Post/Author/DateTime	Post
thasis 12-22-05, 09:56 PM	Guild Name: Guild of Pure Good This heer is a new and revised Guild of Pure Good. A continuation of the original guilds goals and motives to promote good in the world and to try to do things the right way. All members who were in the previous GoPG will still be members of this guild... that is unless you have betrayed us and joined the dark side :P In the distince you see a radiantly shining cathedreal. As you get closer you see a plac above the doors saying "The Guild of Pure Good". You push open the door and you enter a glowing halls. Inside is a chamber with numereous chairs is sitting around. In the front of these chairs there is a great golden throne where an old man sits. He smiles and says "Welcome to my guild. I am Thasis the Good, kin of Thasis the Evil, and aposer of all that is wrong in this world. I welcome you into my halls with a full embrace. Feel free to stay hear as long as you would like". Guild Charter: The main goals of the foundation are as follows: - To promote good in the city of Tryannor - To help all those in need (no matter what there race or class is) - To try to convert ones of evil into ones of good - To use diplomicy over violence to solve problems - To provide reasorces to other guilds of good in the war against evil - To stop the Guild of Ultimate Evil and all of his acomplices Member List: Guild Master 1.) Thasis Guild Members: 2.) Silmarien Aldolome 3.) Ouroboros 4.) Graz'zt, Prince of Shadows 5.) De Batavier 6.) Galeros 7.) Agudo Archmage 8.) Dyne 9.) Frostbite Ravenheart - 11.) Von Crown 12.) Chosen of the Dark Sun 13.) Zombomaniac 14.) Arshes 15.) Premier666 16.) Le-vantae 17.) Aramar the Black 18.) Gurney Halleck 19.) Master_of_Flames 20.) Jaggar Enemy Members 10.) Demonfay If I missed you or put you wrongly on please comment and I'll change it. Alliances: -Half Elven Foundation -Council of Archmages Others Comming Soon Enemies: -Guild of Ultimate Evil and all other acomplises Guild Leadership Score: Comming Soon Districts: Comming Soon Resource Income: Comming Soon Monthly Expenses: Comming Soon Guild Treasury/Items: Comming Soon Total Cost: Comming Soon Remaining Gold: Comming Soon Total[B]: 1,000,000 gp starting gold [B]Miscellaneous Guild Items: Comming Soon
thasis 12-22-05, 09:57 PM	Welcome to the new Guild House. Open for posting as of now!
Demonfey 12-22-05, 11:04 PM	Have you considered doing something like what I did with the GoUE for guild defenses, or would you like something a little more normal?
thasis 12-23-05, 03:00 AM	I'm not quiet sure. I hate developing Guild Defenses, Characters, or any of that stuff. The only thing I'm good at are RPing and designing new stuff.
Demonfey 12-23-05, 03:12 AM	Well, if you decide that you want to go with the vehicle bases, I'd be willing to help with that, as long as it didn't end up copying the GoUE. EDIT: maybe I should rephrase this a bit now: it's not so much I wouldn't help with a normal stronghold as I couldn't, due to not having anything of any use for that.
thasis 12-23-05, 03:17 AM	Yah, I'm thinking I might do an underground base though. I'll have the main meeting hall aboveground, but all of the facilities below ground. That could be intressting.
Demonfey 12-23-05, 03:40 AM	So something with a dwarven feel, perhaps?
Tenzhi 12-23-05, 04:14 AM	Somehow you just gave me inspiration for a breed of desert dwarves who have massive complexes spiralling down into the sands constructed partially of stone and partially of a glassy material made of fused sand.
Demonfey 12-23-05, 03:32 PM	Well, you could start with desert dwarves, for that, a variant in Sandstorm. From there, you could evolve the concept further easily enough.
Kobold_Ur_Priest 12-23-05, 03:58 PM	Somehow you just gave me inspiration for a breed of desert dwarves who have massive complexes spiralling down into the sands constructed partially of stone and partially of a glassy material made of fused sand. that would be so awesome, and would fit in with my friend's evil dwarven warlord who has just relocated his entire clan to a desert because of increasing attacks by outlaying elven/halfling/gnome settlements that have tried to exterminate the evil dwarves fromt the wilderness which they reccently fled from
thasis 12-23-05, 10:45 PM	Desert Dwarfs are cool. Anything Desert is cool actualy. I'm a magor fan of the Desert enviroment though.
Zombomaniac 12-23-05, 10:58 PM	Thasis you might want to change the "Cazic" to "Zombomaniac" in the member's list.
thasis 12-23-05, 11:05 PM	I keep on forgetting to do that. Changed it this time though.
Demonfey 12-24-05, 01:03 AM	There should still be areas in the desert open, actually. That could be GoPG turf, if you think of them needing as much help as they can get.
thasis 12-24-05, 01:41 AM	Hmmm... Desert turf left aye. I'll have to discuss this with the rest of the GoPG members... if they ever deciede to post here.
Zombomaniac 12-24-05, 02:48 AM	A messanger walks into the guild halls. He is a young land and dressed in travel worn clothing. "Great Warriors of Good, I have been sent by Lord Jacob of the Fortress of Light to forge an alliance with you. I have been given full power to fullfil any agreement I make and hope for the best in this talk." OOC: Ya no one has desert areas and there are the natural affects of the lans to protect you. I've read through much of Sandstorm. there is some pretty deadly stuff in there. @Thasis In Sandstorm ther are a race of Jackle looking creatures that live in the desert. They are called somethingspawn. I can't remember. Mabye you should use that for the race of you Thasis the Good if you go desert.
Demonfey 12-24-05, 02:51 AM	Marruspawn, and they're quite evil, actually.
thasis 12-24-05, 02:57 AM	I could create a Vallient Hero version of one? Also, do you have the link to the rules officialy created in stone. It was all posted in a large set of posts by Master of the House I think.
Zombomaniac 12-24-05, 03:01 AM	I could create a Vallient Hero version of one? Also, do you have the link to the rules officialy created in stone. It was all posted in a large set of posts by Master of the House I think. Check the "Important Threads" sticky by Wizo_Cat. It has everything in there. @DF Evil? Your Point? Make him a Redemed Villan. I wouldn't have to be the whole guild is that race and I think it would be better if it wasn't, but one person being a Good guy in a Evil race isn't bad. It is very good (pun :D ).
Demonfey 12-24-05, 03:08 AM	Sorry, my mistake. It says "usually neutral" for all but the abomination.
Zombomaniac 12-24-05, 03:09 AM	Sorry, my mistake. It says "usually neutral" for all but the abomination. Then everything works out fine in the end. :D
thasis 12-24-05, 03:20 AM	This could proove to be an intressting character. Now I'm going to have to get the MMII... to bad I have no cash... as usual...
Demonfey 12-24-05, 03:35 AM	Not MMII, but Sandstorm. You could just ask one of us to PM the stuff to you, you know. Just choose if you want to be better suited as a caster, fighter, or rogue before you ask us, and we will send you the necessary stuff.
thasis 12-24-05, 03:45 AM	I'm thinking caster cause I like the whole arcane thing.
Demonfey 12-24-05, 03:47 AM	I'll get it to you probably tomorrow.
thasis 12-24-05, 03:49 AM	Thanx Monsier! Muchly apprieciated :D
gabrion 12-24-05, 11:52 AM	If you want an arcane caster that is a little bit different, try playing a sylph from the MMII. It has 3 HD and a +5 LA, but casts spells as a sorcerer with CL=HD+4. So if you want thasis the good to fill multiple rolls, you can take levels in another class and it will still advance your Sorcerer levels! Plus they get good stat boosts and nice things like Improved Invisibility at will.
thasis 12-24-05, 04:48 PM	Hmmm... that sounds intressting as well. Possibly more powerful then going straight Wizard as the race that is being provided to me from Demonfay. I'll have to ponder this one.
thasis 12-24-05, 07:52 PM	Thasis the Good enters the Guild of Pure Good "I am back!" I'm pretty sure I have done a returning post for Thasis the Good yet. Damn me and my tendesy to lean to my evil characters.
Zombomaniac 12-24-05, 11:25 PM	If you want an arcane caster that is a little bit different, try playing a sylph from the MMII. It has 3 HD and a +5 LA, but casts spells as a sorcerer with CL=HD+4. So if you want thasis the good to fill multiple rolls, you can take levels in another class and it will still advance your Sorcerer levels! Plus they get good stat boosts and nice things like Improved Invisibility at will. Wait, wait, wait......if I got this right with the 15 ECL that lets you get 7 levels in whatever and from what you are saying if I took persay 7 lvls in Barbarian I would have CL 10 as a Sorc and be huge and bulky from Barb. Am I right? :confused:
Demonfey 12-24-05, 11:48 PM	You'd still about pixie size, maybe a little larger.
Dyne 12-24-05, 11:58 PM	Wait, wait, wait......if I got this right with the 15 ECL that lets you get 7 levels in whatever and from what you are saying if I took persay 7 lvls in Barbarian I would have CL 10 as a Sorc and be huge and bulky from Barb. Am I right? :confused: Barbarians can't do anything that requires concentration (such as casting spells) while raging. Fighter would work, though. And you would be CL 14, if I'm not mistaken (Gabrion said CL = HD +4).
gabrion 12-25-05, 12:55 AM	Dyne has it right. The problem with picking up a combat class though is that you will still only have 10 HD at ECL 15, making HP and such a bit of a problem. A rogue type character would work well though. The interesting thing is picking up a PrC that adds caster levels. By the rules, I'm quite sure you could actually pick up two caster levels at a time...
Dyne 12-25-05, 12:58 AM	Dyne has it right. The problem with picking up a combat class though is that you will still only have 10 HD at ECL 15, making HP and such a bit of a problem. A rogue type character would work well though. The interesting thing is picking up a PrC that adds caster levels. By the rules, I'm quite sure you could actually pick up two caster levels at a time... What if it just took 7 levels in Sorcerer? Would it be CL 21?
Demonfey 12-25-05, 12:59 AM	No, standard procedure for having a race with innate casting ability and adding the same casting class as what it's based off of would have spellcasting stack.
gabrion 12-25-05, 01:56 PM	No, standard procedure for having a race with innate casting ability and adding the same casting class as what it's based off of would have spellcasting stack. I don't know what standard procedure you are talking about. It may be the case that adding base class casting abilities wouldn't stack, but if a PrC gives +1 CL and the casting ability of the creature is always HD+4, then each HD granted by that PrC would actually give 2 Caster Levels.
Demonfey 12-25-05, 02:54 PM	Think it is, anyway. Honestly, at the time I typed it, I was going a bit in the brain.
Zombomaniac 12-25-05, 03:09 PM	With stuff like that it says to pick a class and such. I think what would happen is a 5 level Wiazrd of that race would be a 5 level Wizard and a 12 CL Sorc. If said Wiz went into a PrC then the +1 CL would likely go to Wizard only, but the HD would go to Sorc CL.
Dyne 12-25-05, 03:42 PM	With stuff like that it says to pick a class and such. I think what would happen is a 5 level Wiazrd of that race would be a 5 level Wizard and a 12 CL Sorc. If said Wiz went into a PrC then the +1 CL would likely go to Wizard only, but the HD would go to Sorc CL. Of course. But what if it took levels in Sorcerer? Or what if it just took a PrC that grants increases in spellcasting, like Eldritch Knight, without taking class levels? A regular Sylph could automatically qualify for the requirements without needing to take any levels in wizard or sorcerer.
Demonfey 12-25-05, 03:48 PM	There's normally a failsafe for that, such as "casting ability from race doesn't count for getting into classes". Example: mageslayer yuan-ti, which has a similar thing going on. You'd need a level of caster out of the species.
jagggar 12-25-05, 09:17 PM	There's normally a failsafe for that, such as "casting ability from race doesn't count for getting into classes".Got that phrasing on anything core? 'Cause I thought if your race gave you what you needed for a PrC you could go straight into the PrC without any base classes. I don't know what standard procedure you are talking about. It may be the case that adding base class casting abilities wouldn't stack, but if a PrC gives +1 CL and the casting ability of the creature is always HD+4, then each HD granted by that PrC would actually give 2 Caster Levels. Nani? I mean: What? Could you examplify that?
gabrion 12-26-05, 12:21 PM	Nani? I mean: What? Could you examplify that? Sure, but I don't have any books at home right now, so I will have to go from memory. Better yet, I'll just try to use the SRD. The important thing to keep in mind is that the wording of the spellcasting entry for the Sylph says that it casts as a sorcerer with CL=HD+4. According to the SRD: The creature’s Hit Dice equal the number of class levels it has plus its racial Hit Dice. Additional Hit Dice gained from taking levels in a character class never affect a creature’s size like additional racial Hit Dice do. So, as I was saying before, a sylph that takes 7 levels in a PC class would gain all the benefits of that class (for instance sneak attack, trapfinding, etc for a rogue), while also increasing their sorcerer CL. This is because every class level they gain increases their HD, and since their socerer CL is a function of HD, it also gains casting ability. The tricky part, as has been pointed out, is dealing with sorcerer levels or PrCs that grant casting levels. I really don't know what would happen if a sylph takes sorcerer levels, since the rules aren't too clear on this as far as I can tell (it doesn't say that the sylph's spellcasting stacks with sorcerer levels, although that seems intuitive). The interesting thing comes when a sylph takes levels in a PrC that advances arcane spellcasting. Take the example of Eldritch Knight, which has already been mentioned. The way it advances spellcasting is as follows (bolding mine): From 2nd level on, when a new eldritch knight level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if she had also gained a level in whatever arcane spellcasting class she belonged to before she added the prestige class. She does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. This essentially means that she adds the level of eldritch knight to the level of whatever other arcane spellcasting class the character has, then determines spells per day and caster level accordingly. So basically, the Sylph with 7 levels of EK would cast as a 13th level sorcerer from its racial casting ability, +6 CLs from EK, for a total of Caster Level 19. Note: It's controversion whether or not Eldritch Knight actually benefits sorcerers in the first place, but for this example, I treated the PrC as though it actually advances casting normally. If I need to use another example I can, but this one is pretty simple.
Demonfey 01-14-06, 01:09 AM	Oh yeah...I'd forgotten about this one...
jagggar 01-14-06, 01:16 AM	So, in response to:Okay, but if you played evil, what would be your motivation? If you played good, what would be your motivation?
Demonfey 01-14-06, 02:11 AM	@jagggar: If I played good, my motivation would be to see how long it would take me to accidentally go to neutral (according to the DM). My other goal would be to try and do it right. @thasis: now that Sil seems to have left again, and you're still in trouble, want me to try and breathe some life into the development and possible construction of this guild?
gabrion 01-14-06, 01:48 PM	My other goal would be to try and do it right. And just out of curiosity, what do you mean by "do it right?"
Demonfey 01-14-06, 02:07 PM	I mean stating you are good and doing more evil, going along the mindset that if detect evil says something's evil, it must be destroyed, etc. In other words, I mean more like Arcanus (has human fallabilities, makes mistakes, but is still mostly good), and not like Miko from OOTS (stuck up, has holier-than-thou attitude, believes her way is always best).
gabrion 01-14-06, 04:12 PM	So "doing good right" means operating in a way that ultimately serves good in your mind rather than the way "doing good right" actually looks in D+D (which includes such things as banishing or destroying evil when it can't be converted). If someone is playing a good aligned character who is actually dedicated to good ideals, what do you think they should do when they encounter someone who registers as evil when using a detect spell?
jagggar 01-14-06, 04:28 PM	What kind of evil do they detect as? Faint, Moderate, Strong, or the fun, fun Overwhelming? And is this the King, the peasant on the corner, the . . . . And are we Lawful, Neutral, or Chaotic Good here?
gabrion 01-14-06, 04:48 PM	What kind of evil do they detect as? Faint, Moderate, Strong, or the fun, fun Overwhelming? Lets assume we are dealing with a cleric of an evil diety that fits into the "strong" category. Keep in mind that the relevant question is not "what kind of evil" though, it is "how strong of evil." The difference is subtle, but very important. In D+D, evil is evil, period. When detect evil talks about the strength of an evil aura, it isn't describing different kinds of badness, but instead implying that evil is a singular ideal (perhaps a form?) and the power level it is judging is as much about the independent strength of the thing in question as it is about that things participation in the ideal form of evil. And is this the King, the peasant on the corner, the . . . . Pick any...if your answer depends on this, I would probably question your understanding of the alignment system in D+D. A more valuable question might be, "Do I have a 75%, 25%, or 1% chance of turning them from their evil ways?" And are we Lawful, Neutral, or Chaotic Good here? Now this could indeed make a difference. Lets assume neutral. The character really has no prefernce toward following systems of laws or ignoring them, but instead is primarily concerned with being a good person.
jagggar 01-14-06, 08:36 PM	"What kind of strength does the evil aura possess?" :D I'd say who is more important than what kind of a chance. I'm assuming we're going with a "common race" for our target subject. (This way we can remove the "Well I can't change it." arguement for simplicity*.) Honestly, I don't think you could get the "how much of a chance" answer without interacting with the evil or metagaming. Why? I don't find it likely that you're going to have the exact same reaction to a thug beating on someone at death's door as you will to the lord who kindly invited you to tea even when they register with the same strength of evil. I was more asking to point out that the reactions would likely be different. We shouldn't go calling CG evil just because it doesn't take the lawful route. As the one on trial, DF should probably get to choose his _G brand he'd be. I'll eventually answer (unless I think of more questions), but I don't want to influence DF's answers. *Okay, trying to decide if you should smite the evil human(oid) is probably a less simple decision than smiting the demon. However, assuming a common race removes the time spent on arguing about if devils, demons, and celestials can change their alignment or not.
Demonfey 01-14-06, 09:43 PM	So "doing good right" means operating in a way that ultimately serves good in your mind rather than the way "doing good right" actually looks in D+D (which includes such things as banishing or destroying evil when it can't be converted). If someone is playing a good aligned character who is actually dedicated to good ideals, what do you think they should do when they encounter someone who registers as evil when using a detect spell? Almost: it's trying to convert them from evil first, and delving into the why they are evil, actually similar to how I got people trying to convert Crowley earlier. If I remember right, even you tried, Gabe. If they refused, though, and maintained ways that are just too evil to risk them being free again, then killing them or banishing them when it's apparent. You have it down, with your healer. He understands that there are different viewpoints, some less tasteful than others, but he basically says live and let live, correct? Anyway, the first thing they should do when using the detect evil spell is to first analyze the situation. If the person/creature isn't doing anything evil or menacing anything, it would be best not to draw its attention. If it is actively being evil or has been a definite source of recent evil, try to subdue or, if you must (or by accident) kill. If they show no remorse after subduing them, put it up to a vote to either imprison, or in the case of some of the more dangerous ones, kill, and remember that you sometimes have to kill a helpless foe for the greater good (ie: red dragon has been terrorizing the countryside, you have it down, it's still breathing but would definitely not be remorseful). If using it while defending yourself, see actively being evil sentence.
gabrion 01-15-06, 04:06 AM	@DF-Cool. I would agree with pretty much all of what you just said. I definately try to play the healer in a way that is not a silly rampage in the name of good, while also trying to hold on to some moral principals that he is not willing to deny no matter what the consequences. I guess I've always just been a little skeptical of you (and I hope you don't take offense to that) because you often talk about "good" character who you rightly identify as not actually promoting the cause of good. It seems like some of your characters use that as a reason to reject real good (because they see people who claim to be good messing up so much) whereas I think the "right" reaction to such hypocritical good guys is to say, "hey, that person is just saying they are good...but they really cant be if they act like that."
Tenzhi 01-15-06, 04:54 AM	The healer in the Hall of Refuge is Good? Interesting.
gabrion 01-15-06, 01:34 PM	The healer in the Hall of Refuge is Good? Interesting. Damn you. Really though, is this a serious question (sorry, but as we all know, sarcasm is hard to catch on the boards)? Assuming you are serious though, what about that character makes his identification as good "interesting?" Edit: BTW, the post above this (which is fixed now) should have said "not a silly rampage" instead of "a silly rampage."
Dyne 01-21-06, 01:05 AM	The whole "stuck up, holier-than-thou, etc. Good" and "misunderstood, only wanting to survive, acting like a good guy, whatever, Evil" is a little old and tiresome to me. I personally prefer some good-ol'-fashioned cliche Good vs. Evil, in which either side is absolutely predictable, and they don't hesitate to bash each other's faces in. I mean, if a D&D character has the alignment of "Evil," it means they're a villain. They might have some interesting background that explains why they're Evil, but no matter how misunderstood they are, they're still evil, and it's still justice when a Paladin puts 'em to the sword. That alignment of "Evil" puts them on the same level as Demons and Devils. To me, the poor, misunderstood fellow who has committed horrific acts in his past, who isn't afraid to repeat those acts, but in general isn't a villain (maybe he just wants to keep to himself (who knows, he might even be a pacifist until he's roused to action), just wants to exist, whatever), the alignment of "Neutral" would fit them perfectly. Even if said character commits nothing but Evil acts, that doesn't necessarily make him Evil. Then again, maybe the alignment system should be changed to Hero and Villain to put it in more black and white terms.
Tenzhi 01-21-06, 01:29 AM	His actions seemed rather pragmatic for Good to me. I took him to be Neutral, or perhaps Lawful Neutral.
Demonfey 01-24-06, 06:26 PM	Alright, time to give this place a jump start. Can't have a GoUE without a GoPG, after all. *Takes out jumper cables, two car batteries linked together, and a metal piton to drive into the ground.* Okay, let's see what needs to be done...crud, that's a lot to do. Okay, time to get started. Anything I do here will be unofficial and easily changeable unless either Thasis or whoever is in charge of this place decides that they want something else. List of what Thasis has mentioned he wants done: Desert locale Underground fortress. As the only apparent active (anti)member of the GoPG still looking at the place, I'd like to declare the Barren Dunes area as GoPG territory, due to accessibility to the Oasis Town of Carnak. Construction will be figured out as things go.
Dyne 01-24-06, 06:39 PM	Take the Burning Marches. At least it has some kind of resource. Then again, I don't know what Necro is doing with the map (and last I knew, chaotica was being taken out). Take Wall of Stone and Stone Shape. Eventually, you'll be able to get free walls, plus a discount on all the stronghold spaces. Some other good spells are Fabricate (discount on all stronghold spaces), Fly/Air Walk/Levitate (discount on height adjustment (tall and underground structures)), Telekinesis (bigger discount on height adjustment), and maybe Move Earth (moats, add a few holes here and there). Also, by far the BEST magic item for any stronghold owner is a Lyre of Building. Find someone with a good enough Perform (string instruments) score and you can get a -30% discount on the entire stronghold. And even after the thing is built, strumming the lyre makes the structure (or at least all of it within 300 feet) immune to all damage for 30 minutes.
Demonfey 01-24-06, 06:42 PM	Well, I was actually talking about layout (I really, really suck at those), but this is also good...
Dyne 01-24-06, 06:54 PM	Surface Defensive Structures (guard towers, gates) Meeting Area (for outsiders, nonmembers) Trading Area (stores, caravans, to trade with travelers and such) Shallow Underground More Defensive Structures (guard posts, gates) Traps Moderate Underground Working Areas (smithees, workshops) Deep Underground Members Quarters Meeting Area (for members, allies) Far Underground Safehavens/Hiding Places (in case of invasion) Vaults (store and protect treasures) Mazes Secrets Guildmaster's Quarters Just a thought.
Demonfey 01-24-06, 06:57 PM	Ooo... now to make a special material for the walls to catch the idea Thasis had about it.
jagggar 01-24-06, 07:00 PM	Either Barren Dunes will get a resource, or it will produce twice as much gold as a place with a resources. And there's still the option of removing resources until we're clearly ready for them that hasn't been decided on yet.
Dyne 01-24-06, 07:05 PM	Ooo... now to make a special material for the walls to catch the idea Thasis had about it. "Special materials"? Bah. They're overrated, and way too expensive. At least, in my opinion. Besides, I just realized, hewn stone walls are free underground. And the walls are the most costly part of the structure. Might be interesting to have ice walls in the middle of a desert, though (would need a magical augmentation). It'd be kinda expensive, and they wouldn't be as durable as stone. Other possible "special material" walls would include bone, deep coral (underwater), glass, and living wood. But things like mithral, adamantine, or obdurium would just be ridiculous (not to mention walls of force).
gabrion 01-24-06, 07:10 PM	Well, I was actually talking about layout (I really, really suck at those), but this is also good... Hmm...I could pull CC2 and see what pops into my head. Probably will be later this week though.
Dyne 01-24-06, 07:10 PM	Either Barren Dunes will get a resource, or it will produce twice as much gold as a place with a resources. And there's still the option of removing resources until we're clearly ready for them that hasn't been decided on yet. Keep the districts without the resources? It would only be an increase of about 500 - 1,500 gp per DL (isn't it normally something like 1,000 gp per DL collected each turn?). Having any kind of resource would be way better than that, even if you just sell the resources.
Demonfey 01-24-06, 07:18 PM	@Dyne: Trying to get Thasis's idea for the keep working. That includes the stone/sand/glass wall idea. @Gabe: Actually, could you pull up the Hall of Refuge map? My thinking's that, since it was originally supposed to be for the GoPG, it might as well be the foundation of the work on the GoPG's layout.
gabrion 01-24-06, 11:48 PM	@Gabe: Actually, could you pull up the Hall of Refuge map? My thinking's that, since it was originally supposed to be for the GoPG, it might as well be the foundation of the work on the GoPG's layout. Well there is a link to it in the first post there I think...
Tenzhi 01-24-06, 11:53 PM	I believe the fused sand/glass wall idea was posted by me, and I'm not sure thasis ever said it was appropriate for the guild or not. In any case: Sandsteel Sandsteel is a glass-like material made by fusing sand in a special process developed by the khazish-mak (a race of desert dwarves). The process creates a molten liquid which can be shaped (and coloured) like molten glass, but when it hardens it is harder than steel - if a bit more brittle. Items normally made from metal may be made with sandsteel instead. The cost for making an item with sandsteel is double its normal price. Slashing and piercing weapons fashioned from sandsteel can be made much sharper than their normal metal counterparts. Such masterwork weapons have a Craft DC of 25 rather than 20. A successfully crafted weapon of this sort is treated as having the keen enhancement as an extraordinary ability and cost ten times as much as a normal (non-sandsteel) masterwork weapon of the same kind. Sandsteel has a hardness of 15 and 20 hit points per inch of thickness.
Demonfey 01-25-06, 12:10 AM	Thanks, Tenzhi. And sorry for giving the wrong person.
jagggar 01-25-06, 12:17 AM	Slashing and piercing weapons fashioned from sandsteel can be made much sharper than their normal metal counterparts. Such masterwork weapons have a Craft DC of 25 rather than 20. A successfully crafted weapon of this sort is treated as having the keen enhancement as an extraordinary ability and cost ten times as much as a normal (non-sandsteel) masterwork weapon of the same kind. Would that then stack with the magical version or not?
Tenzhi 01-25-06, 12:25 AM	Would that then stack with the magical version or not? To quote the SRD on the keen enhancement (which the uber-expensive version of the sandsteel weapon is treated as having): "This ability doubles the threat range of a weapon. Only piercing or slashing weapons can be keen. (If you roll this property randomly for an inappropriate weapon, reroll.) This benefit doesn’t stack with any other effect that expands the threat range of a weapon (such as the keen edge spell or the Improved Critical feat)."
Tenzhi 01-25-06, 12:39 AM	Thanks, Tenzhi. And sorry for giving the wrong person. No worries. I'm concerned that it wasn't his idea only because he may not actually want it for the guild. He may say: "Fie on the Elf-Bane and his crazy glass nonsense!" :D
jagggar 01-25-06, 12:41 AM	Hmmm. . . What if that wasn't so. . . 18-20 scimitar, 15-20 sandsteel, 12-20 keen, 9-20 improved critical. . . Wow. . .
Tenzhi 01-25-06, 12:43 AM	If that wasn't so, this would be 3.0 and yes, crit ranges would be heinous. Hence why they fixed that in 3.5. ;)
Demonfey 01-25-06, 12:43 AM	I'd get one.
Dyne 01-25-06, 01:13 AM	If that wasn't so, this would be 3.0 and yes, crit ranges would be heinous. Hence why they fixed that in 3.5. ;) The only thing that needed fixing was Vorpal. I don't get why Keen and all that other nonsense doesn't just increase the threat range by 1. Either that, or just get rid of the entire Threat Range nonsense, and have critical threats only on a nat 20. It doesn't make sense to me that they would create a weapon designed specifically for critical hits (the scimitar, in this case), then freak out when people used the weapon they designed it to be used. And even if the stupid thing crits on every hit, it's still only doing as much damage as a Greatsword, so what difference does it make?
Demonfey 01-25-06, 01:20 AM	It's the part where the Drizzt clones became an increasing notable population, I believe...hell, I had a person who, if he hadn't been forbidden from playing drow or anything involving two scimitars, would have been one. Just imagine, though: two weapons, crit on everything but 1, each would do the damage of a greatsword, full strength behind both. Now, if they were a rogue as well, then things just get messy.
Tenzhi 01-25-06, 01:30 AM	If it crits on every hit, why have crits at all? I do agree that they should've just left criticals on a natural 20 (no monkeyfied threats and confirmations - just a good ol' fashioned actual critical), however. Any improvements to that should have been additional critical damage or an increased multiplier. Indeed, I don't like the whole weapon system in general. Much more complicated than it needs to be. But that's par for the course in this edition.
jagggar 01-25-06, 01:31 AM	Well, I don't see why a magically sharpened weapon weilded by a skilled fighter would not be more effective than just one of those being fullfilled. I can see the keen property not stacking with the keen edge spell, but that's because they're the same thing only one is perminate. Sean K. Reynolds has a rant on the subject. "Keen and Improved Critical are too good if they stack!" (http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/rants/index.html)
Tenzhi 01-26-06, 12:45 AM	Wow, he has some silly rants there. And his self-proclaimed biased rant for LA (and against XP penalties) neglects to mention that, while LA effectively penalizes characters in the lower levels, the penalty relatively increases the higher in level the character goes and quickly becomes disroportionate to the abilities that garnered the penalty in the first place. He also treats abstraction vs. reality as a binary situation in his rant against armor as DR. Ah well, I'm sure I've gone off on even more crackpot tangents. 'Tis the madness of genius, no doubt. Anyway, the reason a magically sharpened blade and a skilled fighter don't stack is simply because there comes a point when peak efficiency is reached. You can only cut so well before it is physically impossible to cut better. At least, if one absolutely must have a worldly reason for it beyond the rules that serves well enough as the reason. I'm personally all for mortal limitations, and think there should be more of 'em.
jagggar 01-26-06, 11:45 AM	I'm not saying there isn't a peak. But why does that have to be the peak? Change the way one feat interacts with magic, and you've got a different peak. As far as LA goes, I can live with it. They can't do something better until 4th edition at least. Buy-off was a great idea (especially the variant from the boards which allows everyone to buy it off starting at 3rd level) until they created the scaling LA. A race with LA that gains benefits based on character level shouldn't lose their LA. Of course, on the other hand, I have no real experience with any of the 'scaling LA' races. That doesn't keep me from talking though. Mortal limits, eh? You don't happen to be the sort of DM that only lets a character take ranks in Craft(basketweaving) if the player can weave you a basket, do you? :P Actually, I was kind of suprised to see you stat your deity-rific self. Does that come from some sort of "the gods have limits too" kinda thinking? Because somehow I'd gotten the idea that you were more the type not to stat your gods (but one who doesn't care enough to yell at others who stat theirs).
Tenzhi 01-26-06, 11:34 PM	Buy-off was a great idea (especially the variant from the boards which allows everyone to buy it off starting at 3rd level) until they created the scaling LA. As I understand the buy-off system, it doesn't really change the nature of LA. So you have an LA +3, which gives you three virtual non-levels that count towards your total level and you buy it off by taking three non-levels that count towards your total level. This leaves you in exactly the same position. But mayhap I missed something along the way. Mortal limits, eh? You don't happen to be the sort of DM that only lets a character take ranks in Craft(basketweaving) if the player can weave you a basket, do you? No, but I'm the sort to install limitations in the system. I may or may not have mentioned these limitations before around the Guild House: 1. The max an ability score can modify a d20 check by is +5 2. DCs (including AC) max out at 40 3. The maximum actual enhancement bonus (not counting effects, IOW) on weapons and armor is +5 4. The maximum natural skill ranks, BAB, and save bonus is +20. Any BAB gained beyond +20 translates to bonus damage. Skill ranks and save bonuses beyond +20 may confer other bonuses. Just to name a few. Actually, I was kind of suprised to see you stat your deity-rific self. Does that come from some sort of "the gods have limits too" kinda thinking? Because somehow I'd gotten the idea that you were more the type not to stat your gods (but one who doesn't care enough to yell at others who stat theirs). More often than not, I would treat such stats as being an avatar of sorts. The gods have limits on the extent they can interact with the mortal realm, though said limits still transcend mortal limits. And their true form may remain beyond statistics entirely. ;)
jagggar 01-26-06, 11:57 PM	When you buy a level of LA off, your ECL drops by one. Then you gain more XP from every battle, assuming you were the same level as the rest of your party before buying off the LA. Well, we could resurrect the Variant Rules Foundation (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=225909). I enjoy your variants even if I don't agree with all of them. That makes sense as well. :)
thasis 01-27-06, 02:37 PM	Sil quite obviously isn't here. I think atleast untill his return that we should appoint a new leader. Does anyone think they're up to it?
Zombomaniac 01-27-06, 08:33 PM	I'd love to, but cant. i'm running Aer'bensek and have three PCs. I am bored so I am making a list of possible leaders: :raincloud :D 1. Thasis- He has always been a big person for the alighnments, but likely cant because of parents. 2. Tenzhi-It isn't gonna happen, but he would make a good level-headed leader. 3. Jagggar-I think she has a good PC (the half-Dragon?). Also a depentable poster. 4. Demonfey-Always been good with keeping things going, but controls the GoUE so this isn't happening. 5. Dyne-Can think of a lot of great stuff, but has been mainly SF devoted and seems to be taking a Tenzhi-ish stand point to the boards by staying OOC. 6. Gabrion-Can make some pretty powerful stuff and has been devoted to good a lot lately, but runs the Halls. Thats everyone in the past few posts so they are the only onlys I am puting on the list right not.
Demonfey 01-28-06, 01:14 AM	Yes. Mwahahaha, now I have the CoA, GoUE, and soon the GoPG! Next stop, the board, and after that, the world! :shifty: ...did I just say that out loud?
Zombomaniac 01-28-06, 01:16 AM	Yes. Mwahahaha, now I have the CoA, GoUE, and soon the GoPG! Next stop, the board, and after that, the world! :shifty: ...did I just say that out loud? No, no you didn't. ;) -Zombie
jagggar 01-28-06, 01:37 AM	Well, he probably should be a good canidate for GoPG leader, but I'm not sure I have the time to devote to it at the moment. I think since I don't have him completely statted yet, I'm going to stat him for next round when I have the time instead.
Demonfey 01-28-06, 01:40 AM	Want me to get the guild somewhat operational for the next round?
thasis 01-31-06, 04:01 PM	If you want to run the place you can DF, but remember not to do something to weaken the guild considering that you do RUN the GOUE.
Demonfey 01-31-06, 04:18 PM	I'm just getting the place set up so that someone that proves they can handle control of a guild comes along and is actually playing a good character, I can turn it over to them and just let this place get past being a supposedly IG place.
Dyne 01-31-06, 10:36 PM	I'd love to, but cant. i'm running Aer'bensek and have three PCs. I am bored so I am making a list of possible leaders: :raincloud :D 1. Thasis- He has always been a big person for the alighnments, but likely cant because of parents. 2. Tenzhi-It isn't gonna happen, but he would make a good level-headed leader. 3. Jagggar-I think she has a good PC (the half-Dragon?). Also a depentable poster. 4. Demonfey-Always been good with keeping things going, but controls the GoUE so this isn't happening. 5. Dyne-Can think of a lot of great stuff, but has been mainly SF devoted and seems to be taking a Tenzhi-ish stand point to the boards by staying OOC. 6. Gabrion-Can make some pretty powerful stuff and has been devoted to good a lot lately, but runs the Halls. Thats everyone in the past few posts so they are the only onlys I am puting on the list right not. Me? Leader? *Thinks a moment* Nah, ain't happenin'. The SF thing is dead, but as was said, I'm taking a "Tenzhi-ish standpoint" to the boards (I'm certain he's flattered for having a particular "standpoint" named after him). One thing I might add, though: All the guilds lately seem to be composed of just one or two people. Rather than have everything be its own individual guild, and since their all so alike in anyway, it might be better to just start merging things into "sides" (maybe all the good guys could combine into the GoPG and all the evil into the GoUE, and what others that are left over could probably figure out something). Get things a little more grouped together and united. All the guilds that seem to have branched off from the GoPG and GoUE could probably remain as the personal strongholds and realms of their respective leaders, and it probably wouldn't hurt for their respective threads to float around the places as discussions for their specific subjects and various locations of Tyranor.
Tenzhi 02-01-06, 01:13 AM	Nah, ain't happenin'. The SF thing is dead, but as was said, I'm taking a "Tenzhi-ish standpoint" to the boards (I'm certain he's flattered for having a particular "standpoint" named after him). Actually, I'm more amused by the irony that I have an honest-to-Elf-Bane character in the game. Zhen Di, the astral gnome monk. He may not have done much, but I do have him.
thasis 02-01-06, 10:43 PM	Mering the threads might have an overall bad effect. At the current point in time it might be benificial, but that's because right now that boards is in a lull. It always seems to get going eventualy so when we start to get people doing stuff again and if we have all of the bases on one thread we'll have wayyy to much stuff going on in one thread with little of it being related.
gabrion 02-02-06, 12:31 AM	Actually, I'm more amused by the irony that I have an honest-to-Elf-Bane character in the game. Zhen Di, the astral gnome monk. He may not have done much, but I do have him. Ya, I like that dude and I wish he would have joined my foundation. I guess you are just taking baby steps toward the form of the good though.
Tenzhi 02-02-06, 12:42 AM	Ya, I like that dude and I wish he would have joined my foundation. I guess you are just taking baby steps toward the form of the good though. What? Join the Halls of Refuge? Actually, I did consider it for a moment. But I have a standing creed that dictates I absolutely do not join *any* guilds/foundations. Even guilds that I like. Such allows me to take a more neutral stance in any given dispute (and as such, I also considered the Waves & Rocks Foundation of Orcy's, but decided it was too mercenary for me), which I prefer.
Dyne 02-02-06, 01:40 PM	What? Join the Halls of Refuge? Actually, I did consider it for a moment. But I have a standing creed that dictates I absolutely do not join *any* guilds/foundations. Even guilds that I like. Such allows me to take a more neutral stance in any given dispute (and as such, I also considered the Waves & Rocks Foundation of Orcy's, but decided it was too mercenary for me), which I prefer. Not even guilds you started (like that Forever Foundation)? Mering the threads might have an overall bad effect. At the current point in time it might be benificial, but that's because right now that boards is in a lull. It always seems to get going eventualy so when we start to get people doing stuff again and if we have all of the bases on one thread we'll have wayyy to much stuff going on in one thread with little of it being related. Take it as you will. If it were implemented, though, it would probably be temporary, until the number of guilds didn't actually outnumber the amount of players.
Tenzhi 02-02-06, 04:48 PM	Not even guilds you started (like that Forever Foundation)? Of course not. Having started it, it would be silly of me to join it. That'd be like trying to get into a car that you're already in. ;)
jagggar 02-02-06, 05:09 PM	Thanks a lot. Now I have to go and make a car analogy as well. Members aren't the passengers, they're the fuel.
Tenzhi 02-02-06, 05:15 PM	In any case, founders are the drivers. Though I prefer members as passengers unless I'm in a particularly evil mood (or they happen to be elves) and thus take joy in the thought of burning or using others - yanno, like fuel. :D
Lady Rolindin 02-02-06, 05:51 PM	Originally Posted by Zombomaniac I'd love to, but cant. i'm running Aer'bensek and have three PCs. I am bored so I am making a list of possible leaders: 1. Thasis- He has always been a big person for the alighnments, but likely cant because of parents. 2. Tenzhi-It isn't gonna happen, but he would make a good level-headed leader. 3. Jagggar-I think she has a good PC (the half-Dragon?). Also a depentable poster. 4. Demonfey-Always been good with keeping things going, but controls the GoUE so this isn't happening. 5. Dyne-Can think of a lot of great stuff, but has been mainly SF devoted and seems to be taking a Tenzhi-ish stand point to the boards by staying OOC. 6. Gabrion-Can make some pretty powerful stuff and has been devoted to good a lot lately, but runs the Halls. Thats everyone in the past few posts so they are the only onlys I am puting on the list right not. I still have an interest in the guild and am working on putting a character in this guild. I think about using Triskar since he's already been approved and then play him in htis guild. the leader is unimportant to me as long as the guild is running smooth and we as a guild do what the frist post says. try to do all the points in the frist post and do them to our utmost ability with our characters. the character dm link seems to be giving me trouble, yahoo says the email address don't exest. I don't believe it my self, I think hotmail is having a conflect with yahoo again, this happens with hotmail and yahoo from my experance of dealing with hotmail from yahoo email.
Demonfey 02-02-06, 05:56 PM	Wait, character DM email address? I wasn't told about that when I took the job... Just send me a PM or email with the link to the character, then, whichever you prefer.
Lady Rolindin 02-02-06, 06:14 PM	If one clicks on the character dm logo, it give's the email as Character DM@Hotmail.com. (don't worK) tryed to send to email and yahoo won't accept the address. where is this character thread to post the character sheet? I would like to have you look at my wizard/ranger and her cohert ranger/fighter to see if you think they might have some proumblems that need to be reworked. (both for the forrest guild)
Demonfey 02-02-06, 06:17 PM	First page, directly under Ghashmal Keep. Look for the Player Character Thread 4.
jagggar 02-02-06, 06:19 PM	I think what might have happened was no one checked it in so long, so the email account was deleted. Character thread is right here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=470766).
Lady Rolindin 02-02-06, 06:22 PM	I thought you was talking about another thread some where else on the boards where one posts a character sheet and then down loads the link to you. what is up with the character email address any way, yahoo won't accept the address. it does say character Dm@hotmail.com
Demonfey 02-02-06, 06:26 PM	I think it's dead. No one ever used it.
Lady Rolindin 02-02-06, 06:36 PM	I still would like to have my characters looked at and any commits made if you think there is a conflect, may be your other email adress. Orcy i still want the ring of Psionic Sanction made (the spell was approved)and a few other things, unless some other character from the merchant guild will make them. I guess i will have to check out the merchant guild and see who's willing to make a few things. 2 rings of psioncis Saction made for different characters, one for my wizard ranger and for triskar (maybe even my wiz/ran cohert also.)
Demonfey 02-02-06, 06:40 PM	Do you remember the page it's on, by any chance?
Lady Rolindin 02-02-06, 06:54 PM	we might have to make another merchant guild, unless theres a link to the revised merchant guild. Deamonfey i look up the page for triskar and send it to you, or post it on the character 4 thread. as far as the revised merchant guild it gone. where is the trynar thread with all the past of the planet and the tread links, I would like to see the traynor gods list again, and reread the trynor history again. maps and everthing again.
Demonfey 02-02-06, 07:00 PM	Pruning hasn't started yet. You just have to put the threads shown option at the bottom of the page to the beginning, which'll bring up every thread. I think it'd be third, maybe fourth page. Post the character and mention that it's ready is the best course of action. For the map, well...its somewhere. I'll hunt for it later and make a link.
Zombomaniac 02-02-06, 10:48 PM	Welcome to The Guild House! (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=417444)
thasis 02-18-06, 10:47 PM	Bump! :P
Lady Rolindin 02-19-06, 01:26 AM	I was always told that only evil creatues go bump into the night. someone turn the light on fast we have monsters running around, Oh no a vampire in the shadows.
Demonfey 02-19-06, 01:30 AM	*Click* *See Zamiel no Oni Crowley* Um...hi?
Lady Rolindin 02-19-06, 01:40 AM	seems this place needs to be cleaned up and brought back to some order. evn you can help Oni Crowley, either we help clean up the place or put up a for sale sign. Would make an good guild house for an mercantile or other merchant guild to use big enough.
Demonfey 02-19-06, 01:45 AM	Excellent, I've already got the sign. Holds up a sign that says "FOR RENT" with what appears to be a severed arm tucked behind his back with the other hand. Um...It was no one you knew?
Lady Rolindin 02-19-06, 02:28 AM	Put the sign up and if the owners ever come back, we don't know nothing. Goes to the door and opens it, looks in the hall way. sees serval women escorting men around, "seems they didn't take long to set up bussiness, not suprised at what else is going on inside the building. "I woulden't want to be here when the owners come back, if they come back." closes the door and wonders what happen to all the people and why they left.
Zombomaniac 02-19-06, 11:34 AM	Lady Rolindin I have to say this and if it sounds rude I am sorry. Even more so cause it sounds rude to me to be telling someone how to post. :( When you post IC please color your posts, Italic them, or something cause your IC posts and your OOC post look almost the same. It will make it easier for people to know whats IC and OOC. Coloring also helps tell people how your character feels about something. Blue = Happy, Red = Mad kinda thing. You should also put quote tags around other people's posts when you quote them. You leave no way of telling when their post stops and your's starts. Sorry again if this is rude, its just been bugging me. :(
redhase 02-19-06, 04:09 PM	" I see the had bussiness people take over and start up business, very good how about starting a gambling hall. Think of the gold we could bring in, who the manager of the women. We could killl him or her and take over their bussiness. Put the sigh up and we could get some partners to take over the building. I do like an good bussiness oppertunities and gold makeing ways. we should set up a bar over there by the wall." opens the door then closes it and goes to find the manger of the women. Humming David Bowe's Money song.
Lady Rolindin 02-19-06, 04:19 PM	"the hall has attracted some ununusual bussiness in their once great hall, Hum I think I'll leave before other things start happening. I do hope the owners come back soon, they have alot of cleaning up to do." It seems while the cats away the mice will play, leaves the building asking one of the people to place the sign on the out side wall for all to see.
jagggar 04-19-06, 04:50 PM	If Thasis can put up lyrics for the GoUE to be inspired by, I can put up lyrics for the GoPG to be inspired by! Though the clouds of fallen ash, a lonely mother's cry Among the fields of broken glass the loyal few will arise Faith now regained Finding the strength within the void, a raging fire ignites A spark of ever-burning power and conviction to fight Pride be your name They will spit upon the honor that you guard with your life And run to hide in selfish fear when threat of death is in sight Lay down your shame Armed with resistance and blind to the cost They say your purpose is mindless and lost But we don't adhere to the slander they spill We mourn with your losses and stand by your will These tears we spill They haunt us still The cries of the weak lie quiet in sleep Beneath our feet We are the sons of holy wrath, a shining light in the dark The ones who walk amongst dispair, no sign of fear in our hearts Stand in death's way Shut out the voice of mindlessness, open your eyes to the truth Believe the words that stand the test and not the slurs of the youth You're not what they say Turn over the tables and watch them run You'll be the weapon they can't outgun I have an idea based on the lyrics all ready, but I'd like to know what others get an image of.
thasis 04-19-06, 08:25 PM	I'm thinking Paladin Prc that is so blindly fanatical in the pursuit of greater good that he starts to loose focus on what is good and what is evil. Of course I see the bad in everything :P
jagggar 04-20-06, 12:58 AM	What the? I thought this was the Guild of Pure Good, not the Guild of Slightly-Twisted and Slowly-Courrpted Good. I got to go to the book stores today, and was able to flip through BoEDs. That exalted barbarian PrC is kinda what I was think of, only not, cause, well, it's exalted and I'm not really into that stuff. If anyone else would like to share what picture the lyrics paint, ya can do so before I start my huge blurb about it. I'll just put my blurbs in a spoiler box. The setting is one part post-apocalypse, one part western (particularly the show Branded), one part something else, Matrix maybe, you know, for the camera angles and slow-mo and bullets flying everywhere. The strong, silent, stranger type is sitting at one of the tables in the tavern. He's not bothering anyone, but he has an aura that kinda keeps people away from his table as though he's been exiled and all of society knows it. The gang of maurders which plauges the town enters. They've come for their dues which includes "pleasures with the women" even though this isn't that kind of tavern. They start going around to the folks tellin' them to put their tribute in the bags. The stranger speaks up, "You don't have to give them anything." The leader turns to the stranger, sizing him up, talking him down. They don't need some hero messing up their little candy factory. "Look, these people aren't hurting anyone and don't owe you anything. Just go home, you've got plenty there already." The stranger talks like a Jedi but his mind tricks don't work. The leader's getting angry. He gets a couple of his guys to come up next to him. Sure this hero is a big guy, but there's no way he can match the gangs numbers. He pulls a gun. "Give them back their things and go home." The stranger takes a sip of his drink and sets it on the table behind him. His buddies pull guns. "I said, GO HOME!" The table flies though the air smaking into the leader and his two buddies. Bullets sink into the men collecting the "tribute" and they crumple to the floor. Another one of them coming through the door crumples as well. The stranger puts one of his guns away and tosses the table aside. He lifts the leader up and wounds his two buddies from earlier badly enough that they shy away from their guns. He drags the leader out the door over the body and hurls him at the man at the bottom of the steps. A few more bullets take care of the man off the way while his boot takes care of the man who thought to stand beside the door. As the stranger approaches the leader and the man he's keeping down a bullet tears into his shoulder from above. With a cry, powerful, angelic wings burst from the strangers back. A brilliant white in the sunlight, something tints them--blood. He turns, scanning the buildings' tops and thrusts himself off of the ground. A minute later, the shooter's body falls to the ground, limp before it lands. "Hope you like hell," The stranger lands forcefully upon the leader's chest creating a sickening *crack*. A few more shots sound the end of the fight. The stranger walks back in silently and finishes his drink. "I'm very sorry about that, ma'am. I hope this'll cover the damages. And if you could contact the undertaker, this should take care of that." He hands the barmaid more than enough to repair the damages thrice and leaves in silence. I see a Paladin/Barbarian PrC (has a rage-like feature and smite evil) that's also the Half-Celestial version of Dragon Disciple (so you're a half-celestial at the end of the class). I'm kinda thinking of calling it Son of Holy Wrath. Somewhere in the flavortext I see, "Ex-Paladins who were tricked into their fall but have regained their faith in good often become Sons of Holy Wrath." I am very much trying to avoid the "You won't like me when I'm angry" line in the little RP scene it seems we're supposed to put on PrCs now-a-days.
thasis 04-20-06, 02:21 AM	If yah want a detailed description of what I see: A man clad in the riteous armors of pelor walks through the windy town. His cloak blowing to one side. The man looks about the town in a form of anger, "You are all ones who betray thee gods who brought thee into the planet. You do not pay your homage, or set up altars. You shall be punished how the gods deem fit". With that he pulls out a blade that starts to glow with a swirling energy of red and orange.
jagggar 04-20-06, 12:41 PM	Again, Pure Good or Slightly-Twisted and Slowly-Courrpted Good? Edit: and the reason I see the guy as having wings is because of Escaflowne and how sexy Van and Folken are.
thasis 04-20-06, 07:18 PM	Hellz yes ;) And I've never played a good character except for Thasis the Good on these boards, nor have I ran in or played in good (or even neutrul) campaign. So expect my views to be twiztid ;)
jagggar 04-21-06, 10:33 AM	So would you be playing Thasis the Good if you weren't trying to do the whole Evil, Neutral, Good thing? Have you ever had the urge to play or run a good game? Or is playing evil a vacation from the sweet, little, innocent boy that you are? Or does your entire group dress in black and walk around school saying "Praise {Demonic Name}" just to scare the normal people? And why the heck do I seem like I'm lecturing you when my head character (jagggar) is CN?
thasis 04-21-06, 07:49 PM	Well I probally would do Thasis the Good eventualy, as it works perfectly into my home-campaign storyline. As for the whole goth thing, yah. I'm the Goth/Emo guy who everyone at school thinks is a Nazi Emo Satanist, marching around shouting "Seig Heil" and drawing Pentagrams all over my binders. I've also made my views on Anton LeVay Satanism very... apparent. :D So am I freak? Yep, and damn proud of it!
jagggar 05-04-06, 01:05 AM	Okay, general ideas/outline for Son of Holy Wrath Requirements: Alignment: Any Good BAB: +7 Feat: Iron Will Special: The character must have made peaceful contact with a good outsider summoned by him or someone else. Or the character must have atoned for its evil actions (this atonement cannot be one which restored class features}. HD: d10 BAB: As Fighter Fortitude: Dunno yet Reflex: Poor Will: Good Class Features Fit of Holy Wrath (su): Like rage, but provides sacred bonuses instead of unnamed bonuses and no AC penalties. While in a Fit of Holy Wrath, the Son of Holy Wrath may smite evil. If a SoHW smites something non-evil, the Fit of Holy Wrath ends immediately and is fatigued till the end of encounter (double penalty if the smote creature is good). Length of a Fit of Holy Wrath is 5+ Wisdom Modifier. Higher levels net more Fits of Holy Wrath per day and more Smite Evils per Fit. Aura of Courage (Su): As the paladin ability Wings (Su): They can sprout feathered wings for 1/2 SoHW level + Wis modifier minutes per day time doesn't have to be conscutive. Flight is as half-celestial (double base land speed, good manuverability). Might have it at earlier levels at base spead with average manuverability.
DeimosDeMalus 05-04-06, 01:11 AM	same here. evil all the way never even slightly twisted soon-to-be-corrupted good. CN was the only variant from a form of evil that i've played,and even then, i slaughtered thing @ will
thasis 05-04-06, 01:24 AM	@Jaggar That seems cool. Is it a 5th level class? @Priest I've always been intrigued behind what makes people think in the methods of the supposed good. What does it provide people? I've attempted to do the supposed "Right Thing" before and I find I just get *****ed at or hurt by somebody, so atleast when i'm doing the supposed "Wrong Thing" I get a little bit of gratification that I helped myself in the end.
jagggar 05-04-06, 11:09 AM	Nope, planning on full 10 levels if I can figure out another ability or two that would work. Possibly a few half-celestial SLAs. I looked it over, and giving them all of them would be too much. Umm, I think I'll have to reread Suffering and get back to you with an answer.
jagggar 05-23-06, 08:36 AM	Umm, isn't this the topic we should be casting Summoning spells and Topic Resurrection instead of the nearly 1000 page thread? I'm not good at sticking to my reading, so I haven't finished Suffering yet. But in short, Good is a whole different world view from not only Evil but Neutral. Neutral cares about the self and evil cares about the self so much that it's willing to intentionally harm the other (prettymuch anyone else) to improve the condition of the self (be that getting stuff or power or whatever). Good is more concerned about the other than the self. Good doesn't sit around asking, 'What do I get out of this?' it just does it if it helps others.
thasis 05-23-06, 10:15 AM	Well the exception might be Chaotic Good in which many rouges and self-benefactors will arise out (but with a tinge of good in them) such as Han Solo (though by my belief he didn't start out as good alignment, he started out as Chaotic Neutrul and progressed towards good).
jagggar 05-23-06, 11:52 AM	I'd agree that Han started out CN and became CG. [Han Shot First Rant] I'm not sure I'd say a tinge of good automatically qualifies you for a good alignment. Against a LE tyrannical force (no pun intended) a CN character would likely look CG part of the time, they are fighting evil after all. Same with the LN upholder of the law against some crazed (crazed is important, because I don't believe chaotic characters are normally incapable of rational thought) CE killer looking good when he delivers the death sentance. I'd say part of transitioning from one alignment to another without an epiphany (represented by atonement in D&D) is being with others of your new alignment (or whatever alignment is distant enough to give you your change) and being dragged along as they do their thing. Enough time spent with good guys and your actions will start being 'good-er'. Soon enough your thoughts will change as well and you won't see doing good as going out of your way for someone else, but just what you do. Likewise, walk around with the baby hunters long enough and you'll start hunting babies and you'll stop seeing what's so wrong about hunting babies.
thasis 05-23-06, 04:17 PM	Well I personally believe that Han didn't realy turn FULL good untill at the very end. This becomes even more apparent in the pre-movie fiction. I believe Leigh brough out the good in him (along with the Rebel Alliance work). And yes, doing good tends to rub off, but it doesn't always make you believe that good is the way. It all depends on how easily influenced your character is, how long your exposure is with the good, and how much good you are actualy involved in. I'm currently playing a LN (borderline evil) Soul Hunter in my friends campaign and I'm playing with a band good guys. Just because the other characters are good doesn't mean I'm going to be good. I'm simply with the other characters to help prolong my characters life and motivations. So I dunno, being with good (or evil) definitly may change your thinkings to some extent, but overall the person (or character) that you are initial is probally the biggest factor in your alignment. Rarely do people make drastic changes in their alignment.
jagggar 05-24-06, 09:06 AM	There's always the pretty girl factor. . . I'm not saying it took five minutes for Han to change. Or that after one session your guy's gunna be begging for an atonement spell from a CG cleric. I'd say it's also a bit different in D&D because if you as the player make a decision that the character will never-ever become good, well, unless some of the RP really gets to you, ya won't be changing it. But you can be considered an outside force so pwoerful the character can't resist what you decide. Again, I'm saying that most of the time it takes quite a while. Darby spent quite a few years with the Children in Neutral before becoming Good. I think I already pointed out that epiphanies in D&D use the atonement spell as reasoning. So yeah, I can't form a coherent rant today. Just create little bits of one.
thasis 05-31-06, 01:35 AM	Zap!
jagggar 05-31-06, 01:42 AM	Zap? Huh? Wha? Is that like some sort of bump?
thasis 05-31-06, 02:40 AM	Yes, do you have a problem with my new Zap Bumpation :P
jagggar 05-31-06, 12:03 PM	:angel: :fight!: :angel: Thou vile fiend! There is only one True and Rightous bump! :bump: All smilie zealotry aside. . . After you Zap I got out my notebook and did a little work on my PrC. Here's what I have so far on the Son of Holy Wrath: HD: d10 Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 +1 + +0 +2 Fit of Wrath 1/day 2 +2 + +0 +3 3 +3 + +1 +3 4 +4 + +1 +4 Fit of Wrath 2/day 5 +5 + +1 +4 6 +6 + +2 +5 7 +7 + +2 +5 Fit of Wrath 3/day 8 +8 + +2 +6 9 +9 + +3 +6 10 +10 + +3 +7 Fit of Wrath 4/day As you can see, I'm missing a Fort Save and all ability descriptions.
thasis 05-31-06, 08:46 PM	I'd say give it a good fortitude save, and maybe add a unique ability at 5th and 10th level. That's just my opinion on the little you have provided.
Zombomaniac 05-31-06, 10:59 PM	I'd say give it a good fortitude save, and maybe add a unique ability at 5th and 10th level. That's just my opinion on the little you have provided. I second this motion. :)
jagggar 05-31-06, 11:32 PM	K. Fortitude in the chart. I'm typing parts of it up right now in Notepad. Earlier on the page, I've got a short idea summary for abilities. Fit of Wrath is kinda like Barbarian rage, but the bonuses to Str and Con are sacred, you get to smite evil, and smiting non-evil creatures ends it automatically. Earlier I was thinking about giving it Aura of Courage as a paladin. Now I'm kinda thinking Mettle wouldn't be bad. The really nifty thing I was thinking of was giving him the ability to sprout wings for a few minutes per day. (I was originally thinking 1/2 class levels + Wis modifier minutes per day.) One of my problems is how is this gunna effect the type of armor he can wear? Edit: Okay, Got Fit of Wrath typed up. Still need more formatting, I know. And fluff as well. Son of Holy Wrath Requirements To qualify to become a son of holy wrath, a character must fulfill all the following criteria. Alignment: Any good. Base Attack Bonus: +7 Feats: Iron Will Special: The character must have been redemed by atonement or other means. The use of atonement to restore class abilities or spellcasting does not qualify. Class Skills The son of holy wrath's class skills (and the key ability modifier for each skill) are... The Son of Holy Wrath Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 +1 +2 +0 +2 Fit of Wrath 1/day 2 +2 +3 +0 +3 3 +3 +3 +1 +3 4 +4 +4 +1 +4 Fit of Wrath 2/day 5 +5 +4 +1 +4 6 +6 +5 +2 +5 7 +7 +5 +2 +5 Fit of Wrath 3/day 8 +8 +6 +2 +6 9 +9 +6 +3 +6 10 +10 +7 +3 +7 Fit of Wrath 4/day Class Features All of the following are class features of the son of holy wrath prestige class. Weapons and Armor Proficiency: A son of holy wrath gains no proficiency with any weapons, armor, or shields. Fit of Wrath (Su): A son of holy wrath can throw himself into a fit of righteous anger a certain nuber of times per day. While in a fit of wrath, he gains a +4 sacred bonus to Strength, a +4 sacred bonus on Constitution, a +2 morale bonus on Will saves, and can smite evil a number of times equal to one half his class level (minumum 1). The increase in Constitution increases the son of holy wrath's hit points by 2 points per level, but these hit points go away at the end of the fit of wrath when his Constitution score drops back to normal. (These extra hit points are not lost first the way temporary hit points are.) While in a fit of wrath, a son of holy wrath cannot use any Charisma-, Dexterity-, or Intelligence-based skills (except for Balance, Escape Artist, Intimidate, and Ride), the Concentration skill, or any abilities that require patience or concentration, nor can he cast spells or activate magic items that require a command word, a spell trigger (such as a wand), or spell completion (such as a scroll) to function. He can use any feat he has except Combat Expertise, item creation feats, and metamagic feats. A fit of wrath lasts for a number of rounds equal to 5 + the character's Wisdom modifier. A son of holy wrath may prematurely end his fit of wrath. At the end of the fit of wrath, the son of holy wrath loses the fit of wrath modifiers and restrictions and becomes fatigued (-2 penalty to Strength, -2 penalty to Dexterity, can't charge or run) for the duration of the current encounter. If a son of holy wrath accidentally smites a non-evil creature, his fit of wrath immediately ends and he is fatigued until the end of the encounter. If a son of holy wrath accidentally smites a good creature, his fit of wrath immediately ends and he is exhausted (-6 penalty to Strength, -6 penalty to Dexterity, moves at half speed) until the end of the encounter at which point he is fatigued until he can rest for 8 hours. A son of holy wrath can fly into a fit of wrath only once per encounter. At 1st level he can use his fit of rage ability once per day. At 4th level and every three levels there after, he can use it once additional time per day (to a maximum of 4 times per day at 10th level). Entering a fit of wrath takes no time itself, but a son of holy wrath can only do it during his action, not in response to someone else's action. A son of holy wrath must be able to think clearly to enter his fit of wrath, and cannot enter it while raging, under the effects of a compulsion spell or effect, or under a similar condition.
thasis 06-01-06, 01:48 AM	I'm thinking Aura of Courage is looking pretty pro.
jagggar 06-01-06, 01:55 AM	"pretty pro"? Darn it, I keep thinking up this other ability and then forgetting it before I jot it down. Edit: Oh yeah, now I remember. I'm thinkin' profiecieny with improvised weapons would be cool. Not sure I've seen it in D&D, but d20 Modern has a couple of advanced classes with it.
thasis 06-01-06, 01:58 AM	Pretty Pro as in looking good.
jagggar 06-01-06, 12:47 PM	Should I start feeling old now? Any suggestions on what level to put it at? I want it early, but I don't want to front load the class. I'm kinda thinking Aura of Courage at 2nd level. Mettle at 8th level. Wings at 5th level. Improvised Weapon Proficiency at 1st level.
thasis 06-01-06, 08:05 PM	Switch around wings and mettle then it looks good.
jagggar 06-01-06, 08:54 PM	The thing about that though is that the wings as I'm planning them now aren't even gunna be around for an hour a day in most cases. Should I just switch it to wings all the time? Edit: My original idea for wings was as follows: Wings (Su): For a number of minutes per day equal to one-half his class level + Wisdom modifier, the Son of Holy Wrath may sprout a pair of feathered wings which grant him a flight speed equal to twice his base land speed (good manuverablity). This time need not be continus. My second idea was: Wings (Su): For a number of minutes per day equal to his class level + Wisdom modifier, the Son of Holy Wrath may sprout a pair of feathered wings which grant him a flight speed equal to twice his base land speed (good manuverablity). This time need not be continus. But if they're not going to get them until pretty late in their career, don't see why they shouldn't get perminate wings.
thasis 06-01-06, 10:15 PM	I'd say give it later and make it permenant. Just my thoughts.
jagggar 06-02-06, 12:49 AM	It probably is the more mechanically sound way of doing. Ever seen Escaflowne? Van has wings. Folken has wings. Wings pretty. . . :love: :drool: :cloud9: I mean, they don't have wings 24/7 and it kinda looks like they can only keep their wings out for a short period of time. That's kinda what I'm going for, I just don't know how to do it in a balanced way, and if it should really be part of this class or not.
thasis 06-02-06, 01:13 AM	Escaflowne... never heard of it. Movie? Anime? ???
jagggar 06-02-06, 01:28 AM	Anime. There's a series and a movie. I think there's a manga as well, but it's pretty different from the anime from what I've heard. Girl Hitomi gets taken to Gaea, a world with normal people, a few varieties of beastpeople (including cat-girls! :P ), and mecha called guymelefs. Oh, and dragons. The dragons are kind important as their hearts power the melefs. Oh, and the floaty rocks. And the earth hangs in the sky, known as the "Mystic Moon."
thasis 06-02-06, 01:46 AM	I like reading Manga, but I can't stand watching it. Most of it's pretty dumb. A few exceptions: Dragonball, Dragonball Z, Sailor Moon.... that's about all I can think of that I like to watch. Reading though... fan... fan... fan..
turalisj 06-02-06, 07:13 AM	Why not make him psionic? There's a power you can use to give yourself the celestial template for a short amount of time.
Zombomaniac 06-02-06, 09:11 AM	Why not make him psionic? There's a power you can use to give yourself the celestial template for a short amount of time. There is also a Clerical spell that does that.
jagggar 06-02-06, 11:15 AM	Is there anything exclusive these days? Wait, wait, wait. . . Dragonball and Sailor Moon? Those are so repetitive. Not that I don't like them. I actually mourn not realize what SM was when it was on, but I woulda had to wake up at 6 to watch it and it was on back when I thought it was just bad animation and didn't have a knowledge of anime (pre-Pokemon). As far as anime goes, I own Escaflowne, Escaflowne the Movie, Slayers, Slayers Next, Slayers Try, several Slayers movies, Pokemon the 3rd Movie, Pokemon: Mewtwo Returns, and Spirited Away. I'll sblock the other stuff I own later. Slayers is western fantasy. Kickass bandit blasting followed by saving the world a few times. Guardians of Order did a pretty good job of translating the magic system to something roughly d20, but it is so not normal D&D power level. Hmm, wonder if you evil guys would like Xellos. . . Pokemon? Okay, it's an obsession. The movies are actually quite good even if you don't like the rest of it (on the other hand, I'm talking to the people who want to see more gore). Mewtwo Returns is an hour-long movie where Giovanni finds Mewtwo again. I just love things with the full Team Rocket in it. Stupid people, replaced Misty with that little tramp May. . . Anyway, last night I did a half-assed summary of Escaflowne. It deserves far better than that. Anyway, I first discovered it when Fox Kids (when it still existed, now replaced by Fox Box) aired it Saturday Mornings as a filler while they ainimated more NASCAR Racers. They actually stopped airing it in the middle of one of the Japanese episodes, while Hitomi's heart wasn't beating no less. Amano, the best guy on the track team, is about to leave for some place else. Hitomi likes him, and asks him to have the honor of being her first kiss if she can run the something-dash in under 13 seconds and that he's to time it with her grandmother's pendant. While she's running, this pillar of blue light appears in her path and dumps Van in, a guy with a funky arm shield and a sword and Amano and Hitiomi's friend (who showed up to be supportive even though she likes Amano herself) can't understand a word he says. Van is here to hunt a land dragon that appeared in a seperate beam of blue light. The land dragon finds them, it and Van fight some, shield goes bye-bye, the dragon chases after the three earthlings, Van intercepts and fights it some more. Hitomi has a vision flash before her where the dragon kills him with its tail stinger and she yells to warn him. He dodges it, kills the dragon, and removes its heart, a dragenergist (a battery for guiymelefs). She asks if he's okay and he snaps at her telling her that he doesn't need the help of some woman and the she shouldn't expect a reward. Hitomi snaps right back saying all she was trying to do was save his life and that a simple thank you would've been enough. He's all like, "Fine, you can go to the castle." The blue piliar of light shows up again and they start getting sucked upward. Amano tries to grab her hand, but they're too far away and the pendant which he's still holding gets sucked up as well. Next thing she knows, Hitomi's on a strange planet with non-human things looking at her. They're beast men of I guess some tribe that's friendly with Fanelia, Van's kingdom. They take them back to Fanelia where (Merle the catgirl jumps all over Van because she's glad he's safe) he announces that he's accomplished the rite of dragonslaying. He's king for two minutes and invisible attackers show up and start to rip apart the kingdom. Van's told to go awaken Escaflowne so he does and starts fighting. Hitomi has sort of a 6th sense about where the invisible attackers are, and saves his butt several more times. Balgus, who taught several people in the show how to fight (and definately has the ability to weild oversized weapons), tells Van to get out of there (a dead king can't rebuild a kingdom). Van protests, but another one of those blue light pillars shows up and gets him and Hitomi out of there. Hitomi wakes up and this creepy guy, Moleman, is looking at her pendant. Allen, Knight of Austuria, shows up and tells Moleman to get lost. Hitomi faints (perhaps, in part, because Allen looks like Amano except with longer, blonde hair) and Allen picks her up to carry her to safty. Van shows up and tells him to get his hands off her and foolishly draws his sword. Allen whoops his ass and they wake up in a border outpost. While there, Hitomi does a tarot reading for Allen which is right on the money as all her readings end up. Sooner or later, representitives from the Zaibach Empire show up and ask if they've seen Escaflowne around. Allen tells them no and they're sent on their way. A few hours later, another invisible attack. They hold them off long enough to flee to the capital of Austuria (but not before Van and Escaflowne get captured and they have to pull a rescue mission). From Austuria's capital they go to Freid (where Allen clearly fathered the heir) which is where Hitomi's heart stops thanks to a doppleganger and where I said Fox Kids stopped airing the show. This is also where I forget what order things happend in. Van goes into a state of shock and almost dies because of the pact he made with Escaflowne after he goes crazy and slaughters a bunch of enemies. They end up traveling to a lost continent to find out what happened to Atlantas. They learn that Zaibach's plans have something to do with altering fate. Hitomi gets kidnapped. Someone invents the dragenergist equivilant of the nuke. Van and Allen duke it out at the end. Oh, and a character I love: Dilandau. He's one crazy SOB. Awesome example of CE. He becomes obsessed with killing Van after he scratches his face in a duel. ("My face, my beautiful face.") He gets a flamethrower in his melef. And. . . And Van has wings. . .The movie's kinda different. Drops Emperor Dornkirk and just uses Folken as the leader with a different motive. Good guys are already all together, and Hitomi's gets called the Wing Goddess because she was in Escaflowne when they found her and it (and she supposidly was the one who made it disappear). Oh, and Hitomi and Van are both really depressed. Yay self-centered anguish.
thasis 06-02-06, 03:26 PM	Just to backup Sailor Moon, it was repetitive... but it was sooooo wellll done. I think I watched it for it's repetitivness. I knew what I was getting and I liked it. As for Dragonball Z, yes combat was repetitive, but they always took it to the new levels, always got bigger and badder enemies, and the heroes actualy showed REAL sings of evolving in power (which alot of the newer animes don't show as much). I LOVE DRAGONBALL Z! But like I said, I'm more to read then to watch. I hate TV in general, and most movie suck (except horror, in which about half-of-them suck).
jagggar 06-02-06, 04:37 PM	And again, repetitive isn't necessasarly bad, just repetitive. Some of the things I didn't care for too much about it, I try to chalk up to being the dub since they tend to be worse than subs. DBZ kinda irritated me when I'd half to watch for a week-and-a-half of them charging up before they attacked each other. And coming in in the middle of it all didn't help my understanding. *cuddles TV* It's okay, he doesn't mean it. And even if he does, I still love you. Sure, maybe it's cause I'm too lazy to read. Or maybe it's because I'm a slow reader compared to my friends, so it just feels like reading takes to long. It's not that TV&Movies suck, it's that they're not to your taste. I tend to like most genres just like I like most foods I try (some I like more than others, and some I get too much of and don't really care for for a while). I doubt I could limit myself to just one genre (horror), let alone a subgenre (gory-slasher).
thasis 06-02-06, 11:02 PM	Most gory-slashers are overated... most horrors are poorely done... most films are poorely done. They should make better quality films and then I'd watch them.
Zombomaniac 06-02-06, 11:30 PM	Most gory-slashers are overated... most horrors are poorely done... most films are poorely done. They should make better quality films and then I'd watch them. Once we get the "Hey lets remake all the classics" kick out of our system we should hopefully get some good stuff again.
Elvez4ever 06-02-06, 11:36 PM	"Guild of Good, I have been set upon by your opponent and wish to make a truce. Will you consider this offer? You can have either a powerful ally, or an equally strong enemy, the choice is yours.
thasis 06-03-06, 01:27 AM	I responded quite formally in your thread. Anywayz, back to movies :P
turalisj 06-03-06, 11:50 AM	*an elf pops in wearinf armor and a psicrystal floating around him* Greetings, I am Turalisj's newest incarnation. An ardent I am, of chaos, light/darkness, good, and freedom. Since his other incarntaions were members if this guild, I'd assume I'd be allowed in?
Elvez4ever 06-03-06, 12:00 PM	I responded quite formally in your thread. Anywayz, back to movies :P Thank you for doing as such. Besides it was posted B4 you did. (You know how thoses elves like to make everything dramatic.... :D)
jagggar 06-03-06, 02:26 PM	Son of Holy Wrath Requirements To qualify to become a son of holy wrath, a character must fulfill all the following criteria. Alignment: Any good. Base Attack Bonus: +7 Feats: Iron Will Special: The character must have been redemed by atonement or other means. The use of atonement to restore class abilities or spellcasting does not qualify. Class Skills The son of holy wrath's class skills (and the key ability modifier for each skill) are... The Son of Holy Wrath Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 +1 +2 +0 +2 Fit of Wrath 1/day 2 +2 +3 +0 +3 Aura of Courage 3 +3 +3 +1 +3 4 +4 +4 +1 +4 Fit of Wrath 2/day 5 +5 +4 +1 +4 Mettle 6 +6 +5 +2 +5 7 +7 +5 +2 +5 Fit of Wrath 3/day 8 +8 +6 +2 +6 Wings 9 +9 +6 +3 +6 10 +10 +7 +3 +7 Fit of Wrath 4/day Class Features All of the following are class features of the son of holy wrath prestige class. Weapons and Armor Proficiency: Often in situtations that obvious weapons would escalate, a son of holy wrath learns to use anything as a weapon and may treat improvised weapons as though he were proficent in their use. A son of holy wrath gains no other proficiency with any weapons, armor, or shields. Fit of Wrath (Su): A son of holy wrath can throw himself into a fit of righteous anger a certain nuber of times per day. While in a fit of wrath, he gains a +4 sacred bonus to Strength, a +4 sacred bonus on Constitution, a +2 morale bonus on Will saves, and can smite evil a number of times equal to one half his class level (minumum 1. At 10th level he can smite evil 5 times per fit of wrath). The increase in Constitution increases the son of holy wrath's hit points by 2 points per level, but these hit points go away at the end of the fit of wrath when his Constitution score drops back to normal. (These extra hit points are not lost first the way temporary hit points are.) While in a fit of wrath, a son of holy wrath cannot use any Charisma-, Dexterity-, or Intelligence-based skills (except for Balance, Escape Artist, Intimidate, and Ride), the Concentration skill, or any abilities that require patience or concentration, nor can he cast spells or activate magic items that require a command word, a spell trigger (such as a wand), or spell completion (such as a scroll) to function. He can use any feat he has except Combat Expertise, item creation feats, and metamagic feats. A fit of wrath lasts for a number of rounds equal to 5 + the character's Wisdom modifier. A son of holy wrath may prematurely end his fit of wrath. At the end of the fit of wrath, the son of holy wrath loses the fit of wrath modifiers and restrictions and becomes fatigued (-2 penalty to Strength, -2 penalty to Dexterity, can't charge or run) for the duration of the current encounter. If a son of holy wrath accidentally smites a non-evil creature, his fit of wrath immediately ends and he is fatigued until the end of the encounter. If a son of holy wrath accidentally smites a good creature, his fit of wrath immediately ends and he is exhausted (-6 penalty to Strength, -6 penalty to Dexterity, moves at half speed) until the end of the encounter at which point he is fatigued until he can rest for 8 hours. A son of holy wrath can fly into a fit of wrath only once per encounter. At 1st level he can use his fit of rage ability once per day. At 4th level and every three levels there after, he can use it once additional time per day (to a maximum of 4 times per day at 10th level). Entering a fit of wrath takes no time itself, but a son of holy wrath can only do it during his action, not in response to someone else's action. A son of holy wrath must be able to think clearly to enter his fit of wrath, and cannot enter it while raging, under the effects of a compulsion spell or effect, or under a similar condition. Aura of Courage (Su): Beginning at 2nd level, a son of holy wrath is immune to fear (magical or otherwise). Each ally within 10 feet of him gains a +4 morale bonus on saving throws against fear effects. This ability functions while the son of holy wrath is conscious, but not if he is unconscious or dead. Mettle (??): If a son of holy wrath of 5th level or higher makes a successful Will or Fortitude saving throw that would normally reduce the spell's effects, he suffers no effect from the spell at all. Only those spells with a Saing Throw entry of "Will partial," "Fortitude half," or similar entries can be negated through this ability. Wings (Ex): At 8th level, a son of holy wrath grows a set of feathered wings. He may now fly at a speed equal to twice his base land speed, with good maneuverability. These wings are most often black, white, or any shade inbetween.
jagggar 06-03-06, 02:31 PM	All I'm missing now is. . . Fluff Class Skills Skill points per level Type of ability Mettle is (Ex, Su, Sp) Right?
thasis 06-03-06, 04:12 PM	I say that it is looking very good as of now. And Turalisg, you are very welcome indeed.
Dyne 06-07-06, 08:21 PM	Son of Holy Wrath Sexist.
Kobold_Ur_Priest 06-07-06, 08:26 PM	Sexist. maybe rename it: Child of Wrath of something of the like
thasis 06-07-06, 09:05 PM	Mmm... this is true. In today's society of you don't include things that don't specificy that it's a He only class, and you make some sort of refrence to it being a He only class you have to make a special section explaining that it's either a He only class or not.
jagggar 06-07-06, 11:13 PM	Sexist. Yes. Yes I am. And proud of it. The Son of Holy Wrath is called Son of Holy Wrath because that's the lyrics. We are the sons of holy wrath, a shining light in the dark The ones who walk amongst despair, no sign of fear in our hearts When I got around to flavor text, I was gunna put in, "...there are a small number of female Sons of Holy Wrath. They are called Sons of Holy Wrath or Daughters of Holy Wrath as per there preference. The male Sons of Holy Wrath make no arguement with them." But now I'm almost tempted to make it a male only PrC just to tick off people. Or maybe I'll go create my own male/female stat adjustment topic.
thasis 06-08-06, 01:32 AM	No, please don't. I saw it done... and let's just say one of the most painful flame wars I've ever seen. Save me the anguish... :(
Lady Rolindin 06-20-06, 09:00 PM	it does sound interesting Jaggar, even a female being in the order. is this guild going to be active in the game? or does the guild require more members. I would not be opposed to making a character for the guild, but as to what kind I have to think on that.