Accidental favoritism? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Accidental favoritism? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
green_yawgmoth
09-13-05, 03:11 PM A thought occured to me a moment ago, while contemplating past sessions of my Eberron game. Is it possible that a DM could show favoritism to a certain player on accident? So far, we've had all of maybe 5-6 combats, and I have one character (whose player happens to be my girlfriend) who has yet to take damage. On the one hand, it might be because she stays away from the creatures and manages to deal a considerable amount of damage with Prismatic Ray and Acid Orb (T&B version); but I can't shake the feeling that I'm letting her character get away with not getting attacked because I like her and her character, and she's new to the game. Thoughts?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
john_045412
09-13-05, 03:31 PM It is absolutely possible to be unintentionally favoring someone... but you knew that or you would not have brought it up.

Obviously being a non-melee class she will encounter less attacks in general. But just make sure that every once in a while a ranged opponent targets the weak caster in the back.

Random dice rolls for targets seem silly to me, but if you are really worried about it, give each creature a % to attack each opponent. Higher for obvious and easy threats, lower for non-threatening or difficult to reach players.
Bruunwald
09-13-05, 03:34 PM It's good of you to question yourself. It says that you are concerned with being fair and impartial and with an appearance of propriety.

Obviously, you have not intended to spare her, or you wouldn't be asking the question. While it is possible to act to some degree subconsciously, it's probably more likely that other forces have intervened here. Before you punish yourself, think over what sorts of battles these have been.

My wife is in our game, and gets damaged plenty enough. A close friend is also in the game, and he suffers from time to time. However, my wife plays the elf ranger (archer) and the friend plays the mage. Both are usually firing from a distance. If I give them five or so standup fights in a row, it's a possibility (and it has happened) that one or both of them might not be harmed.

The best thing to do, in order to challenge your girlfriend, is to break up the opponents into multiple mobile groups or targets, throw in a few ranged attackers on the other side, or create an NPC who is out to get her, even if just for a single combat. That ought to even the field well enough.
wonlee76
09-13-05, 03:35 PM It's the character concept. Spellcasters are hard to target in a typical combat encounter unless you have your own spellcasters or range attack types on your side of the screen. I'm sure the meatshields jump right into melee protecting the spellcasters and archers so its kind of tough to strategically attack the spellcasters unless you use similar tactics as the players.

Play your monsters and enemies as intelligently to make sense. Maybe the goblins/orcs/gnolls might ignore the spellcaster for the first round of combat but after the first blast, they should be looking to try to get rid of the threat as fast as possible (all archers and opposing spellcasters will target the sorceress). My PCs do that to me all the time. They identify the enemy spellcaster and immediately take him out before anyone else. Its smart tactics and can't blame the players for fighting in that fashion.
TheErsatzFacsimileOfMe
09-13-05, 03:36 PM Well, it could be you are showing a slight bit of favor. I would certainly think so as a player in your gaming group.

A few quick and dirty solutions:

1. Once she starts blasting the crap out of stuff...she becomes the new "prime target". So, unless the party actively protects her, she's what everyone is gunning for. It sounds slightly unfair but think about it. If you were standing there and someone was punching you, and then someone else threw a huge rock at you, who is the bigger threat?

2. Have the players pick a number between 1-10, who ever is closest is the next target (I use this one alot when gaming with my wife, otherwise the other players think I'm going easy on her, but consequently she'll think I'm picking on her.) It leaves some of it more up to "luck of the draw".

3. Talk to your group, without your g/f around, and see what they think.

4. Talk to your g/f and see what she thinks.

5. Don't change a thing and wait for someone to bring it to you.
AlphaSquirell
09-13-05, 03:42 PM A few things I would personally do in this situation:

Pick one of the non-favorite players, and ask them if you think it looks like favoritism. (pick someone who won't really be angry if it does look like favoritism, someone who would be most likely to be neutral about it)

Have SOMETHING escape a fight with the PCs. Then, they know how dangerous she is, and the next fight might be more about the PCs protecting her than about defeating the enemy. (when they ambush the PCs JUST to attack her, because she is a threat)

Keep playing as is, and if someone points out favoritism, tell them you noticed weren't intending for it, and then make it obvious that you aren't going to do favoritism. (have something charger past fighters of the group, and make her the primary target, or have a trap go off on her that all others avoid, but not anything too major, so she doesn't get mad at you for it)
green_yawgmoth
09-13-05, 10:17 PM Thanks all for the replies. Their next battle is against their first BBEG, who is a fleshwarper. He'll most definitely be giving everyone something to deal with in some form. Usually I just drop the enemies onto the board where I think they'd be, and have them attack how I assume a creature of X int would attack. Usually it's average int melee monsters, so they just run in and attack whoever's nearest unless someone else becomes a bigger threat.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Lord Gwydion
09-14-05, 12:57 AM Well, even average Int creatures should be able to figure out the advantages and disadvantages of using a bow compared to those of using an axe. Especially if the pesky interloper adventurers use both of them effectively.

Most humanoid creatures have a ranged attack listed in their stat block, even if it is a measley javelin or thrown dagger. So the next fight versus a group of humanoids should have a variety of weapons (a few with close melee weapons, a few with reach melee weapons, and a few with ranged weapons) to spice up the combat.

For battles against single or paired non-humanoids, it can be easier for a caster or archer to stay out of range. If most encounters are with a single creature with a CR equal to the group's level or a pair with a EL of the level, then it's a good chance a caster or archer will take very little damage unless the creature has spells or spell-like abilities of its own, or a ranged attack.

When fighting creatures like this, a good tactic is to have it fight defensively for a few rounds, using its ranged attacks on dangerous casters/archers, and hoping its upped AC will protect it from the nasty meleers at its heels.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
green_yawgmoth 09-13-05, 03:11 PM	A thought occured to me a moment ago, while contemplating past sessions of my Eberron game. Is it possible that a DM could show favoritism to a certain player on accident? So far, we've had all of maybe 5-6 combats, and I have one character (whose player happens to be my girlfriend) who has yet to take damage. On the one hand, it might be because she stays away from the creatures and manages to deal a considerable amount of damage with Prismatic Ray and Acid Orb (T&B version); but I can't shake the feeling that I'm letting her character get away with not getting attacked because I like her and her character, and she's new to the game. Thoughts? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
john_045412 09-13-05, 03:31 PM	It is absolutely possible to be unintentionally favoring someone... but you knew that or you would not have brought it up. Obviously being a non-melee class she will encounter less attacks in general. But just make sure that every once in a while a ranged opponent targets the weak caster in the back. Random dice rolls for targets seem silly to me, but if you are really worried about it, give each creature a % to attack each opponent. Higher for obvious and easy threats, lower for non-threatening or difficult to reach players.
Bruunwald 09-13-05, 03:34 PM	It's good of you to question yourself. It says that you are concerned with being fair and impartial and with an appearance of propriety. Obviously, you have not intended to spare her, or you wouldn't be asking the question. While it is possible to act to some degree subconsciously, it's probably more likely that other forces have intervened here. Before you punish yourself, think over what sorts of battles these have been. My wife is in our game, and gets damaged plenty enough. A close friend is also in the game, and he suffers from time to time. However, my wife plays the elf ranger (archer) and the friend plays the mage. Both are usually firing from a distance. If I give them five or so standup fights in a row, it's a possibility (and it has happened) that one or both of them might not be harmed. The best thing to do, in order to challenge your girlfriend, is to break up the opponents into multiple mobile groups or targets, throw in a few ranged attackers on the other side, or create an NPC who is out to get her, even if just for a single combat. That ought to even the field well enough.
wonlee76 09-13-05, 03:35 PM	It's the character concept. Spellcasters are hard to target in a typical combat encounter unless you have your own spellcasters or range attack types on your side of the screen. I'm sure the meatshields jump right into melee protecting the spellcasters and archers so its kind of tough to strategically attack the spellcasters unless you use similar tactics as the players. Play your monsters and enemies as intelligently to make sense. Maybe the goblins/orcs/gnolls might ignore the spellcaster for the first round of combat but after the first blast, they should be looking to try to get rid of the threat as fast as possible (all archers and opposing spellcasters will target the sorceress). My PCs do that to me all the time. They identify the enemy spellcaster and immediately take him out before anyone else. Its smart tactics and can't blame the players for fighting in that fashion.
TheErsatzFacsimileOfMe 09-13-05, 03:36 PM	Well, it could be you are showing a slight bit of favor. I would certainly think so as a player in your gaming group. A few quick and dirty solutions: 1. Once she starts blasting the crap out of stuff...she becomes the new "prime target". So, unless the party actively protects her, she's what everyone is gunning for. It sounds slightly unfair but think about it. If you were standing there and someone was punching you, and then someone else threw a huge rock at you, who is the bigger threat? 2. Have the players pick a number between 1-10, who ever is closest is the next target (I use this one alot when gaming with my wife, otherwise the other players think I'm going easy on her, but consequently she'll think I'm picking on her.) It leaves some of it more up to "luck of the draw". 3. Talk to your group, without your g/f around, and see what they think. 4. Talk to your g/f and see what she thinks. 5. Don't change a thing and wait for someone to bring it to you.
AlphaSquirell 09-13-05, 03:42 PM	A few things I would personally do in this situation: Pick one of the non-favorite players, and ask them if you think it looks like favoritism. (pick someone who won't really be angry if it does look like favoritism, someone who would be most likely to be neutral about it) Have SOMETHING escape a fight with the PCs. Then, they know how dangerous she is, and the next fight might be more about the PCs protecting her than about defeating the enemy. (when they ambush the PCs JUST to attack her, because she is a threat) Keep playing as is, and if someone points out favoritism, tell them you noticed weren't intending for it, and then make it obvious that you aren't going to do favoritism. (have something charger past fighters of the group, and make her the primary target, or have a trap go off on her that all others avoid, but not anything too major, so she doesn't get mad at you for it)
green_yawgmoth 09-13-05, 10:17 PM	Thanks all for the replies. Their next battle is against their first BBEG, who is a fleshwarper. He'll most definitely be giving everyone something to deal with in some form. Usually I just drop the enemies onto the board where I think they'd be, and have them attack how I assume a creature of X int would attack. Usually it's average int melee monsters, so they just run in and attack whoever's nearest unless someone else becomes a bigger threat. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Lord Gwydion 09-14-05, 12:57 AM	Well, even average Int creatures should be able to figure out the advantages and disadvantages of using a bow compared to those of using an axe. Especially if the pesky interloper adventurers use both of them effectively. Most humanoid creatures have a ranged attack listed in their stat block, even if it is a measley javelin or thrown dagger. So the next fight versus a group of humanoids should have a variety of weapons (a few with close melee weapons, a few with reach melee weapons, and a few with ranged weapons) to spice up the combat. For battles against single or paired non-humanoids, it can be easier for a caster or archer to stay out of range. If most encounters are with a single creature with a CR equal to the group's level or a pair with a EL of the level, then it's a good chance a caster or archer will take very little damage unless the creature has spells or spell-like abilities of its own, or a ranged attack. When fighting creatures like this, a good tactic is to have it fight defensively for a few rounds, using its ranged attacks on dangerous casters/archers, and hoping its upped AC will protect it from the nasty meleers at its heels.