Mythgar House Rules [Archive] - Wizards Community

Mythgar House Rules [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Tethka
05-10-05, 10:58 AM Please take a moment to look over my house rules I plan to use in my future campaign. Please just give me your opinions, balancing issues or errors. Thank you.

Mythgar D&D House Rules

Books used (ver. 3.5)
Players Handbook {PHB}, Dungeon Masters Guide {DMG}, Monster Manual 1 & 2 {MM1 & MM2}, Complete Adventurer {ADV}, Complete Arcane {ARC}, Complete Divine {DIV}, Complete Warrior {WAR} and Arms & Equipment Guide {AEG}.
A number following the books abbreviation is the page number in that book.

Multi-classed & Prestige Class Characters
Players may have a character with a maximum of two core classes, but multi-class penalties may apply (see PHB 60 under Uneven Levels). Favored Classes have been revised from the Players Handbook, see below for favored class listing. Characters may have any number of prestige classes as long as they meet the requirements.

Favored Classes
Multi-classed characters may be any combination of two core classes, however a -20% experience point penalty may apply when experience points are given out. To avoid the penalty, characters of a race listed below may take one of the favored classes listed beside that race.

Dwarf - Cleric, Fighter
Elf - Ranger, Wizard
Gnome - Bard, Druid
Halfling - Rogue, Spirit Shaman
Human - Any
Half-Elf - Any
Half-Orc - Barbarian, Sorcerer

Character Generation {DMG 169}
All ability scores start at 8. Take 30 points to spread out among all abilities. The point cost for each ability is listed below. No ability score can be below 8 or above 18 at this point.

After ability scores have been done, players may (optional) subtract 2 from one ability score and add 1 to another. This may only be done once and no ability score can be below 6 or above 19 at this point. After which racial adjustments to ability scores are added.

Character Hit Points
To simplify the recording of hit points, each character class has a fixed number of hit points they receive each level (they do not roll for hit points). At first and second level a character will get maximum hit points per level according to their class Hit Die (plus constitution modifier and feats). At 3rd level and higher the character gets half their maximum hit points per level according to the class Hit Die (plus constitution modifier and feats).

Variant Rules

Actions: Immediate & Swift {ADV & ARC}
Immediate and Swift actions that are described in the Complete Adventurer and Complete Arcane books are not used in Mythgar. These actions are changed to standard or free actions where applied.

Casting Defensively {DMG 140}
Spell casting in Mythgar is more difficult than other D&D worlds. The power of magic both arcane and divine is harder to control.
So casting defensively is as follows:

DC 15 + spell level +2 per additional threatening opponent beyond the first.
Tiny size and smaller opponents only threaten squares they occupy and count as only one opponent in that square.

A natural roll of 1 while making a concentration check when casting defensively is always a failure.

Cost of Living
Each month characters need to deduct 30 gold pieces from their total money. This represents cost of living expenses such has food, shelter, maintenance of items, research, travel, etc.

Critical miss (fumble)
Combat is chaotic and sometimes a nasty hit is made (critical hit) and sometimes a nasty mistake is made (fumble).

If a natural 1 is rolled during an attack, roll a fumble check. This is a d20 + Dexterity modifier. The DC is 10.

If successful, nothing happens and that attack is just a miss.

If failed, the attacker gets no actions or movement during his next round, but he may still defend himself (dodge bonuses etc.) and use free actions. The attacker may still do remaining attacks or move actions during the round he fumbled.
Any additional natural 1 rolled by the fumbling character in the same turn is just a miss.

Skills: Listen & Spot {PHB}
The Listen skill and Spot skill are equally accessible to every class, therefore these two skills are class skills for every class.

Toughness Feat {PHB 101} & Improved Toughness Feat {WAR 101}
Toughness [General]
You are tougher than normal.
Benefit: You gain a number of hit points equal to your current Hit Dice. Each time you gain a HD (such as by gaining a level), you gain 1 additional hit point. If you lose a HD (such as losing a level), you lose one hit point permanently.
Special: Toughness can only be taken once.

Improved Toughness [General]
You are significantly tougher than normal.
Prerequisite: Toughness, Base Fortitude save bonus +2.
Benefit: You gain a number of hit points equal to your current Hit Dice. Each time you gain a HD (such as by gaining a level), you gain 1 additional hit point. If you lose a HD (such as losing a level), you lose one hit point permanently.
Special: Improved Toughness feat stacks with Toughness feat. For example, if you have Toughness and Improved Toughness you would gain 2 additional hit points each time you gain a HD. If you lose a HD, you lose 2 hit points permanently. Improved Toughness can only be taken once. A fighter may select Improved Toughness as one of his fighter bonus feats.
baalzamon999
05-10-05, 02:03 PM Cool, but I just have two things to say.
1: Why remove immediate and swift actions?
2: Why the Spot and Listen? Some classes are just more adept at alertness. There was a thread covered about class skills such as these and Move Silently and Hide.
Ra-Tiel
05-10-05, 04:32 PM Hi.

===

@Tethka:
Please take a moment to look over my house rules I plan to use in my future campaign. Please just give me your opinions, balancing issues or errors. Thank you.
OK.. so let's see...

Everthing seems fine, but one thing. This one here:

[...]
Critical miss (fumble)
Combat is chaotic and sometimes a nasty hit is made (critical hit) and sometimes a nasty mistake is made (fumble).

If a natural 1 is rolled during an attack, roll a fumble check. This is a d20 + Dexterity modifier. The DC is 10.

If successful, nothing happens and that attack is just a miss.

If failed, the attacker gets no actions or movement during his next round, but he may still defend himself (dodge bonuses etc.) and use free actions. The attacker may still do remaining attacks or move actions during the round he fumbled.
Any additional natural 1 rolled by the fumbling character in the same turn is just a miss.
[...]

Please consider to read this. Are you really sure you want to keep that house rule? Consider it carefully.

===

Greetings,
_Ra-Tiel.
Tethka
05-10-05, 11:00 PM Cool, but I just have two things to say.
1: Why remove immediate and swift actions?
2: Why the Spot and Listen? Some classes are just more adept at alertness. There was a thread covered about class skills such as these and Move Silently and Hide.

1. The immediate and swift action was introduced in the Complete Arcane and used often in the Complete Adventurer book. These actions are not mentioned or used in the Complete Warrior & Divine and especially in the PHB.
To me this feels like a quick fix or after thought rule that would need to be inserted into the books that do not have such a rule. I found this addtional rule to complicate the rules of actions, since you can use free (limit 1 per round) or standard actions just fine for the spells and other things that use immediate or swift actions.

2. IMHO Listen & Spot skills are more of a 'natural' skill than a 'learned' skill, also these two skills are used more than any other skill during a usual game session (at least in our group). Of course one can increase their skill by adding ranks, but I don't see why some classes should be limited by cross-class skill with these skills.

I hope this explains why I would like this house rules, however if you think that my reply is flawed, please let me know why. I thank you for your post baalzamon999. :)
Tethka
05-10-05, 11:13 PM Hi.

===

@Tethka:

OK.. so let's see...

Everthing seems fine, but one thing. This one here:

Please consider to read this. Are you really sure you want to keep that house rule? Consider it carefully.

===

Greetings,
_Ra-Tiel.

I have read the post by chocobochicken and found it to be very interesting. I wanted to use the 'fumble' rule to balance the critical hit and to add a realistic feel to the game. After reading the thread however, I may need to reconsider for I see that it would hurt the characters more as they advance and that does not seem right.
Thank you Ra-Tiel for that reference, I will certainly consider it. :)
HailSpork
05-10-05, 11:57 PM 1. The immediate and swift action was introduced in the Complete Arcane and used often in the Complete Adventurer book. These actions are not mentioned or used in the Complete Warrior & Divine and especially in the PHB.
To me this feels like a quick fix or after thought rule that would need to be inserted into the books that do not have such a rule. I found this addtional rule to complicate the rules of actions, since you can use free (limit 1 per round) or standard actions just fine for the spells and other things that use immediate or swift actions.

Actually, it was in Miniature's Handbook before Complete Arcane and in Expanded Psionicists Handbook before that (which, btw, predates Complete Divine). Anyway, when it was added is kind of irrelevent to their use.
Even before that, Swift and Immediate actions are used, they just aren't named as such. Feather Fall is a perfect example of an Immediate Action. Quicken spell is an example of Swift. It's not so much a quick fix as it is naming the actions.

If it's actually too complicated for you, then I suppose there's nothing wrong with removing them, but I don't see the complication. Swift: 1 per round, during your turn. Immediate: 1 per round, any time. Free: as much as you want (within reason).
baalzamon999
05-11-05, 09:05 AM Tethka:
1: Simplicity is important, and the more fun your game is, the better. So your desicions are best if the make it more fun. I agree with both you and HailSpork, but simplicity is important (did I already say that?)

2: Yes, I also can agree with that. In White Wolf's World of Darkness game, there is no "Alertness" skill, it is a roll based purely on attributes (namely Wits and Composure). I can see your reasoning there.

Good luck with the game, and have fun!
DragonWatcher
05-11-05, 09:25 AM Cost of Living
Each month characters need to deduct 30 gold pieces from their total money. This represents cost of living expenses such has food, shelter, maintenance of items, research, travel, etc.

While I agree that this adds a level of realism to the game, it seems to me that there are three potential problems with using this rule:

1. At low levels (unless you're a really generous DM), 30 gp can be hard to come by, and it could really get in the way of the characters buying the equipment that they need to complete an adventure.

2. At high levels 30 gp isn't even worth tracking as adventurers tend to find large stashes of treasure, and more valuable items that they can easily sell.

3. At any level this adds another thing that everyone will have to worry about taking care of, which just takes time and energy away from the game.

To me, I game in part to forget about the mundane aspects of daily life, and I really don't want to have to be reminded to pay my bills in character as well. That said, I think that if the characters want to buy a home as a base of operations, or build one, then they should have to spend the cash. However, if they're constantly traveling, they're already paying for inns, meals, rations, et al anyhow.

If you've already thought of all this, though, and want to do it anyhow... then I don't think that it will inherently break anything. I just think that it's an unnecessary distraction from the meat of your game. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Tethka 05-10-05, 10:58 AM	Please take a moment to look over my house rules I plan to use in my future campaign. Please just give me your opinions, balancing issues or errors. Thank you. Mythgar D&D House Rules Books used (ver. 3.5) Players Handbook {PHB}, Dungeon Masters Guide {DMG}, Monster Manual 1 & 2 {MM1 & MM2}, Complete Adventurer {ADV}, Complete Arcane {ARC}, Complete Divine {DIV}, Complete Warrior {WAR} and Arms & Equipment Guide {AEG}. A number following the books abbreviation is the page number in that book. Multi-classed & Prestige Class Characters Players may have a character with a maximum of two core classes, but multi-class penalties may apply (see PHB 60 under Uneven Levels). Favored Classes have been revised from the Players Handbook, see below for favored class listing. Characters may have any number of prestige classes as long as they meet the requirements. Favored Classes Multi-classed characters may be any combination of two core classes, however a -20% experience point penalty may apply when experience points are given out. To avoid the penalty, characters of a race listed below may take one of the favored classes listed beside that race. Dwarf - Cleric, Fighter Elf - Ranger, Wizard Gnome - Bard, Druid Halfling - Rogue, Spirit Shaman Human - Any Half-Elf - Any Half-Orc - Barbarian, Sorcerer Character Generation {DMG 169} All ability scores start at 8. Take 30 points to spread out among all abilities. The point cost for each ability is listed below. No ability score can be below 8 or above 18 at this point. After ability scores have been done, players may (optional) subtract 2 from one ability score and add 1 to another. This may only be done once and no ability score can be below 6 or above 19 at this point. After which racial adjustments to ability scores are added. Character Hit Points To simplify the recording of hit points, each character class has a fixed number of hit points they receive each level (they do not roll for hit points). At first and second level a character will get maximum hit points per level according to their class Hit Die (plus constitution modifier and feats). At 3rd level and higher the character gets half their maximum hit points per level according to the class Hit Die (plus constitution modifier and feats). Variant Rules Actions: Immediate & Swift {ADV & ARC} Immediate and Swift actions that are described in the Complete Adventurer and Complete Arcane books are not used in Mythgar. These actions are changed to standard or free actions where applied. Casting Defensively {DMG 140} Spell casting in Mythgar is more difficult than other D&D worlds. The power of magic both arcane and divine is harder to control. So casting defensively is as follows: DC 15 + spell level +2 per additional threatening opponent beyond the first. Tiny size and smaller opponents only threaten squares they occupy and count as only one opponent in that square. A natural roll of 1 while making a concentration check when casting defensively is always a failure. Cost of Living Each month characters need to deduct 30 gold pieces from their total money. This represents cost of living expenses such has food, shelter, maintenance of items, research, travel, etc. Critical miss (fumble) Combat is chaotic and sometimes a nasty hit is made (critical hit) and sometimes a nasty mistake is made (fumble). If a natural 1 is rolled during an attack, roll a fumble check. This is a d20 + Dexterity modifier. The DC is 10. If successful, nothing happens and that attack is just a miss. If failed, the attacker gets no actions or movement during his next round, but he may still defend himself (dodge bonuses etc.) and use free actions. The attacker may still do remaining attacks or move actions during the round he fumbled. Any additional natural 1 rolled by the fumbling character in the same turn is just a miss. Skills: Listen & Spot {PHB} The Listen skill and Spot skill are equally accessible to every class, therefore these two skills are class skills for every class. Toughness Feat {PHB 101} & Improved Toughness Feat {WAR 101} Toughness [General] You are tougher than normal. Benefit: You gain a number of hit points equal to your current Hit Dice. Each time you gain a HD (such as by gaining a level), you gain 1 additional hit point. If you lose a HD (such as losing a level), you lose one hit point permanently. Special: Toughness can only be taken once. Improved Toughness [General] You are significantly tougher than normal. Prerequisite: Toughness, Base Fortitude save bonus +2. Benefit: You gain a number of hit points equal to your current Hit Dice. Each time you gain a HD (such as by gaining a level), you gain 1 additional hit point. If you lose a HD (such as losing a level), you lose one hit point permanently. Special: Improved Toughness feat stacks with Toughness feat. For example, if you have Toughness and Improved Toughness you would gain 2 additional hit points each time you gain a HD. If you lose a HD, you lose 2 hit points permanently. Improved Toughness can only be taken once. A fighter may select Improved Toughness as one of his fighter bonus feats.
baalzamon999 05-10-05, 02:03 PM	Cool, but I just have two things to say. 1: Why remove immediate and swift actions? 2: Why the Spot and Listen? Some classes are just more adept at alertness. There was a thread covered about class skills such as these and Move Silently and Hide.
Ra-Tiel 05-10-05, 04:32 PM	Hi. === @Tethka: Please take a moment to look over my house rules I plan to use in my future campaign. Please just give me your opinions, balancing issues or errors. Thank you. OK.. so let's see... Everthing seems fine, but one thing. This one here: [...] Critical miss (fumble) Combat is chaotic and sometimes a nasty hit is made (critical hit) and sometimes a nasty mistake is made (fumble). If a natural 1 is rolled during an attack, roll a fumble check. This is a d20 + Dexterity modifier. The DC is 10. If successful, nothing happens and that attack is just a miss. If failed, the attacker gets no actions or movement during his next round, but he may still defend himself (dodge bonuses etc.) and use free actions. The attacker may still do remaining attacks or move actions during the round he fumbled. Any additional natural 1 rolled by the fumbling character in the same turn is just a miss. [...] Please consider to read this. Are you really sure you want to keep that house rule? Consider it carefully. === Greetings, _Ra-Tiel.
Tethka 05-10-05, 11:00 PM	Cool, but I just have two things to say. 1: Why remove immediate and swift actions? 2: Why the Spot and Listen? Some classes are just more adept at alertness. There was a thread covered about class skills such as these and Move Silently and Hide. 1. The immediate and swift action was introduced in the Complete Arcane and used often in the Complete Adventurer book. These actions are not mentioned or used in the Complete Warrior & Divine and especially in the PHB. To me this feels like a quick fix or after thought rule that would need to be inserted into the books that do not have such a rule. I found this addtional rule to complicate the rules of actions, since you can use free (limit 1 per round) or standard actions just fine for the spells and other things that use immediate or swift actions. 2. IMHO Listen & Spot skills are more of a 'natural' skill than a 'learned' skill, also these two skills are used more than any other skill during a usual game session (at least in our group). Of course one can increase their skill by adding ranks, but I don't see why some classes should be limited by cross-class skill with these skills. I hope this explains why I would like this house rules, however if you think that my reply is flawed, please let me know why. I thank you for your post baalzamon999. :)
Tethka 05-10-05, 11:13 PM	Hi. === @Tethka: OK.. so let's see... Everthing seems fine, but one thing. This one here: Please consider to read this. Are you really sure you want to keep that house rule? Consider it carefully. === Greetings, _Ra-Tiel. I have read the post by chocobochicken and found it to be very interesting. I wanted to use the 'fumble' rule to balance the critical hit and to add a realistic feel to the game. After reading the thread however, I may need to reconsider for I see that it would hurt the characters more as they advance and that does not seem right. Thank you Ra-Tiel for that reference, I will certainly consider it. :)
HailSpork 05-10-05, 11:57 PM	1. The immediate and swift action was introduced in the Complete Arcane and used often in the Complete Adventurer book. These actions are not mentioned or used in the Complete Warrior & Divine and especially in the PHB. To me this feels like a quick fix or after thought rule that would need to be inserted into the books that do not have such a rule. I found this addtional rule to complicate the rules of actions, since you can use free (limit 1 per round) or standard actions just fine for the spells and other things that use immediate or swift actions. Actually, it was in Miniature's Handbook before Complete Arcane and in Expanded Psionicists Handbook before that (which, btw, predates Complete Divine). Anyway, when it was added is kind of irrelevent to their use. Even before that, Swift and Immediate actions are used, they just aren't named as such. Feather Fall is a perfect example of an Immediate Action. Quicken spell is an example of Swift. It's not so much a quick fix as it is naming the actions. If it's actually too complicated for you, then I suppose there's nothing wrong with removing them, but I don't see the complication. Swift: 1 per round, during your turn. Immediate: 1 per round, any time. Free: as much as you want (within reason).
baalzamon999 05-11-05, 09:05 AM	Tethka: 1: Simplicity is important, and the more fun your game is, the better. So your desicions are best if the make it more fun. I agree with both you and HailSpork, but simplicity is important (did I already say that?) 2: Yes, I also can agree with that. In White Wolf's World of Darkness game, there is no "Alertness" skill, it is a roll based purely on attributes (namely Wits and Composure). I can see your reasoning there. Good luck with the game, and have fun!
DragonWatcher 05-11-05, 09:25 AM	Cost of Living Each month characters need to deduct 30 gold pieces from their total money. This represents cost of living expenses such has food, shelter, maintenance of items, research, travel, etc. While I agree that this adds a level of realism to the game, it seems to me that there are three potential problems with using this rule: 1. At low levels (unless you're a really generous DM), 30 gp can be hard to come by, and it could really get in the way of the characters buying the equipment that they need to complete an adventure. 2. At high levels 30 gp isn't even worth tracking as adventurers tend to find large stashes of treasure, and more valuable items that they can easily sell. 3. At any level this adds another thing that everyone will have to worry about taking care of, which just takes time and energy away from the game. To me, I game in part to forget about the mundane aspects of daily life, and I really don't want to have to be reminded to pay my bills in character as well. That said, I think that if the characters want to buy a home as a base of operations, or build one, then they should have to spend the cash. However, if they're constantly traveling, they're already paying for inns, meals, rations, et al anyhow. If you've already thought of all this, though, and want to do it anyhow... then I don't think that it will inherently break anything. I just think that it's an unnecessary distraction from the meat of your game. :)