Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Xeviat-DM 09-08-04, 08:54 PM	A player has been working on a character idea, trying to figure out how to best do it in D&D. He found that taking the Druidic Avenger model, then applying the Druid ability trade (giving up wild shape and armor proficiencies for monk AC, monk fast movement, and ranger tracking stuff, and ranger favored enemy) would make a character similar to what he wants, but he doesn't need the spells. So, I made an attempt to use the alterations on a Ranger instead. First, using the Druidic Avenger model, he takes a penalty on animal empathy and gives up his animal companion. Because I grant Ranger's companions at -3 druid level instead of 1/2 druid level, I figure that it isn't too much of a change. He will gain the Druidic Avenger model, but he won't gain fast movement. Second, using the Ranger trade off variant, he will give up his combat style feats for wild shape (small and medium animals only) and fast movement (as barbarian). Then he will use the Druid trade off variant, giving up his wild shape and armor/shield proficiencies, but he will only gain the monk AC and Monk Fast Movement. Does this mish-mash of flip flopping abilities seem fair?
Mac Awol 09-10-04, 01:27 AM	You suggestion seems fair, but something is just off... Armor/Shield profiency for the Monk AC, thats fair.. But his Combat Style for the Monk's Fast Movement, that just seems wrong... I think it would make more sense to give him the Barbarian's fast movement at 1st level, and stick with that... but you could create a new Combat Style for him.. But take a look at the No Spell Variant from Complete Warrior, it might give you some ideas...
Xeviat-DM 09-10-04, 06:43 AM	Well note, the ranger has given up their combat style to gain barbarian fast movement and a slightly limited wild shape. Druids are then able to give up their armor proficiencies and wild shape to gain Monk AC (fair with the armor proficiencies as you said), Monk Speed, Ranger favored enemy, Track, and fast tracking. And really, when it is all said and done, 3 feats for +60 speed sounds like a lot, but +60 speed will rarely have an affect on combat like the three archery feats will. And you think giving up the animal companion and taking a -4 penalty on wild empathy checks is fair for gaining barbarian rage 1/day +1/day/5 levels?
Mac Awol 09-10-04, 09:39 AM	So basically you want a basic class that gives you the qualities of a good blood hound; speed, able to track fast, fair at attacking??? The Mish-Mash seems strange, but you could make a better class, if you considered the class concept first, cause it seems more like a prestige class to me. But remember that the GM has the final say, cause it could also be done by a very clever combination of basic classes. And with that in mind think of Core Class abilities, like the Fighter's Weapon Specialization, and the Monk's Fast Movement. This abilities shouldn't be given lightly any other class. So if he wants Fast Movement I would give him a maximum of +30 feet throughout the class levels, perhaps with a +10 feet boost while in rage. But Based on the ranger I would do something like this: add Intimidate to Class Skills, +10 Unarmored speed extra +10 ft. while in rage only. Lose Armor/Shield proficiency, gain Monk's AC bonus. 1st: use wild empathy at -4, gain rage 1/day. 2nd: lose combat style. 4th: lose animal companion. 5th: rage 2/day. 6th: lose improved combat style. gain Unarmored speed +10 ft. 10th: rage 3/day. 11th: lose combat style mastery. 12th: gain Unarmored speed +20 ft. 15th: rage 4/day. 17th: gain tireless rage. 18th: gain Unarmored speed +30 ft. 20th: rage 5/day. The Extra speed under rage is added to compensate for the fact that you can't cast spells while raging. Does this seem fair to you??