Gestalt Campaigns - Best and Worst of [Archive] - Wizards Community

Gestalt Campaigns - Best and Worst of [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Kilsek of Sheverash
05-06-04, 02:18 PM Hi, I'd like DMs' and players' top lessons learned and insights not on class combinations, but moreso on the DMing and campaign style and goals side.

That is, what kinds of encounters and monsters have you discovered, during play, are the best fit in a Gestalt campaign?

What kinds of character goals are more motivating in Gestalt campaign?

What kind of problems do you run into as a DM in a Gestalt campaign? For example, what's your one toughest challenge as DM? Is it number crunching, actually challenging the PCs, miscalculating how challenging an encounter is, etc.?
Kilsek of Sheverash
05-06-04, 05:23 PM Honestly, I thought more than a few ppl played and DMed Gestalt campaigns? I guess not?

Anyone? Anyone? :uh-huh:
Riznar
05-06-04, 05:34 PM Since I'm hungry and want to eat before I go to class, I'll make this short.

-Gestalt characters really have almost no special benefit against big grapplers like Ankhegs and Bears. A CR6 grappler will munch a 4th level gestalt party.
-If you don't adjust CRs, Gestalt characters level really fast, I wanted my group to, but it is a lot faster than I expected.
-Gestalt characters are more likely to suffer from MAD.
-Gestalt removes a lot of the stereotypes that you see associated with classes. I had a Halfling Paragon3/Urban Rgr3//Swh3/Rog3 that was a ninja RP wise. The city my campaign takes place in has a bard college where you can't really tell what someone's class is at all.
-My players have reported that they feel more heroic, that they can do the kinds of things that they expect out of heroes.
Kilsek of Sheverash
05-07-04, 10:44 AM Wow, thanks Riznar. That's exactly what I was looking for! Thanks very much for taking the time and for the insights, I appreciate it as I think about the possibility of running our 1st Gestalt campaign.

Any other pointers? Anyone? DM or player?
Lord_Anthrax
05-07-04, 11:25 AM My suggestion would be to use the Level-Independent XP Reward System from UA and knock 2 off everything's CR for XP and calculating treasure rewards. That will slow their advancement and more readily represent the kind of gains such powerful characters should have. Moreso than in a single-class game, it should be about what the characters can do, not what their magic items can do. YMMV, of course, that's just my 2 cents on the subject. Personally I'm going to be dropping it down 4 steps to really extend the game's lifespan.
Jandor1
05-09-04, 09:37 AM The real tricky part is that all NPC's are Gestalt. Anyone the party might or needs to kill has to be Gestalt, otherwise it's too easy (and inconsistant). So while this isn't really a balancing problem, as a DM you have to be willing (espicially at high levels) to take the extra time to make your NPC's gestalt. And it is a LOT of extra time.

But hey, if that's cool than power to you. Just expect some sleepless nights. :D
Riznar
05-09-04, 09:41 AM Gestalt is a great way to have a higher powered campaign without being epic level and having to deal with all the problems that come with that.
Kilsek of Sheverash
05-09-04, 11:42 AM Yeah, Gestalt definitely seems like "Epic Lite." So if you want a high-powered campaign, it's a great option.

And as I feared someone would say, it WILL require a lot of extra time detailing Gestalt NPCs. It's time-consuming enough to come up with a 15th-level spellcaster, have his "combat suite"-modified stats detailed up, and so on. Nevermind a Gestalt Cleric-Wizard! Aahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Kilsek of Sheverash 05-06-04, 02:18 PM	Hi, I'd like DMs' and players' top lessons learned and insights not on class combinations, but moreso on the DMing and campaign style and goals side. That is, what kinds of encounters and monsters have you discovered, during play, are the best fit in a Gestalt campaign? What kinds of character goals are more motivating in Gestalt campaign? What kind of problems do you run into as a DM in a Gestalt campaign? For example, what's your one toughest challenge as DM? Is it number crunching, actually challenging the PCs, miscalculating how challenging an encounter is, etc.?
Kilsek of Sheverash 05-06-04, 05:23 PM	Honestly, I thought more than a few ppl played and DMed Gestalt campaigns? I guess not? Anyone? Anyone? :uh-huh:
Riznar 05-06-04, 05:34 PM	Since I'm hungry and want to eat before I go to class, I'll make this short. -Gestalt characters really have almost no special benefit against big grapplers like Ankhegs and Bears. A CR6 grappler will munch a 4th level gestalt party. -If you don't adjust CRs, Gestalt characters level really fast, I wanted my group to, but it is a lot faster than I expected. -Gestalt characters are more likely to suffer from MAD. -Gestalt removes a lot of the stereotypes that you see associated with classes. I had a Halfling Paragon3/Urban Rgr3//Swh3/Rog3 that was a ninja RP wise. The city my campaign takes place in has a bard college where you can't really tell what someone's class is at all. -My players have reported that they feel more heroic, that they can do the kinds of things that they expect out of heroes.
Kilsek of Sheverash 05-07-04, 10:44 AM	Wow, thanks Riznar. That's exactly what I was looking for! Thanks very much for taking the time and for the insights, I appreciate it as I think about the possibility of running our 1st Gestalt campaign. Any other pointers? Anyone? DM or player?
Lord_Anthrax 05-07-04, 11:25 AM	My suggestion would be to use the Level-Independent XP Reward System from UA and knock 2 off everything's CR for XP and calculating treasure rewards. That will slow their advancement and more readily represent the kind of gains such powerful characters should have. Moreso than in a single-class game, it should be about what the characters can do, not what their magic items can do. YMMV, of course, that's just my 2 cents on the subject. Personally I'm going to be dropping it down 4 steps to really extend the game's lifespan.
Jandor1 05-09-04, 09:37 AM	The real tricky part is that all NPC's are Gestalt. Anyone the party might or needs to kill has to be Gestalt, otherwise it's too easy (and inconsistant). So while this isn't really a balancing problem, as a DM you have to be willing (espicially at high levels) to take the extra time to make your NPC's gestalt. And it is a LOT of extra time. But hey, if that's cool than power to you. Just expect some sleepless nights. :D
Riznar 05-09-04, 09:41 AM	Gestalt is a great way to have a higher powered campaign without being epic level and having to deal with all the problems that come with that.
Kilsek of Sheverash 05-09-04, 11:42 AM	Yeah, Gestalt definitely seems like "Epic Lite." So if you want a high-powered campaign, it's a great option. And as I feared someone would say, it WILL require a lot of extra time detailing Gestalt NPCs. It's time-consuming enough to come up with a 15th-level spellcaster, have his "combat suite"-modified stats detailed up, and so on. Nevermind a Gestalt Cleric-Wizard! Aahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!