Post/Author/DateTime	Post
femmehack 05-15-05, 11:21 PM	Ok, so a friend of mine created a character class to play an intelligent sword that can move on its own. I think that it will work out ok, but here's my question: we're starting at 5th level, so starting gold is 9000gp...but how much should I give the sword, how would he carry/equip/use it, and what could I do in lieu of giving him gold/equipment? I am rather at a loss here. Any ideas?
High Octane 05-15-05, 11:37 PM	I recommend him investing in legs.
Fenris Frost 05-15-05, 11:40 PM	That's most certainly odd. Perhaps he gains an enhancement or wondrous ability equivalent to the reward of the others? Say if everyone else gets 18,000 gp, he gets a +3 enhancement, that sort of thing. Or the ability to?.... Heal, levitate, cast a spell a certain number of times per day, that sort of thing.
Flushmaster 05-15-05, 11:43 PM	I'm with the sword buying itse'f enhancements. You could also rule that the sword can "wear" certain magical items, such as magical rings on the hilt, a pendant hung over the crossguard, etc.
Rumple_Cragstan 05-15-05, 11:46 PM	just keep enchanting yourself. 9000g is a +2 weapon, and you gotta have at least 300g to account for the MW weapon price. But as a side-note, how the hell is your DM going to deal with this? I mean you're going to get destroyed so fast that it'll be hard to notice. With the inability to wear armor, your AC will be deadly low. *UNLESS* your DM allows you to enchant yourself as if you where armor as well. Consider it having a magic blade for weapon, and a magic basket hilt for armor or something. Wear rings in the handle. embed magic gemstones in the pommel. wrap amulets around the hilt. With the exception of helmets and boots and such, you can probably find a way to use each wonderous item. That would allow you to have a +1 weapon, a +2 armor, and roughly 2500g to spend on rings and other items. I would recommend a Ring of Protection, or an Amulet of Natural Armor. And on another side-note: what happens to your character in an antimagic field?
Lidabmob 05-15-05, 11:48 PM	As an inteligent Sword that can fly... Hmm. Since he is a sword that is essentially being wielded by a magical source AKA himslef. He should have a STR score and Possiably Even a DEX score. Also is he just an Intellignet +1 sword? If so then here is some of my suggestions. He possess a unique ability to absorb things of value. He must spend spend 4 hours in contact with the item/s to be absorbed and at the end of the time the item is absorbed in to his being. This allows him to upgrade aspects of his being according to the value of the item. The following could be an example chart. Benefit Value of Items to be Absorbed +1 to any stat 2000gp +1 Armor bonus 1500gp +1 Deflection Bonus 2000gp +1 Weapon Bonus 2500gp +5 Hp 1750gp +1 hardness 3000gp So on an so fourth you can use your imagination. This allows the character to accumilate wealth and still benifit from items found... It's just he absorbs them into his being and becomes stronger. As far as how he carries it and such. Well you can also solve that via a simple ruling that he can send items to an extra dimensional space that can only carry items = to his medium load. With the ablity to recall them from there as a standard action. As he is a weapon he will have very few hit points but hey thats why the +5 HP upgrade can be cool and the Hardness upgrade helps along the same means also.
Aeromus 05-16-05, 12:22 AM	Why not give the sword stats, and apply them all to a "host" body? Like a peasant girl... Whom while wielding the sword has a str 17, dex 15, con 18, int 12, wis 15, cha 12 or whatever abilities the sword gives. Has HP equal to a 5th level "fighter ect."
VirgilCaine 05-16-05, 08:32 AM	Why not give the sword stats, and apply them all to a "host" body? Now that sounds a LOT more workable for the "PC as weapon" idea.
DM Zoc 05-16-05, 08:40 AM	There are pricing guidelines for intelligent items. My vote is that it gains new powers.
Osiris Memnoch 05-16-05, 08:44 AM	My solution? Don't let your freinds play REDICULOUS "characters."
Da Dinictus 05-16-05, 08:48 AM	Actually, I -like- it. Give it levitation, so it can move, but can't really fly, and that will at least solve the problem of locomotion. I'm going to drive any future DM's insane with such a character. Thanks for the novel idea :D
Lord Ian Stark 05-16-05, 09:23 AM	My solution? Don't let your freinds play REDICULOUS "characters." Bah. :ahem: Anyhow, this type of thing happened to me when my soul got trapped in the magic armor I was wearing. I was now an intelligent armor. My body was just a mindless mount. You should have seen the party try to understand why my character always stared off into nothingness and his mouth didn't move when I would talk. I was able to make it eat and "act" normal since it was once my body as long as I had the armor on. It was fun worrying about my "mount" getting damaged so I was very cautious. Want to award something for your sword? Every few levels he gets a new more powerful mount (Mount being anybody that uses the sword and fails there will save.) This way he can still level up a character and all that but the "mount" is under total control from the sword if the wielder fails a will save.
Joe Khol 05-16-05, 09:39 AM	Ok, so a friend of mine created a character class to play an intelligent sword that can move on its own. I think that it will work out ok, but here's my question: we're starting at 5th level, so starting gold is 9000gp...but how much should I give the sword, how would he carry/equip/use it, and what could I do in lieu of giving him gold/equipment? I am rather at a loss here. Any ideas? A 5th level character starts with 9000gp, whether they are a human, an orc or a sword. I guess he could hang some kind of bag from his hilt to carry stuff if he wanted, or get the party to help. Most equipment would be, of course, useless to him. I don't think you should be specifically 'giving him' treasure catered to his obscure character choice. What his intelligent sword does with it's share of treasure is his problem. Some of the ideas above are fine but he should be seeking those out in the game. If he wants to play something so obscure, its only fair he does some of the hard work.
snowlynx 05-16-05, 09:52 AM	Like the ancesteral relic feat, you should probably allow him to sacrifice magical items and the sort in order to enchance his weapon (in this case, himself.) That way, he can continue enchancing himself as he gains levels, and he can use his share of the treasure gained through adventures. Hrm....there was an enhancement to a weapon that allowed it to hold a ring, but I don't remember from which book.
Lord Ian Stark 05-16-05, 09:58 AM	Like the ancesteral relic feat, you should probably allow him to sacrifice magical items and the sort in order to enchance his weapon (in this case, himself.) That way, he can continue enchancing himself as he gains levels, and he can use his share of the treasure gained through adventures. Hrm....there was an enhancement to a weapon that allowed it to hold a ring, but I don't remember from which book. Ooh very nice. He could have the Paladin or someone trustworthy hold onto his share of the loot so when they find a smith or someone capable of upgrading magical weapons, he can do so. femmehack, that is an interesting name. It kinda gives me a serial killer feeling with the femme and hack in there. :P So are you going to let him find a suitable "mount?" That could be an adventure in itself. ;)
olshanski_home 05-16-05, 01:30 PM	I want to play a character that is either a roof shingled with bananna peels, or else I want to play approximately 4 square inches of the color orange. What kind of starting money do I get?
Dishliquid 05-16-05, 01:52 PM	One word: "sunder". :P
Thoronmir 05-16-05, 01:59 PM	One word: "sunder". :PDang! I don't have the books with me, but what's the spell that nullifies magical items' magical properties? Disjunction? Is that the one? Seems like that would wreak havoc with this "PC" ... cast it and watch the "PC" drop to the floor, inert. But at least he'd still be a Masterwork weapon. :D
Lord of the Underdark 05-16-05, 02:09 PM	Why not give the sword stats, and apply them all to a "host" body? Like a peasant girl... Whom while wielding the sword has a str 17, dex 15, con 18, int 12, wis 15, cha 12 or whatever abilities the sword gives. Has HP equal to a 5th level "fighter ect." Personally, I like this idea better as well, I think I may even use it in my next adventure.
Alcari Ambaron 05-16-05, 03:12 PM	I want to play a character that is either a roof shingled with bananna peels, or else I want to play approximately 4 square inches of the color orange. What kind of starting money do I get? goes to my sig if it's OK Anyway I like Aeromus' idea of the Host body. especially if it's a little 15(or so) year old peasant girl...image the look on that dragons face when it gets pummeled to death by a little girl :D
Lord of the Underdark 05-16-05, 03:37 PM	Okay, so I'm going to take the "host body" concept and run with it for a second. I would look at it something like this The sword has such an enormous ego that it's thoughts, words and actions almost always overpower whomever picks it up. By first instinct they immediately loot the rest of the body on which is was found ( as a method of keeping it's valuables". The "wielder" who's mind is now useless will do as the sword wishes, fighting or not fighting only when it wants to, and spending all of it's wealth on upgrading itself. Only providing the bare minimum of care for it's host body. (Just enough to keep it alive) As the sword progresses in levels, the attributes it gives to the host-wielder will change accordingly. (i.e. If the sword has the stats of a lvl 8 Fighter, so does the li'l girl holding it) As for the "nay-sayers", make the item an artifact...any sword that grants powers like this "has to be" beyond the magical reach of the garden variety spell-caster. It would help with the whole "Disjunction thing...." and when someone does manage to sunder it....They die in a wild magic burst. And on the off chance that someone wants to argue the "disjunction vs. artifact" point with me...I'll quote the SRD and bold the portions you may want to read over carefully. :D Mage’s Disjunction Abjuration Level: Magic 9, Sor/Wiz 9 Components: V Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Area: All magical effects and magic items within a 40-ft.-radius burst Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: Will negates (object) Spell Resistance: No All magical effects and magic items within the radius of the spell, except for those that you carry or touch, are disjoined. That is, spells and spell-like effects are separated into their individual components (ending the effect as a dispel magic spell does), and each permanent magic item must make a successful Will save or be turned into a normal item. An item in a creature’s possession uses its own Will save bonus or its possessor’s Will save bonus, whichever is higher. You also have a 1% chance per caster level of destroying an antimagic field. If the antimagic field survives the disjunction, no items within it are disjoined. Even artifacts are subject to disjunction, though there is only a 1% chance per caster level of actually affecting such powerful items. Additionally, if an artifact is destroyed, you must make a DC 25 Will save or permanently lose all spellcasting abilities. (These abilities cannot be recovered by mortal magic, not even miracle or wish.) Note: Destroying artifacts is a dangerous business, and it is 95% likely to attract the attention of some powerful being who has an interest in or connection with the device.
olshanski_home 05-16-05, 04:18 PM	Lord of the underdark.... The various "protection from [alignment]" spells all allow a person to be free from mental control/domination/etcetera. These spells are scattered all over the place, especially in hallowed or unhallowed locations... causing a bit of a problem with the total mental control theory.
Thoronmir 05-16-05, 04:32 PM	In addition, from a conceptual perspective, I would not allow a PC who is virtually indestructible. Even if Sissy the Milkmaid dies, nothing has happened to the PC (other than he has to wait for some new yokel to wander by and pick him up). So, absent some genuine repercussions to the Player Character, I'd never tolerate it.
Sargon 05-16-05, 04:58 PM	Sockets... Borrowing the Socketed weapon Idea from other games.. The 'Sword PC' can find gem that give it enchaments. Hmm much like diffrent crystals affect a lightsaber (if anyone has played SWRPG or Knight of the old republic I or II ). A knowledge Gemstone check might be had to know what type of affect diffrent Gems might have.. Like a diamond worth 10,000 gp (such as the type used for true res) would increase its the Weapons Hardness.. Because Diamond are really really hard.. Just an Idea The host body sounds good too BTW
Rumple_Cragstan 05-16-05, 05:20 PM	In addition, from a conceptual perspective, I would not allow a PC who is virtually indestructible. Even if Sissy the Milkmaid dies, nothing has happened to the PC (other than he has to wait for some new yokel to wander by and pick him up). So, absent some genuine repercussions to the Player Character, I'd never tolerate it. I agree wholeheartedly. Maybe have some kinda connection between the body and the sword? Wait! Solution just came to mind! I presume we all know the soulknife class... howabout a soulbody class? This way, the sword could 'wear' armor and other items, and not look like a 'gangster' (the boards censor out the 'w' word) with a million and two items crammed onto its hilt. This would prevent the sword from gaining an evil alignment (because with a host, thats depriving someone of thier free will), and if the body dies, thats the physical incarnation of the sword's soul - so it would die as well. Probably with a 'soulstone' in the pommel or hilt shattering for dramatic effect.
SwitchUK 05-16-05, 06:49 PM	Frankly, I'd call the whole concept more than a little unworkable. If I had to go with an idea, I'd do this: Sentient Weapon. Sometimes, in incredibly rare situations, a magical weapon becomes so totally infused with magical energy that its sentience and sense of self reach the stage where the weapon gains not only the will, but the ability to act and control itself, freeing itself from the bonds of mortal control. Such sentient weapons tend to take up the life of an adventurer, as much as possible, out of a sense of completing their purpose in existence. They animate and wield themselves via the formation of an intangible, ethereal force, and, being magical in nature, have an innate grasp of magic, though this talent is slow to develop. sentient weapons are essentially a blend of species and class. A sentient weapon may not gain levels in any class other than sentient weapon, ever, unless it is somehow permanently rendered in the form of a living creature (such as via being raised by the reincarnation spell). Race: A sentient weapon belongs to no race, being in effect a unique entity. They feel no particular affinity for any species, or even for other sentient weapons, not even those made by their creator. Abilities: The primary abilities for a sword are STR, as the primary purpose of a weapon is to attack and damage, and also provides a bonus to theweapon's AC. A high DEX score is important for its bonus to AC. Also important is CHA, which affects the weapon's spell choice, and certain class abilities. Weapon and armour proficiency - A sentient weapon has no proficiency in any weaponry or armour other than itself. They may not gain any weapon proficiency, though may gain proficiency in armour and shields. Alignment: Sentient weapons come in all alignments, usually matching that of their creator. They seldom (if ever) worship deities, Hit die: D4. Class Skills: Spellcraft, craft (weaponsmithing) concentration, hide, search, spot, knowledge (arcana), appraise, tumble. Spells: A sentient weapon casts spells as a sorceror of half its class level. saves: a sentient weapon's save modifiers are as a bard of the weapon's level Special: Size - Although their only physical component is the weapon itself, the ethereal force exerted by the weapon in order to wield itself is appropriately sized to the weapon - so a medium longsword would produce a medium-sized force, a large club produces a large force, and so on. A weapon will always create the smallest possible force that it can create without suffering a penalty to its attack rolls. Ethereal wielder: The sword's "body" is actually an intangible field of force generated by the weapon itself. although faint, this creation does have a tangible physical presence. Any hits and spells targetted against this field of force have a 50% chance of missing completely. The wielder field cannot be bull rushed, tripped or grappled (nor can it attempt any of these actions) and cannot be flanked or disarmed. Having no discernible physiology, it is also immune to sneak attacks and critical hits. The field is the normal target for attacks, and if it is reduced to 0 hit points, the field dissipates, dropping the weapon to the ground, utterly helpless. The weapon does not require raising or healing, but can instead form a new body force by expending a spell slot of 1st level or higher. The force regenerates HP at the rate of 1 per round. A sentient weapon gains feats as a fighter of its own level. sunderproof If a sentient weapon is targetted by a "sunder", attempt, the attempt automatically fails unless the weapon is somehow rendered helpless and incapable of motion (by supressing its body with an antimagic field, for example). A sundered sentient weapon is effectively dead, unless it can be reconstructed and a resurrection spell of some description cast on the repaired weapon. A "reincarnation" spell and "true resurrection" act as normal, transferring the sentience of the weapon into a new (living) body or else recreating the weapon as good as new, even if it was totally destroyed. Sentient weapons apply their STR bonus to their AC. This bonus is lost if the weaapon somehow finds itself wearing armour or wielding a shield (either of which would first have to be ghost touched in order to be "worn" by the body force) Sentient weapons have an enhancement equal to their charisma bonus. this bonus is always at leas +1 for being a magical, masterwork weapon. At 1st level, the weapon gains the following bonus feats: Weapon specialization (itself), weapon focus (itself). At 3rd level, the sentient weapon gains the "power attack" feat. At 5th level, the weapon gains the "combat expertise" and "cleave" feats. At 7th level, the weapon gains the "Improved sunder" feat At 10th level, the weapon gains the bous feats Great weapon Specialization itself) and Greater Weapon focus (itself). At 13th level, the weapon gains the "Great Cleave" feat. Sentient weapons also gain feats as if they were a human fighter At 4th level, and every 4 levels thereafter (so 4th, 8th, 12th, 16th and 20th), a sentient weapon may choose to gain an addition +1 enhancement bonus (this is allowed to cause the weapon to exceed the normal +5 limit on enhancement bonuses - sentient weapons are far more powerful than their more common kin), or may select any one magical property (such as keen, Vorpal, or Holy) that is allowed by its damage type and alignment. Using items and equipment: Being powerful magical items and pieces of equipment in themselves, sentient weapons are not usually permitted to use equipment. they are capable of carrying items as if they were a small character (the items are stored in an extradimensional space), but are not capable of employing many of the items they carry unless the item in question can somehow feasibly be combined with the weapon (by fitting a ring into the pommel, for example). The exception to this rule is that any ghost touched items may be manipulated by the weapon via its force body as normal. ...that's one way of handling it. I'd be inclined to tell your player that the whole idea is just too difficult and complicated to do properly, and that he'd be better off taking something a bit more conventional.
WCH 05-16-05, 07:53 PM	Heh, this thread reminds me of a discussion I had with one of my players the other day... we were looking at the SRD under Epic Obstacles, specifically the door page, and found the idea of an "epic door" quite amusing. "My level 18 wizard wishes to multiclass into door. Is that okay?" :D Result is an oddly flat looking character, for whom "hold portal" functions but not "hold person" or "hold monster," among other things. :rolleyes:
reaperofnazgul 05-16-05, 08:16 PM	Why not give the sword stats, and apply them all to a "host" body? Like a peasant girl... Whom while wielding the sword has a str 17, dex 15, con 18, int 12, wis 15, cha 12 or whatever abilities the sword gives. Has HP equal to a 5th level "fighter ect." OMG attack of the 3 year olds with intelligent weapons!!! OH MY GOD THE THREE YEAR OLD JUST SNAPPED THE WIZARDS NECK!!!! OH NO!! NOT THAT AARRRGGHHH!!!
Always-Late 05-16-05, 08:58 PM	You could make it an everdancing (epic) weapon with the ability to use mage hand at will, with a hilt of holding. Anybody can try to grab on to him with a grapple check. Since you're size tiny (or small), you have a decent AC, and rings can be slipped onto the hilt. Sounds like an interesting, but stupid, concept. (Actually, I wanted to make an intelligent the BBEG in one of my games.)
nosoupforyou 05-16-05, 10:38 PM	Normally an intelligent item is played as an NPC by the DM. But I think that switching it from a NPC to a PC is perfectly legit. You keep the assigned int, wis, cha and simply add str, dex, and con is negated for it being an inantimate object. Str/dex could even be based on the power of the magic that brings the weapon to life. Maybe create a class kind of like the monster classes in Savage Species. Every few levels you get a str/dex increase and a new ability from the intelligent item table in DMG. I like it alot. - Soup