Post/Author/DateTime	Post
JaronK 05-02-07, 08:06 PM	I'm really liking the Binder thing. However, since Binders aren't supported much past Tome of Magic, there are very few Vestiges available... 28 or so I think, in total, including a few from Dragon magazine. There are, however, guidelines for how to create new Vestiges, given in an article on the D&D website in the design section (see here: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dd/20060324a ). The basic balance points are as follos: At-will or constant abilities a binder gains should be about as powerful as what a warlock of the same level can accomplish. (See Complete Arcane for a description of the warlock.) Abilities with the 5-round delay should be about as useful and powerful as the highest-level spell a wizard of the same level as the binder can cast (assuming the vestige grants just one such ability.) If the vestige grants more than one such ability, you’ll need to scale both powers down. A good rule of thumb is to lower the effective spell level by one for each additional 5-round-delay ability that the vestige grants. Abilities that grant a feature from another class, such as sneak attack or sudden strike, should be slightly behind what a character of that class gains. I've also noticed that generally, all vestiges follow a theme, but the abilities of any one vestige aren't usually very synergistic... they do very different things. With that in mind, I've got an idea for a Vestige... tell me what you think: Nicomas, the Undying. Legend: Nicomas was a powerful necromancer, and very afraid of vanishing. As such, he studied how to become a lich, that he might live forever. However, he learned too much about lichdom, and realized that while it would preserve his body, it would also stagnate his soul, such that he would not truly be alive. He was now afraid of being either dead or undead. As such, as his life was ending, he devised a powerful spell to prevent his becoming either. He assumed incorrectly that by being unable to die and unable to be undead, he would have to remain the only other option, alive. Instead, however, he faded into a fourth option, existance as a Vestige. Influence: While bound to Nicomas you are intensely interested in methods of continued existance. Any time you come upon an outsider or abberation with a lifespan of greater than 1000 years, you must spend a standard action to study it before doing anything else. Sign: Those bound to Nicomas have eyes that are jet black and seem to be looking directly at anyone gazing upon them. Granted Powers: March of the Dead: You may animate a single corpse as though you have cast the Animate Dead spell, following all the usual rules for that spell, with your caster level being equal to your effective binder level. This being is under your control, as per the spell, and counts towards your limit of animated undead. Once you have used this ability, you cannot use it again for another 5 rounds. Deathlight: To your eyes, undead shine like light sources, allowing you to see. This light is not visible to anyone else. Undead of 6HD or less cast light like a torch. Undead of 7-12HD shine like a lantern. Undead of 13 or more HD shine like a daylight spell cast from their location. Deathward: You are continually protected from Death effects. As animate dead is a 3rd level cleric spell, and thus could be cast by a 5th level character, I figure this should count as a 3rd level vestige, available to a 5th level binder. Deathlight is actually nearly identical to a feat that's undead only called "Lifesight" that does almost the same thing, except that living people glow instead of undead. Deathward is a useful and characterful ability, but a bit rare to actually come up. Anyway, some details need to be ironed out, but what do you think? JaronK
JaronK 05-03-07, 05:18 PM	Hmm. No responses. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? Anyway, I'll throw out another one I've been playing with: Vulnan Legend: Vulnan was an incredible dwarven craftsman, known far and wide for his inventive creations and the quality of his work. He lived inside his workshop, which itself was a maze of tools and partially created machines. When asked to create anything, he would disappear deep within the maze, returning only when the device was finished. It seemed he could create absolutely anything. One day, a dwarven prince decided to challenge his abilities. He asked Vulnan to create a machine that, without the aide of magic, could run forever. Vulnan disappeared into his laboratory, and was never heard from again. Special Requirement: Vulnan can only work with skilled hands. He will only answer the call of a binder with at least 5 ranks in any one craft skill. Influence: Vulnan was a tinkerer, and always wanted to know how things worked. If you find a trap, you must at least attempt to disable it or trigger it... you cannot go around it. Sign: While you are bound to Vulnan, your hands seem to be made of iron. Granted Powers: Knowledgeable Craftsman: While bound to Vulnan, you gain a +5 bonus to all Craft checks and Disable Device checks. Right Tool for the Job: While bound to Vulnan you can, as a standard action, create a tool out of thin air. This counts as a masterwork tool (+2 Circumstance bonus to the skill it's used for). The tool vanishes if it leaves your person. Eyes of the Master Builder: You gain the trapfinding ability, as well as a +5 bonus to all search checks when searching for traps or secret doors. Vestige Level: 2. Knowledgeable craftsman is roughly equivalent to a casting of the Magecraft Spell. Right tool for the Job, I'm not sure, but it doesn't seem terribly powerful... Eyes of the Master Builder likewise is a +5 bonus and thus roughly equivalent to a 1st or 2nd level spell. Thoughts? JaronK
Soel Griffin 05-04-07, 04:07 AM	Always nice to have more vestiges. I especially dig Nicomas. Here's a link for homebrew vestiges. Lots to look at. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=606718
Vashwood 05-05-07, 01:41 AM	Heh, I kinda like it ... it lacks the outright insanity of the original ToM vestiges, but then, it's hard to tap into that level of insanity. Work up some kind of wierd appearance for when you summon him, and maybe flesh out the backstory a bit. You should prolly explain that he liked to tinker and such, rather than letting them infer from the special requirements and such. This guy lacks the rather ambiguous feel that the original vestiges had (his past feels a bit more certain, I guess) but all in all not bad.
Deper 05-05-07, 11:34 AM	Nicomas, the Undying. Influence: While bound to Nicomas you are intensely interested in methods of continued existance. Any time you come upon an outsider or abberation with a lifespan of greater than 1000 years, you must spend a standard action to study it before doing anything else. It's highly unlikely that this influence will ever come into play. You might want to pick something out. Granted Powers: March of the Dead: You may animate a single corpse as though you have cast the Animate Dead spell, following all the usual rules for that spell, with your caster level being equal to your effective binder level. This being is under your control, as per the spell, and counts towards your limit of animated undead. Once you have used this ability, you cannot use it again for another 5 rounds. This should be limited to a number of times per day, like Karsus's dispel magic touch, only I would limit it to 1 per day per 4 binder levels since it can do damage. Also, each undead should only last as long as you are bound to Nicomas. Deathlight: To your eyes, undead shine like light sources, allowing you to see. This light is not visible to anyone else. Undead of 6HD or less cast light like a torch. Undead of 7-12HD shine like a lantern. Undead of 13 or more HD shine like a daylight spell cast from their location. Seems ok, but you'd be better off to just give him an area that he can perfectly detect undead in, as per the spell. Deathward: You are continually protected from Death effects. Fine. 5th level might work for this vestige, though I would consider bumping it up to 6th just to be sure. Vulnan Special Requirement: Vulnan can only work with skilled hands. He will only answer the call of a binder with at least 5 ranks in any one craft skill. Influence: Vulnan was a tinkerer, and always wanted to know how things worked. If you find a trap, you must at least attempt to disable it or trigger it... you cannot go around it. Granted Powers: Knowledgeable Craftsman: While bound to Vulnan, you gain a +5 bonus to all Craft checks and Disable Device checks. Right Tool for the Job: While bound to Vulnan you can, as a standard action, create a tool out of thin air. This counts as a masterwork tool (+2 Circumstance bonus to the skill it's used for). The tool vanishes if it leaves your person. The tool should be normal for the first few levels. Make it masterwork after they reach say, level 5. Eyes of the Master Builder: You gain the trapfinding ability, as well as a +5 bonus to all search checks when searching for traps or secret doors. Looks good. Oh, and they have been supporting Pact Magic. You might want to check out the following links. Two City Vestiges (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070307a) Three Psionic Vestiges (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070119a) One Draconic Vestige (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=products/dndacc/953837200)
Pyrolocutus 05-05-07, 12:13 PM	Seems ok, but you'd be better off to just give him an area that he can perfectly detect undead in, as per the spell. I think the intent is to use undead to be able to see in darkness, more than detecting them. The vestiges look pretty nifty!
Deper 05-05-07, 12:37 PM	I think the intent is to use undead to be able to see in darkness, more than detecting them. The vestiges look pretty nifty! I realize that, but it's a clunky mechanic that is going to get a lot of confusion in play, and basically makes it almost impossible for most undead to actually hide, so it goes far beyond just showing where they are. EDIT: Deathlight gives you Detect Undead (3 round) with no maximum range or need to concentrate, plus a situational darkvision that allows you to see colour (which is better than darkvision). Also, it shouldn't be available unless you are showing Nicomas's sign.
Millennium 05-05-07, 01:34 PM	Before Dragon Magic and Cityscape, there were 33 vestiges counting the ones from Dragon. I remember this, because the flavor of it was awesome: Dahlver-Nar is said to have used all of the Teeth that existed in his day, and if his Tooth was the 33rd then no human would ever be able to use them all again (the human mouth has 32 teeth). With Dragon Magic and Cityscape, I believe the number is now 36.
Deper 05-05-07, 05:47 PM	Before Dragon Magic and Cityscape, there were 33 vestiges counting the ones from Dragon. I remember this, because the flavor of it was awesome: Dahlver-Nar is said to have used all of the Teeth that existed in his day, and if his Tooth was the 33rd then no human would ever be able to use them all again (the human mouth has 32 teeth). With Dragon Magic and Cityscape, I believe the number is now 36. 39. You're forgetting the three psionic vestiges. I linked to them in a previous post.
Phoenix00 01-31-08, 04:18 PM	I know this thread is old and (this is necromancy), but I like the vestige JaronK made and I found it when looking at other old binder threads. ---- This should be limited to a number of times per day, like Karsus's dispel magic touch, only I would limit it to 1 per day per 4 binder levels since it can do damage. Also, each undead should only last as long as you are bound to Nicomas. March of the Dead: I would consider this bind to be a 6th lvl vestige. The reason why is that it is more or less at will, since you use the ability out of combat but then bring it in the combat the next battle. And I agree with Deper that the undead should only be under your control as long as you are bound to Nicomas Deathlight gives you Detect Undead (3 round) with no maximum range or need to concentrate, plus a situational darkvision that allows you to see colour (which is better than darkvision). Also, it shouldn't be available unless you are showing Nicomas's sign. I agree with this revised ability as well. Deathward: You are continually protected from Death effects. Is fine That is only 3 granted abilities, you need 1 more. Probably something related to skills, or some form of nonpassive form of attack.
JaronK 01-31-08, 04:57 PM	I should mention that my intent with March of the Dead was for it to have a cost in Onyxs, like the Animate Dead spell. This makes it reasonably balanced. Furthermore, when you stop binding Nicomas for more than 10 minutes, you lose control of the undead you created as though they were released normally. This lets you rebind him to keep your army up if you so desire for multiple days. Basically, it's like actually casting Animate Dead, with the advantage that you can do it whenever you come across a corpse, but the disadvantage that it takes a lot longer to create a decent number of undead (since it's single target only). Deathlight is just mimicking a feat, and yes, it makes it very easy for you to see the undead. It also lets you use your own controlled undead as hands free torches... very nifty! Perhaps this should be a 4th level vestige though, since Animate Dead is 4th level for casters. JaronK