0-level spells for beginning wizards [Archive] - Wizards Community

0-level spells for beginning wizards [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
pukunui
07-22-06, 12:56 AM Just a quick question: a wizard is supposed to start out with "all" the 0-level spells already transcribed in his/her spellbook. When written, this obviously applied only to the 0-level spells found in the PHB. Now, however, one can find 9 more 0-level spells, all nicely compiled in one place in the new Spell Compendium. Could these extra 0-level spells be included in a beginning wizard's spellbook, or should they be just that -- extra spells that have to be added to one's spellbook individually, either for free during level-up or at 100gp each (since they each only take up one page)?

Just wondering what other DMs thoughts are on this.
bitswordmaker
07-22-06, 01:10 AM If they want them at first lvl, let them take them. However, if they don't tell you they're taking them, then keep with the 100gp rule, or for free at lvl ups.
pukunui
07-22-06, 01:52 AM If they want them at first lvl, let them take them. However, if they don't tell you they're taking them, then keep with the 100gp rule, or for free at lvl ups.
Sounds reasonable to me. I'm all for extra stuff -- I'm not out to be a stingy DM, I just don't want to be overly generous, either.
Malakai_Demonos
07-22-06, 03:33 AM A wizard begins play with all 0-level spells, it doesn't say all 0-level spells in the PHB I. Hope I helped.

From the SRD:
A wizard begins play with a spellbook containing all 0-level wizard spells (except those from her prohibited school or schools, if any; see School Specialization, below) plus three 1st-level spells of your choice. For each point of Intelligence bonus the wizard has, the spellbook holds one additional 1st-level spell of your choice. At each new wizard level, she gains two new spells of any spell level or levels that she can cast (based on her new wizard level) for her spellbook. At any time, a wizard can also add spells found in other wizards’ spellbooks to her own.
pukunui
07-22-06, 03:48 AM Thanks. That's what I was thinking (and hoping) people would say ... I just wasn't sure, because obviously when the rules were first drawn up, the only 0-level spells were the ones in the PHB, and I didn't know whether or not it was generally accepted that new 0-level spells published since then would be considered automatically known by a wizard or not. It makes sense -- if you've got access to them, you might as well use them.
Malakai_Demonos
07-22-06, 04:06 AM Yeah, that, plus I don't think it will change even low level play if you give a wizard like 10 more cantrips known in his book. Hell in my opinion, wizards and especially sorcerors should get them at will. But hey, I've yet to institute it b/c its not too big of a deal.
prawn
07-22-06, 08:19 AM I don't have the SC. Are their any useful ones among the new spells? My favorite is mage hand. My 12th level mage uses it all the time!
pukunui
07-22-06, 04:56 PM I don't have the SC. Are their any useful ones among the new spells?
Caltrops
Electric Jolt
Sonic Snap
Silent Portal
Amanuensis
Launch Bolt
Launch Item
Repair Minor Damage
Stick

That's all nine of them. Sorry, don't have time to post their effects.
Malakai_Demonos
07-22-06, 05:34 PM Caltrops
Electric Jolt
Sonic Snap
Silent Portal
Amanuensis
Launch Bolt
Launch Item
Repair Minor Damage
Stick

That's all nine of them. Sorry, don't have time to post their effects.

Amanuensis is prety cool, it copies non magical text, and caltrops of course summon up caltrops, not too many though, I think maybe two or three bags worth max.
Cifer
07-23-06, 06:59 PM I'd say it depends on how you handle spells from splat books in general. Personally, I take the Core list and everything else is generally unknown - but can probably be found through research and some crawling. The same things applies to classes that know "all the spells" like clerics or druids.
This saves you as a DM the problem of looking through each and every splat book available to your players whether one spell might or might not be used to completely break your game.
MasterOfPsychic
07-23-06, 10:16 PM The problem is that this applies much more extremly to clerics and druids. If wizards don't know all 0-level spells in all books, why should clerics and druids know the 0-9th level spells in th other books?

If they do not know them, how are they supposed to get them?

Thererfore, wizards know the cantrips on non-core books, unless the DM elects not to add it to his campaign. Or does not elect to add it. Depends on DM's policy.

But if they exist in the campagin, the wizard should know them.
shadowfox628
07-23-06, 10:30 PM I remember reading what I believe was a 3.0 book, with new 0-Level spells. At the end, it was saying why they made those spells, and what to do if you introduce them into your campaign. As a suggestion, it said something along the lines of this:

A starting Wizard, as an optional choice, can choose 16 0-level spells (not so sure about the number) instead of getting all of them, to reflect his/her character's training.

Honestly, though, I'd stick with the PHB, but, if the PC wanted to, could swap a PHB 0-level spell for a 0-level spell from another book.
Zheon
07-23-06, 10:34 PM ..and caltrops of course summon up caltrops, not too many though, I think maybe two or three bags worth max.

heheh. hopefully it scales with level or something. tell the druid to cast "whirlwind" before you cast caltrops.. then make the tanks use thier tower shields as a metal wall.. caltrops everywhere.. flying around at a hundred miles an hour.. heheh..
Cifer
07-24-06, 07:47 AM The problem is that this applies much more extremly to clerics and druids. If wizards don't know all 0-level spells in all books, why should clerics and druids know the 0-9th level spells in th other books?
They generally don't, in my games. They might, however, have heard of an obscure liturgy that is used in the hidden Valley of Plotok, which they may see as a incentive to travel there, brave the dangers on the travel and show themselves worthy of the spell. Same with different flavour applies to druids.
Shaggy_Shaggs
07-24-06, 08:17 AM It's probably best to give wizards the same amount of cantrips known, but let them make exchanges between PHB cantrips and other source cantrips if they want.

Starting off with all cantrips from all books can actually hurt a low level wizard a bit - spellbook space is limited, and each cantrip takes up a page of it, after all. Filling up a spellbook too fast and carrying an extra may be just enough weight to encumber the wiz, and slow him down just enough to get him killed when an encounter goes south.
pukunui
07-24-06, 04:29 PM We're only talking about 9 one-page spells here ... I don't think it's that big a deal, really. I'm going to say, if you want some or all of them, you can have them as extra freebies. If not, that's fine too. I bought the Spell Compendium for a reason, and I intend to get some use out of it.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
pukunui 07-22-06, 12:56 AM	Just a quick question: a wizard is supposed to start out with "all" the 0-level spells already transcribed in his/her spellbook. When written, this obviously applied only to the 0-level spells found in the PHB. Now, however, one can find 9 more 0-level spells, all nicely compiled in one place in the new Spell Compendium. Could these extra 0-level spells be included in a beginning wizard's spellbook, or should they be just that -- extra spells that have to be added to one's spellbook individually, either for free during level-up or at 100gp each (since they each only take up one page)? Just wondering what other DMs thoughts are on this.
bitswordmaker 07-22-06, 01:10 AM	If they want them at first lvl, let them take them. However, if they don't tell you they're taking them, then keep with the 100gp rule, or for free at lvl ups.
pukunui 07-22-06, 01:52 AM	If they want them at first lvl, let them take them. However, if they don't tell you they're taking them, then keep with the 100gp rule, or for free at lvl ups. Sounds reasonable to me. I'm all for extra stuff -- I'm not out to be a stingy DM, I just don't want to be overly generous, either.
Malakai_Demonos 07-22-06, 03:33 AM	A wizard begins play with all 0-level spells, it doesn't say all 0-level spells in the PHB I. Hope I helped. From the SRD: A wizard begins play with a spellbook containing all 0-level wizard spells (except those from her prohibited school or schools, if any; see School Specialization, below) plus three 1st-level spells of your choice. For each point of Intelligence bonus the wizard has, the spellbook holds one additional 1st-level spell of your choice. At each new wizard level, she gains two new spells of any spell level or levels that she can cast (based on her new wizard level) for her spellbook. At any time, a wizard can also add spells found in other wizards’ spellbooks to her own.
pukunui 07-22-06, 03:48 AM	Thanks. That's what I was thinking (and hoping) people would say ... I just wasn't sure, because obviously when the rules were first drawn up, the only 0-level spells were the ones in the PHB, and I didn't know whether or not it was generally accepted that new 0-level spells published since then would be considered automatically known by a wizard or not. It makes sense -- if you've got access to them, you might as well use them.
Malakai_Demonos 07-22-06, 04:06 AM	Yeah, that, plus I don't think it will change even low level play if you give a wizard like 10 more cantrips known in his book. Hell in my opinion, wizards and especially sorcerors should get them at will. But hey, I've yet to institute it b/c its not too big of a deal.
prawn 07-22-06, 08:19 AM	I don't have the SC. Are their any useful ones among the new spells? My favorite is mage hand. My 12th level mage uses it all the time!
pukunui 07-22-06, 04:56 PM	I don't have the SC. Are their any useful ones among the new spells? Caltrops Electric Jolt Sonic Snap Silent Portal Amanuensis Launch Bolt Launch Item Repair Minor Damage Stick That's all nine of them. Sorry, don't have time to post their effects.
Malakai_Demonos 07-22-06, 05:34 PM	Caltrops Electric Jolt Sonic Snap Silent Portal Amanuensis Launch Bolt Launch Item Repair Minor Damage Stick That's all nine of them. Sorry, don't have time to post their effects. Amanuensis is prety cool, it copies non magical text, and caltrops of course summon up caltrops, not too many though, I think maybe two or three bags worth max.
Cifer 07-23-06, 06:59 PM	I'd say it depends on how you handle spells from splat books in general. Personally, I take the Core list and everything else is generally unknown - but can probably be found through research and some crawling. The same things applies to classes that know "all the spells" like clerics or druids. This saves you as a DM the problem of looking through each and every splat book available to your players whether one spell might or might not be used to completely break your game.
MasterOfPsychic 07-23-06, 10:16 PM	The problem is that this applies much more extremly to clerics and druids. If wizards don't know all 0-level spells in all books, why should clerics and druids know the 0-9th level spells in th other books? If they do not know them, how are they supposed to get them? Thererfore, wizards know the cantrips on non-core books, unless the DM elects not to add it to his campaign. Or does not elect to add it. Depends on DM's policy. But if they exist in the campagin, the wizard should know them.
shadowfox628 07-23-06, 10:30 PM	I remember reading what I believe was a 3.0 book, with new 0-Level spells. At the end, it was saying why they made those spells, and what to do if you introduce them into your campaign. As a suggestion, it said something along the lines of this: A starting Wizard, as an optional choice, can choose 16 0-level spells (not so sure about the number) instead of getting all of them, to reflect his/her character's training. Honestly, though, I'd stick with the PHB, but, if the PC wanted to, could swap a PHB 0-level spell for a 0-level spell from another book.
Zheon 07-23-06, 10:34 PM	..and caltrops of course summon up caltrops, not too many though, I think maybe two or three bags worth max. heheh. hopefully it scales with level or something. tell the druid to cast "whirlwind" before you cast caltrops.. then make the tanks use thier tower shields as a metal wall.. caltrops everywhere.. flying around at a hundred miles an hour.. heheh..
Cifer 07-24-06, 07:47 AM	The problem is that this applies much more extremly to clerics and druids. If wizards don't know all 0-level spells in all books, why should clerics and druids know the 0-9th level spells in th other books? They generally don't, in my games. They might, however, have heard of an obscure liturgy that is used in the hidden Valley of Plotok, which they may see as a incentive to travel there, brave the dangers on the travel and show themselves worthy of the spell. Same with different flavour applies to druids.
Shaggy_Shaggs 07-24-06, 08:17 AM	It's probably best to give wizards the same amount of cantrips known, but let them make exchanges between PHB cantrips and other source cantrips if they want. Starting off with all cantrips from all books can actually hurt a low level wizard a bit - spellbook space is limited, and each cantrip takes up a page of it, after all. Filling up a spellbook too fast and carrying an extra may be just enough weight to encumber the wiz, and slow him down just enough to get him killed when an encounter goes south.
pukunui 07-24-06, 04:29 PM	We're only talking about 9 one-page spells here ... I don't think it's that big a deal, really. I'm going to say, if you want some or all of them, you can have them as extra freebies. If not, that's fine too. I bought the Spell Compendium for a reason, and I intend to get some use out of it.