tell me your exp./opinions on gestalts [Archive] - Wizards Community

tell me your exp./opinions on gestalts [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
oberyn
12-23-04, 02:33 AM hello everyone i would like to use gestalts in my game but i have to convince my players of good aspects and possibly figure out how to balance out bad issues so i can get them to agree to it. i dont want to force them into anything so please help me
Morwen
12-23-04, 05:22 AM The gestalt character option is good for small groups (2-3 players) that still want to have a good mix of classes within the group. For instance, you could have a Fighter/Cleric and a Wizard/Rogue, providing all the "core" classes for a 2-person party. It is also good if you want a high-powered campaign (with 4+ players).

One bad aspect of gestalt is that it could quickly turn troublesome for the DM to provide proper challenges for the PCs, especially in the case of 4+ players. Some classes work pretty well together with others (for instance, Fighter/Cleric to provide a hard-hitting yet hard-to-hit PC), and adjusting CRs down by 1-2 won't necessarily fix that problem.
Lord_Anthrax
12-23-04, 09:30 AM The biggest thing I've noticed about gestalts is endurance. A gestalt character can exhaust his abilities in one class and still have everything in his second to draw upon. This is especially true of dual spellcasters, who can load up and fling death all day long without even touching items.
Luminosity
12-24-04, 07:52 AM Be very careful with templates. They're balanced to be offset by a loss in HD, but that's negated in gestalt.
Annaylli
12-24-04, 09:47 AM We've been using Gestalts since spring.

A few things that will simplify things:
1. Limit the number of classes you can take in any combination. We cap it at 4 (no more than 4 different classes and no more than 3 different core classes). That might be a little low but that's what we're running with now.

2. Use fractional saves and BAB. Only grant the +2 bonus for a good save once per category (Will, Fort, Reflex). At each level you have either a Good, Moderate or Poor BAB and a Good or Poor save. This means that no matter what at 20th all BABs are between +20 and +10, and all base saves are +12 to +6. The first temptation for gestalt was to build up monster saves.

3. Ban all prestige classes that are really combinations of classes already. Eldritch Knight, Mystic Theurge, Arcane Trickster, Geomancer, Enlightened Fist, etc. This is right in the description of Gestalt. We also limit which new or optional base classes are allowed (cloistered cleric is the main one).
strenoth
12-24-04, 12:08 PM well, from yoru list, I wouldn;t ban Geomancer. Unlike MT, it doesn;t grant dual caster progression, and much like spellsword, it grants unique abilites the other classes do not have. so just because it rquires two different classes doesn't mean it's one fo the classes that should be banned.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
oberyn 12-23-04, 02:33 AM	hello everyone i would like to use gestalts in my game but i have to convince my players of good aspects and possibly figure out how to balance out bad issues so i can get them to agree to it. i dont want to force them into anything so please help me
Morwen 12-23-04, 05:22 AM	The gestalt character option is good for small groups (2-3 players) that still want to have a good mix of classes within the group. For instance, you could have a Fighter/Cleric and a Wizard/Rogue, providing all the "core" classes for a 2-person party. It is also good if you want a high-powered campaign (with 4+ players). One bad aspect of gestalt is that it could quickly turn troublesome for the DM to provide proper challenges for the PCs, especially in the case of 4+ players. Some classes work pretty well together with others (for instance, Fighter/Cleric to provide a hard-hitting yet hard-to-hit PC), and adjusting CRs down by 1-2 won't necessarily fix that problem.
Lord_Anthrax 12-23-04, 09:30 AM	The biggest thing I've noticed about gestalts is endurance. A gestalt character can exhaust his abilities in one class and still have everything in his second to draw upon. This is especially true of dual spellcasters, who can load up and fling death all day long without even touching items.
Luminosity 12-24-04, 07:52 AM	Be very careful with templates. They're balanced to be offset by a loss in HD, but that's negated in gestalt.
Annaylli 12-24-04, 09:47 AM	We've been using Gestalts since spring. A few things that will simplify things: 1. Limit the number of classes you can take in any combination. We cap it at 4 (no more than 4 different classes and no more than 3 different core classes). That might be a little low but that's what we're running with now. 2. Use fractional saves and BAB. Only grant the +2 bonus for a good save once per category (Will, Fort, Reflex). At each level you have either a Good, Moderate or Poor BAB and a Good or Poor save. This means that no matter what at 20th all BABs are between +20 and +10, and all base saves are +12 to +6. The first temptation for gestalt was to build up monster saves. 3. Ban all prestige classes that are really combinations of classes already. Eldritch Knight, Mystic Theurge, Arcane Trickster, Geomancer, Enlightened Fist, etc. This is right in the description of Gestalt. We also limit which new or optional base classes are allowed (cloistered cleric is the main one).
strenoth 12-24-04, 12:08 PM	well, from yoru list, I wouldn;t ban Geomancer. Unlike MT, it doesn;t grant dual caster progression, and much like spellsword, it grants unique abilites the other classes do not have. so just because it rquires two different classes doesn't mean it's one fo the classes that should be banned.