Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Xabre 05-31-06, 08:23 AM	Once upon a time someone helped me make this... and I lost it. So here's what I need. The trait is called Blind From Birth. The downside: duh. Blind. The upside: The character has learned to compensate, granting acute other senses, allowing for better than normal other ways of detection. I want this for a cleric who's blind, but will be going the way of a Divination-heavy spellcaster/seer. Any help, mechanics-wise, would be greatly appreciated.
jagggar 05-31-06, 09:44 AM	Well, I'd say bonuses to Listen. Or hey *smacks forehead* Blind-Fight?
Xabre 05-31-06, 09:57 AM	Well that was crude. I was hoping for something a little less combat-oriented, and a little more universally effective than just 'remove some of the concealment miss chance'.
00_Whupass 05-31-06, 12:43 PM	Honestly I think blind-fight is the best option, maybe with a +2 to listen. Honestly though playing a permanently blind character is pretty unsuited to being a PC. It is likely, though it depends on the setting, that you would be entirely illiterate, braille isn't really suited to a middle age fantasy setting. You would have extreme difficulty adventuring, and would burden the party. Not that I don't think its a good concept, I mean who doesn't love Zatoichi, I just feel confident that you would be able to make it work.
Xabre 05-31-06, 01:00 PM	The setting is Helenic/Greek Mythology... the Olympus setting. This is what first got me thinking of the idea... the stereotypical blind Delphic Oracle. I had considered some form of trade... normal sight for some sort of more powerful, but more restrained mystical vision... sort of like the Blindfold of True Darkness or the warcraft Demon Hunter prestige class... but I needed it basic, level 1 style. As for combat... the character is, as mentioned... a cleric. Cloisered Cleric from UA, in fact.
Xeviat-DM 05-31-06, 02:16 PM	I don't have my books with me, so I can't really comment fully; I will do so when I get home tonight. Blindness comes with a host of penalties. Everything has total concealment, because you can't see. Your speed is reduced to half if I remember correctly, and you can't charge or run. Blindfight allows you to reroll the miss chance, but I don't remember if it helps the movement penalties at all. Blindsense could possibly be a valid trade off; it doesn't negate miss chances, it only pinpoints the square that targets are in. It doesn't negate the movement penalties, though. Remember, in the real world, there are blind people who have specifically trained themselves to echolocate. This could be a reasonably high listen DC, to make a click and listen for the echo. Thus, combined with the DC for pinpointing a target by exceeding their move silently check by 20 with your listen check, a "blind from birth" trait could just grant a fat listen bonus. But, I don't think that a "blind from birth" trait should do everything you want. Such a character should have to take a feat to gain the rest of their abilities; we're talking about exceptional amounts of training. To maintain balance, though, a blind character with said trait and said feat should be as powerful as another character with any other reasonable feat.
jagggar 05-31-06, 06:44 PM	Okay, let's look at the penalties you'd have being blinded: -2 AC Lose Dex bonus to AC (if any) Move at half speed -4 Search, and "most Strength- and Dexderity-based skill checks" Visual based stuff automatically fails (no reading, no Spot) All opponents have total concealment (50% miss chance) Now the main thing I was thinking about when I said Blind-Fight was the reduced movement penalty. Blind from birth, you aren't going to be stumbling around quite as much as someone who just had their lights shut-off. Likewise, even if you didn't want the better chance to hit, I'd think not having the AC penalties would still go well. If I was DM, you could probably talk me into slowly gaining mystical sight as you rose in levels, but you wouldn't start with it. Also, I think I recall seeing an oracle PrC on the boards that required you to put your own eyes out. Not sure you'd have to already being blind, but I can't say I recall where it was.
Xabre 06-01-06, 08:04 AM	Jaggar, I apologize for my earlier response. Seeing how you put it now, that does indeed make sense. Reading the SRD right now also has that last line 'Characters who remain blinded for a long time grow accustomed to these drawbacks and can overcome some of them'. So here's my first try at actually writing this trait: Blind From Birth Born blind, you have learned to overcome some of your handicap. Drawback: You are blind. See the PH for more details on this condition . Benefit: You gain a +4 to Listen checks, and may take 10 on Listen checks in any condition as a swift action. You are considered to have the Blindfight feat (and may use it for any prerequisites that require having the feat). I'm not sure if this is TOO powerful. Blindfight as a feat is decent... but it was never meant to stopgap true blindness, so I also threw in the Listen bonus.
jagggar 06-01-06, 11:13 AM	Nah, it's okay. I posted pretty quickly cause I had to go somewhere, so it does sound rather lousey without an explanation. Let's see where this puts us. . . +4 Listen checks. Able to take 10 on listen checks in any condition as a swift action. All opponents have total concealment (50% miss chance) but miss chance may be rolled twice (effectively only a 25% miss chance). Normal AC vs melee attacks. -2 AC, no Dex bonus to AC vs ranged attacks. Move at three-quarters normal speed. -4 Search, and "most Strength- and Dexderity-based skill checks" Nothing visual (no reading, no Spot). Character gains Blind-Fight as a bonus feat (benefits already shown above)
Xabre 06-01-06, 11:41 AM	Alright. Looking at this breakdown makes the trait seem DISGUSTINGLY complicated. However, I think alot of it is simply softening blindness, which I like. Plus the Listen bonus. As it stands right now, the character still has a good deal of penalties... but I think at this point it's at a playable level... it becomse a RP character obviously far more so than a combat one... and isn't hindered enough that I spend all my time posing walking into walls and such. What are other people's thoughts?