Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Quithion 03-09-04, 03:04 PM	Do players and dms of the small races cosnider the quick trait a worthy trade off ? FOr refernece the jsut of it is that you gain +10 speed in exchange for -1 hp level I havea halfing rogue with run who has suprised many of her persuers by being able ot out run them. Giove me your thoughts Quithion
Wil_Hyral 03-09-04, 03:09 PM	It strikes me as worthless. I'd be more tempted if I had particularly higher rolls than usual, and was able to give my constitution a nice bonus. With standard array of scores, no I'd not take it. Not that level 9 is a given, but by level 9, movement itself isn't the same resource it used to be. Fly, teleport, incorporeality, dimensional door, stuff like that all sort of makes that extra 10' not worth it.
Quithion 03-09-04, 03:31 PM	Would your opinon of this trait change in a low magick world ? Currently, all spellcasting classes are pretigous except for divine classes.
Greyman 03-09-04, 05:14 PM	Yes, it depends on your style of play. The point of flaws and traits isn't to make your character more powerful. The main aim of their design was to ensure that they do not. Their purpose is to make the character more distinct; it's giving a mechanical effect to match the roleplay concept. Let's say you have two halfling rogues that, using a point buy, wind up with the much same statistics. However, yours is Quick while the other is Aggressive. The quick rogue uses his extra speed to stay away from melee (and he pretty much has to), while the agressive rogue quite recklessly rushes in; she takes more hits than ussual, but she dishes out more too. Now, you could just roleplay this without the trait mechanic, and you could model the difference just with strength, constitution, and dexterity scores. But the extra 10 feet of movement means that the quick character really is quicker than the average halfling.
Myztek 03-09-04, 07:09 PM	Movement is a key ability. I wory that the quick trait is too strong, not too weak. If you've played a monk, you may know what I mean when I say that giving up 1 hp/lvl is a great exchange for +10' movement. Ignoring the role playing aspects which should be your primary reason for taking the trait, this feat can upset intended balance rather easily. I won't tell the full story of my nezumi (40' base movement) ranger (+10' movement for longstrider spell) witht he quick trait (+10' movement), but I will say that if you (who have a 30' move and a run no higher than 120') run from him, he'll be able to keep up with you with charge (double 60' to 120' movement) attacks. For melee fighters, greater movement means getting to your foes faster and being able to circle around them to cut off their escape (or set up flanking for the rogue). I'm certainly happy with my choice to effectively go from a 16 con to a 14 con in exchange for +10' movement.
Myztek 03-09-04, 07:12 PM	Another quick point on the balance issue: Improved Toughness gives you +1 hp / lvl. Dash gives you +5' movement per level. Both are feats of supposed equal value. Thus, 5' move = +1 hp / lvl for balance purposes. But quick gives you +10' movement for 1 hp / lvl. Twice the value of dash.
DM Zoc 03-09-04, 10:22 PM	HP are only useful in combat, while speed is useful for avoiding combat. It seems a good trade-off. Besides, if you're getting hit, then you're doing something wrong.
Paraboombo 03-10-04, 02:36 PM	Actually, a constitution-based barbarian with this trait would be fun. *imagines a dwarf barbarian in medium armor moving at 40ft/round* A lot of fun.
Greyman 03-10-04, 07:17 PM	Originally posted by Myztek Another quick point on the balance issue: Improved Toughness gives you +1 hp / lvl. Dash gives you +5' movement per level. Both are feats of supposed equal value. Thus, 5' move = +1 hp / lvl for balance purposes. But quick gives you +10' movement for 1 hp / lvl. Twice the value of dash. This is, of course, assuming that Improved Toughness is balanced in the first place. :angel:
Wil_Hyral 03-10-04, 07:39 PM	Originally posted by Quithion Would your opinon of this trait change in a low magick world ? Yes. I mean even before level 9, the trait seems worth it. Just by the time teleport rolls around, it's seriously not about the foot per turn anymore. Offhand, I'd not ever spell magic with a k though. Pulling a rabbit out of a hat is just as magic as a fireball, as long as neither follow any known rules of physics.
Vaelan 03-11-04, 02:30 AM	If I remember correctly, Dash was not brought forward from 3.0 and Unearthed Arcana was primarily written for 3.5(although this is just speculation), thus the balance between the trait and similar Feats wasn't considered. As for the trait: If you need to run away from people, I would recommend it. If you are a small race, I would highly recommend it.
Nuclear_Cheetos 03-17-04, 11:56 AM	Dash only applies once, and only in light or no armor. Improved Toughness is perfectly fine the way it is, as is Quick (Assuming you aren't playing with a group that refuses to take low HP rolls).
Ancient Wyrm 03-17-04, 11:07 PM	Dash is in The Complete Warrior, isn't it? Yup, it is.
bitnine 03-18-04, 04:47 AM	Quick trait is good for gnomish barbarians, let me tell you.