Post/Author/DateTime	Post
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-06-04, 07:38 PM	Welcome! This is CASKET, or the Coalition Asserting Sorcerers Kick Everyone's Tail. This is a guild for Sorcerers and lovers of Sorcerers. Any and all are welcome to join. To join, simply choose an unchosen number, and assert that Sorcerers Kick Everyone's Tail. :D Feel free to put the number in your sig, and even a link to this thread. Go Sorcerers! :mage: EDIT: Originally posted (below) by Chosen of the Dark Sun: What's the topic (of this thread)? In a word, Sorcerers. Discussions can range from debating the benefits and drawbacks of spontaneous spellcasting, to discussing alternate sorcerers you have seen or built, rules variants, balancing, spell choice, etc... Really, any arcane topic you can think of, plus any casting class topic you can think of. I'm getting veklempt... talk amongst yourselves, I'll give you a topic... the effective, dynamic prepared spell, which was neither effective nor dynamic... discuss... Here's the members list: Chosen of the Dark Sun: 323 Dyne: 777 thasis: 666 He Who Shall Not Be Named: 1 Chaos Evoker: 42 TheDarkestofAngels: 0 Frost Mage: 13
ChaosEvoker 12-06-04, 08:34 PM	This Is So My Foundation! Sorcerors Rock!!!!!!!!! Im Joining!
thasis 12-06-04, 08:59 PM	I'm in!!! Totally!!!!
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-06-04, 09:12 PM	Great!!! Call numbers, (none besides mine have been taken) and throw them in your sig. :D I knew I wasn't the only one... :mage:
thasis 12-06-04, 10:03 PM	My sig is already pretty big. I'm kinnda saving room for other things. (ex. links to New things I design, New Foundations I Make, and new projects I start. The basics). My number for members list will be 666 though.
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-06-04, 11:24 PM	JOIN! Sorcerer's powers that I have so far discovered: in one of the campaigns I am in, my sorcerer lives on the bottom of Lake Ashane in Rashamen with his wife. Who is his wife, you ask? Why she is a nymph, charisma 30 without items. :D :D :D Luckiest ****** ever! I'd rather have the sorcerers charisma than a wizards intelligence. Since when to old guys get the girls? The onlyother classes with high charisma are bards, who I don't really like, and paladins who would probably go "you like me, therefore you must be evil" and promptly try to smite the hell out of her, then when they find out the person wasn't evil, they either comit suicide or spend the rest of their natural life atoning. Almost any character I ever play is a sorcerer. Lets here it for pickin' up Drow chicks! ;)
Dyne 12-06-04, 11:57 PM	The above is why I'm not very fond of many Sorcerers. ;) Sorcerers can be pretty powerful, though I haven't played as many. I usually play a Wizard simply for the choice of spells. I'll join though, and my number will be 777. :)
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-07-04, 05:02 PM	323. Just some random number.
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-07-04, 07:15 PM	Glad to see the enthusiasm. :) So far: Chosen of the Dark Sun: 323 Dyne: 777 thasis: 666 He Who Shall Not Be Named: 1 Chaos Evoker: ???
ChaosEvoker 12-07-04, 09:31 PM	Sorry its been a while till I could post. I'm member 42. (since 42 is the answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything)
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-07-04, 09:38 PM	Fair enough Chaos Evoker. It most certainly is. So far: Chosen of the Dark Sun: 323 Dyne: 777 thasis: 666 He Who Shall Not Be Named: 1 Chaos Evoker: 42
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-07-04, 10:51 PM	What's the topic?
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-07-04, 11:01 PM	Originally posted by Chosen of the Dark Sun: What's the topic? In a word, Sorcerers. Discussions can range from debating the benefits and drawbacks of spontaneous spellcasting, to discussing alternate sorcerers you have seen or built, rules variants, balancing, spell choice, etc... Really, any arcane topic you can think of, plus any casting class topic you can think of. I'm getting veklempt... talk amongst yourselves, I'll give you a topic... the effective, dynamic prepared spell, which was neither effective nor dynamic... discuss...
ChaosEvoker 12-08-04, 11:36 AM	I see we have another Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy fan. As far as the topic, the problem with prepared spells is that in any given situation if you didn't prepare the right spell, no adaptability is possible. In fact the ONLY drawback to Sorcerors is that they have a couple less feats and less variety of spells. (Which the latter, quite honestly can be fixed with the right magic items..... :plotting: )
ChaosEvoker 12-08-04, 11:36 AM	Are we participating in the IFWG?
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-08-04, 05:41 PM	Yeah, just pack a few wands and scrolls, and you're set. Are we participating in the IFGW?
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-08-04, 05:42 PM	Actually, the main problem I find with wizards is that if you lose you spellbook, you are completely and utterly screwed.
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-08-04, 07:59 PM	Originally posted by ChaosEvoker and Chosen of the Dark Sun: Are we participating in the IFWG? What is that? :confused: (I probably know, I'm just not down with the lingo...) Also, I recently PMed Orcy the Green Wonder for our official status in the Guild House, if that has anything to do with the IFWG...
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-08-04, 09:27 PM	I've nothing important to add atm, except that I have a alt. sorcerer (and five varients upon that sorcerer, as well as several feats) in my sig. and that I'd like to join and that I'd like my number to be 0.
Dyne 12-08-04, 11:37 PM	The IFWG stands for the Inter-Foundation Guild Wars. It's a thing we have going in which foundations wage war on each other. Every person who participates builds a character and use it in the game.
Tenzhi 12-09-04, 01:30 AM	I don't join guilds, but I do like sorcerers. I've always thought that sorcerers should develop known spells along themes rather than merely tapping into (or being limited to) the entire Wizard list. In my ideal world they would choose a theme upon creation - these themes would be similar to Cleric domains in that they would grant basic theme-related powers and access to a unique spell list (with more than one spell per level available, unlike Domain lists).
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-09-04, 11:01 AM	Originally posted by Dyne: The IFWG stands for the Inter-Foundation Guild Wars. It's a thing we have going in which foundations wage war on each other. Every person who participates builds a character and use it in the game.Absolutely!!! We will so be participating. Also, I've moved the members list to the first thread.
ChaosEvoker 12-09-04, 11:34 AM	Alright i'll make a chracter soon. Man I'll have FOUR chracters with the Drogon Foundation Relaoded participating too
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-09-04, 05:36 PM	I'll make my character as soon as I can.
thasis 12-09-04, 07:30 PM	Yay, Inter-Foundation Guild Wars participating thingy. Looks like I'll have to create some more characters. I'm thinking a Half-Black Dragon Goblin Sorcerer that I will use for here and the Dragon Foundation Reloded and umm... am I in any other guilds that make me need to make a new character. I don't know. I'm in to many guilds. Ahhhh.... whatever. Anyway, I have a idea. Since Dragons and Sorcerers are very close maybe the CASKET and the Dragon Foundation Reloded should make an allyship.
Dyne 12-09-04, 07:40 PM	Alright i'll make a chracter soon. Man I'll have FOUR chracters with the Drogon Foundation Relaoded participating too I'll have more than that. But, some of them are sure to be killed off pretty quick. Several of them are already plotting to kill each other. But, I suppose that's what happens when you make Lawful Good, Chaotic Evil, Neutral Good, and Neutral Evil characters and run them all at once.
Frost Mage 12-09-04, 09:12 PM	Well, I've always preferred sorcery over those who are 'bound by the book,' so to speak. I'd like to join this guild under the number 13, and fling spells around like they were going out of style! HA!
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-09-04, 09:49 PM	OK, so just for clarification (I'm a newbie to this board...), chars you create are ECL 15, 200K gp? And what books/races/classes/templates can we use?
Dyne 12-09-04, 09:52 PM	OK, so just for clarification (I'm a newbie to this board...), chars you create are ECL 15, 200K gp? And what books/races/classes/templates can we use? That's right. And you can use whatever material you want. You can even use homebrew stuff, but the GM's have to look over it first.
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-09-04, 09:54 PM	Originally posted by Dyne: That's right. And you can use whatever material you want. :devil:
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-10-04, 02:32 PM	Originally posted by Frost Mage: Well, I've always preferred sorcery over those who are 'bound by the book,' so to speak. I'd like to join this guild under the number 13, and fling spells around like they were going out of style! HA! Seriously. I just don't know how ppl can keep limiting their spell list like that. Spontaneous casting is so worth the lost level of spells...
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-11-04, 10:52 AM	:bump:
thasis 12-11-04, 01:09 PM	We need a new topic or disscussion. What always worked for me was deloping your own Magic Item, Class, Prc, Feat, Skill, ect. It took up time untill something better could be done. Plus it's something that pretty much anyone in that guild could use.
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-11-04, 04:46 PM	Well, here are some prestige classes that I created for the sorcerer (well... and the bard also. A few of them are accessable by the wizard, also) from an old thread I made. Some of them were well made and some weren't, but since there is a character # limit, I'll post the ones I think were made better. So... here are the better (in my opinion) ones: I believe my favorites are the Metamagi Prestige Class and the Blade, which is more of a bard prestige class. The rest were cut to save space. (More than 1/2 were cut.) The Blade "I know my way around the sword better than you think." A Blade is essentially everything that a bard is, except specialized in flashy combat maneuvers and combat oriented fighting skills. They're tougher, more deadly, and more capable in melee than any bard, however, they're not as versitile or as generally knowledgable than their bardic bretheren. Hit Dice:d8 Requirements Base Attack Bonus: +4 Skills: Perform (Dancing): 8 Ranks or Tumble: 8 Ranks Feats: Weapon Focus (Any Martial Weapon), Power Attack, Expertise Spells: Able to spontaneously cast 2nd level spells. Special: Must have bardic music or bardic lore special abilities. Class Skills The Blade's sorcerer's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (all skills, taken individually) (Int), Listen (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spellcraft (Int), Swim (Str), and Tumble (Dex). See chapter 4 of the players handbook for skill descriptions. Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Intelligence Modifier The Blade Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Spells/day 1st +0 +2 +2 +0 Offensive/Defensive Spin 1/day 2nd +1 +3 +3 +0 Faster Inspiration +1 Level of Existing Class 3rd +2 +3 +3 +1 Offensive/Defensive Spin 2/day 4th +3 +4 +4 +1 Bonus Feat +1 Level of Existing Class 5th +3 +4 +4 +1 Offensive/Defensive Spin 3/day 6th +4 +5 +5 +2 Whirl of Blades +1 Level of Existing Class 7th +5 +5 +5 +2 Offensive/Defensive Spin 4/day 8th +6 +6 +6 +2 Bonus Feat +1 Level of Existing Class 9th +6 +6 +6 +3 Offensive/Defensive Spin 5/day 10th +7 +7 +7 +3 Greater Whirl of Blades +1 Level of Existing Class Class Features All of the following are class features of the Blade prestige class. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Blades gain full martial weapon proficiency if they didn't already have it. However, they gain no new proficiency in armor or shields. Bardic Music: Blade levels and Bard levels stack for purposes of aquiring bardic music and bardic musics/day. Offensive/Defensive Spin: 1/day at level one and one additional time/day every two levels thereafter, the blade can immediately alter their swordplay and take up either a defensive play of melee or an offensive play. During an attack, the blade can choose to initiate the spin. An offensive spin allows the blade to increase his/her overall attack power. For every blade level, the Blade gains a +1 to attack and damage up to a maximum of +10, but the blade suffers a -1 to AC per two levels of blade to a minimum of -5. A Defensive Spin allows the blade to add a +1 dodge bonus to AC per blade level to a maximum of +10. However, the blade suffers a -1 to attack and damage per two blade levels to a minimum of -5. This ability is initiated as part of an attack or defensive action. Once invoked, one use of this ability lasts for 1 round/blade level. Faster Inspiration: The Inspire Courage bardic music can be invoked as a move action instead of a standard action. Bonus Feat: The Blade can select any fighter feat (except weapon specialization) as a bonus feat. Whirl of Blades: As a free action, the blade can gain an additional attack at his/her highest attack bonus that lasts for 1 round/blade level, as per the haste spell, except that it provides no additional benifits, usable 1/day/2 blade levels to a maximum of 5 times/day. Greater Whirl of Blades: As Whirl of Blades, except that the ability grants two additional attacks per use instead of just one. The Draconic Sorcerer "Excuse me, hey. My name is Kilyas the Bringer of Firy Death. Pleased to meet you. I heard that you were the famous thief and that you recently ransacked a rather large cache of moola. Well, that was my great-grandaddy's horde you took and I'd like to take it back. You see, bad tempers run in the family, so it might be better that you give it all back. Now." The Draconic Sorcerer is a descendant of a powerful dragon and likewise has an intimidating reptillian aura of exoticness that constantly surrounds that sorcerer. The draconic sorcerer is a person who would dabble in the ancestrial line that made him or her who he or she is to this very day. Bringing out the heritage that surrounds that particular sorcerer and enhancing his/her overall sorcerous power through the blood that created it. These sorcerers can be of any alignment and of any draconic descent. Although some draconic sorcerers tend to be similarly aligned to thier ancestor, not nearly all of them follow their path. Many of these sorcerers do tend to spend their time around dragons in general and even with their ancestor, if that particular dragon or family of dragons is still around. Sorcerers that choose this path often take on the characteristics of their ancester and many of their powers while furthering their sorcerous powers as far as they can bring them. Hit Dice:d6 Requirements Intimidate: 4 Ranks Knowledge (Arcana): 8 Ranks Language: Draconic Feats: Great Fortitude and Lightning Reflexes or Improved Toughness and Magical Aptitude Spells: Able to spontaneously cast 3rd level spells. Special: The Sorcerer must be of dragon blood, that is, an actual descendant of a true dragon. The dragon doesn't need to be particularly close or distant in familial ties, but the two must share a family bond of some type. Class Skills The Draconic Sorcerer's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Use Magic Device (Cha). See chapter 4 of the players handbook for skill descriptions. Skill Points at Each Level: 2 + Intelligence Modifier The Draconic Sorcerer Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Spells/day 1st +0 +0 +0 +2 Dragon Type, Dragon Empowerment 2nd +1 +0 +0 +2 Dragon Sense +1 Level of Existing Class 3rd +1 +1 +1 +3 Dragon Defense +1 Level of Existing Class 4th +2 +1 +1 +3 Dragon Attack +1 Level of Existing Class 5th +2 +1 +1 +4 Dragon Sense +1 Level of Existing Class 6th +3 +2 +2 +4 Dragon Defense +1 Level of Existing Class 7th +3 +2 +2 +5 Dragon Attack +1 Level of Existing Class 8th +4 +2 +2 +5 Dragon Sense +1 Level of Existing Class 9th +4 +3 +3 +6 Dragon Defense +1 Level of Existing Class 10th +5 +3 +3 +6 Dragon Attack, Dragon Apothesis +1 Level of Existing Class Class Features All of the following are class features of the Draconic Sorcerer prestige class. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The Draconic Sorcerer gains no further proficiency in any weapons or armor. Dragon Type: The sorcerer selects a dragon type. The sorcerer gains a slight skin coloration and light scaling of the skin and other obvious physical features of the Sorcerer's ancestor dragon. As a result, the sorcerer gains a +4 racial bonus to intimidation checks. Dragon Empowerment: The sorcerer's charisma increases by two points and strength increases by four points. The sorcerer also gains +1 bonus to natural armor (stacks with any perminant pre-existing natural armor,) and immunity to paralysis and sleep effects. Dragon Sense: The sorcerer gains an ability from the following list: Lowlight Vision (Ex): The sorcerer gains the ability to see twice as far as humans in less than optimal lighting conditions. The sorcerer can gain this ability multiple times, each time, the sorcerer's existing lowlight increases by 100%. Darkvision (Ex): The sorcerer gains 30ft. Darkvision. The sorcerer can take this ability multiple times, each time, the sorcerer gains an additional 30ft. to the sorcerer's existing darkvision. Blindsight (Ex): The sorcerer gains 10ft. Blindsight. The sorcerer can take this ability multiple times, each time, the sorcerer gains an additional 10ft. to the sorcerer's existing blindsight. Scent (Ex): The sorcerer gains the ability to use scent. Tremorsense (Ex): The sorcerer gains the ability to use tremorsense to a 20ft radius. The sorcerer can gain this ability multiple times, gaining an additional 20ft to the sorcerer's tremorsense each time. Dragon Attack: The sorcerer gains an ability from the following list: Breath Weapon (Su): The sorcerer gains the ability to use a breath weapon that deals damage according to its type. The sorcerer must choose a single element (Fire, Cold, Sonic, Acid, Electricity) or nonelement (such as negitive energy, destructive energy, or force damage) and the sorcerer will be able to deal 2d8 (element) or 2d4 (nonelement) points of damage in a 30ft. cone. Once the sorcerer uses his/her breath weapon, the sorcerer cannot use it again for another 1d4 rounds. The sorcerer can take this ability multiple times. Each time the sorcerer takes this ability, he/she may be able to either increase damage by the stated amount, increase the area by 30ft or reduce the delay of the use of this specific breath weapon by one round. The sorcerer cannot take this ability to gain another breath weapon. A "breath weapon" that doesn't deal energy damage (like energy drain breath weapons or single dragon bites that deal energy drain) translates into, in the case of energy drain, negitive energy, doing 2d4 negitive energy damage. Other forms of attacks translate into similar attacks that deal hitpoint damage. Attacks that "are" breath weapons, but don't form in the way of actual breath attacks (such as a bite that deals energy drain damage) might require other forms of attack. The save for this ability is 10 + 1/2 Caster Level + The sorcerer's Constitution Modifier. Natural Weapons: The sorcerer gains a bite attack and two claw attacks that the sorcerer can use all of in one full attack action. The claw/bite damage varies on the sorcerer's size. This ability can only be gained once. Size Bite Dmg Claw Dmg Fine 1 - Diminutive 1d2 1 Tiny 1d3 1d2 Small 1d4 1d3 Medium 1d6 1d4 Large 1d8 1d6 Huge 2d6 1d8 Gargantuan 3d6 2d6 Colossal 4d6 3d6 Frightful Presence (Ex): If the sorcerer has a total of 10 or more total HD, then the sorcerer can select frightful presence. This ability takes effect whenever the sorcerer attacks, charges, casts a spell, flies overhead, or any other effect that is especially hostile. This effect affects creatures within a 30ft radius of the caster and only creatures with fewer HD than the sorcerer. The subjects of the effect must suffer a will save (DC= 10 + 1/2 HD + the sorcerer's charisma modifier) or be panicked for 4d6 rounds (4 or less HD) or shaken for 4d6 rounds (5 or more HD). A successful save renders the subjects immune for 24 hours. This ability also makes the sorcerer immune to the frightful presence of all true dragons. Spell: The sorcerer gains an additional spell known. Spell-Like Ability: The sorcerer is able to use a spell-like ability available to the sorcerer's chosen dragon type. The sorcerer can select any spell-like ability available to the dragon variety, but must be the adequite level to be able to cast the chosen spell. For instance, if the selected dragon variety were red, the sorcerer can select discern location as a spell-like ability, provided that the sorcerer is able to cast 8th level spells, since discern location is an 8th level spell. The selected spell-like ability is useable once/day. Dragon Defense: Damage Reduction: The sorcerer gains DR 5/Magic. The sorcerer can gain this ability multiple times, each time, the DR increases by 5. For instance, if the sorcerer selects this ability three times, then the DR will be 15/magic. Energy Resistance: The sorcerer gains resistance 10 against the energy (such as sonic, cold, fire, acid, and electricity) affiliated with the selected dragon type. Other energy types (such as force, negitive energy, etc) recieve resistance 5. If no particular energy type is affiliated with the dragon, then use the energy used in the breath weapon, but only if the damage is hitpoint damage. If the dragon has no such resistance or immunities, then this ability cannot be selected. Spell Resistance: The sorcerer gains SR 10 + total HD. This ability can only be selected once and is maxed out at SR 20. If this ability is selected more than once, then the maximum SR increases by 5 points. Natural Armor: The sorcerer gains a +2 bonus to natural armor. This ability can be taken multiple times, each time this ability is taken, the bonus stacks. This bonus also stacks with any kind of perminant bonus to natural armor. Dragon's Toughness: This ability gives the sorcerer +12 HP. This ability can be taken more than once. This ability stacks with itself. Dragon Apothesis: The sorcerer finally becomes part dragon, reaching a massive transformation that scars the sorcerer forever with the form that rekindles the power of the sorcerer's ancient dragon ancestor. The sorcerer, among other things, doubles in weight and height. If that doesn't increase the sorcerer's size by one catagory, then the sorcerer gains the minimum size and weight in order to do so, gaining the usual size benifits and penelties. If the sorcerer's newly modified size is large or larger, then the sorcerer gains a tail and two wings. Those new appendages can be made into additional attacks if the sorcerer took the natural weapons special ability described above. The wings also allow the caster to fly at twice of the sorcerer's base speed with size-dependant maneuverability. The sorcerer also gains a +1 bonus to natual armor that stacks with any pre-existing perminant natural armor. A colossal sorcerer (that was colossal before gaining Dragon Apothesis) doesn't gain a size catagory, but gains all of the other benifits. Size Wing Dmg Tail Dmg Maneuverability Fine - - - Diminutive 1 - - Tiny 1d2 1 - Small 1d3 1d2 - Medium 1d4 1d3 - Large 1d6 1d4 Average Huge 1d8 1d6 Poor Gargantuan 2d6 1d8 Poor Colossal 3d6 2d6 Clumsy The Harmonic Crystalizer Perfection is often sysonymous with with sound. Not just any sounds, mind you, but the clarity of a lightly hit tuning fork, the beautiful noice of a flawless orchestra, the list goes on. The difference between noise, harmonics, music, and the like can be heard by anyone, as the difference between the flawed form of simple noise and the flawless form of musics and general harmonics. I deal with perfection of the waves, making the air as perfect as crystal. Flawless and beautiful in its own way. Crystal Harmonizers are masters of sound waves, as a result, the vast majority of crystal harmonizers are perfectionistic bards, wizards, and sorcerers. Mastering sound to this extent tests even the freest of spirit, as only those whom would work to any end to perfect something intangible, but very maliable and nearly uncontrollable without magical aid or extremely skilled hands or singing voice. Being a Harmonic Crystalizer requires a vast degree of specialization, effort, and dedication, which dissuades the freer spirits, but those who've mastered the waves of sound are often very expressionistic and often talented. Hit Dice: d6 Requirements: Alignment: Any Nonchaotic Concentration: 8 Ranks Peform (Singing, or any string or wind instrament): 4 Ranks Spellcraft: 8 Ranks Feats: Skill Focus: Peform (singing, wind instrament, string instrament), Skill Focus: Spellcraft Spells: Ability to cast 2nd level spells Special: The Harmonic Crystalizer must have one spell with the sonic descriptor. Class Skills The Harmonic Crystalizer's Class Skills (and ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Listen (Wis), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Speak Language (n/a), Spellcraft (Int). See chapter 4 of the Player's Handbook for skill descriptions. Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Intelligence Modifier The Harmonic Crystalizer level BAB F/R/W Special Spells/day 1 +0 +0/+2/+2 Focus, Bardic Music +1 Effective Level of Existing Class 2 +1 +0/+3/+3 Musical Harmonics 3 +2 +1/+3/+3 Wavemaster +1 Effective Level of Existing Class 4 +3 +1/+4/+4 Soundbreaker 1/day 5 +3 +1/+4/+4 Wavemaster, +1 Effective Level of Existing Class 30ft Blindsight 6 +4 +2/+5/+5 Silencebreaker 1/day 7 +5 +2/+5/+5 Wavemaster +1 Effective Level of Existing Class 8 +6 +2/+6/+6 Soundbreaker 2/day 9 +6 +3/+6/+6 Wavemaster +1 Effective Level of Existing Class 60ft Blindsight 10 +7 +3/+7/+7 Silencebreaker 2/day Destructive Harmonics Class Features Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The Harmonic Cryastalizer aquires no further proficiency in armor, shields Focus: The Crystal Harmonizer must give up the ability to cast spells in one school of magic, in order to focus his/her attentions elsewhere. Bardic Music: At level one, the Harmonic Crystalizer aquires a form of bardic music, usable once/day/level. If the Harmonic Crystalizer had bardic music, or a variation thereof, the progression of that music continues normally, as per what the previous class dictates, but will not aquire any new forms of songs. If the Crystalizer did not have bardic music before, the crystalizer gains it, but with only the musics that a level one bard has. For example, a Bard10/HCrys5 can employ bardic music as if he/she were a bard 15 with all of the songs of a 10th level bard. A sorcerer 8/HCrys10 can employ bardic music as if he/she were a 10th level bard with all of the songs of a 1st level bard. Musical Harmonics: Every noise that comes from a Crystalizer comes out perfectly. The Crystalizer's voice is always pleasant and musical to listen to, giving the Crystalizer a +2 bonus to all charsima skill checks that involve talking or other noises, such as diplomacy, bluff, and most perform checks. Wavemaster (Su): The Crystalizer's command over sound is only beginning. This ability allows the Harmonizer to command the very air to produce a desired wave. This wave can do a variety of effects, depending on how it's used. This abililty is usable 1/day/HC Level. Each time this ability is gained, the Crystalizer selects an ability from the following list: Cut: As a standard action, the Crystalizer creates a superthin wave that has a 30ft cone, which deals 1d4/HC Level slashing damage. Block: The Crystalizer creates a sound barrior, similar to a wind wall, but activatable as a free action and only lasts one round. Wave Harmonics: As a free action and lasting only one round, the Crystalizer's voice, words, and music all become exceedingly perfect in form, allowing it to not only fill its standard function, but surpass it. All of the Crystalizer's bardic music doubles in effect, any sound dependant spell otherwise cast in that round has an effective caster level two levels higher than what it would normally be, and any perform checks are made with a +2 circumstance bonus. Shockwave: As a standard action, The crystalizer can create a massive wave in the air to ward off anyone immediately surrounding him/her. Anyone within a 10ft radius + 5ft per 2 Levels of Crystalizer must make a strength check or reflex save against a bull rush attempt with str 10 +Charisma Modifier +Harmonic Crystalizer Level or be knocked back 30ft and take 1d8/level damage upon a failed check or save. When an opponent succeds either check, he/she still takes 1/2 damage. Evasion and Improved Evasion only apply if the character succeeds a reflex save. Unattended objects are thrown back automatically, as long as the wave as the strength to be able to throw them back. The light load capacity of the strength of the shockwaves determines what items are thrown back and which are not. Sound Disruption: As a standard action, against one target within 60ft in line of sight, the Crystalizer can force the target to make a will save or Concentration check or be stunned for 1 round per HC level. The DC for this effect is 10 + Charisma Modifier + HC level. Soundbreaker (Su): 1/day and one additional time/day every four levels thereafter, the Crystalizer gains the ability to generate waves of sound that are disrupting to anyone concentrating around the Crystalizer. As a standard action, the Crystalizer can activate the ability. Anyone concentrating on any activity that requires concentration in a 60ft radius around the caster must make a concentration check or fail at their task. These activities include complicated skills and spellcasting. The concentration DC is 15 + Charisma + HC level. Blindsight (Ex): The Crystalizer can use hearing to ascertain all foes within 30 feet as a sighted creature would. This ability's range increases by 30ft. every four levels. Silencebreaker (Su): 1/day and one additional time/day every four levels thereafter, the Crystalizer gains the ability to control sound so well, that it breaks through any silence effect. The Crystalizer need not be in the silence effect, but the crystalizer must be within 30ft of a silence effect. When the Crystalizer does anything that would normally be snuffed out by a silence effect, such as casting a spell with a verbal component, or singing a bardic song, the Crystalizer makes a dispel check equal to 5 +HC Level +1d20 to dispel the silence effect. Success means that the silence is broken and the Crystalizer's ability operates normally. This ability can also come into function reactively if a silence were placed while the crystalizer was using an effect that required the use of sound. Destructive Harmonics (Su): A crystalizer can blast sonic energy in a cone up to 80 feet long. It can also use this attack to affect any creatures or objects within a 30-foot radius. It can tune the harmonics of this destructive power to affect different types of targets. Flesh: Disrupting tissue and rending bone, this attack deals 1d6 points of damage per Harmonic Crystalizer level to all within the area (Reflex DC 10 +Charisma Modifier + HC Level for half). Nerves: A Harmonic Crystalizer can focus its harmonics to knock out foes rather than slay them. This attack deals 1d6 points per harmonic crystalizer level of nonlethal damage to all within the area (Reflex DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + HC Level for half ). Material: When using this form of harmonics, a Harmonic Crystalizer chooses wood, stone, metal, or glass. All objects made of that material within the area must succeed on a DC 10 + Charisma Modifier + HC Level Fortitude save or shatter. Objects (or portions of objects) that have up to 30 hit points are potentially affected by this attack. The Metamagi Edward entered the Doomed Castle of Elwich Thel, the Mighty. It was a decrepid place, a place suited for a lich, but there are no such things here. Edward came past the grand enterence and slipped into a massive dining room, which appears to have been cleaned recently. While there were no such undead residents here, there was a hot young move-in that came recently. He was someone that's been heavily sought after by his rivals, including himself. He was a different kind of sorcerer and one to not be trifled with. Edward had come across a rumor in Athkaltha that a sorcerer had overcome a weakness that all of his lesser bretheren had to endure. He was also much more powerful, able to cast spells of a greater circle than that of the traditional nine. Edward, of course, was intrigued and wanted to study the sorcerer, to figure out how this one not only learned to use metamagic to his greater benifit, but mastered it. Of course, he was well prepared to fight him. After travelling though several well lit hallways, he came to a recently cleaned room that was well lit and very ornate. The sorcerer was sitting inside on a chair. He seemed unprepared, but a sorcerer never needs to be. Edward stood his ground, prepared to retrieve his specimen for study. He desperately wants to learn more about the sorcerer's natural talent, but this sorcerer was different, he's not only mastered his talent, he has intensified it. Edward eagerly awaited the sorcerer's next move, but his biggest concern was that the sorcerer didn't appear to be concerned in the slightest bit. --Edward, the Loremaster The metamagi is a spontaneous caster that has mastered the whimsical values of metamagic, turning the semi-weakness into a strength for the caster, allowing the metamagi to wield metamagic like the caster never has before. Giving the caster much more freedom with her spells than she ever thought possible before. The most common metamagi are sorcerers and bards whom wish to maximize the potential of their inborne talent. Most metamagi are fixated on improving themselves, often lifelong adventurers whom see their spells as their greatest asset and continueously seek to improve themselves though experience (as opposed to intense study and contemplation, like the wizard and cleric) and hard work as well as intuition. Most metamagi come from all breeds of people with different faiths, but the most common worship magical dieties, such as Mystra, Azuth, and Oghma and other magic-oriented dieties. Dieties that focus on self-improvement and personal strength, such as lolth, Kossuth, Malar, Talos, Tempus, Torm, etc... The bulk of Metamagis are incantrixes seeking to improve their spells and enhance their ability to deal with extraplanar entities, less common are magekillers seeking an edge over wizards, and archmage seeking to further enhance their powers. Requirements: Concentration: 24 ranks Knowledge (Arcana): 24 ranks Spellcraft: 24 ranks Feats: Any four metamagic feats Spells: Ability to cast 9th level spells Special: Spellcaster with the ability to spontaneously cast arcane spells and must have achieved maximum advancement in the spell progression of the spontaneously spellcasting class. Class Abilites: Hit Die: d4 Class Skills: Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Spellcraft (Int). See Chapter 4: Skills in the Player’s Handbook for skill descriptions. Skill Points at Each Level: 2 + Intelligence Modifier Class Features: The following are class features of the Metamagi prestige class. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A Metamagi gains no new armor, weapon, or shield proficiency. Spells per Day/ Spells Known: At each Metamagi level, the character gains new spells per day (or spells known, if applicable) as if s/he gained a level in whichever spellcasting class s/he belonged before adding the prestige class level. If already an epic spellcaster, the character gains only the benefit noted under the spells entry for that epic class. S/he does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained (improved chance of turning/destroying undead, metamagic or item creation feats, and so on.) If the character had more than one spellcasting class before becoming a Metamagi, the player must decide which class to add the new level for the purpose of determining spells per day. Metamagic Mastery (Su): The metamagi gains this ability at first level, allowing the metamagi to cast any spell the metamagi knows of 0 and 1st level with any metamagic feat the metamagi knows without the extended time requirement to cast the spell using the normal casting time of the spell being cast. At every odd level thereafter, the benifit of metamagic mastery extends two levels higher until all the spells a metamagi can cast can be seamlessly and effortlessly with any metamagic feat the metamagi knows at 9th level. This ability does not apply to epic spells. This ability also cannot be used with prepared spells. Bonus Feats: A Metamagi gains a bonus feat every two levels starting at 2nd level and every two levels thereafter. Metamagi’s bonus feat list: Automatic Quicken Spell, Automatic Silent Spell, Automatic Still Spell, Enhance Spell, Epic Spellcasting, Ignore Material Components, Improved Heightened Spell, Improved Metamagic, Improved Spell Capacity, Intensify Spell, Multispell, and any metamagic feat that the spellcaster meets the prequisites for that wasn't mentioned on the list. Special Note: While all prestige classes, epic and nonepic that have 10 levels of progression is generally assumed to have further progression, this particular prestige class does not. This class does not advance after level 10, like any prestige class that has less than a 10 level progression. Metamagi: Level Special Spells/Day 1st Metamagic Mastery (0-1) +1 Level of existing class 2nd Bonus Feat +1 Level of existing class 3rd Metamagic Mastery (2-3) +1 Level of existing class 4th Bonus Feat +1 Level of existing class 5th Metamagic Mastery (4-5) +1 Level of existing class 6th Bonus Feat +1 Level of existing class 7th Metamagic Mastery (6-7) +1 Level of existing class 8th Bonus Feat +1 Level of existing class 9th Metamagic Mastery (8-9) +1 Level of existing class 10th Bonus Feat +1 Level of existing class The Sky Glider "One could hardly imagine the energy and power of the coming storm. It devistates entire towns, ruins homes, and can annhilate an entire city. The sky has the power of life, by raining down the life-giving waters of renewal and opening up the rejuvinating and rebirthing lights of the sun. But it also has the power of death, with the ability cause mass destruction and chaos. That is the dual nature and power of all that is above and I have a piece of it." The Sky Glider is a master of all things weather related. They command the wind and the clouds to the benifit or the bane of all that stands in their way. Hit Dice:d4 Requirements Knowledge (Arcana): 8 Ranks Knowledge (Nature): 4 Ranks Knowledge (The Planes): 4 Ranks Languages: Auran Feats: Improved Initiative Spells: Ability to cast 3rd Level Spells, the caster must also know one spell with the sonic descriptor and one spell with the electricity descriptor. Special: The caster cannot know or cast any spells with the acid and/or fire descriptors. Class Abilities The Sky Glider's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Spellcraft (Int). See chapter 4 of the players handbook for skill descriptions. Skill Points at Each Level: 2 + Intelligence Modifier The Sky Glider Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Spells/day 1st +0 +0 +0 +2 Fast as the Wind +1 Level of Existing Class 2nd +1 +0 +0 +3 Thunder & Lightning +1 Level of Existing Class 3rd +1 +1 +1 +3 Fast as the High Winds +1 Level of Existing Class Blood of the Wind 4th +2 +1 +1 +4 Storm Resistance 5 +1 Level of Existing Class 5th +2 +1 +1 +4 Fast as the Hurricane +1 Level of Existing Class 6th +3 +2 +2 +5 Control Weather +1 Level of Existing Class Blood of the Wind II 7th +3 +2 +2 +5 Fast as the Tornado +1 Level of Existing Class 8th +4 +2 +2 +6 Storm Resistance 10 +1 Level of Existing Class 9th +4 +3 +3 +6 Sonic Speed +1 Level of Existing Class Blood of the Wind III 10th +5 +3 +3 +7 One with the Sky +1 Level of Existing Class Class Features All of the following are class features of the Sky Glider prestige class. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Sky Gliders gain no further proficiency in any weapons or armor, but a Glider can never carry more than a light load, otherwise, the Glider's powers cannot operate. Fast as the Wind (Ex): The Sky Glider gains the ability to glide across the ground. The Glider's feat no longer contact the ground and they no longer need to. The Glider can continue gliding as long as the Glider chooses to at the Glider's base movement +10ft. The new movement requires as much thought as his/her normal form of movement. The Glider cannot move more than one foot up into the air. This gliding ability allows the Glider to glide over any surface roughly as dense or denser than water. The Glider can choose to walk if he/she so chooses to, but must move at his/her standard movement rate. This ability also grants the Glider a +1 dodge bonus to reflex saves, AC, and initiative. Thunder and Lightning (Su): The Sky Glider becomes capable of commanding the very elements of the sky to his/her beck and call. As a standard action, the Glider can "loose" a spell slot to manifest lightning and thunder. Against one target, the Glider can create a lightning bolt (as the spell in all respects) that deals 2d6 damage per spell level of the slot sacrificed. Creating the lightning also creates a thunderous boom that shakes and shatters weak, nonattended objects (such as weak glass and pottery.) The thunder deals 1d6 sonic damage per spell level of the spell slot sacrificed. The area that this damage applies to is a 5ft radius centered on the caster +5 ft/caster level. All of those caught in the radius must make a fortitude save against a DC of 10 + spell level of spell slot sacrificed + relevant casting modifier or be deafened for 1d4 minutes/spell level of spell slot sacrificed. A successful reflex save halves the damage. The ability is subject to spell resistance (the lightning and thunder count seporately for both SR and the reflex save.) The maximum amount of damage the ability can do is 2d6 (Lightning) and 1d6 (thunder) per each level of Sky Glider. Using a cantrip to power this ability creates small sparks, but no noise. The sparks last for 1 minute/caster level. The sparks can be used to light flammables or anything else that small electrical sparks could concievably do. Fast as the High Winds: The Sky Glider's gliding movement increases by +10ft. The Glider can also glide with much greater effectiveness, allowing the Glider to use his/her gliding power to levitate similarly to the spell, but moveing upward requires no more concentration than normal movement and has an upward speed equal to 1/2 the Glider's movement rate with a maximum "ceiling" of 10ft per caster level. The Glider's dodge bonuses to Initiative, Reflex saves, and AC increase to +2. Blood of the Wind: A Glider becomes bound to the sky and to its lifegiving forces, like a fish to sea. The Sky Walker requires wind in order to breathe and otherwise continue to live. Not necessarily just air, but wind, or at least a breeze. At this point, the Sky Glider's mere presence can generate a small breeze, enough to just live (as though at a high altitude), but still air, such as that provided by the silence spell, makes the Glider inable to "breathe" and will "sufficate" unless the glider can get gain access moving air. Storm Resistance: The Glider gains resistance 5 against sonic, cold, and electricity damage. This resistance increases to 10 at level 8. Fast as the Hurricane: The Glider's speed increases magnificently, gaining a further +10 bonus to the Glider's gliding movement rate. Furthermore, the Glider gains a fly speed equal to half the Glider's glide movement with average maneuverability. Flight, unlike levitation or gliding requires a more focused concentration and the sorcerer must use a standard action to initiate flight and must concentrate to continue it. Otherwise the Glider's dodge bonus to AC, Reflex Saves, and Initiative increase to +3. Control Weather (Sp): The Sky Glider gains the ability to command the local weather as a spell like ability at will. With this ability, the Glider's ability to command the elemental forces of the storm becomes greater. The damage dealt by the Glider's Lightning increases to 3d6/spell level of the slot sacrificed and the sonic damage increases to 1d10/spell level of the slot sacrificed. The maximum damage likewise increases for each Glider level. The thunder aspect of this casting also generates a much greater impact. Anything within immediate range must make an opposing strength check to counter a bull rush, with a strength equal to 5 + the Glider's caster level. Blood of the Wind II: The Glider's affinity with the aural forces becomes greater, forcing a more intensive dependancy. Not only must a Glider remain, in the very least, within a slight breeze, but the Glider must also have constant access to the sky or at least a volume of air that the Glider can easily fly in. While taking a Glider away from the sky isn't directly harmful, the Glider, much like a sea or water elf, will suffer from a similar "longing" for the sky if brought out of its majesty for one day per two caster levels of the glider. Once that time has ended, the Glider must make a will save each day (DC=20+1 per each previous check) or suddenly be overcome with a longing for the sky, in which the caster would do everything in his or her power to come back to it. Once the Glider returns to the open sky, the Glider will remain there until satiated for at least each day that it was away from the sky. For each day in which the Glider cannot return to the sky after failing a will save and falling under a "longing for the sky," the glider takes a -1 to all saves, skill checks, and ability checks for each additional day that the glider is away from the sky. Fast as the Tornado: The Glider no longer needs to concentrate to fly and the he/she gains a +10 bonus to his/her gliding movement rate. The Glider no longer needs to "activate" flight does so with as much concentration as normal movement. The Glider's flight speed increases to 3/4 the Glider's normal base movement. The Glider's dodge bonuses to AC, Reflex saves, and Initiative increase to +4. Sonic Speed: The Glider's gliding movement rate increases by +10ft and his/her flight speed maneuverability increases to (good), true flight replaces the Glider's glide and levitate ability completely. The Glider's flight speed equals the Glider's former glide speed. The dodge bonuses to AC, reflex saves, and initiative increase to +5. Blood of the Wind III: The Glider's dependancy on the Sky reaches its pinnacle. The DC to resist a longing increases by 4 and failure results in a -1 temporary ability drain for each day that the Glider is away from the sky. If the Glider's constitution reaches 0, the glider falls unconcioius and dies. One with the Sky: The Glider's Flight speed increases to 100ft and maneuverability becomes perfect. The Glider also becomes an elemental creature, which gives the caster the following benifits: —Darkvision out to 60 feet. —Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, and stunning. —Not subject to critical hits or flanking. Unlike most elementals, Sky Gliders keep their dual nature of body and soul and can be raised/resurrected normally. Gliders no longer need to breathe, eat, or drink. The Terror Mage "No passion so effectually robs the mind of all its powers of acting and reasoning as fear." Edmund Burke (1729 - 1797), "A Philosophical Inquiry into the Origin of Our Ideas of the Sublime and Beautiful", 1756 The terror mage is a master of invoking the deepest, darkest rescesses of the mind. They are most often enchanters whom have made it their career to effectually invoke fear in those around them. Often to their pleasure, but often because they feel more compelled to watch them writhe. Naturally, there are no "good" Terror Mages. Some sorcerers and generalist wizards join the ranks, but those are few and far in between. Wizards of other specializations are extraordinarily rare, with the noted exception of illusionists and necromancers, who are nearly as common as enchanters. Hit Dice:d4 Requirements Alignment: Any Nongood Intimidate: 4 Ranks Knowledge (Arcana): 8 Ranks Spellcraft: 8 Ranks Feats: Skill Focus: Intimidate, Spell Focus: Enchantment Spells: Ability to cast 3rd Level Arcane Spells Special: The caster must have knowledge of 3 enchantments or mind-effecting illusions, one of which must be 3rd level or higher Class Abilities The Terror Mage's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (all, each taken individually) (Int), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int). See chapter 4 of the players handbook for skill descriptions. Skill Points at Each Level: 2 + Intelligence Modifier The Terror Mage Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special Spells/day 1st +0 +0 +0 +2 Invoke Fear +1 Level of Existing Class 2nd +1 +0 +0 +3 Cloak of Terror 1/day +1 Level of Existing Class 3rd +1 +1 +1 +3 Fear of Pain +1 Level of Existing Class 4th +2 +1 +1 +4 Cloak of Terror 2/day +1 Level of Existing Class 5th +2 +1 +1 +4 Fear of Thought +1 Level of Existing Class 6th +3 +2 +2 +5 Cloak of Terror 3/day +1 Level of Existing Class 7th +3 +2 +2 +5 Break Resistance +1 Level of Existing Class 8th +4 +2 +2 +6 Cloak of Terror 4/day +1 Level of Existing Class 9th +4 +3 +3 +6 Fear of Death +1 Level of Existing Class 10th +5 +3 +3 +7 Cloak of Terror 5/day +1 Level of Existing Class Class Features All of the following are class features of the Terror Mage prestige class. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Terror Mages gain no further proficiency in any weapons or armor. Note: All effects, aside from the cloak of terror abilities and invoke fear ability are fear, mind affecting effects unless otherwise noted. Invoke Fear: The Terror Mage recieves a bonus to intimidate equal to his/her levels as a Terror Mage to demoralize a victim to a maximum of +10. Furthermore, for every two levels of terror mage, he/she recieves an additional -1 per two Terror Mage levels to the penelties inflicted by demoralizing a victim with intimidate. Cloak of Terror (Su): 1/day/2 Terror Mage levels, the Terror Mage can, as a standard action, create a wave of absolute fear eminating from the caster. The process requires either an open spell slot or a spell slot with a prepared mind-affecting enchantment, illusion, or necromancy spell. The effect forces everyone within a 30ft radius around the caster to make a will save or suffer the effects of the spell. If an open spell slot is used, the caster must select a spell of the slot's level or lower that has a fear effect. Break Resistance: The Terror Mage's fear effects are far more potent than before. Protection from fear effects from any kind of magical immunity suffers from a caster level check against the Terror Mage whenever the subject with the protection is targetted by the Terror Mage with a fear effect. If the Terror Mage's caster level check against the magical protection succeeds, the target suffers the fear effect as per normal upon failing whatever save the spell requires. Fear of Pain (Su): As a standard action upon sacrificing a 4th level spell slot or better, the Terror Mage can invoke an immense fear in a single target that renders them completely afraid of being subjected to pain to the point to which the target would go out of his or her way to avoid any situation in which the target would be struck by something that the target would recognise to cause pain. The target recieves a will save vs. DC 10 + Charisma + Level of the Spell Slot sacrificed to negate. The ability lasts 1 round/Terror Mage level. Fear of Thought (Su): As a standard action upon sacrificing a 5th level spell slot or better, the Terror Mage can invoke an immense fear in a single target that renders them completely afraid of thinking and descisionmaking, rendering them docile and unthinking. Upon a failed will save vs. DC 10 + Charisma + the Level of the Spell Slot sacrificed, the target recieves a Feeblemind and Mind Fog effect for 1 round/Terror Mage level. Fear of Life (Su): As a standard action upon sacrificing a 6th level spell slot or better, the Terror Mage can invoke an immense fear in a single target that renders them afraid of all things that appear animate, whether actually alive or not. The victim acts as though turned by a cleric for 1 round/terror mage level by everything that seems to be alive or at least animate in some fashion, except that the effect cannot be broken. A will save DC DC 10 + Charisma + the Level of the Spell Slot sacrificed can negate the effect. Fear of Death (Su): As a standard action upon sacrificing a 8th level spell slot or better, the Terror Mage can invoke an immense fear in a single target that renders them so terrified that they literally die of fear. This effect is a death effect. Only a will save DC 10 + Charisma + Spell Slot Level would negate this effect.
ChaosEvoker 12-14-04, 10:56 AM	Quite a few classes I'll be putting up a couple of creations myself soon.
thasis 12-14-04, 08:31 PM	I've created a Exiled Arcanist (see sig) but it's more for Wizards. Sorcerers can benifit from it to though.
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-14-04, 09:54 PM	Also, house rules to make sorcs better is a nice topic. My group rules that sorcs can apply metamagic as a standard action instead of a full round. Nice classes guys! :D
ChaosEvoker 12-15-04, 06:21 PM	Hmm..problem with that is: It makes sorceror metamagic WAY too powerful.
Dyne 12-15-04, 06:36 PM	I can see ChaosEvoker's point. One of the drawbacks of Metamagic for Wizards is that they have to choose a spell to be enhanced by Metamagic ahead of time. Sorcerers can apply their Metamagic feats at any time they feel they are needed. I don't think I would put that House Rule in my campaign, but that's just me.
ChaosEvoker 12-17-04, 08:32 PM	Hmm for house rules, I have considered creating some kind of spellpoint system similar to that (or even exactly like that) of the Psionics. It seems to me that would make more sence than having the sorcerors inborn power being divided into power levels that can only be used a certain amount per day.
Chosen of the Dark Sun 12-20-04, 02:10 PM	Sorry I haven't been here. My computer's internet connection hasn't been working for several days. :mad:
ChaosEvoker 12-22-04, 01:40 PM	DO you guys find the sorceror's charisma based spellcasting to be an advantage or disadvantage over intellegence?
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-22-04, 01:50 PM	DO you guys find the sorceror's charisma based spellcasting to be an advantage or disadvantage over intellegence? niether
ChaosEvoker 12-22-04, 01:55 PM	Really, why is that? (Either one could come form skills that are charaima vs intellegence based, or anything like that)
Dyne 12-22-04, 02:46 PM	DO you guys find the sorceror's charisma based spellcasting to be an advantage or disadvantage over intellegence? I think it just fits them better. Besides, it can be helpful sometimes to be able to lie through your teeth. :schemes: I have a question. I am gonna be making my very first Sorcerer character. I'm wondering, what spells do you guys find most useful to know? What are good combinations of spells, considering the Sorcerer's limited knowledge of spells?
ChaosEvoker 12-22-04, 04:03 PM	Definately Magic Missle early on, you can change it later if you aren't a big fan of that spell. (you can change out spells everytime you gain a level for others)
Dyne 12-22-04, 05:04 PM	Definately Magic Missle early on, you can change it later if you aren't a big fan of that spell. (you can change out spells everytime you gain a level for others) I thought it was that you can change out spells on every even-numbered level. Anyway, Magic Missile has always been one of the most popular spells. That, and Fireball.
ChaosEvoker 12-22-04, 05:14 PM	yeah and btw if any of you haven't EVERYONE must go to this site: CLICK HERE IT ROCKS!!!!!!!!! (http://www.cybermoonstudios.com/8bitDandD.html)
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-23-04, 01:37 AM	Really, why is that? (Either one could come form skills that are charaima vs intellegence based, or anything like that) for a few reasons... because charisma doesn't benifit sorcerers any more than what intelligence would. Intelligence's only benifit, were it the prime casting stat, would have it's only real benifit come from being the sorcerer's primary spellcasting stat. Otherwise, it would grant a few extra skill points. Charisma, as the sorcerer's prime casting stat, only benifits in terms of spellcasting ability. Otherwise, it grants some social benifits and multiclassing benifits (such as with the paladin). The sorcerer isn't a skilled class, which is the perview of the ranger, rogue, and bard. Therefore, intelligence doesn't benifit sorcerers any more than charisma does. (not without granting more charisma-based skills.) Since the sorcerer is a spontaenous caster, charisma is the stat of choice, given how intelligence is attributed to a "studious" or "discliplined" spellcaster. In that sense, charisma makes sense given how much the sorcerer doesn't study in the same manner as a wizard and gains thier arcane knowledge through being especially, possibly even supernaturally talented with the arcane arts.
Dyne 12-23-04, 01:39 AM	That, and Charisma doesn't have enough going for it as is. There isn't much that it gives, outside of spontaneous spellcasting.
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-23-04, 01:51 AM	That, and Charisma doesn't have enough going for it as is. There isn't much that it gives, outside of spontaneous spellcasting. charisma as a stat, overall, has more than plenty "going for it" as it were. Aside from being the primary determinant of a character's viability in a social situation beyond prodigeous skill ranks in several different social skills (which only a rogue could pull off) charisma also is the stat that governs the basis for virtually all "special powers." Cleric's turning, the bulk of the bard and paladin's assorted powers, the ranger and druid need it for their wild empathy, sorcerers obviously require it, enchanter wizards require a decent charisma in order for many of their mind-affecting enchantments to work well, rogues can make use of a good charisma for their social powers (skill ranks won't do it alone - bonuses help quite a bit.) and that's the tip of the iceburg with only the PC classes. Intelligence grants extra skill points and has synergy with several skills. But that's about it. I *could* go on to argue how charisma is better than intelligence.
Dyne 12-23-04, 02:01 AM	You'd be welcome to. Things are getting stagnant around here. :) I was referring to, if Charisma was not used for such things as spontaneous casting, then it would not have much going for it. Charisma only grants a few bonuses to a couple skills, outside of the special abilities it affects. And there are a lot of characters that are too direct to care whether or not they can diplomatically influence someone. Charisma has a lot of merit because it affects such things as the Paladin's Divine Grace ability, Smite Evil, and Lay on Hands abilities. It also affects a Cleric's Turn Undead ability, as well as the spellcasting of the Sorcerer and the Bard. Intelligence, outside of special abilities, provides bonuses to very useful skills, as well as provides bonus skill points. It also affects the spellcasting ability of Wizards, as well as prove useful in certain situations (such as if you encounter a Sphere of Annihilation). It can be useful for any character concept. While Charisma helps out more of the social types and those who like to get through things diplomatically, Intelligence helps out all character types, granting better Knowledge modifiers for the bookish types, granting more skill points for such things as Climb, Jump, Swim, or Ride for the more physical types, as well as more skill points for skills like Open Lock, Disable Device, Hide, Move Silently, Sleight of Hand, and all other skills. Both skills are very valuable. But, without the spellcasting and special abilities associated with it, Charisma would not be worth it IMHO.
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-23-04, 02:52 AM	Both skills are very valuable. But, without the spellcasting and special abilities associated with it, Charisma would not be worth it IMHO. I agree that both skills are valueable. However, I think saying things like "Charisma wouldn't be worthwhile at all without it affecting spellcasting/social abilities/special abilities/whatever" is exactly the same as saying "intelligence wouldn't be worthwhile at all if it didn't grant additional skill points/contribution to knowledgability/scholarly pursuits/etc." The answer is that OF COURSE it would be worthless without these major attributes. The exact same could be said for all of the other five stats, which changes nothing except the acknowledgement that the six stats, unlike in previous editions (where charisma was nigh-worthless) charisma is just as important as the other six ability scores. ...... except maybe constitution, which is important to anything that isn't undead, deathless, or a construct. (though even those race types would be better off with a constitution ability modifier.)
Dyne 12-25-04, 03:09 PM	Charisma, overall, is just as valuable as the other ability scores. But, depending on the character concept, it can be virtually worthless to certain types of characters. One of my friends would play as a Half-Orc Barbarian who basically liked to smash stuff. He focused completely on the physical ability scores. His Charisma was horrible, but it didn't really matter because he never used it at all anyway. Overall, Intelligence and Charisma are equal. Intelligence is just more valuable to more characters than Charisma, IMHO. A Fighter would likely take Intelligence over Charisma for the bonus skill points, since he could use them on skills he actually uses. Charisma would basically only be worthwhile to his Handle Animal and Intimidate skills, but not all Fighters use either of those skills anyway. Basically: Intelligence and Charisma are equal, but Intelligence is more widely used. Back to my question: What combinations of spells do you use for your Sorcerer characters? Actually, I have another question as well. What types of Sorcerer characters do you play? Do you focus on Combat spells? Divination spells? Protection and Bolstering spells?
TheDarkestOfAngels 12-26-04, 03:28 PM	Charisma, overall, is just as valuable as the other ability scores. But, depending on the character concept, it can be virtually worthless to certain types of characters. Perhaps, but this is true for every ability score except perhaps constitution. Though even constitution is argueable. Overall, Intelligence and Charisma are equal. Intelligence is just more valuable to more characters than Charisma, IMHO. A Fighter would likely take Intelligence over Charisma for the bonus skill points, since he could use them on skills he actually uses. Charisma would basically only be worthwhile to his Handle Animal and Intimidate skills, but not all Fighters use either of those skills anyway. Yes, but I don't think THAT's true either. That same fighter, for example, would only really need intelligence if he wanted a feat or group of feats that has an intelligence prerequisite. On the other hand, a fighter that wanted to focus on being intimidating would want charisma or if another feat tree had charisma as a prerequisite. In either case, charisma isn't any more important to fighters than intelligence is. Basically: Intelligence and Charisma are equal, but Intelligence is more widely used. By whom? For what reason? Skill points? Those aren't necessary for most classes. Bards have use for intelligence almost as much as charisma (which is the only one, really, that is needed over INT), rogues and wizards obviously need a high intelligence and they value it over charisma. rangers need charisma for wild empathy, though it's argueable that they would want intelligence more because they're almost as much a "skilled" class as bards and rogues. (though their extra skill points could also be the reason they emphasise charisma over intelligence, since they've the skill points to spare.) Though really more classes require charisma more than intelligence. Bards, clerics, paladins, sorcerers obviously either require or have a much better benifit from a higher charisma than intelligence. With barbarians, druids, fighters, monks, and rangers, it could go either way depending on things like character build and whatnot. Only rogues and wizards actually have either a greater benifit or actually need more from intelligence than charisma. Therefore, intelligence is not more widely used without very liberal interpretation of what classes actually need one over the other. Back to my question: What combinations of spells do you use for your Sorcerer characters? I have no such universal spell list. Quite literally, I could have anything go and still work to great benifit. Actually, I have another question as well. What types of Sorcerer characters do you play? Do you focus on Combat spells? Divination spells? Protection and Bolstering spells? Like I said before, I don't really have a universal spell list that are "must haves" from sorcerer character to sorcerer character. The sorcerer characters I have played vary greatly. Though only two stand out in my recollection. One named Erick and another named Sai Ket. Erick is worth mentioning because I started this character recently and am still playing this character. Sai Ket is important because I like her as a character better. She's one of my top characters. Erick is an character in the evil campaign that I'm currently participating in. He's a lawyer (he took profession: lawyer as a skill he has full ranks in) from waterdeep that craves money and power, sort of like the atypical/stereotypical/cliche'd evil character would. Sai Ket is a half celestial sun elf from evermeet. She was formerly aristocratic (and acts extremely haughty and arrogant), though she's a good-aligned character and acts quite accordingly. Erick focuses more on disabling, save-or-die, and defensive spells. Sai Ket has much more of a general selection including a number that she created herself. Though she enjoys more blasty spells than any other.
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