Post/Author/DateTime	Post
leoravitorrio 08-14-05, 05:12 PM	Okay, so, I am a new DM. I still have a lot of practice to get "good". But I think I do a pretty decent job and my other players agree with me on that. They are really understanding and patient with me. But then there's the one player that is making me nuts. He has been gaming and DM'ing for a long time. He has a huge superiority complex and it comes out often in his games. I was running a Modern game recently and he was telling another player of mine that he couldn't do something! Something that is ultimately DM's decision. I am convinced he says stuff like that because he doesn't want any one player to be "better" then his character in a game. He also chimes in constantly and makes me feel really crappy if I make even a little mistake. I feel like he tries to take my game from me and run it himself. One of my other players can see this somewhat too. He is a good RP'er so I don't want to ban him from my game. What should I do?!?!? (suggestions would be good please).
Deadlion 08-14-05, 05:21 PM	First thing that pops to mind - Ask him if he would like to take turns with you as DM. You could change over at logical points in the story (i.e. after the end of an episodic adventure/module/whatever). If he has a chance to run the game himself part of the time then maybe the rest of the time he will leave you to do it your way. That's my only thought, I'm afraid, and it's not very good :(
Nephite 08-14-05, 05:37 PM	Take him aside and talk to him. I'm a pretty new DM too, but I can tell you having private concersations is your #1 DM tool.
weasel fierce 08-14-05, 05:39 PM	Talk to him, and explain that the idea of a game, is for everyone to have fun.
20goingon1232 08-14-05, 05:48 PM	Okay, so, I am a new DM. I still have a lot of practice to get "good". But I think I do a pretty decent job and my other players agree with me on that. They are really understanding and patient with me. But then there's the one player that is making me nuts. He has been gaming and DM'ing for a long time. He has a huge superiority complex and it comes out often in his games. I was running a Modern game recently and he was telling another player of mine that he couldn't do something! Something that is ultimately DM's decision. I am convinced he says stuff like that because he doesn't want any one player to be "better" then his character in a game. He also chimes in constantly and makes me feel really crappy if I make even a little mistake. I feel like he tries to take my game from me and run it himself. One of my other players can see this somewhat too. He is a good RP'er so I don't want to ban him from my game. What should I do?!?!? (suggestions would be good please). I have a guy like this in a game where I am a player. He is not even experienced in 3.5. He will even sneakily attack my characters (any and all in every single campaign) and then come up with all sorts of justification for it (misplaced fireball, etc.). The best thing you can do is tell him not to show up again. Ever. I never invite this guy to my games.
Teydyn 08-14-05, 06:23 PM	But I think I do a pretty decent job and my other players agree with me on that. They are really understanding and patient with me. Just a hint, as long as a DM isnt driving the players nuts they are fine with him, almost NO ONE likes to DM... =) They say they are "really understanding and patient", but in reality they are GLAD that they have you IMO. But then there's the one player that is making me nuts. He has been gaming and DM'ing for a long time. He has a huge superiority complex and it comes out often in his games. I was running a Modern game recently and he was telling another player of mine that he couldn't do something! Something that is ultimately DM's decision. Just tell him to stop it and ask if he would like it when someone does it in a game HE DMed. I am sure the answer will be no. He also chimes in constantly and makes me feel really crappy if I make even a little mistake. I feel like he tries to take my game from me and run it himself. 1) "Please stop this crap" 2) "STOP this crap" 3) "STOP this crap or go" 4) "GO!" You have to feel good on the table too. (With you being the DM its even a bit more important then the others) He is a good RP'er so I don't want to ban him from my game. What should I do?!?!? (suggestions would be good please). Better a bad roleplayer that is a nice person then a great roleplayer that is an ***hole.
Agent Cooper 08-14-05, 08:14 PM	You've contradicted your own description of this individual. If this person really has such extensive gaming experience and is the great roleplayer you say he is, then he would know better than to behave in the ways he does. If he does all the unpleasant things you say, then this person obviously does not know how to act civilly in general, much less in a gaming environment. How in the world does his acting like a jackass make him so invaluable?? Why you (or any of the other dozens of DMs who post these same kinds of threads over and over on this forum, for that matter) would subject yourself to his obnoxious behavior over and over again is beyond me. Must be some kind of co-dependent abuser/abusee syndrome. Tell him to find another game. Period.
Shatteredtower 08-14-05, 09:06 PM	You've contradicted your own description of this individual. If this person really has such extensive gaming experience and is the great roleplayer you say he is, then he would know better than to behave in the ways he does. It's not true in any other field, professional or not, so I don't see why you think it would be any different here. There is no contradiction. Someone can be very good at a game or occupation and unbearable to work with at the same time. Now if you're lucky, this sort of conduct can be stopped by pointing out how unacceptable it is. This method is a lot more effective when used with someone who isn't signing your paycheques, but it's been known to work well enough even then. "Look, you've got a lot to offer this group, but if you don't stop disrupting things like this, you have to leave. If there's a concern, we'll discuss it after the game, but not before. Any outburst before then and you're gone. Understood?" Take a deep breath before you say that and make sure you've got his full attention. Make eye contact and speak calmly. And if he won't leave, apologize to the others and state that you'll have to postpone the next session until conditions are more suitable to playing, letting your disruption know that he is not welcome until certain things are sorted out to the rest of the group's satisfaction. This, of course, depends on whether or not you wish to go to the trouble for what he can contribute to the game. If you've decided life's too short for this sort of nonsense, skip right to showing him the door or leaving. The rest of your party will understand if you say, "I'm sorry, everyone, but I can't run the game under these conditions; it's just not fair to any of us. Shall we resume on [pick a date]? [Troublemaker] is not welcome in this game as of now, though that may change if we all agree to let him back in." It works better if you can suggest another activity for the evening, especially one that won't catch the players' wallets flat-footed. Even if the disruption is a good friend of yours, however, I suggest making him sit this get-together out. He chose to interfere with the good time the rest of you were having, so it's only fair to leave him out of it, just as you'd kick him out of your house if he disrupted a birthday party or the like. (But if he is your friend, be sure to tell him you'll see him at the next... well, whatever constitutes your next gathering, so long as it's not the game itself. This doesn't have to go beyond the gaming table, so long as he's mature enough to be able to understand that.)
WizardlyFriend 08-14-05, 11:02 PM	sounds like me. i have an extensive knowledge of the rules and since we started playing i was considered the dm. however i haven't DMed in around 5 months and others have taked turns. if someone makes a rules mistake i correct it and i don't see a problem with that. even a small rules mistake makes a difference. however, i try not to be arrogant about it, and i try not to rules lawyer. meaning i never look up something to prove someone wrong on how they remembered a rule. dming is addictive and there is no PC experience like it. as a DM you can be anything so when you PC you feel the loss of power immediately. you're new to DMing and he probably is new to PCing, just give it some time
Agent Cooper 08-15-05, 07:54 PM	ShatteredTower- Have to disagree with you on that point. Yes, in a professional situation I may have to put up with a cranky prima donna, but not in a game I play for enjoyment in my spare time. Unless we're talking about an open table at a con or a tournament, I get to pick who I game with, so I game with people I like. Roleplaying games like D&D are a social activity; by their very nature, you MUST have good social skills to play and enjoy them. At the very least, you have to get along well with the group you play with. If somebody is obnoxious and obtuse, can't get along with the other players or the DM and spoils the fun for everybody on a regular basis, then they're not a very good player, no matter how well they can roleplay or how extensive their knowledge of the rules. It just doesn't work.
edgy_rhinx 08-15-05, 08:45 PM	I'm a DM since 1998, I think. I had similar situation: the player was moderately experienced and caused a lot of problems. I failed to solve the situation and had to stop DMing that group. :( So far I gave no advice. Well, it depends on whether you have many DnD people in your area or not. If you don't know them as it is usually, you have to either make a miracle or stop, because it's impossible to change person's bahavior unless he chooses to change it himself. And if the person is ... he will never do it. Rather pessimistic, I guess.
derfenrirwolv 08-15-05, 09:03 PM	I was running a Modern game recently and he was telling another player of mine that he couldn't do something! What precisely was the problem telling the other player he can't do? Player 1 "I want to jump up onto the 10 foot building!" The problem isn't being a jerk if he says "sorry, thats a dc fourty something jump check.. that +2 of yours isn't going to cut it even on a natural 20".
Arrowhen 08-15-05, 09:05 PM	Someone can be very good at a game or occupation and unbearable to work with at the same time. Not in roleplaying. A roleplaying game requires cooperation among the players in order to succeed. The characters might spend the whole session trying to kill each other in increasingly horrible ways, but the players must cooperate in creating the story. Playing nice with the other people at the table is an essential part of being a good roleplayer.
20goingon1232 08-15-05, 09:06 PM	What precisely was the problem telling the other player he can't do? Player 1 "I want to jump up onto the 10 foot building!" The problem isn't being a jerk if he says "sorry, thats a dc fourty something jump check.. that +2 of yours isn't going to cut it even on a natural 20". There is a difference between saying that and saying: Your character won't do that! It is not in his nature! He will do....! So, who created the character, exactly?
Shatteredtower 08-15-05, 09:29 PM	ShatteredTower- Have to disagree with you on that point. Yes, in a professional situation I may have to put up with a cranky prima donna, but not in a game I play for enjoyment in my spare time. Unless we're talking about an open table at a con or a tournament, I get to pick who I game with, so I game with people I like. You're not disagreeing with me here. What I disagreed with was the claim that a person could not be a good roleplayer with lots of game experience and be disagreeable at the same time. Roleplaying games like D&D are a social activity; by their very nature, you MUST have good social skills to play and enjoy them. Not in my experience, no. They help, but they've never been essential. We've both experienced and read enough horror stories to know otherwise, surely? As described, the player in question has brought something valuable to the table, but has demanded too high a price for it. As long as the group sees value in it, there is no harm in trying to reach a more agreeable settlement before resorting to a straightforward boot, which may regrettably prove necessary anyway. Accusing them of codependent for such efforts is unwarranted.
Rogirrek 08-15-05, 11:01 PM	What precisely was the problem telling the other player he can't do? Player 1 "I want to jump up onto the 10 foot building!" The problem isn't being a jerk if he says "sorry, thats a dc fourty something jump check.. that +2 of yours isn't going to cut it even on a natural 20". i was the other player. it wasn't a rules thing, i was going to taunt someone (for those that don't play modern it makes it so someone can't act for a round) so the party could get past with one last threat, a machine gun weilding threat at that, and he said it was stupid and that we should just do what he said which pretty much involved watching him stroke his ego with a sniper rifle. if it was a rules thing i'm sure leora wouldn't have minded, and i would have bowed down but it was just a case of "my character is better". -------- he's a nice guy and is good to game with on occasion but somewhere in his upbringing social skills took a back seat...in geek terms he would have a Charisma of 8 or 9.