What about average damage? [Archive] - Wizards Community

What about average damage? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Bavix
12-17-06, 06:52 PM What do you guys think about using average damage instead of rolling? I can think of two pros and a couple of cons but I was wondering what I am missing.

Pros
#1: Quicker combat rounds since players and myself do not need to roll and do the math.
#2: It fixes the lame situation when you roll less on a critical hit than you could on a normal hit. It'll always at least double.

Cons
#1: Players like to roll dice.
#2: Damage becomes predictable after the first hit from an opponent.
theotherdraxen
12-17-06, 06:56 PM Dice rolling adds fun and randomness to the game. Just becasue you hit does not mean that you hit well.

Besides, once you get into high levels, the damage you dish out does become kind of static. You go from dealing 3d6+15 damage to dealing 2d6+130. You can bet that even if those two dice end up as ones, even on a crit, you're still going to deal out a bunch of damage.
Anaxander
12-18-06, 12:45 PM Cons
#3 damage reduction

Against some foes you just have to roll high damage or you can't hurt them. High DR (elementals eg) becomes more powerful, low DR (warlock, dread necromancer eg) becomes useless.
Paul Hopebringer
12-18-06, 01:13 PM Well... yes, it does have its disadvantages, but the advantages it has arn't worth discounting. I would say it is possible to have the best of both worlds, and use average damage when it will speed up a combat that needs to be speed up. If the players are getting bored or whatnot, and you can't just * give * them victory, well... pull out the average damage alternative.
Keterys
12-18-06, 04:27 PM I actually like the idea of rolling up to first few dice. So you go ahead and roll you 2d6+13, but your high level rogue who does 1d6+7, 1d6 fire, 1d6 electricity, 8d6 sneak attack?

How about 1d6+7, 1d6f, 1d6e, +28SA

Similarly, how about instead of something doing 13d12, it does 3d12+65, 10d8 to 2d8+36 (or 4d8+27)
theotherdraxen
12-18-06, 06:31 PM I actually like the idea of rolling up to first few dice. So you go ahead and roll you 2d6+13, but your high level rogue who does 1d6+7, 1d6 fire, 1d6 electricity, 8d6 sneak attack?

How about 1d6+7, 1d6f, 1d6e, +28SA

Similarly, how about instead of something doing 13d12, it does 3d12+65, 10d8 to 2d8+36 (or 4d8+27)

Now this is an idea I like. Speeds up combat and doesn't take all the luck away.
Draegun Fury
12-19-06, 10:11 PM A system I have contemplated using is:

Roll 1d20 a determine your attack as normal. The damage dealt is equal to the ammount you exceed your targets AC plus your Weapon Damage

Weapon Damage
1d4 = 1
1d6 = 2
1d8 = 3
1d10 = 4
1d12 = 5
2d6 = 5
2d8 = 6

Thus Player's still get the fun of rolling, and luck still plays in, but instead of rolling 1 dice to hit and 1 to damage, they are both resolved in the same roll. It also means Criticals are always going to deal more damage.

What do you think?

Cheers.
Keterys
12-20-06, 10:37 AM That change would make for a very interesting system, but it has wider impact than you think. For example, it makes strength double dip (bonus to hit, bonus to damage, bonus to damage again for to hit), same with weapon enhancements, etc. Power Attack is basically subsumed, or possibly something you get just for 2-handers to get extra bonus when they hit.

It's enough of a change that I wouldn't just try it, but would want things to be designed with it in mind.

P.S. The reduce to just a few dice thing is something I've been doing lately, and it helps speed things way up. It also means I need less of a huge pile of dice at high level, which I also like.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bavix 12-17-06, 06:52 PM	What do you guys think about using average damage instead of rolling? I can think of two pros and a couple of cons but I was wondering what I am missing. Pros #1: Quicker combat rounds since players and myself do not need to roll and do the math. #2: It fixes the lame situation when you roll less on a critical hit than you could on a normal hit. It'll always at least double. Cons #1: Players like to roll dice. #2: Damage becomes predictable after the first hit from an opponent.
theotherdraxen 12-17-06, 06:56 PM	Dice rolling adds fun and randomness to the game. Just becasue you hit does not mean that you hit well. Besides, once you get into high levels, the damage you dish out does become kind of static. You go from dealing 3d6+15 damage to dealing 2d6+130. You can bet that even if those two dice end up as ones, even on a crit, you're still going to deal out a bunch of damage.
Anaxander 12-18-06, 12:45 PM	Cons #3 damage reduction Against some foes you just have to roll high damage or you can't hurt them. High DR (elementals eg) becomes more powerful, low DR (warlock, dread necromancer eg) becomes useless.
Paul Hopebringer 12-18-06, 01:13 PM	Well... yes, it does have its disadvantages, but the advantages it has arn't worth discounting. I would say it is possible to have the best of both worlds, and use average damage when it will speed up a combat that needs to be speed up. If the players are getting bored or whatnot, and you can't just * give * them victory, well... pull out the average damage alternative.
Keterys 12-18-06, 04:27 PM	I actually like the idea of rolling up to first few dice. So you go ahead and roll you 2d6+13, but your high level rogue who does 1d6+7, 1d6 fire, 1d6 electricity, 8d6 sneak attack? How about 1d6+7, 1d6f, 1d6e, +28SA Similarly, how about instead of something doing 13d12, it does 3d12+65, 10d8 to 2d8+36 (or 4d8+27)
theotherdraxen 12-18-06, 06:31 PM	I actually like the idea of rolling up to first few dice. So you go ahead and roll you 2d6+13, but your high level rogue who does 1d6+7, 1d6 fire, 1d6 electricity, 8d6 sneak attack? How about 1d6+7, 1d6f, 1d6e, +28SA Similarly, how about instead of something doing 13d12, it does 3d12+65, 10d8 to 2d8+36 (or 4d8+27) Now this is an idea I like. Speeds up combat and doesn't take all the luck away.
Draegun Fury 12-19-06, 10:11 PM	A system I have contemplated using is: Roll 1d20 a determine your attack as normal. The damage dealt is equal to the ammount you exceed your targets AC plus your Weapon Damage Weapon Damage 1d4 = 1 1d6 = 2 1d8 = 3 1d10 = 4 1d12 = 5 2d6 = 5 2d8 = 6 Thus Player's still get the fun of rolling, and luck still plays in, but instead of rolling 1 dice to hit and 1 to damage, they are both resolved in the same roll. It also means Criticals are always going to deal more damage. What do you think? Cheers.
Keterys 12-20-06, 10:37 AM	That change would make for a very interesting system, but it has wider impact than you think. For example, it makes strength double dip (bonus to hit, bonus to damage, bonus to damage again for to hit), same with weapon enhancements, etc. Power Attack is basically subsumed, or possibly something you get just for 2-handers to get extra bonus when they hit. It's enough of a change that I wouldn't just try it, but would want things to be designed with it in mind. P.S. The reduce to just a few dice thing is something I've been doing lately, and it helps speed things way up. It also means I need less of a huge pile of dice at high level, which I also like.