find the light switch. You're searching for it, but you're not using your eyes.)
JLaurHughes 05-06-07, 08:00 PM	Maxis: Sniffs the air Guy's what's that smell? Everyone else: Sniffs the air Juni: Scrunching her nose Smells like a wet dog. Everyone else falls silent and Maxis asks: Ok, where is it coming from? Juni: Sniffing the air again and moving in one direction then the opposite Well, it's hard to tell, I think there are two ways to get to the source, or we're surrounded by many things giving off that smell. Maxis: In a whisper Be on your guard, Juni, take point, we're going to find that source. And it goes on from there with two possible outcomes. I would say it's more of a Search&spot check, an Int check to determine what the smell is and which direction it comes from, then a spot to see what is making that smell.
Maldrin 05-08-07, 02:33 PM	Thanks, everybody, for the feedback. I think I will leave it open to my players to use either Search or Survival, if they can justify it. One of my PCs is a lycanthrope who has been psioncially barred from shapeshifting, but still has access to the lycanthropic senses. Survival/Scent would work there. But the cleric NPC would probably need to use Search. I also like Fireclave's DC table. I think that would be pretty useful. And I could also incorporate JLaurHughes' suggestion of an INT check to tell what it is. Perhaps modified by appropriate skills (Craft or Profession) related to the scent?