An alternate way of doing bonus skill points [Archive] - Wizards Community

An alternate way of doing bonus skill points [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Howland Reed
02-29-08, 12:17 AM This was an idea I had when trying to update one of my 2nd ed. characters to 3rd ed. He was a ranger who was raised by wolves (feralan kit, if you remember), with an Int of 4. He wasn't all that bright, but he thought with his hands...he was a good athlete (Str/Dex) and woodsman (Wis).

I got to thinking...if I wanted him to have good skills in 3E, I couldn't give him a really low Int; it would hamstring him (even a ranger would drop to 3 pts/lvl if he had 4 Int...not enough for all the skills he'd need). But why would someone being smarter make him better at Climb, or Jump? Shouldn't it be possible to have someone who's dim, but a good athlete? Or the dumb-but-likeable character, like Elan from Order of the Stick?

So: my new system:

1.) Instead of getting bonus skill points based off Int, they get them based off ALL abilities...but those bonus points can only be spent on skills based off that ability score. If the character has no bonus or a penalty, they get no bonus skill points. If they have an Int penalty, it applies to their base skill points from their class only.

Example: My wolf-boy ranger has Str 14, Int 4, Wis 12, Dex 16, Con 14, and Cha 8.
Each level, he gets 3 skill points for being a ranger (6 normal, -3 for Int). He also gets 2 points to spend on Str skills (climb, jump, etc), 1 point to spend on Wis skills (survival, heal, etc), 3 points to spend on Dex skills (balance, hide, etc), 2 points to spend on Con skills (concentration...hmm, are there any others?). He gets no points to spend on Cha skills because of his penalty, but does not otherwise take a penalty.

2.) At first level, characters get 4 x their class skill points for any class skills. They also get 4 x each ability score bonus for skills based off that ability only.

3.) Normal cross class costs and rank limits apply. If my ranger tried to spend his Dex bonus skill points on Sleight of Hand, for example, he'd pay 2 pts. per rank and have the cross class maximum.

What do people think? So far, I'm seeing only 2 potential problems.

1.) This lowers the gap between low-skill and high-skill characters. This isn't a problem for me, personally...I think low-skill classes get too few.

2.) Con...are there any Con-based skills other than concentration? If not, any bonus Con skill points are just going to get sunk into concentration. 2 options:

a.) Let it. This might cause problems with classes that use concentration (as they no longer need to sink skill points in to max it out).
b.) Say that Con is an exception, and doesn't grant you any skill points.

Thoughts? Objections?
squidyak
03-02-08, 09:09 PM I've thought about doing the same thing but never implemented it. If you pull the trigger post how it goes. Con is a problem. A solution might be to tie a couple more skills to con (maybe survival) or make some new skills (perhaps a running skill or skill to replace endurance checks.)
nonsi
03-03-08, 02:28 AM I've thought about doing the same thing but never implemented it. If you pull the trigger post how it goes. Con is a problem. A solution might be to tie a couple more skills to con (maybe survival) or make some new skills (perhaps a running skill or skill to replace endurance checks.)

How about Drinking and/of Food-Tasting (checking for poisoned food & drink) ?
squidyak
03-04-08, 03:11 PM How about Drinking and/of Food-Tasting (checking for poisoned food & drink) ?

Seems kind of narrow for a skill, but if a player in one of my games asked for it i'd give it to him.
skywyze
03-04-08, 04:49 PM Very interesting concept for a house rule, but it's a little complicated. Would it be possible to simplify it a bit do you think? Maybe just say that every level, you get a number of skill points to spend equal to your modifier in an ability, and those skill points can only be spent in skills based on that ability.It's one long sentence, so it's a little quicker to read I think, and I think it catches most of it.
Cranewings
03-05-08, 01:12 AM In my games everyone, despite their intellegence, gets a +0 or +1 minimum INT adjustment for skills because the skills are needed to help the character make sense.

If "Work Ethic" was a stat, then skill points would come from it instead of INT. Sense it isn't, everyone gets a bonus.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Howland Reed 02-29-08, 12:17 AM	This was an idea I had when trying to update one of my 2nd ed. characters to 3rd ed. He was a ranger who was raised by wolves (feralan kit, if you remember), with an Int of 4. He wasn't all that bright, but he thought with his hands...he was a good athlete (Str/Dex) and woodsman (Wis). I got to thinking...if I wanted him to have good skills in 3E, I couldn't give him a really low Int; it would hamstring him (even a ranger would drop to 3 pts/lvl if he had 4 Int...not enough for all the skills he'd need). But why would someone being smarter make him better at Climb, or Jump? Shouldn't it be possible to have someone who's dim, but a good athlete? Or the dumb-but-likeable character, like Elan from Order of the Stick? So: my new system: 1.) Instead of getting bonus skill points based off Int, they get them based off ALL abilities...but those bonus points can only be spent on skills based off that ability score. If the character has no bonus or a penalty, they get no bonus skill points. If they have an Int penalty, it applies to their base skill points from their class only. Example: My wolf-boy ranger has Str 14, Int 4, Wis 12, Dex 16, Con 14, and Cha 8. Each level, he gets 3 skill points for being a ranger (6 normal, -3 for Int). He also gets 2 points to spend on Str skills (climb, jump, etc), 1 point to spend on Wis skills (survival, heal, etc), 3 points to spend on Dex skills (balance, hide, etc), 2 points to spend on Con skills (concentration...hmm, are there any others?). He gets no points to spend on Cha skills because of his penalty, but does not otherwise take a penalty. 2.) At first level, characters get 4 x their class skill points for any class skills. They also get 4 x each ability score bonus for skills based off that ability only. 3.) Normal cross class costs and rank limits apply. If my ranger tried to spend his Dex bonus skill points on Sleight of Hand, for example, he'd pay 2 pts. per rank and have the cross class maximum. What do people think? So far, I'm seeing only 2 potential problems. 1.) This lowers the gap between low-skill and high-skill characters. This isn't a problem for me, personally...I think low-skill classes get too few. 2.) Con...are there any Con-based skills other than concentration? If not, any bonus Con skill points are just going to get sunk into concentration. 2 options: a.) Let it. This might cause problems with classes that use concentration (as they no longer need to sink skill points in to max it out). b.) Say that Con is an exception, and doesn't grant you any skill points. Thoughts? Objections?
squidyak 03-02-08, 09:09 PM	I've thought about doing the same thing but never implemented it. If you pull the trigger post how it goes. Con is a problem. A solution might be to tie a couple more skills to con (maybe survival) or make some new skills (perhaps a running skill or skill to replace endurance checks.)
nonsi 03-03-08, 02:28 AM	I've thought about doing the same thing but never implemented it. If you pull the trigger post how it goes. Con is a problem. A solution might be to tie a couple more skills to con (maybe survival) or make some new skills (perhaps a running skill or skill to replace endurance checks.) How about Drinking and/of Food-Tasting (checking for poisoned food & drink) ?
squidyak 03-04-08, 03:11 PM	How about Drinking and/of Food-Tasting (checking for poisoned food & drink) ? Seems kind of narrow for a skill, but if a player in one of my games asked for it i'd give it to him.
skywyze 03-04-08, 04:49 PM	Very interesting concept for a house rule, but it's a little complicated. Would it be possible to simplify it a bit do you think? Maybe just say that every level, you get a number of skill points to spend equal to your modifier in an ability, and those skill points can only be spent in skills based on that ability.It's one long sentence, so it's a little quicker to read I think, and I think it catches most of it.
Cranewings 03-05-08, 01:12 AM	In my games everyone, despite their intellegence, gets a +0 or +1 minimum INT adjustment for skills because the skills are needed to help the character make sense. If "Work Ethic" was a stat, then skill points would come from it instead of INT. Sense it isn't, everyone gets a bonus.