Post/Author/DateTime	Post
DrKultra 03-30-04, 05:19 PM	Hmmmm, it has come to my mind his little thing.... In Dragon 318 there was a variant ninja who gets Sudden strike every Odd level, now my question is.. If one were to go Rouge20//Fighter1/Ninja19 Would one have +20d6 per strike? Since thecnically, you ARE getting the best advancment (whoa, this brings memories of the Wiz/Sorc with +20 BAB) Just a question that has been going around my head.
jagggar 03-30-04, 09:17 PM	Great, now I've got an urge to make a Gestalt Ninja/______ that's a pirate. Funny how a ninja would make a good pirate. . . I'd probably say no. If I was being really lenient I'd say only under the conditions which the Sudden Strike is usable, not when a rogue Sneak Attack is.
Veton 03-30-04, 09:26 PM	Originally posted by DrKultra Hmmmm, it has come to my mind his little thing.... In Dragon 318 there was a variant ninja who gets Sudden strike every Odd level, now my question is.. If one were to go Rouge20//Fighter1/Ninja19 Would one have +20d6 per strike? Depends on what Sudden Strike is. If it's just like sneak attack, I'd say no. Since thecnically, you ARE getting the best advancment (whoa, this brings memories of the Wiz/Sorc with +20 BAB) How? You would use the best BAB, which is 1/2 of either the Sorcerer or Wizard level (doesn't really matter). You don't use both.
jagggar 03-30-04, 09:38 PM	The Wiz/Sorc arguement was if you took Wiz/Fighter first level, then Wiz/Sorc after that you'd end up with a +20 because you'd get +1 from the fighter, at second level the Wiz would go up by +1, third Sorc +1 and so on until you had a character with +20. It took the actual bonuses though, not the progression like the book says. Sudden Strike is like Sneak Attack, but only usable when the target would be denied its Dex bonus to AC. It says, "Sudden attack's extra damage dice stack with those from sneak attack whenever both would apply to the same target."
Part-Human2 03-31-04, 11:17 AM	Originally posted by jagggar The Wiz/Sorc arguement was if you took Wiz/Fighter first level, then Wiz/Sorc after that you'd end up with a +20 because you'd get +1 from the fighter, at second level the Wiz would go up by +1, third Sorc +1 and so on until you had a character with +20. It took the actual bonuses though, not the progression like the book says. Which is dumb because that's not what Gestalt says. It says the better progression. The Ftr1/Wiz 19 is +10 BAB; the Sor 20 is +10 BAB so the best one is only +10 BAB. Originally posted by jagggar Sudden Strike is like Sneak Attack, but only usable when the target would be denied its Dex bonus to AC. It says, "Sudden attack's extra damage dice stack with those from sneak attack whenever both would apply to the same target." Hrm, technically I guess it does stack. I think many DM's might rule otherwise though.
silarrow 03-31-04, 06:58 PM	For BAB, you really should use the fractional BAB varient rule (for the life of me I can't find the page right now). It would make it so each Sorcerer/Wizard level would only give you 1/2 BAB, making that combo much less broken As for sneak-attack thing, I as a DM would rule that any bonus dice to attack roll damage (theirs alot of them), cap out. The maximum dice should be something like 1/2 your charcter level, rounded up. Gestalt charcters are supposed to round out charcters, give them alittle more omph. Just as a gestalt charcter should never get to cast their spell levesl early, they shoulden't get crazy specials early
JoAT 03-31-04, 09:32 PM	I'd say tinker with the class - this is one of those situations where not everything can be play-tested together, or even thought of as mixing. In place of the sudden strike ability, maybe some bonus feats or something - I know that it's a seperate ability, with a (semi-)seperate progression (just as I argue anything that gives bonus feats are), but it's also something of a cheese-fest. To be honest, unless there was something specific about the class that is needed for the character (like those cool ki-powers...), I'd say just give up on the ninja and go for a rogue/monk - same basic result, in most ways, less tinkering required.
DrKultra 03-31-04, 10:00 PM	Ninja offers lots of Nifty abilities >_> I was asking, because it was brough to my attention. So, should they stack only when Sudden Strike CAN be used (as I tought before) or should I rule something otherwise?
jagggar 03-31-04, 11:36 PM	Must love the ki pool. . . I actually think a Monk built like the Ninja would be interesting. If you wanna be "safe," say they don't stack. If you're running a high-powered campaign (well, even higher than Gestalt) and feel comfortable with it, let it stack.
Bluebrush 04-01-04, 11:00 AM	I'd say they don't stack. Sudden strike is basically an inferior sneak attack, so I'd rule the sneak attack dice override the sudden strike. Remember that even for gestalt classes hit dice do not stack and an extra effective dice of sudden strike for every level would be very poweful. Especially with a ninja's invisibility ability. (Note: In the Dragon article, it does say sudden strike stacks with sneak attack, but I think with this much potential for damage, that needs to be houseruled away. Since you're already using gestault characters, that's presumably not a problem.)
stone_dog 04-01-04, 03:38 PM	Originally posted by Bluebrush (Note: In the Dragon article, it does say sudden strike stacks with sneak attack, but I think with this much potential for damage, that needs to be houseruled away. Since you're already using gestault characters, that's presumably not a problem.) Yes, I'd say the two only stack in terms of standard multiclassing. For a gestalt character you just can't get more than 10 dice of sneak attack no matter what.