A Slap on the Wrist [Archive] - Wizards Community

A Slap on the Wrist [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Blacksworddragon
09-17-07, 11:33 AM I have a PC that causes trouble because he can and shows no remorse for his actions or interest in the well being of the group outside of battle. He's the highest level character (Rogue 7/Fighter 3) and he is notorious for high rolls.

I want to teach him a lesson in game but am reluctant to have the authorities approach because a) he's never been caught and b) he'd mop the floor with the average guards.

My question is what a good in game way of showing him I'm displeased without killing him or fudging rolls? (I roll very low btw)
Kamin_Majere
09-17-07, 11:38 AM have you tried to just talk to the player? Usually that will do the trick. If hes being a prat then tell him so.

If the Player wont stop at that point then tell them to stop or leave the game.

This game is about having fun (for everyone) but if the only way this person has fun is to disrupt the game for you and generally be a git then make them suffer consequences.

If you want something ingame... well if hes screwing with the city guard and the ruler finds out about it, then the ruler generally has alot of money and assassins are plentiful.
RobbyPants
09-17-07, 11:50 AM I agree 100% with Kamin_Majere on talking to said player. That will probably give you the best results.

Still, if you feel you need some in-game consequences, use the guards the first time. Assuming he mops the floor with their Warrior 1 butts, then the guards know they need to take more drastic measures. Have them post a bounty on said PC's head. Have the payment be some amount of gold, plus they can keep his items. Now, NPC adventurer types will start hunting him down.

When you think about it, how many times have the PCs had plot hooks like these? There are other bounty hunters out there other than the PCs... ;)
Einvaldurinn_mikli
09-17-07, 11:51 AM A message from his mother, where she scolds him.
JohnnyWeird
09-17-07, 12:05 PM Nobody likes a jerk. If the PC is a jerk, no exception need be made. I don't care how many ranks of diplomacy a guy has, being unpleasant to people makes them unlikely to help him. Hell, as he gets a reputation, he may get refused service at inns frequented by adventurers, nobles advertising quests may not purchase his services, or other adventurers may just haul off and belt him.
Alternately, try rewarding teamwork more intensely. Players who advance the party's goals or aid each other receive more XP. NPCs who have heard of their loyalty or generosity will be more free with information, items, assistance, etc.

Thomas the Hero: How much for a room?
Inkeeper: Your money's no good here. Enjoy your stay.
Mickey the Jerk: Sweet! Free rooms!
Innkeeper: Your money's no good here, either. Get out of my inn.
Kouk
09-17-07, 12:06 PM A message from his mother, where she scolds him.

Or, she helps set up a sting operation to capture him...
Blacksworddragon
09-17-07, 01:33 PM Nobody likes a jerk. If the PC is a jerk, no exception need be made. I don't care how many ranks of diplomacy a guy has, being unpleasant to people makes them unlikely to help him. Hell, as he gets a reputation, he may get refused service at inns frequented by adventurers, nobles advertising quests may not purchase his services, or other adventurers may just haul off and belt him.
Alternately, try rewarding teamwork more intensely. Players who advance the party's goals or aid each other receive more XP. NPCs who have heard of their loyalty or generosity will be more free with information, items, assistance, etc.

Thomas the Hero: How much for a room?
Inkeeper: Your money's no good here. Enjoy your stay.
Mickey the Jerk: Sweet! Free rooms!
Innkeeper: Your money's no good here, either. Get out of my inn.

Mickey the Jerk is a jerk, its part of his character so talking to the player won't change anything but a few players have mentioned their reluctance to roleplay when Mickey the Jerk is around because no amount of roleplaying makes up for when Mickey starts a fight and stabs NPCs from the shadows... I think I'll do like RobbyPants suggested and bring on the guards.
Mock26
09-17-07, 01:42 PM Why would someone trust others with their lives in battle and then act like a jerk towards them later on? If I relied on someone to help keep me alive I'd be sure to NOT be a jerk towards them, even if I didn't like them. So, as has been stated, talk to the player. He's not being a good team player, and both the player and the character need to be team players in order for the players to have fun and the characters stay alive.
JohnnyWeird
09-17-07, 01:47 PM Why involve the other PCs? He starts a fight, he can get it finished for him. If nobody else is fighting at his side, he can hardly justify vanishing into the shadows. If they dislike the experience that much, they've got no reason not to string him out to dry.
ghost_image
09-17-07, 08:46 PM How about sending a half-orc Bloodhound that captures him and have an Inquisitor....."investigate" any matters of NPC killing.
DyloniusFunk
09-18-07, 12:59 AM You're being awfully vague. What exactly does he do? Does he go around one shotting commoners, or is it just that he dosen't participate in out of dungeons activities? The first is easily dealt with, but if it's the second, well then so what? There's nothing that says that PCs have to like each other, they just have to work together to get the job done. Did you expect your PCs to sit in a circle around the campfire and sing Kom-Bi-Ya? As long as the fighter does his job it's up to him how much involvement he wants to have with the rest of the group and if his activities don't put the others at risk well then that's that.
Keladelros
09-18-07, 01:07 AM If hes really bad. Break out the Justiciars and the Bloodhounds on him. Bring him to justice.

If he's being a jerk to people in the group and just a pain about the whole thing then I advise the following alongside of the afformentioned PrC's.

2 things will work. A well placed Disintigration spell OR talking to him out of game. Perhaps its time to kiss him goodbye.
FrostyObsitnic
09-18-07, 04:50 AM If hes really bad. Break out the Justiciars and the Bloodhounds on him. Bring him to justice.

If he's being a jerk to people in the group and just a pain about the whole thing then I advise the following alongside of the afformentioned PrC's.

2 things will work. A well placed Disintigration spell OR talking to him out of game. Perhaps its time to kiss him goodbye.

Damn. I was about to mention justicars. They're practically made for this sort of thing. Non-lethal damage plus a commitment to downing law-breakers.

Anyway, an in-game solution is alot better than an out of game solution IMO, because he's probably doing what he's doing because he knows he can get away with it. People like that often react to talkings-to by behaving worse rather than better.
buzzsawl
09-18-07, 07:11 AM Yeah...send some level 1&2 guards after him for breaking the law.

When he kills them, send a squad of guards of around 3-5th level, investigating the killings of previous guards.

When he kills those, step it up a little more.

Continue until he wises up (or is captured or killed).

He may figure it out by the time he's facing a party of epic adventurers, hired by the king to capture a mass murderer.
calronmoonflower
09-19-07, 02:52 AM Rule 1 for Player and Dungeon Master problems: talk to them.

If this doesn't work just remember that all guards do not have to be average. I see no reason that he cannot find himself facing down and party of adventures that are moonlighting as guards. Especially in a larger community.

Of course if there is a good aligned temple nearby a couple of optimized clerics can bowl over a party extremely well.
DInDenver
09-19-07, 12:07 PM Hi!
That has to be a cardinal rule. Do not try and manage out of game issues in game. EVER.
First, try and talk to them in private. Away from the group. People are less likely to e defensive if its one on one.
If this does not work, do it intervention style. Have everyone say that they want them in the group, but that he needs to clean up his act.
Finally, Lay down the law, give them ultimatum and stick to it. It important not to enter this phase unless everyone agrees. don't make an ultimatum that you can;t follow up on.
And if they are a friend outside of the game group, make sure they know that this is only in regards to the game group, not other parts of your friendship.

Check this out:
http://sean.chittenden.org/humor/www.plausiblydeniable.com/opinion/gsf.html
Its not 100% accurate, but it might help you identify some dysfunction in your group...
Good luck!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Blacksworddragon 09-17-07, 11:33 AM	I have a PC that causes trouble because he can and shows no remorse for his actions or interest in the well being of the group outside of battle. He's the highest level character (Rogue 7/Fighter 3) and he is notorious for high rolls. I want to teach him a lesson in game but am reluctant to have the authorities approach because a) he's never been caught and b) he'd mop the floor with the average guards. My question is what a good in game way of showing him I'm displeased without killing him or fudging rolls? (I roll very low btw)
Kamin_Majere 09-17-07, 11:38 AM	have you tried to just talk to the player? Usually that will do the trick. If hes being a prat then tell him so. If the Player wont stop at that point then tell them to stop or leave the game. This game is about having fun (for everyone) but if the only way this person has fun is to disrupt the game for you and generally be a git then make them suffer consequences. If you want something ingame... well if hes screwing with the city guard and the ruler finds out about it, then the ruler generally has alot of money and assassins are plentiful.
RobbyPants 09-17-07, 11:50 AM	I agree 100% with Kamin_Majere on talking to said player. That will probably give you the best results. Still, if you feel you need some in-game consequences, use the guards the first time. Assuming he mops the floor with their Warrior 1 butts, then the guards know they need to take more drastic measures. Have them post a bounty on said PC's head. Have the payment be some amount of gold, plus they can keep his items. Now, NPC adventurer types will start hunting him down. When you think about it, how many times have the PCs had plot hooks like these? There are other bounty hunters out there other than the PCs... ;)
Einvaldurinn_mikli 09-17-07, 11:51 AM	A message from his mother, where she scolds him.
JohnnyWeird 09-17-07, 12:05 PM	Nobody likes a jerk. If the PC is a jerk, no exception need be made. I don't care how many ranks of diplomacy a guy has, being unpleasant to people makes them unlikely to help him. Hell, as he gets a reputation, he may get refused service at inns frequented by adventurers, nobles advertising quests may not purchase his services, or other adventurers may just haul off and belt him. Alternately, try rewarding teamwork more intensely. Players who advance the party's goals or aid each other receive more XP. NPCs who have heard of their loyalty or generosity will be more free with information, items, assistance, etc. Thomas the Hero: How much for a room? Inkeeper: Your money's no good here. Enjoy your stay. Mickey the Jerk: Sweet! Free rooms! Innkeeper: Your money's no good here, either. Get out of my inn.
Kouk 09-17-07, 12:06 PM	A message from his mother, where she scolds him. Or, she helps set up a sting operation to capture him...
Blacksworddragon 09-17-07, 01:33 PM	Nobody likes a jerk. If the PC is a jerk, no exception need be made. I don't care how many ranks of diplomacy a guy has, being unpleasant to people makes them unlikely to help him. Hell, as he gets a reputation, he may get refused service at inns frequented by adventurers, nobles advertising quests may not purchase his services, or other adventurers may just haul off and belt him. Alternately, try rewarding teamwork more intensely. Players who advance the party's goals or aid each other receive more XP. NPCs who have heard of their loyalty or generosity will be more free with information, items, assistance, etc. Thomas the Hero: How much for a room? Inkeeper: Your money's no good here. Enjoy your stay. Mickey the Jerk: Sweet! Free rooms! Innkeeper: Your money's no good here, either. Get out of my inn. Mickey the Jerk is a jerk, its part of his character so talking to the player won't change anything but a few players have mentioned their reluctance to roleplay when Mickey the Jerk is around because no amount of roleplaying makes up for when Mickey starts a fight and stabs NPCs from the shadows... I think I'll do like RobbyPants suggested and bring on the guards.
Mock26 09-17-07, 01:42 PM	Why would someone trust others with their lives in battle and then act like a jerk towards them later on? If I relied on someone to help keep me alive I'd be sure to NOT be a jerk towards them, even if I didn't like them. So, as has been stated, talk to the player. He's not being a good team player, and both the player and the character need to be team players in order for the players to have fun and the characters stay alive.
JohnnyWeird 09-17-07, 01:47 PM	Why involve the other PCs? He starts a fight, he can get it finished for him. If nobody else is fighting at his side, he can hardly justify vanishing into the shadows. If they dislike the experience that much, they've got no reason not to string him out to dry.
ghost_image 09-17-07, 08:46 PM	How about sending a half-orc Bloodhound that captures him and have an Inquisitor....."investigate" any matters of NPC killing.
DyloniusFunk 09-18-07, 12:59 AM	You're being awfully vague. What exactly does he do? Does he go around one shotting commoners, or is it just that he dosen't participate in out of dungeons activities? The first is easily dealt with, but if it's the second, well then so what? There's nothing that says that PCs have to like each other, they just have to work together to get the job done. Did you expect your PCs to sit in a circle around the campfire and sing Kom-Bi-Ya? As long as the fighter does his job it's up to him how much involvement he wants to have with the rest of the group and if his activities don't put the others at risk well then that's that.
Keladelros 09-18-07, 01:07 AM	If hes really bad. Break out the Justiciars and the Bloodhounds on him. Bring him to justice. If he's being a jerk to people in the group and just a pain about the whole thing then I advise the following alongside of the afformentioned PrC's. 2 things will work. A well placed Disintigration spell OR talking to him out of game. Perhaps its time to kiss him goodbye.
FrostyObsitnic 09-18-07, 04:50 AM	If hes really bad. Break out the Justiciars and the Bloodhounds on him. Bring him to justice. If he's being a jerk to people in the group and just a pain about the whole thing then I advise the following alongside of the afformentioned PrC's. 2 things will work. A well placed Disintigration spell OR talking to him out of game. Perhaps its time to kiss him goodbye. Damn. I was about to mention justicars. They're practically made for this sort of thing. Non-lethal damage plus a commitment to downing law-breakers. Anyway, an in-game solution is alot better than an out of game solution IMO, because he's probably doing what he's doing because he knows he can get away with it. People like that often react to talkings-to by behaving worse rather than better.
buzzsawl 09-18-07, 07:11 AM	Yeah...send some level 1&2 guards after him for breaking the law. When he kills them, send a squad of guards of around 3-5th level, investigating the killings of previous guards. When he kills those, step it up a little more. Continue until he wises up (or is captured or killed). He may figure it out by the time he's facing a party of epic adventurers, hired by the king to capture a mass murderer.
calronmoonflower 09-19-07, 02:52 AM	Rule 1 for Player and Dungeon Master problems: talk to them. If this doesn't work just remember that all guards do not have to be average. I see no reason that he cannot find himself facing down and party of adventures that are moonlighting as guards. Especially in a larger community. Of course if there is a good aligned temple nearby a couple of optimized clerics can bowl over a party extremely well.
DInDenver 09-19-07, 12:07 PM	Hi! That has to be a cardinal rule. Do not try and manage out of game issues in game. EVER. First, try and talk to them in private. Away from the group. People are less likely to e defensive if its one on one. If this does not work, do it intervention style. Have everyone say that they want them in the group, but that he needs to clean up his act. Finally, Lay down the law, give them ultimatum and stick to it. It important not to enter this phase unless everyone agrees. don't make an ultimatum that you can;t follow up on. And if they are a friend outside of the game group, make sure they know that this is only in regards to the game group, not other parts of your friendship. Check this out: http://sean.chittenden.org/humor/www.plausiblydeniable.com/opinion/gsf.html Its not 100% accurate, but it might help you identify some dysfunction in your group... Good luck!