Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Lady Ishtar 05-02-04, 12:43 AM	i want to make a bard variant that doesnt use spells. i want to keep it simple, without giving them some crazy new abilities, but insted giving them access to abilities of other classes. i was thinking of replacing spells with sneak attack every other level, though it seems to me that i am giving the bard a shaft. what do you think would be worth the spells? any ideas are welcome
Lina_Inverse 05-02-04, 01:13 AM	A.expand bard song B.bonus feats,everyone likes feats. C.8 skill points/level couldnt hurt i dont think sneak attack makes sense for bard.
Lady Ishtar 05-02-04, 01:21 AM	extra skill points look good. bonus feats look good as well im thinking you get one at levels 2, 5, 8, 11, 14, 17, 20 although that might be too much as far as the bard song goes, i think its fine the way it is. im not really looking to make this variant THAT focused on music
Lina_Inverse 05-02-04, 01:24 AM	but bard song is the only true bardic feature,enchanceing bard song or some feats to do it is the best way to make bards still bards but without the spells.
Lady Ishtar 05-03-04, 12:20 AM	Originally posted by Lina_Inverse but bard song is the only true bardic feature,enchanceing bard song or some feats to do it is the best way to make bards still bards but without the spells. thats true, do you have any suggestions? as for other things: skill points/level +2 bonus general feats at levels: 2, 6, 10, 14, 18 i was also thinking about giving them one free weapon proficiency at 1st level with any weapon of their choice, since as bards they tentd to get trained in weird things and how would you boost bardic music?
Nifft 05-03-04, 12:07 PM	HD d8 BAB 3/4 Proficency with all simple and martial weapons, light and medium armor, and shields (but not tower shields). Bard Song 3/day per level. Level 1: Countersong, fascinate, inspire courage +1 Level 2: Greater Lore Level 3: Inspire competence Level 4: Inspire courage +2 Level 5: Bonus Language Level 6: Suggestion Level 7: Inspire courage +3 Level 8: Bonus Language Level 9: Inspire greatness Level 10: Inspire courage +4 Level 11: Bonus Language, True Lore 1/day Level 12: Song of freedom Level 13: Inspire courage +5 Level 14: Bonus Language, True Lore 2/day Level 15: Inspire heroics Level 16: Inspire courage +6 Level 17: Bonus Language, True Lore 3/day Level 18: Mass suggestion Level 19: Inspire courage +7 Level 20: Bonus Language, True Lore 4/day Better Inspire Courage (the formula here is: whenever a Bard would gain an extra level of spells, he gains a +1 to his Inspire Courage song). Bonus Language: The Bard learns any new langauge. Greater Lore (Ex): at 2nd level, a Bard can identify a magic item as though he had cast Identify, 1/day per Bard level. True Lore (Ex): At 11th level, once per day a Bard can use her knowledge to gain the effect of a legend lore spell or an analyze dweomer spell. -- N
eggplantm 05-03-04, 01:47 PM	Originally posted by Nifft HD d8 BAB 3/4 Proficency with all simple and martial weapons, light and medium armor, and shields (but not tower shields). Bard Song 3/day per level. Level 1: Countersong, fascinate, inspire courage +1 Level 2: Greater Lore Level 3: Inspire competence Level 4: Inspire courage +2 Level 5: Bonus Language Level 6: Suggestion Level 7: Inspire courage +3 Level 8: Bonus Language Level 9: Inspire greatness Level 10: Inspire courage +4 Level 11: Bonus Language, True Lore 1/day Level 12: Song of freedom Level 13: Inspire courage +5 Level 14: Bonus Language, True Lore 2/day Level 15: Inspire heroics Level 16: Inspire courage +6 Level 17: Bonus Language, True Lore 3/day Level 18: Mass suggestion Level 19: Inspire courage +7 Level 20: Bonus Language, True Lore 4/day Better Inspire Courage (the formula here is: whenever a Bard would gain an extra level of spells, he gains a +1 to his Inspire Courage song). Bonus Language: The Bard learns any new langauge. Greater Lore (Ex): at 2nd level, a Bard can identify a magic item as though he had cast Identify, 1/day per Bard level. True Lore (Ex): At 11th level, once per day a Bard can use her knowledge to gain the effect of a legend lore spell or an analyze dweomer spell. -- N Pretty cool, Nifft. I'm always looking for interesting bard variants. They're still not as desirable to play as the other classes.
Belegbeth 05-03-04, 02:20 PM	You could always take a look at Monte Cook's variant bard in *The Complete Book of Eldritch Might*. That version uses "spellsongs" instead of standard bard songs and spells. She also gets some cool "bard only" feats. Though the idea of "spellsongs" may still be too "spell-like" for what you're looking for, I suppose.
Lady Ishtar 05-03-04, 03:13 PM	while i was thinking about a simpler variant, i like this. thank you Nifft. although i tink i would replace bonus language at levels 8, 14, 20 for a feat, to represent the jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none thing that the bards are supposed to be ive see the spellsong bard, but i want to stay away from adding another spell list thing to the game.
Nifft 05-03-04, 04:12 PM	Originally posted by Lady Ishtar while i was thinking about a simpler variant, i like this. thank you Nifft. although i tink i would replace bonus language at levels 8, 14, 20 for a feat, to represent the jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none thing that the bards are supposed to be If you add stuff, take stuff away too -- for example, add 3 Feats, and remove the additional True Lore applications, except at level 20 (when the Bard gets it 2/day). -- N
Lady Ishtar 05-03-04, 04:57 PM	ok, how does this look: changed weapon proficiencies added bardic knowkedge added bonus feats took out half of the free languages reduced greater lore and true lore HD d8 BAB 3/4 Saves as Bard Skills as Bard Proficency with all simple and two weapons of choice (may be martial or exotic), light and medium armor, and shields (but not tower shields). Bard Song as Bard Level 1: Countersong, fascinate, inspire courage +1, Bardic Knowledge Level 2: Greater Lore Level 3: Inspire competence Level 4: Inspire courage +2 Level 5: Bonus Feat Level 6: Suggestion Level 7: Inspire courage +3 Level 8: Bonus Language Level 9: Inspire greatness Level 10: Inspire courage +4 Level 11: Bonus Feat Level 12: Song of freedom Level 13: Inspire courage +5 Level 14: Bonus Language, True Lore 1/day Level 15: Inspire heroics Level 16: Inspire courage +6 Level 17: Bonus Feat Level 18: Mass suggestion Level 19: Inspire courage +7 Level 20: Bonus Language, True Lore 2/day Better Inspire Courage (the formula here is: whenever a Bard would gain an extra level of spells, he gains a +1 to his Inspire Courage song). Bonus Language: The Bard learns any new langauge. Greater Lore (Ex): at 2nd level, a Bard can identify a magic item as though he had cast Identify, 1/day at every even level. True Lore (Ex): At 11th level, once per day a Bard can use her knowledge to gain the effect of a legend lore spell or an analyze dweomer spell.
Nifft 05-03-04, 05:28 PM	Now it seems a little weak. Add in a bunch of Affinities (like Favored Enemy, but only applies to Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Perform and Sense Motive checks) at the same rate that Rangers get their Favored Enemy bonuses. -- N
Lady Ishtar 05-03-04, 05:50 PM	HD d8 BAB 3/4 Saves as Bard Skills as Bard Proficency with all simple and two weapons of choice (may be martial or exotic), light and medium armor, and shields (but not tower shields). Bard Song as Bard Level 1: Countersong, fascinate, inspire courage +1, Bardic Knowledge Level 2: Greater Lore Level 3: Inspire competence Level 4: Inspire courage +2 Level 5: Bonus Feat, Jack of all Trades Level 6: Suggestion Level 7: Inspire courage +3 Level 8: Bonus Language Level 9: Inspire greatness Level 10: Inspire courage +4, Jack of All Trades Level 11: Bonus Feat Level 12: Song of freedom Level 13: Inspire courage +5 Level 14: Bonus Language, True Lore 1/day Level 15: Inspire heroics, Jack of all Trades Level 16: Inspire courage +6 Level 17: Bonus Feat Level 18: Mass suggestion Level 19: Inspire courage +7 Level 20: Bonus Language, True Lore 2/day, Jack of all Trades Better Inspire Courage (the formula here is: whenever a Bard would gain an extra level of spells, he gains a +1 to his Inspire Courage song). Bonus Feat: The Bard gains any general feat he meets prereqs for. Jack of all Trades: Beggining at 5th level, and again at levels 10, 15, and 20, Bard learns to duplicate abilities of other classes. Each time he gains Jack of all Trades ability, he must pick an ability from the following list. Fast Movement: as barbarian. Uncanny Dodge: as barbarian. Woodland Stride: as druid. Wild Empathy: as druid. Animal Companion: as ranger. Trapfinding: as rogue. Evasion: as rogue. Sneak Attack: as rogue, may be taken multiple times. Bonus Language: The Bard learns any new langauge. Greater Lore (Ex): at 2nd level, a Bard can identify a magic item as though he had cast Identify, 1/day at every even level. True Lore (Ex): At 11th level, once per day a Bard can use her knowledge to gain the effect of a legend lore spell or an analyze dweomer spell. another thing: this variant needs a name. any ideas?
Nifft 05-04-04, 03:56 AM	Originally posted by Lady Ishtar Jack of all Trades: Beggining at 5th level, and again at levels 10, 15, and 20, Bard learns to duplicate abilities of other classes. Each time he gains Jack of all Trades ability, he must pick an ability from the following list. Fast Movement: as barbarian. Rage: as barbarian, may be taken multiple times. Uncanny Dodge: as barbarian. Woodland Stride: as druid. Wild Empathy: as druid. Favored Enemy: as ranger, may be taken multiple times. Animal Companion: as ranger. Trapfinding: as rogue. Evasion: as rogue. Sneak Attack: as rogue, may be taken multiple times. Very cool. I would NOT allow Favored Enemy, Rage or Sneak Attack, but the others are good ideas. (Why not? Because the Bard's Inspire Courage song adds to his damage, and that of his allies. This is his damage-enhancing ability. He doesn't need any others. Trust me, +7 to attack and damage is just fine.) -- N
Lady Ishtar 05-04-04, 10:31 AM	fair enough, i took out rage and favored enemy, but kept sneak attack. i figure by level 20 extra 4d6 isnt incredibly powerful, and there are a lot of PrCs that require SA to get into. seems like a rogueish thing to have. and rage and favored enemy are rather unique abilities, while plenty of PrCs out there get it.
Aurotuli 05-04-04, 11:32 PM	I created another variant, more bardic music and much less spellcasting. Note that as it was made for my homebrew system some ideas may not be fully compatible. Changes in red are suggestions on how I'd modify it for a typical D&D core class: Name: Bard HD: d6 BAB: 1/2 (3/4) Saves: Endr (str): poor, Refl (dex): med, Fort (con): poor, Snty (wis): med, Prcp (wis): good, Will (cha): good (Saves: Fort poor, Refl good, Will good) Wpn/Arm: Light Armor, No Shields, All Simple Wpns, any 2 other Martial or 1 Exotic. Skill Pts: 6 + Int Class Skills: Climb (str), Jump (str), Swim (str), Balance (dex), Escape Artist (dex), Hide (dex), Move Silently (dex), Open Lock (dex), Ride (dex), Slight of Hand (dex), Tumble (dex), Use Rope (dex), Concentration (con), Appraise (int), Craft (int), Decipher Script (int), Disable Device/ Repair (int), Forgery (int), Investigate (int), Language (int), Knowledge (Local; Art/ Music/ Mythos, Architecture/ Engineering, Business/ Finance, Geography, History (region & era)*, Monster Lore**, Nature, Politics (region), War; Arcane, Heraldry/ Nobility (region), Math/ Logic, Advanced Monster Lore***, Natural Philosophy, Planar Lore, Religion, Spellcraft) (int), Navigate (int), Research (int), Search (int), Heal (wis), Listen (wis), Pantomime (wis), Profession (wis), Sense Motive (wis), Spot (wis), Survival (wis), Bluff (cha), Diplomacy (cha), Disguise (cha), Gather Information (cha), Handle Animal (cha), Perform**** (cha), Presense (cha), Use Magic Device (cha). * The skill 'History' requires specification. Choose a region and also an era: recent (last 400 yrs), archaic (400 - 1100), classical (1100 - 2600), or ancient (2600 - 5600). They may also choose High Age or Mythic, but these are rare knowledges that must be taught or learned directly through exploration of ruins dating back that far. High Age and Mythic history do not require a choice of region, although a region may still be selected. Prerecorded history is usually included with Mythic history. ** The intermediate skill 'Monsters' includes the following: Animal, Fae, Magical Creatures, Monstrous Humanoids, Plant, & Vermin. *** The advanced skill 'Monsters' requires specification. Each of the following is considered a separate skill: Abberrations, Celestials, Constructs, Elementals, Fiends, or Undead. **** Perform must choose a form of performance: Act [acting, ceremony, comedy, drama, & mime], Dance , Jest [limericks, jocks, riddles, etc], Musical Instrument (must choose from the following: keyboard [piano, pipe organ, etc], precussion [bells, chimes, drums, gong, etc], string [fiddle, harp, lute, etc], or wind [flute, panpipes, recorder]), Oratory [ballad, epic, ode, storytelling, etc], or Song [chant, melody, song, etc]). Specials: 01 Bardic Knowledge, Bardic Music (Fascinate 1 creature), Spellcasting, Wandering Diversity of Skills 02 Bardic Music (Inspire Courage +1) 03 Bardic Music (Counter Song, Lulling Chant^) 04 Bardic Music (Inspire Competence +2, Fascinate 2 creatures) 05 Bardic Music (Heighten Performance^) 06 Bardic Music (Enchanting Melody^, Suggestion) 07 Bardic Music (Sustaining Song*, Fascinate 3 creatures) 08 Bardic Music (Inspire Greatness 1 ally, Inspire Courage +2) 09 Bardic Music (Calumny*, Pull the Heartstrings^) 10 Bardic Music (Jarring Song*, Fascinate 4 creatures) 11 Bardic Music (Song of Freedom, Greater Enchanting Melody^, Inspire Greatness 2 allies) 12 Bardic Music (Inspire Competence +4, Song of Frenzy^) 13 Bardic Music (Greater Calumny*, Fascinate 5 creatures) 14 Bardic Music (Mindbending Melody*, Inspire Courage +3, Inspire Greatness 3 allies) 15 Bardic Music (Mass Suggestion, Inspire Heroics 1 creature) 16 Bardic Music (Enthralling Melody^, Fascinate 6 creatures) 17 Bardic Music (Magical Melody*, Inspire Greatness 4 allies) 18 Bardic Music (Revealing Melody*, Inspire Heroics 2 creatures) 19 Bardic Music (Song of Fury*, Fascinate 7 creatures) 20 Bardic Music (Inspire Competence +6, Inspire Courage +4, Inspire Greatness 5 allies) 21 Bardic Music (Inspire Heroics 3 creatures) 22 Bardic Music (Fascinate 8 creatures) 23 Bardic Music (Deafening Song**, Inspire Greatness 6 allies) 24 Bardic Music ( Inspire Heroics 4 creatures) 25 Bardic Music (Fascinate 9 creatures) 26 Bardic Music (Inspire Courage +5, Inspire Greatness 7 allies) 27 Bardic Music (Inspire Heroics 5 creatures) 28 Bardic Music (Fascinate 10 creatures, Inspire Competence +8, ) 29 Bardic Music (Heighten 'Ability'**, Inspire Greatness 8 allies) 30 Bardic Music (Inspire Heroics 6 creatures) * from the S&S (Virtuoso) ** from the ELH (two feats, each song gained 2 levels after normally available) ^ new [b]Spellcasting: The Bard cast magic through his performances. To use his spells he must make a successful performance check (DC 10 + spell level). Any and all verbal, somantic, focus, and even less than 1 GP material components are fully replaced with this performance. Any form of performance is allowable: singing, instrument playing, graceful gestures and dancesteps, clever riddles and rhymes, a well spoken passage from an epic, etc. His spells are few and rare, and despite being spontaneous they are usually learned as he becomes better acquainted with the powers of performance. He may choose his spells from the following schools (as he does not have a separate listing to choose from): Abjuration, Divination, Enchantment, and Illusion. Bardic Lore (Ex): The Bard constantly moves from place to place, learning more stories and songs as he travels. The ever growing collection of trivia he thus picks up along the road and in the taverns and palaces where he plays allows him to know a great diversity of lore rarely encountered by others. Secrets never placed in print and only spoken in hushed tones over a tankard of ale are his. When a bard stops to play the people that listen are as much interesting in what news he brings as in the skill of his fingers on the harp strings. And some might be willing to pay a bit extra for any secrets he may have overheard at his previous stops along the road. Bards gain the Bardic Lore special, which enables them to make a knowledge check on any of the following knowledges, using their class level combinted with their Intelligence modifer to determine the roll: Local; Art/ Music/ Mythos, Geography, History (region & era)*, Monster Lore (intermediate), Politics (region), War; Arcane (dealing with historic / mythic people, places, and things only), Heraldry/ Nobility (region), Monster Lore (advanced), Planar Lore, and Religion. In effect he gains two knowledge checks for each of the previous: a bardic lore and his own (based on his ranks, etc). A check of DC 10 is easily aquired lore (the name of the current mayor in the neighboring town). Higher DCs apply for more obscure lore. All advanced knowledges other than Heraldry (ie: Arcane, Advanced Monster Lore, Religion, and the Planes) are a minimum of DC 20 + modifiers. The feat 'Obscure Lore' grants a +3 bonus to Bardic Lore checks. The feat 'A Lifetime of Learning' allows the character to count half his non-Bardic class levels to his Bardic levels for the purpose of Bardic Lore checks, although the requirements prevent this from being taken at early levels. Bardic Music (Su): A Bard is a master of performance, able to reach levels of skill that no others can hope to achieve. They learn, early in their training, to draw upon the magical forces around them and channel those forces through their performances so as to better enhance the final results. As their skill increases they soon learn to achieve varied supernatural affects with their potent musical tones. All Bardic Music abilities are supernatural sonic effects. Each requires a specific degree of skill in performance to utilize (equal to the level it is gained increased by two). Most bards maximize one or two performances and focus a significant degree of skill in yet another one or two forms of performance, thus allowing them one or more 'surprise' means of performing should their primary method of performance be neutralized. Bardic Music may be used a number of times per day equal to the Bard's class level combined with their Charisma modifier. The feat 'Extra Bardic Music' grants three additional uses of Bardic Music per day each time it is taken. Below are listed the most commonly discovered magical melodies. It is likely that others exist, for these are simply those best known and most likely to be discovered by the experienced bard. (Various PrCs grant additional or other songs. DMs may also develop songs and allow bards to choose the new song(s) over those they would normally learn at the next level gain.) Finally, note that despite being called songs, the below may be performed in a variety of ways, including poetry, drums, and possibly even dance (with GM permission and applicable situation for its use). Fascinate: Gained at 1st level, this bardic song requires 3 ranks to use. The bard, through skillful interweaving of notes, tones, or movements, fascinates a creature for a number of rounds up to his bardic level. The bard makes a Perform check that becomes the DC of the creature's Will save. Those that fail focus entirely on the bard, taking no other actions so long as they are not distracted (which ends the affect). They also take a -4 penalty to all skill checks made as reactions, such as Listen and Spot, for the duration of the song. Nearby combat and other similar dangers are too distracting to allow for fascination. Note that the creature must be within 90 feet of the bard and able to witness the performance (hear a song, see a dance, etc), and that the bard must be able to see the creature. Furthermore, any potential threat requires the bard to make a new performance check and allows the creature to make another Will save against the new DC. This does not count as another use of Bardic Music. Those that succeed in their Will save may not be fascinated by this manner of performance from this bard for another 24 hours. Every three levels after first the bard is capable of fascinating another creature with the same performance. Fascinate is an Enchantment [compulsion]. (+1 creature at the following levels: 4, 7, 10, 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, & 28) Inspire Courage: Gained at 2nd level, this bardic song requires 4 ranks to use. A bard may inspire his allies (including himself), bolstering their courage against fear and improving their combat abilities. An ally is only affected for as long as he can hear the bard sing and for a number rounds immediately following that is equal to the bard's charisma modifier (if it is positive). An affected ally receives a +1 morale bonus on saving throws against charm and fear effects and a +1 morale bonus on attack and weapon damage rolls. The bonus increases by one every six levels. (+2 at Lv 8; +3 at Lv 14; +4 at Lv20, etc) Counter Song: Gained at 3rd level, this bardic song requires 5 ranks to use. A bard can use his music or poetics to counter magical effects that depend on sound (but not spells that simply have verbal components). Each round of the countersong, he makes a Perform check. Any creature within 30 feet of the bard (including the bard himself ) that is affected by a sonic or language-dependent magical attack may use the bard’s Perform check result in place of its saving throw if, after the saving throw is rolled, the Perform check result proves to be higher. If a creature within range of the countersong is already under the effect of a non-instantaneous sonic or language-dependent magical attack, it gains another saving throw against the effect each round it hears the countersong, but it must use the bard’s Perform check result for the save. Countersong has no effect against effects that don’t allow saves. The bard may keep up the countersong for a number of rounds equal to 2ce his level. Lulling Chant: Gained at 3rd level, this bardic song requires 5 ranks to use. A bard may attempt to bring slumber to a creature or number of creatures whose collective hit dice are no greater than his level. The bard makes a performance check that becomes the DC of the Will save for the creature(s) affected. Those whose hit die are higher than the bard's class level are not affected. Furthermore, if a number of creatures are being affected, those closest are affected first. When two or more are of equal distance from the bard, the creature with the lowest hit die number is affected first. All affected creature(s) must be within 90 feet of the bard and able to witness the performance (see a dance, hear a melody, etc). Furthermore, no two creatures affected may be more than 15 feet apart. Those that fail their Will save fall asleep for 1 min / level. Those that succeed in their Will save may not be lulled by this manner of performance from this bard for another 24 hours. Inspire Competence: Gained at 4th level, this bardic song requires 6 ranks to use. The bard may seek to aid a companion in a task through an encouraging performance. The ally must be within 30 feet and able to witness the performance (see a dance, hear a song, etc). The bard must also be able to see the ally. The ally gains a +2 competence bonus to skill checks with a particular skill as long as he or she continues to witness the performance. Certain uses of this ability are infeasible. Using a dance to inspire an ally that attempting a skill that requires sight is not feasible. Nor is using a song to inspire an ally using a skill that requires hearing. The bonus lasts as long as the bard performing, up to a twice the bard's level in rounds. A bard cannot inspire himself. Every eight levels following the bonus increases by +2. (+4 at Lv 12; +6 at Lv 20; +8 at Lv 28) Inspire Competence is a mind-affecting ability. Heighten Performance: Gained at 5th level, this bardic song requires 7 ranks to use. The bard, by skillful participation in a (non-magical) performance, heightens its appeal to the masses. When the bard uses this form of bardic music while participating in a group performance (all of whom are using the same form of performance as the bard's type of bardic music), his 'aid other' ability in this performance automatically succeeds and grants half his level rather than the standard +2 bonus. Those witnessing the performance (seeing a dance, listening to a song) are unaware of the bard's contribution unless he wills it otherwise at the time of the use of Heighten Performance. Suggestion: Gained at 6th level, this bardic song requires 8 ranks to use. The bard can make a Suggestion (as the spell) to a creature that he has already fascinated (see above). Using this ability does not break the bard’s concentration on the Fascinate effect, nor does it allow a second saving throw against the Fascinate effect. Making a Suggestion does not count against a bard’s daily limit on bardic music performances. A Will saving throw negates the effect. This ability affects only a single creature (but see Mass Suggestion, below). Suggestion is an enchantment (compulsion), mind-affecting, language dependent ability. Enchanting Melody: Gained at 6th level, this bardic song requires 8 ranks to use. The bard can charm a person or animal through the use of a well made performance. The person or animal must make a Will save to resist the effect. This ability affects only a single creature. Enchanting Melody is an enchantment (compulsion) mind-affecting ability. The amicable feelings generated may be made to be directed at someone other than the bard. Sustaining Song: Gained at 7th level, this bardic song requires 9 ranks to use. The bard sustains his allies, negating the need to make stabilization checks for the duration of the performance. All allies the bard wishes to stabilize must be within 30 feet of him. The bard may continue playing a sustaining song for a number of rounds equal to twice his class level. While playing the sustained allies do not lose hit points. Furthermore, if they are not unconscious at the start of the song they may continue to make move equivalent actions. Standard actions result in immediate unconsciousness but no loss of hit points so long as the sustaining song continues. Upon the end of the sustaining song, the allies must begin making stabilization checks again. Inspire Greatness: Gained at 8th level, this bardic song requires 10 ranks to use. The bard can inspire true greatness in himself or a single willing ally within 30 ft, granting him or her extra fighting capability. The ally must be able to witness the performance (see a dance, hear a song, etc) to be affected by it. The effect lasts for the duration that the bard performs and an additional number of rounds thereafter equal to the bard's charisma modifier (if it is positive). A creature inspired with greatness gains two bonus Hit Die (in their highest available hit die), the commensurate number of temporary hit points (applying the creature's Constitution modifier, if any, to these bonus Hit Dice), a +2 competence bonus on attack rolls, and a +1 competence bonus on Fortitude saves. The bonus Hit Die count as regular Hit Dice for determining the effect of spells that are Hit Die dependant. Inspire Greatness is a mind-affecting ability. Every three levels following eighth the bard may target an additional ally with a single use of this use bardic music. (2 allies at Lv 11; 3 allies at Lv 14; 4 allies at Lv 17; 5 allies at Lv 20; 6 allies at Lv 23; 7 allies at Lv 26; 8 allies at Lv 29) Calumny: Gained at 9th level, this bardic song requires 11 ranks to use. The bard is skilled in manipulating the feelings and opinions of others. With this use of bardic music the bard can attempt to shift the attitude of each member of his audience against a particular person or organization (class, race, nationality, or the like). Those that fail their Will save (equal to the bard's performance check) automatically have their attitude adjusted one step lower, and they gain a +2 morale bonus on all opposed social interaction checks against the target. Those that succeed in their Will save may not have their attitude adjusted by this manner of performance from this bard for another 24 hours. Calumny lingers in the minds for 24 hours per daily use applied. Thus a bard that chooses to spend four daily uses of bardic music on this attempt causes those affected to have their attitude adjustment for four days. If he fails all four daily uses are lost. Calumny is a mind-affecting language-dependant ability. Pull the Heartstrings: Gained at 9th level, this bardic song requires 11 ranks to use. The bard is skilled in manipulating the feelings of others. All within 30 ft that witness the performance must make a Will save or gain either a morale penalty or a morale bonus to all saving throws equal to half the bard's class level. The penalty or bonus applies to ALL within 30 ft that fail their save (enemies and allies both). The bard chooses the affect at the time he begins his performance. The affect lasts for the duration of the performance and a number of following rounds equal to the bard's Charisma modifier (if it is positive). While a powerful ability, its potential for harming allies or aiding enemies limits its usefulness. Jarring Song: Gained at 10th level, this bardic song requires 12 ranks to use. The bard plays a discordant melody, distracting spellcasters in the immediate area. All spellcasters within 30 feet of the bard that attempt to cast a spell must make a Concentration check (DC 15 + spell level). Success allows normal completion of the spell; failure means it is lost. A Jarring Song may only be played for a number of rounds equal to the bard's charisma modifier (if positive, minimum 1 round). Furthermore, it requires a sound-based form of performance. Song of Freedom: Gained at 11th level, this bardic song requires 13 ranks to use. The bard can use performance to create an effect equivalent to the Break Enchantment spell (caster level equals the bard's level). Using this ability requires one full minute of uninterrupted concentration and performance, and it functions on a single target within 30 ft. A bard cannot use a Song of Freedom upon himself. Greater Enchanting Melody: Gained at 11th level, this bardic song requires 13 ranks to use. The bard becomes more skilled in using music to beguile the senses and the mind. This form of bardic music is identical to Enchanting Melody, except that the bard may now use it to charm any creature not immune to charms. Song of Frenzy: Gained at 12th level, this bardic song requires 14 ranks to use. The bard uses music to weaken the wills and inhibitions of those around him. All within 30 ft of the bard must make a Will save or suffer a circumstance penalty to all mental saves equal to half the bard's class level. Note that this affects every creature within 30 ft that fails its save, both enemies and allies alike. The effect lasts for the duration of the performance and a number of rounds following equal to his charisma modifier (if it is positive). Greater Calumny: Gained at 13th level, this bardic song requires 15 ranks to use. The bard's skill in slander reaches a new level. This form of bardic music is identical to Calumny, except that it shifts attitudes by two levels and the morale bonus is +4 rather than +2. Mindbending Melody: Gained at 14th level, this bardic song requires 16 ranks to use. The bard can Dominate a humanoid that he has already fascinated (as the spell Dominate Person by a caster of the bard's class level). Using this ability does not break the bard’s concentration on the Fascinate effect, nor does it allow a second saving throw against the Fascinate effect. Dominating a humanoid count against a bard’s daily limit on bardic music performances. A Will saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 bard’s level + bard’s Cha modifier) negates the effect. This ability affects only a single creature. Mindbending melody is an enchantment (charm), mind-affecting, language dependent ability. Inspire Heroics: Gained at 15th level, this bardic song requires 17 ranks to use. The bard may use a performance to inspire truly great heroics in himself or another single willing ally within 30 ft. The ally must be able to witness the performance (see a dance, hear a song, etc) to be affected by it. The effect lasts for the duration that the bard performs and an additional number of rounds thereafter equal to the bard's charisma modifier (if it is positive). A creature inspired with heroics gains a +4 morale bonus on saving throws and a +4 dodge bonus to AC. For every three levels thereafter the bard can target an additional willing ally within 30 ft of himself. (2 allies at Lv 18; 3 allies at Lv 21; 4 allies at Lv 24; 5 allies at Lv 27; 6 allies at Lv 30) Mass Suggestion: Gained at 15th level, this bardic song requires 17 ranks to use. The bard gains more skill with the suggestive abilities of a performance. This bardic music is the same as Suggestion (see above), but it allows the bard to make a single suggestion to any or all creatures Fascinated by the bard. Mass Suggestion is an enchantment (compulsion), mind-affecting, language-dependent ability. Enthralling Melody: Gained at 16th level, this bardic song requires 18 ranks to use. The bard has increased his skills in charming others. Now, through the use of this ability, the subject of the performance must make a Will save or be affected in a manner similar to the spell Desire. For a number of days equal to the number of daily uses of bardic music spent, the subject is as charmed by the bard or the person indicated by the bard during the performance (whether the indicated person is present or not) and suffers a morale penalty equal to half the bard's level to resist any non-harmful suggestion from that person. Magical Melody: Gained at 17th level, this bardic song requires 19 ranks to use. A bard may use a performance as a means of encouraging and even empowering spellcasters. A bard may perform a Magical Melody for a number of rounds equal to their level. For the duration of the performance, and ending immediately upon the end of the performance, an allied spell caster within 30 ft is empowered, gaining the equivalent of +1 caster level for purposes of spell effects and penetrating spell resistance. The spellcaster's effective caster level may be raised no more than one caster level by this means, no matter how many bards may attempt to empower the spellcaster. Revealing Melody: Gained at 18th level, this bardic song requires 20 ranks to use. The bard can use a performance to reveal the true nature of reality. All those within 30 ft of the bard that witness the performance are affected as by a True Seeing spell cast by a caster who level is equal to the bard's class level. The bard can continue playing for a duration equal to his level, and the effect lasts a number of rounds following equal to the bard's charisma modifier (if it is positive). Song of Fury: Gained at 19th level, this bardic song requires 21 ranks to use. All willing allies within 20 ft enter into a rage identical to the rage a barbarian gains at its first level. The effect lasts for the duration of the bard's song, but the bard is limited to their class level in the number of rounds he or she can continue this song. Barbarians entering a rage by this manner do not use up one of their rages per day, but they gain no more than the bonuses they would have at the first level, and they may not voluntarily end the rage before the bard ends his or her performance. However, if a barbarian thus affected has the Tireless Rage ability they are not fatigued afterwards, unlike their companions. This is an Enchantment (compulsion) mind-affecting ability. Deafening Song: Gained at 23rd level, this bardic song requires 25 ranks to use. The bard may temporarily deafen ALL within 30 ft spread through the use of a sound-based performance. A successful Fortitude save negates the affect. The deafening affect lasts for the duration of the song and a number of following rounds equal to the charisma modifier of the bard (if it is positive). A bard may continue playing a deafening song for a number of rounds equal to half his or her class level. Heighten 'Ability': Gained at 29th level, this bardic song requires 31 ranks to use. The bard may grant a +4 competence bonus for a single predetermined ability score to himself and/or any chosen allies within 30 ft. The effect lasts for as long as the bard continues the performance (up to his class level in rounds) and a number of following rounds equal to his charisma modifier (if positive). This is a mind-affecting ability. Wandering Diversity of Skills (Ex): The Bard wanders as much from skill to skill as from location to location. They so rarely focus on learning any one skill that their cap for maximum ranks in any skill is lowered from Lv + 3 to Lv +1. Those who later chose to multiclass into this class have their maximum skill cap level permanently and irrevocably lowered by one (from Lv +3 to Lv +2). Multiclassed Bard / Wanderers do not have their skill cap lowered further, as their skills caps are lowered for the same reason (constant wandering from place to place, from skill to skill). Note that Bards have a slight bonus over the Wanderer, for their decreased skill cap does not apply toward Craft, Knowledge, or Performance checks. However, if they multiclass with Wanderer these checks are likewise reduced to Lv +2 maximum ranks. Spells per Day (0 allows casting only if he has bonus spells per day due to a high Cha) LV 0 1 2 3 4 5 01 0 - - - - - 02 0 - - - - - 03 0 - - - - - 04 1 - - - - - 05 1 - - - - - 06 1 - - - - - 07 1 0 - - - - 08 2 0 - - - - 09 2 0 - - - - 10 2 1 - - - - 11 2 1 - - - - 12 2 1 - - - - 13 3 1 0 - - - 14 3 2 0 - - - 15 3 2 0 - - - 16 3 2 1 - - - 17 3 2 1 - - - 18 3 2 1 - - - 19 4 3 1 0 - - 20 4 3 2 0 - - 21 4 3 2 0 - - 22 4 3 2 1 - - 23 4 3 2 1 - - 24 4 3 2 1 - - 25 4 4 3 1 0 - 26 5 4 3 2 0 - 27 5 4 3 2 0 - 28 5 4 3 2 1 - 29 5 4 3 2 1 - 30 5 4 3 2 1 0 Spells Known LV 0 1 2 3 4 5 01 1* - - - - - 02 1* - - - - - 03 2* - - - - - 04 2 - - - - - 05 2 - - - - - 06 2 - - - - - 07 3 1* - - - - 08 3 1* - - - - 09 3 2* - - - - 10 3 2 - - - - 11 3 2 - - - - 12 3 2 - - - - 13 4 3 1* - - - 14 4 3 1* - - - 15 4 3 2* - - - 16 4 3 2 - - - 17 4 3 2 - - - 18 4 3 2 - - - 19 4 4 3 1* - - 20 4 4 3 1* - - 21 5 4 3 2* - - 22 5 4 3 2 - - 23 5 4 3 2 - - 24 5 4 3 2 - - 25 5 4 4 3 1* - 26 5 4 4 3 1* - 27 5 5 4 3 2* - 28 5 5 4 3 2 - 29 5 5 4 3 2 - 30 5 5 4 3 2 1*
Lady Ishtar 05-05-04, 12:18 AM	thats pretty cool Aurotuli, but i was going for something simpler, and closed to the original bard. thanks though.
Nifft 05-05-04, 03:01 AM	Ishtar: I like your final version. Of course, as a source I'm biased. :) Aurotuli: Too many house rules -- you have six saves, eh? -- N
Lady Ishtar 05-05-04, 10:28 AM	Originally posted by Nifft Ishtar: I like your final version. Of course, as a source I'm biased. :) Aurotuli: Too many house rules -- you have six saves, eh? -- N couldnt have madet it without you :bow:
Aurotuli 05-05-04, 07:52 PM	I can understand your potential aversion to my version of the class. :) When I created it I wanted a bard that was truly based on performance. Magic should be present, but at such low levels that it is more of a minor knack used during performances than a life & death necessity. Combat, as you can probably tell, was also a minor focus as the Bard typically stays out of combat while using performance to encourage allies / demoralize foes. My houserules regarding saves (for core use, not for homebrew use) are rather straightforward and simple: Fort is broken into Endurance and Fortitude. Fort saves usually used to swim that extra lap, etc are treated as endurance saves (based on Str) instead. Will saves are broken into three saves: Sanity (wis), Perception (wis), and Will (cha). Sanity is used for horror / madness saves (ala Ravenloft style). Perception is used to disbelieve illusions and for uncommon mental perceptions (enlightenment on how to deal with a problem, common sense, etc). Perception deals with perceiving reality, and it is used anytime a means is used to fool the senses or distract the mind from its senses. Will is charisma based and used entirely to resist effects that strive to remove freewill, overpower the mind, etc. It is used vs Fear effects and Turning, vs charms and compulsions, etc. So, in effect all I did was break up Fort and Will into their main component parts. Due to the number of saves I allow feats that grant bonuses to such to allow a +3 rather than a +2. The only save this potentially overpowers is Reflex, as it was not changed, but to date few have taken Lightning Reflexes. There are simply so many many more other feats that can be of better use. The few times it has been taken the PC was usually seeking to fulfill a PrC's requirements. Now, having said all this, what do you mean by 'original bard'? Do you mean the original core class bard or the original historical bard? In the case of the latter you should have the Bard as a PrC that is required before becoming a Druid (who, from a more historical perspective, should have received a form of bardic lore for local and natural knowledge). I'm going to assume you meant the core class bard, which I'll readily admit my version makes a significant departure from. :)
danielinthewolvesden 05-05-04, 08:25 PM	Have you seen the Marshal in the Mini handbook? It is kinda a bard without spells....
Lady Ishtar 05-06-04, 01:24 AM	the PHB core bard as for marshal, i am not looking for a Diablo 2 paladin