Wild talent [Archive] - Wizards Community

Wild talent [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Whisper_Swiftblade
01-13-08, 02:24 AM So I was looking at some of the stuff on srd today and got my first look at the feat wild talent. My first immpression of this was bounding interest, as I had just looked at the feats up the wall, speed of thought, and mentel leap, and the prospect of useing them with a charicter NOT having a phyonic class was interesting to me indeed.

so here is the catch, I have to ask "is it worth it"?

Sure it opens up alot of feats but almost all of them require you to use up a psionic focus (with exeption to at least two of the ones I named above) and as much as I enjoy the idea of a barbarian who can run up walls or a wizard who gets an extra ten feet in a move I just don't see it being all that practical on a day to day basis, as running up a wall is of limited use when avalible, and compleatly useless when there are no walls near by, and there are plenty of spells to get me where I want to go that are far less feat expensive.

So here is my question. do you think wild talent is worth it (in general as well as for the examples given)?

PS. am I correct in that because up the wall allows you to travel on any smooth surface that one could for example run on water?
Tempest Stormwind
01-13-08, 03:50 AM so here is the catch, I have to ask "is it worth it"?

It can be, although generally only humans use the wild-talent route. Most nonpsionic-classed characters I've seen are either humans with Wild Talent or naturally psionic races (in the SRD: dromite, elan, duergar, half-giant, maenad, xeph. In the XPH itself: All the SRD ones plus githyanki, githzerai, and thri-kreen. In the Eberron Campaign Setting: Kalashtar).

A notable exception to this is the HIDDEN TALENT feat. This feat is only in the XPH itself (not the SRD); it's designed for high-psionics games. With that one, YES, it's worth it, but you need to be very clever in picking powers.

Sure it opens up alot of feats but almost all of them require you to use up a psionic focus (with exeption to at least two of the ones I named above) and as much as I enjoy the idea of a barbarian who can run up walls or a wizard who gets an extra ten feet in a move I just don't see it being all that practical on a day to day basis, as running up a wall is of limited use when avalible, and compleatly useless when there are no walls near by, and there are plenty of spells to get me where I want to go that are far less feat expensive.

You certainly have to have the right character type for it. Up the Walls is most useful on a rogue, for instance, since it allows him to flank from odd angles, move past foes he can't tumble past, clear long obstacles, and so on. I've seen it used to great effect on a dervish, for instance (think Prince of Persia on speed).

If your character isn't built to take advantage of it, though, it's just a wasted slot.

Characters who can get a lot of mileage out of Concentration generally consider Wild Talent ON ITS OWN to be useful. I've seen at least one Diamond Mind warblade who uses Wild Talent to gain psionic focus, which he can then expend to "take 15" on a Concentration check. Thanks to his Diamond Mind focus, that Concentration check can replace saving throws, attack rolls, and damage rolls!

PS. am I correct in that because up the wall allows you to travel on any smooth surface that one could for example run on water?

No. Up the Walls lets you ignore gravity for a brief moment. The surface still needs to be solid enough to support you.

If you want to move on water, consider the Body Equilibrium power.

If you're into third-party material, the Untapped Potential psionics expansion book (check the FAQ in my sig; I mention it there briefly) has a prestige class based entirely around these feats, designed to work with rogues, monks, and soulknives. It also comes with "Mantra" feats, which let you use Wild Talent to buff yourself in a very specific manner. You might find those interesting.
InkBlot
01-13-08, 11:48 AM I think the real problem with using Up The Walls to run up a waterfall is that it's constantly moving downward. It would be like trying to walk up the down escalator, but a hundred times worse.

Unlike Tempest, by default I always imagine Up The Walls as a combination of skill and power; A psychically enhanced wall run (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRzRKdyLec8); prescience enhancing your skill, perhaps combined with a weak psychokinetic attraction to the wall (like static cling). Gravity defying, without anti-gravity.

A notable exception to this is the HIDDEN TALENT feat. This feat is only in the XPH itself (not the SRD); it's designed for high-psionics games. With that one, YES, it's worth it, but you need to be very clever in picking powers.
To clarify what Tempest intimated, Hidden Talent is a variant feat used for "high psionics" games. It grants 2 power points and a single 1st level power (from any power list) for you to spend those points on. You're stuck at ML 1, unless you take levels in a manifesting class, but that doesn't matter with some powers. Hidden Talent can only be taken at 1st level.
Tempest Stormwind
01-13-08, 03:16 PM Unlike Tempest, by default I always imagine Up The Walls as a combination of skill and power; A psychically enhanced wall run (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRzRKdyLec8); prescience enhancing your skill, perhaps combined with a weak psychokinetic attraction to the wall (like static cling). Gravity defying, without anti-gravity.

Actually, we see it the same way; I just used the wrong terms to express it earlier. I just don't think it can work on a waterfall or similar, because it lets you walk on vertical surfaces, not surfaces that can't support your weight.

A similar question: Would you see Up the Walls letting you walk across a river? (I wouldn't.) Fundamentally, this is the same as a waterfall to someone with Up the Walls (water crossing the surface you're walking on).
Salla
01-13-08, 04:00 PM From Up The Walls, d20 SRD:
While you are psionically focused, you can take part of one of your move actions to traverse a wall or other relatively smooth vertical surface if you begin and end your move on a horizontal surface.

So, it's completely inapplicable to *any* horizontal surface, solid or liquid, and it would have to be a darn small waterfall for you to run up it (if you're even allowed; I, personally, would say no).
kuorukun
01-16-08, 08:51 PM it is if you take hidden talent insted, it does the same thing bout gives you one power from any first lvl. but you have to have a cha of 11 at least
InkBlot
01-18-08, 04:50 PM To clarify, Hidden Talent doesn't have a Charisma prerequisite. You can take Hidden Talent if your Charisma score is 4. However, you must have a Charisma score of at least 11 to use the power granted by Hidden Talent. So you could take the feat before you can make full use of it, and boot your Charsima later.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Whisper_Swiftblade 01-13-08, 02:24 AM	So I was looking at some of the stuff on srd today and got my first look at the feat wild talent. My first immpression of this was bounding interest, as I had just looked at the feats up the wall, speed of thought, and mentel leap, and the prospect of useing them with a charicter NOT having a phyonic class was interesting to me indeed. so here is the catch, I have to ask "is it worth it"? Sure it opens up alot of feats but almost all of them require you to use up a psionic focus (with exeption to at least two of the ones I named above) and as much as I enjoy the idea of a barbarian who can run up walls or a wizard who gets an extra ten feet in a move I just don't see it being all that practical on a day to day basis, as running up a wall is of limited use when avalible, and compleatly useless when there are no walls near by, and there are plenty of spells to get me where I want to go that are far less feat expensive. So here is my question. do you think wild talent is worth it (in general as well as for the examples given)? PS. am I correct in that because up the wall allows you to travel on any smooth surface that one could for example run on water?
Tempest Stormwind 01-13-08, 03:50 AM	so here is the catch, I have to ask "is it worth it"? It can be, although generally only humans use the wild-talent route. Most nonpsionic-classed characters I've seen are either humans with Wild Talent or naturally psionic races (in the SRD: dromite, elan, duergar, half-giant, maenad, xeph. In the XPH itself: All the SRD ones plus githyanki, githzerai, and thri-kreen. In the Eberron Campaign Setting: Kalashtar). A notable exception to this is the HIDDEN TALENT feat. This feat is only in the XPH itself (not the SRD); it's designed for high-psionics games. With that one, YES, it's worth it, but you need to be very clever in picking powers. Sure it opens up alot of feats but almost all of them require you to use up a psionic focus (with exeption to at least two of the ones I named above) and as much as I enjoy the idea of a barbarian who can run up walls or a wizard who gets an extra ten feet in a move I just don't see it being all that practical on a day to day basis, as running up a wall is of limited use when avalible, and compleatly useless when there are no walls near by, and there are plenty of spells to get me where I want to go that are far less feat expensive. You certainly have to have the right character type for it. Up the Walls is most useful on a rogue, for instance, since it allows him to flank from odd angles, move past foes he can't tumble past, clear long obstacles, and so on. I've seen it used to great effect on a dervish, for instance (think Prince of Persia on speed). If your character isn't built to take advantage of it, though, it's just a wasted slot. Characters who can get a lot of mileage out of Concentration generally consider Wild Talent ON ITS OWN to be useful. I've seen at least one Diamond Mind warblade who uses Wild Talent to gain psionic focus, which he can then expend to "take 15" on a Concentration check. Thanks to his Diamond Mind focus, that Concentration check can replace saving throws, attack rolls, and damage rolls! PS. am I correct in that because up the wall allows you to travel on any smooth surface that one could for example run on water? No. Up the Walls lets you ignore gravity for a brief moment. The surface still needs to be solid enough to support you. If you want to move on water, consider the Body Equilibrium power. If you're into third-party material, the Untapped Potential psionics expansion book (check the FAQ in my sig; I mention it there briefly) has a prestige class based entirely around these feats, designed to work with rogues, monks, and soulknives. It also comes with "Mantra" feats, which let you use Wild Talent to buff yourself in a very specific manner. You might find those interesting.
InkBlot 01-13-08, 11:48 AM	I think the real problem with using Up The Walls to run up a waterfall is that it's constantly moving downward. It would be like trying to walk up the down escalator, but a hundred times worse. Unlike Tempest, by default I always imagine Up The Walls as a combination of skill and power; A psychically enhanced wall run (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRzRKdyLec8); prescience enhancing your skill, perhaps combined with a weak psychokinetic attraction to the wall (like static cling). Gravity defying, without anti-gravity. A notable exception to this is the HIDDEN TALENT feat. This feat is only in the XPH itself (not the SRD); it's designed for high-psionics games. With that one, YES, it's worth it, but you need to be very clever in picking powers. To clarify what Tempest intimated, Hidden Talent is a variant feat used for "high psionics" games. It grants 2 power points and a single 1st level power (from any power list) for you to spend those points on. You're stuck at ML 1, unless you take levels in a manifesting class, but that doesn't matter with some powers. Hidden Talent can only be taken at 1st level.
Tempest Stormwind 01-13-08, 03:16 PM	Unlike Tempest, by default I always imagine Up The Walls as a combination of skill and power; A psychically enhanced wall run (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRzRKdyLec8); prescience enhancing your skill, perhaps combined with a weak psychokinetic attraction to the wall (like static cling). Gravity defying, without anti-gravity. Actually, we see it the same way; I just used the wrong terms to express it earlier. I just don't think it can work on a waterfall or similar, because it lets you walk on vertical surfaces, not surfaces that can't support your weight. A similar question: Would you see Up the Walls letting you walk across a river? (I wouldn't.) Fundamentally, this is the same as a waterfall to someone with Up the Walls (water crossing the surface you're walking on).
Salla 01-13-08, 04:00 PM	From Up The Walls, d20 SRD: While you are psionically focused, you can take part of one of your move actions to traverse a wall or other relatively smooth vertical surface if you begin and end your move on a horizontal surface. So, it's completely inapplicable to any horizontal surface, solid or liquid, and it would have to be a darn small waterfall for you to run up it (if you're even allowed; I, personally, would say no).
kuorukun 01-16-08, 08:51 PM	it is if you take hidden talent insted, it does the same thing bout gives you one power from any first lvl. but you have to have a cha of 11 at least
InkBlot 01-18-08, 04:50 PM	To clarify, Hidden Talent doesn't have a Charisma prerequisite. You can take Hidden Talent if your Charisma score is 4. However, you must have a Charisma score of at least 11 to use the power granted by Hidden Talent. So you could take the feat before you can make full use of it, and boot your Charsima later.