Post/Author/DateTime	Post
bluetooth 01-03-07, 11:56 PM	In terms of flavor I *love* the vow of poverty...yet well all know how broken it is. Therefore I suggest a fix that makes the vow 90% flavor and 10% usable benefit. My version works like this: For every gold piece (or equivalent value) you donate to charity you receive an equal number of "karma points". With Karma points you may purchase effects similar to magic items. For instance for 16000 karma points you can give yourself a +4 enhancement bonus to an ability score (because a +4 ability score enhancer like a Headband of Intellect +4 costs 16000 gold) Body slots are still used for balance purposes. For instance, a monk using this feat cannot receive the effect of a Amulet of Mighty Fists *and* a Periapt of Wisdom. Furthermore if you decide to give up your enhancement to your fists (a la Amulet of Mighty Fists) you can recoup half the Karma Points spent. (Just like if you actually possessed an Amulet of Mighty Fists and sold it). On top of this, your DM may decide you can purchase "coincidences" like free passage on a ship or magical healing potions. You may not purchase anything with Karma points that would break your Vow (thus you cannot accidentally loose your feat this way). The benefit of taking this feat (beyond flavor) is that you need not have a magical item vendor. Furthermore the DM should be somewhat lax about what sorts of mundane items and services can be purchased, although in an extremely unlikely situation he is free to raise the price. Additionally the DM may reward you with Karma points directly. This is always at the DM's discretion.
unundindur 01-04-07, 10:30 AM	In terms of flavor I *love* the vow of poverty...yet well all know how broken it is. Therefore I suggest a fix that makes the vow 90% flavor and 10% usable benefit. My version works like this: For every gold piece (or equivalent value) you donate to charity you receive an equal number of "karma points". With Karma points you may purchase effects similar to magic items. For instance for 16000 karma points you can give yourself a +4 enhancement bonus to an ability score (because a +4 ability score enhancer like a Headband of Intellect +4 costs 16000 gold) Body slots are still used for balance purposes. For instance, a monk using this feat cannot receive the effect of a Amulet of Mighty Fists *and* a Periapt of Wisdom. Furthermore if you decide to give up your enhancement to your fists (a la Amulet of Mighty Fists) you can recoup half the Karma Points spent. (Just like if you actually possessed an Amulet of Mighty Fists and sold it). On top of this, your DM may decide you can purchase "coincidences" like free passage on a ship or magical healing potions. You may not purchase anything with Karma points that would break your Vow (thus you cannot accidentally loose your feat this way). The benefit of taking this feat (beyond flavor) is that you need not have a magical item vendor. Furthermore the DM should be somewhat lax about what sorts of mundane items and services can be purchased, although in an extremely unlikely situation he is free to raise the price. Additionally the DM may reward you with Karma points directly. This is always at the DM's discretion. The other obvious benefit is that these "items" cannot be dispelled, shattered or stolen. I see no problem with that though :)
jagggar 01-04-07, 12:24 PM	The benefit of taking this feat (beyond flavor) is that you need not have a magical item vendor. Furthermore the DM should be somewhat lax about what sorts of mundane items and services can be purchased, although in an extremely unlikely situation he is free to raise the price. Screw that. Keep the vendor and let the VoP character laugh as the other characters have to sell their treasure for less than it's worth while you get full benefit of your charity's share of the loot. Makes me think of the OA Samurai's Ancestrial Daisho (which I like), so I'd probably add in the 1 day of meditation/prayer per 1000 gp (now karma points) spent in from that.
DarkRhystar 01-04-07, 01:03 PM	Effectively this feat means: You are not affected by mark up prices for items so you can get more. You are not limited by vendors for items you can acquire. Everything you get is slotless for no extra cost. Nothing you get can be stolen or destroyed. Balanced? I think not. Possibly.
jagggar 01-04-07, 03:26 PM	Everything you get is slotless for no extra cost. Could you explain what you mean a bit more? It looks like you missed this: Body slots are still used for balance purposes. For instance, a monk using this feat cannot receive the effect of a Amulet of Mighty Fists *and* a Periapt of Wisdom. But I'm not sure if you mean something else.
Andrul 01-04-07, 03:28 PM	Actually, he said "Body slots are still used for balance purposes." Also, you can modify this by saying the effects are temporary, requiring further donations to keep them in effect. Oh, and how is he getting full benefit of sale prices when he has to sell the items in order to donate money? Instead of just saying what's wrong with his ideas, let's make positive suggestions guys ;)
Deathcow38 01-04-07, 03:35 PM	Bear in mind that to take VoP in the first place, you need to burn a total of two feat slots- including taking Sacred Vow, which is one of the crappier feats in the game. Seems balanced, as long as you add the stuff about "if you violate your principles, you lose this ability."
Dochenor 01-04-07, 03:59 PM	I like VoP and have allowed it in several of my games. Everyone seems to immediatly think Monk. Why not a Psion or Sorcerer? Trust me a Psion VoP is scary I wouldn't and do not change the VoP, just make sure you really enforce the restrictions!
bluetooth 01-05-07, 01:08 AM	Well, actually there's nothing saying these items couldn't somehow be stolen or destroyed. Think about the Ur Priest...maybe he can steal karma as well as divine magic. But honestly, how often are you *really* gonna steal/destroy the party's items? Unless you've given them an item that's well beyond their level for plot reasons. Just like the rule books, this is just a rough outline/suggestion. It is probably not balanced in some games (low magic games). Also, it's up to the DM to decide if these bonuses do or do not work in an antimagic field. A clever DM might do both, charging significantly more for enchancements that work in an antimagic field. Plus I mean for the love of god think of the flavor! "I use karma points to buy a virtual Lyre of Building, then I take Words of Creation and start singing" Or how about Crystal Balls? Rings of Sustanence and Regeneration? I mean, I suppose I could add "The DM is advised to put similar limits on the use of these 'abilities' as with their item counter parts" but the DM can do that whether I say they should or not. And any DM that's running a higher/lower powered than normal game should know that they will have to adjust most of the rules to fit their game anyway.
DarkRhystar 01-05-07, 09:09 PM	Could you explain what you mean a bit more?:( It looks like you missed this: But I'm not sure if you mean something else. Must have missed that. :) After rereading the original, I stand by the other three points I made however I think I like this newer version more than the old at least.
Krusk 01-05-07, 10:36 PM	Effectively this feat means: You are not affected by mark up prices for items so you can get more. You are not limited by vendors for items you can acquire. Everything you get is slotless for no extra cost. Nothing you get can be stolen or destroyed. Balanced? I think not. Possibly. You could always ask the dm how much item X costs in their campaign, and pay that many karma points. this is what i do in any game when buying anything. Then adjust. You could also create some evil varient on VOP no idea how or what, and then allow them to steal karma points from players. but ive always wanted an evil counter part to VOP, and have no idea how.
DarkRhystar 01-06-07, 01:37 AM	You could always ask the dm how much item X costs in their campaign, and pay that many karma points. this is what i do in any game when buying anything. Then adjust. You could also create some evil varient on VOP no idea how or what, and then allow them to steal karma points from players. but ive always wanted an evil counter part to VOP, and have no idea how. The part about this I like is this gets rid of the essential flaw in design of VoP. VoP is bad because not all DMs run the same wealth level in their games so in some games it will be vastly underpowered and in others it will be just the opposite. By correlating directly to wealth you're getting rid of that flaw. All we're left with is a couple feats for the aforementioned perks and some strict penalties.
flindbar 01-07-07, 03:12 AM	Anyone know if there was ever an FAQ produced about the Book of Exalted deeds ?? :)