Pally is a downer [Archive] - Wizards Community

Pally is a downer [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
zephyrTR
07-30-07, 12:31 PM I started up a new campaign yesterday and my pally didn't seem to be having much fun. Ive seen people post about how pally is kinda lackluster so I thought I'd ask how people try to rejuvenate the class.

I allow the 4 kinds of pallies outlined in UA, this pally is CG. I just don't know how to approach making this class funner.
bobothechimp
07-30-07, 12:46 PM One of my main problems with the Paladin is how it is simply not as good as other classes, same as the Ranger. They get full BAB, but their class abilities aren't much of a help in combat. You only get a few uses of Smite Evil per day, and Favored Enemy hardly ever comes into play. A Cleric is better than a Paladin at everything Paladins do, just as Druids are better than Rangers at everything Rangers do.

The way I tried to fix this was to, among other things, reduce Cleric and Druid spellcasting progression to that of a Bard. To fill in the spellcasting roles, I added Priest and Shaman classes, with worse hit dice, poor BAB, less combat-related abilites, and worse saves than the originals, but with full spellcasting. This has helped in my group, getting people to actually play Paladins or Rangers sometimes, instead of Clerics or Druids.
Warweaver
07-31-07, 11:26 PM One fix that has worked wonders in my game is changing the Paladin's Smite ability to per-encounter, rather than per-day. It's a fairly common Paladin fix.
Arcane Guyver
08-01-07, 12:47 AM I started up a new campaign yesterday and my pally didn't seem to be having much fun...I just don't know how to approach making this class funner.

Just curious, what about the class wasn't 'much fun' for the player?

At any rate, my suggested changes to the Paladin is using the 'Holy Warrior' variant from Complete Champion, the 'Divine Spirit' variant from Dungeonscape, and toss in all but the 'Heal Mount' abilities from the spell-less Paladin variant in Complete Warrior for free. Not that any of this is necessary to have fun with the paladin, but it really *fits* my idea of what the class should be like.

Oh yeah, since this is a holy liberator-style CG paladin variant, you might want to try the 'Curse Breaker' variant from Complete Mage. Just sounds like a good match, flavor-wise.
ShinoAburame
08-01-07, 01:53 AM Some interesting and not tottaly game-breaking ways to improve the paladin.

Good fortitude saves. (It makes sense being a warrior type class)

Can use smite evil 1/day per paladin level. (This is like 4x the amount they normaly could, and not every encounter is evil)

Smite evil can be used on ranged attacks. (For more versatility)

Try those out and see how it plansout. If it makes the game to uneven in your favor, they can blame me.
The_Hedgewizard
08-01-07, 12:55 PM These are the changes I made to the paladin class:

-Good Fortitude *and* Will saves.
-Turns Undead as a cleric of equal level (not three levels lower).
-Extra damage from smiting evil is divine damage.
-Can cast Remove Fear an equal number of times per week as Remove Disease.
-Gains tower shield proficiency as a fighter does.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
zephyrTR 07-30-07, 12:31 PM	I started up a new campaign yesterday and my pally didn't seem to be having much fun. Ive seen people post about how pally is kinda lackluster so I thought I'd ask how people try to rejuvenate the class. I allow the 4 kinds of pallies outlined in UA, this pally is CG. I just don't know how to approach making this class funner.
bobothechimp 07-30-07, 12:46 PM	One of my main problems with the Paladin is how it is simply not as good as other classes, same as the Ranger. They get full BAB, but their class abilities aren't much of a help in combat. You only get a few uses of Smite Evil per day, and Favored Enemy hardly ever comes into play. A Cleric is better than a Paladin at everything Paladins do, just as Druids are better than Rangers at everything Rangers do. The way I tried to fix this was to, among other things, reduce Cleric and Druid spellcasting progression to that of a Bard. To fill in the spellcasting roles, I added Priest and Shaman classes, with worse hit dice, poor BAB, less combat-related abilites, and worse saves than the originals, but with full spellcasting. This has helped in my group, getting people to actually play Paladins or Rangers sometimes, instead of Clerics or Druids.
Warweaver 07-31-07, 11:26 PM	One fix that has worked wonders in my game is changing the Paladin's Smite ability to per-encounter, rather than per-day. It's a fairly common Paladin fix.
Arcane Guyver 08-01-07, 12:47 AM	I started up a new campaign yesterday and my pally didn't seem to be having much fun...I just don't know how to approach making this class funner. Just curious, what about the class wasn't 'much fun' for the player? At any rate, my suggested changes to the Paladin is using the 'Holy Warrior' variant from Complete Champion, the 'Divine Spirit' variant from Dungeonscape, and toss in all but the 'Heal Mount' abilities from the spell-less Paladin variant in Complete Warrior for free. Not that any of this is necessary to have fun with the paladin, but it really fits my idea of what the class should be like. Oh yeah, since this is a holy liberator-style CG paladin variant, you might want to try the 'Curse Breaker' variant from Complete Mage. Just sounds like a good match, flavor-wise.
ShinoAburame 08-01-07, 01:53 AM	Some interesting and not tottaly game-breaking ways to improve the paladin. Good fortitude saves. (It makes sense being a warrior type class) Can use smite evil 1/day per paladin level. (This is like 4x the amount they normaly could, and not every encounter is evil) Smite evil can be used on ranged attacks. (For more versatility) Try those out and see how it plansout. If it makes the game to uneven in your favor, they can blame me.
The_Hedgewizard 08-01-07, 12:55 PM	These are the changes I made to the paladin class: -Good Fortitude and Will saves. -Turns Undead as a cleric of equal level (not three levels lower). -Extra damage from smiting evil is divine damage. -Can cast Remove Fear an equal number of times per week as Remove Disease. -Gains tower shield proficiency as a fighter does.