Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dez_Demona 06-01-07, 12:34 PM	I'm considering a new variant style where the player announces what his character's going to take next level, and the character gets minimal class abilities for that class temporarily(such as 0-level spells for someone who wants to be a wizard) but if the character decides they don't want to, they can still take levels in something else they've already taken levels in. However, the character cannot take any other class levels for their new level. For example. A 4th level rogue/barbarian wants to be a sorceror. So he gets one 0-level spell per day, just to try things out, and gets the rest of the sorceror's abilities when he levels up. If he decides he doesn't like sorcerors, he can instead choose to take a level in either barbarian or rogue, as he already has levels in those classes. However, he may not take a level in cleric, as he did not express wishes of wanting to be a cleric. The player can choose one class when they level up as the class they want to become. All of these classes must be basic classes. (from the Player's Handbook) Prestige classes not included. Players can still remain undecided, and do not have to choose to use this variant. I'm still trying to decide how to balance all of this....Help Wanted.
RobbyPants 06-01-07, 02:27 PM	One thing I am confused on with your example: if the barbarian/rogue is considering sorcerer, gets the 0-level spells, and changes his mind, he can advance as a barbarian or rogue? What happens to the 0-level spell? Does he lose it? This isn't a bad idea, but I think I would force them to stay committed to the choice. When do they select it? Right after they gain a level? If you're looking for suggestions on pseudo-abilities to gain in these intermediate stages, I guess I can give you a few suggestions: Barbarian - Ability to use a lesser rage (1/day) for 1 round + Con bonus (if any). They get all the drawbacks of rage, and gain +2 Str. Bard - Abilility to use bardic knowledge (bard level = 0, so it just uses the PC's Int mod). Cleric - Ability to prepare two 0-level cleric spells per day. Druid - Ability to prepare two 0-level druid spells per day. Fighter - Proficiency in one martial weapon. Monk - Unarmed strike damage of 1d4 (1d3 if small). Possibly Improved Unarmed Strike. Paladin - Detect Evil (3/day). Ranger - Track as a bonus feat. Rogue - Trapfinding. Sorcerer - Ability to cast one 0-level sorcerer spell three times per day. Wizard - Ability to prepare two 0-level wizard spells per day.
Dez_Demona 06-01-07, 04:53 PM	Thanks Rob, I like your ideas. I'm having issues with other things too, though. They would choose right after they leveled up, and they would be forced to stay committed to that choice, as in no changing what you're pondering becoming. I'm looking for ideas to prevent munchkins from trying to work the system, and saying that they were considering being (insert class here) just to get the abilities when their original intent was just to get extra special abilities, and continue taking levels in whatever class they already have. So I need some kind of drawback, that isn't that serious, to prevent people from just doing it to work the system. Or maybe have it so that all classes, even the ones you already have levels in, provide some kind of bonus. That would make everything overall slightly overpowered, but I don't think it would unbalance anything. Thoughts still welcome.
General Felire 06-01-07, 05:13 PM	I like this variant, it presents an interesting option to players. It also makes sense and I think works from an in-game perspective. Say, I am choosing to take a level of Sorceror next class. By getting some 0-level spells, my character can say that the reason he is taken sorceror NOW is because something in him manifested some basic ability and he wants to expand it. It also allows for characters to have powers that don't technically come out of the blue as he has some features that led up to it. So, all in all, I like this variant and think that it has merit. I do want to mention that I think if you say "This is what I intend" then you must stick with it unless something drastic happens in the game and the DM says, okay, I'll allow the resciding of your promise."
shout27 06-01-07, 05:20 PM	Consider giving them temporary in-game time penaties or a certain XP penalty to "pay" for the powerup, maybe forcing them to gain an extra 1000 XP for level-up if they back out of the class choice. Another option is if a character is thinking about taking the Class he must announce this and over the course of 2 character levels he'll gain the ability, example: John announced before creating his 1st Level Fighter that he was looking into studying magic as a wizard for a hobby at 2nd level he'd gain the 2 0-level spells and his 3rd level could be a wizard level at his choice.
Rhialto 06-01-07, 06:18 PM	How about they can pay 1000 xp for that ability any time, which gets refunded when they take that first level for real, but the 1000 xp is lost if they don't actually take their next level in that class? This way, they aren't forced to immediately make that choice either, and a truly indecisive character could change it many times (forfeiting the 1000 xp each time).
Dez_Demona 06-01-07, 07:52 PM	How about they can pay 1000 xp for that ability any time, which gets refunded when they take that first level for real, but the 1000 xp is lost if they don't actually take their next level in that class? This way, they aren't forced to immediately make that choice either, and a truly indecisive character could change it many times (forfeiting the 1000 xp each time). I really like this idea. It presents an obvious penalty, but one not so severe as to permanently hinder a character. I'm going to be DMing all summer, so I guess I'll let it be known how that goes. I'd also like an opinion on whether or not it's too unbalancing to do the same thing for prestige classes... I've got a rogue who's considering assassin, but he still doesn't have access to an assassin's guild (I'm using a variant that still forces players to work for their classes, more realism) What would the community think of letting a level 6 rogue get access in advance to prestige class abilities? I think it could get VERY messy and far too complicated to try and come up with minor abilities for every single class and prestige class out there. Maybe something to consider for 4th edition. *wink, wink* So...thoughts.
shout27 06-01-07, 10:10 PM	don't, let him start his own assassins guild (with him being the first member) if he really wants that prestige class, knowledge(local) can point him to his first customer after all.
shout27 06-01-07, 10:11 PM	for those considering monk just give them Improved Unarmed Strike.