Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Lord Stigius 11-27-04, 06:38 PM	I'm one of the people who think that the sword-and-board style, as it stands, is underpowered. I have an idea of a houserule fix - criticism welcome. What if the benefits of Two Weapon Defense (and its improved versions) were applied to characters using a shield as off-hand weapon? The character would still need Two Weapon Fighting first, also the DEX requirement is an issue. Esentially, I'm going to change the bonus for Two Weapon Defense from 'shield bonus' to 'unnamed', allowing it to stack with regular shield bonus. Overpowered? But the character still has to get the feats, including TWF to start with, making this a feat fro high level characters, or fighters (these feats to spend). His damage potential still remains behind that of a character with, say, tho light weapons. Shield in general is not the best offensive weapon. Is this idea viable or wouldn't you touch it with a 10f. pole?
KmartKommando 11-28-04, 02:38 AM	Though I know the idea will be cut apart around here, I like it. Historically speaking, using a shield effectively was quite literally life or death. Combat Expertise can substitute for being defensive with a shield as well. But I say why should parrying with an offhand dagger be better than parrying with an actual shield? Kinda dumb, and the RAW starts to break down. Maybe there should be an errata, where Two Weapon Defense gives a competence bonus to AC. That actually makes the most sense, both in game terms and in real life examples. That way weilding a dagger is: +0 shield +1 competence = +1AC with a hvy shield it's: +2 shield +1 competence = +3AC Hmm, that gives me an idea for a new way of making a defending weapon: Dagger +1 = 2302gp +1 AC (Competence Bonus) = 1*1*2500 = 2500gp x 1.5 (multiple abilities) = 3750gp Effectively a +3 weapon for 6052gp :D It'd be even cheaper if you make a non-enhancement bonus dagger that gives AC only.
DwarvinJedi 11-28-04, 09:41 PM	one thing, that I saw sometime on the boards, was that when using a shield, combat expertise was a 2-for-1 deal, like PA with Two-handed weapons, personally I would also double the benefits from dodge.
Karui_Kage 11-29-04, 12:40 PM	Actually, just go with the feat Improved Shield Usage. It's something like that, and Im hoping someone can remember which book it was from, as it escapes me. There was an improved and a greater feat for it. They essentially just improved the AC by 1 and 2 respectively, I believe. Of course, I could just be insane. No idea.
Lord Stigius 12-01-04, 01:56 PM	Improved Shield Usage seems to be exactly what I've been looking for, I just didn't know that such a thing already exists, that's why I try to create somewhat similar with as little rule-twisting as possible. Maybe it's from Races of Stone? Probably not fromComplete Arcane, and these two books would be about all that I haven't got yet. I'm glad to see that the idea of making something for the sword-and-board style didn't get shredded to pieces - quite the opposite, it seems. Thanks for all replies!
MetalGemini 12-02-04, 01:10 AM	Races of Stone has Heavy Armor Optimization, but nothing for shields. I can't seem to find the feat either, but even if you can't find it, using the same principles as Heavy Armor Optimization would be fine IMHO. +1 to armor bonus and -1 armor check penalty. The ACP reduction isnt very important, but would be an added bonus for using the sword-n-board style.
He Who Shall Not Be Named 12-04-04, 06:06 AM	Originally posted by DwarvinJedi: one thing, that I saw sometime on the boards, was that when using a shield, combat expertise was a 2-for-1 deal, like PA with Two-handed weapons, personally I would also double the benefits from dodge. That's a good one, I've seen it used very well before. It's quite balanced, IMO. Originally posted by Lord Stigius: But the character still has to get the feats, including TWF to start with... As for your feat idea, I wouldn't say it's broken. In fact, there's no reason to make them need TWF. Just make three feats, identical to the TWD feats, for guys holding a one-handed weapon and a non-buckler shield. (Non-buckler to prevent the pesky buckler-wielding duelists, who have enuf AC already :rolleyes:) Make the prereq Exotic Shield Proficiency: Tower Shield, or Deflect Arrows. (Or CHA 15+, to make the :censored: stat useful...) :heehee: Just my two cents...