Acid Damage? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Acid Damage? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Xarrith
10-09-03, 01:31 PM My DM and I are having trouble figuring something out about acid damage. First, a black dragon spat acid at us, and we have no idea how to handle the damage done to the metal we were wearing, although we handled the physical damage according to the module, and that was fine.

Next, an ooze (I forgot which one) should have destroyed my character's weapon, I'm pretty sure, but the DM and I can't figure out how to determine how much acid damage the weapon took.

Can someone point me to some pages in the 3.0 books to help resolve the question of "How does acid affect metal armor and weapons?"

Any help would be appreciated.
lorddark17
10-09-03, 01:41 PM You know... it is really simple from an Real-Life perspective.

It is all about chemistry!

Let's say your iron weapon reacts with acid. If acid touch it, the weapon will automaticly "destroy" the weapon. By destroying I mean that even if you can still grab the sword and fight with it, you'll have a lot of problem with it since the acid will have created imbalance in it.

If iron does't react with acid, well, nothing important happen...

Now to know if iron react with acid... well the DM is the one who knows it... but if someone got a book about chemistry who talks about Iron and Chlorine Acid... well you got your answer, lol.

Just think about the glass bottle that have the acid in it, lol. Why is the glass not destroyed by the acid?
NobodyReadsThis
10-09-03, 02:06 PM Please ignore everything lorddark said. not beacuse it is hogwash, but because it doesn't apply.

Weapons and armor are attended objects. As such, they don't take damage from area affects unless specified otherwise. So the armor would hav been fine after the acid bath from the dragon.

What kind of ooze was it? It should say in the MM description whether or not weapons touching it are destroyed or not.
Chobemaster
10-09-03, 03:00 PM I've got to agree with Nobody Reads this, and thereby invalidate his moniker, but affirm his idea.

Also, several types of acid in game don't really respect any chemical laws as we understand them.
bitnine
10-09-03, 03:06 PM Indeed. As an additional note, if an object happens to be specifically targetted with energy damage, you first halve that damage, then apply it normally (including hardness). Exceptions to this is that cold damage does 1/4th and sonic energy does full damage to objects.

The ooze would have a note in its description if it had any automatically destroyed armor of weaponry, though. I don't see it specifically targeting a weapon/shield or somesuch, unless you're, say, using a tower shield for full cover.
NobodyReadsThis
10-09-03, 03:14 PM Originally posted by Chobemaster
I've got to agree with Nobody Reads this, and thereby invalidate his moniker, but affirm his idea. Auuuuugh!!!

*Gets Invalidated*

That's 3 posters that have noticed that My SN has changed. ;) Not many have - which is why I have that SN inthe first place. Most posters read the sig and look at the picture without reading the SN.
Xarrith
10-09-03, 04:03 PM Originally posted by NobodyReadsThis
What kind of ooze was it? It should say in the MM description whether or not weapons touching it are destroyed or not.

Okay, I found it. Here goes:
MM, 3.0, pp. 145-146

Gray Ooze
Skip to...
Acid (Ex): A gray ooze secretes a digestive acid that quickly dissolves organic material and metal. Any melee hit deals acid damage.
The ooze's acidic touch deals 40 points of damage per round to wood or metal objects. Armor or clothing dissolves and becomes useless immediately unless it succeeds at a Reflex save (DC 19). The acid cannot harm stone. A metal or wooden weapon that strikes a gray ooze also dissolves immediately unless it succeeds at a Reflex save (DC 19).

My trouble is, I don't know how to do a Reflex save for my clothes and weapons. I also don't know how many hit points my clothes and weapons have. Nor does the DM. We looked, but simply can't seem to locate the proper pages in the DMG.

I guess it's *me* that does the Reflex save *for* my weapons and clothes. But, that still leaves me with not knowing how many hit points my clothes and weapons had, although I am guessing my clothes were probably toast, I find it hard to imagine that any piece of regular clothing can take "40 points of damage per round" and still remain wearable. Perhaps that is what is meant by "dissolves immediately"--I am meant to understand from that phrase that NO weapons or clothing can withstand the damage? That's what it sounds like, but that's quite the formidable acid for a CR 4 creature, though not outside the realm of my believability. Thanks for your responses so far :)

Edited CR7 corrected to CR4.
Joe Gold
10-09-03, 04:36 PM Originally posted by NobodyReadsThis

That's 3 posters that have noticed that My SN has changed. ;) Not many have - which is why I have that SN inthe first place. Most posters read the sig and look at the picture without reading the SN.

I noticed, I just don't have the impulsive urge to respond to everything I see. ...wait a second, d'oh.
NobodyReadsThis
10-09-03, 06:06 PM Originally posted by Xarrith
I guess it's *me* that does the Reflex save *for* my weapons and clothes. But, that still leaves me with not knowing how many hit points my clothes and weapons had, although I am guessing my clothes were probably toast, I find it hard to imagine that any piece of regular clothing can take "40 points of damage per round" and still remain wearable. Perhaps that is what is meant by "dissolves immediately"--I am meant to understand from that phrase that NO weapons or clothing can withstand the damage? That's what it sounds like, but that's quite the formidable acid for a CR 7 creature, though not outside the realm of my believability. Thanks for your responses so far :) [/B] Ah, now I understand. First of all, as attended objects the character rolls the saves. Unattended have their own saves. Now for the fun stuff - the failed save.

Look in the PHB under Breaking an Item. It gives hardness and HP ratings for most common items and materials. Since it is acid damage, subtract the hardness, and that's how much damage the weapon, armor, or material takes. This is from the SRD:
Weapon Type (Hardness, HP)
Light blade (10, 2)
One-handed blade (10, 5)
Two-handed blade (10, 10)
Light metal-hafted weapon (10, 10)
One-handed metal-hafted weapon (10, 20)
Two-handed metal-hafted weapon (10, 30) *
Light hafted weapon (5, 2)
One-handed hafted weapon (5, 5)
Two-handed hafted weapon (5, 10)
Projectile weapon (5, 5)
Armor (see material, Armor Bonus x 5)
Buckler (10, 5)
Light wooden shield (5, 7)
Heavy wooden shield (5, 15)
Light steel shield (10, 10)
Heavy steel shield (10, 20)
Tower shield (5, 20)

Magical items add (+2, +10) for each +1 enhancement.

*Best Guess. This isn't actually on the list so I extrapolated. ;)

Armor Material Hardness
Paper or cloth 0
Rope 0
Glass 1
Ice 0
Leather or hide 2
Wood 5
Stone 8
Iron or steel 10
Mithral 15
Adamantine 20

Well, that's how ye figure it out. So a weapon takes 30 hp of damage a round normally. There's only a few weapons in the entirety of the system that could possibly withstand more than a single rounds worth of acid damage!!!

As for yer armor, that all depends on what kind it is. *shrug* I hope this helps ye out as much as it can. I'll include the formula for used to figure out Item damage, okay?

Acid and Sonic Damage to Items
Damage - Hardness = Damage dealt

Fire and Electricity
Damage/2 - hardness = damage dealt

Cold
Damage/4 - hardness = damage dealt.
Xarrith
10-09-03, 06:55 PM That does indeed help a great deal! Given what I now understand about this gray ooze, I am glad we are on RttToEE. (That one was in Forge of Fury, I think). I believe my character would have been dead altogether, as the ooze successfully grabbed her and sucked her in...I at least envisioned her caught *in* the ooze. I'm not sure that's what the DM meant though.

Regardless of whether she survived it or not, she should certainly have spent the rest of the dungeon crawl as a naked and weaponless halfling. *Very glad we didn't understand about the gray ooze*

Thank you so much for your help :)
Evil Spearman
10-10-03, 03:32 AM Glad I could help. (This is NRT, but some banning because of other issues has me playing roulette with Screen Names)
bitnine
10-10-03, 12:30 PM Good catch, I had completely forgot that acid did full damage as well as sonic. That's what I get for working off memory.
Evil Spearman
10-10-03, 12:42 PM Originally posted by bitnine
Good catch, I had completely forgot that acid did full damage as well as sonic. That's what I get for working off memory. I didn't catch it until I went looking for the actual tables myself. In 3.0 they still take half from acid. 3.5 they take full. ;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Xarrith 10-09-03, 01:31 PM	My DM and I are having trouble figuring something out about acid damage. First, a black dragon spat acid at us, and we have no idea how to handle the damage done to the metal we were wearing, although we handled the physical damage according to the module, and that was fine. Next, an ooze (I forgot which one) should have destroyed my character's weapon, I'm pretty sure, but the DM and I can't figure out how to determine how much acid damage the weapon took. Can someone point me to some pages in the 3.0 books to help resolve the question of "How does acid affect metal armor and weapons?" Any help would be appreciated.
lorddark17 10-09-03, 01:41 PM	You know... it is really simple from an Real-Life perspective. It is all about chemistry! Let's say your iron weapon reacts with acid. If acid touch it, the weapon will automaticly "destroy" the weapon. By destroying I mean that even if you can still grab the sword and fight with it, you'll have a lot of problem with it since the acid will have created imbalance in it. If iron does't react with acid, well, nothing important happen... Now to know if iron react with acid... well the DM is the one who knows it... but if someone got a book about chemistry who talks about Iron and Chlorine Acid... well you got your answer, lol. Just think about the glass bottle that have the acid in it, lol. Why is the glass not destroyed by the acid?
NobodyReadsThis 10-09-03, 02:06 PM	Please ignore everything lorddark said. not beacuse it is hogwash, but because it doesn't apply. Weapons and armor are attended objects. As such, they don't take damage from area affects unless specified otherwise. So the armor would hav been fine after the acid bath from the dragon. What kind of ooze was it? It should say in the MM description whether or not weapons touching it are destroyed or not.
Chobemaster 10-09-03, 03:00 PM	I've got to agree with Nobody Reads this, and thereby invalidate his moniker, but affirm his idea. Also, several types of acid in game don't really respect any chemical laws as we understand them.
bitnine 10-09-03, 03:06 PM	Indeed. As an additional note, if an object happens to be specifically targetted with energy damage, you first halve that damage, then apply it normally (including hardness). Exceptions to this is that cold damage does 1/4th and sonic energy does full damage to objects. The ooze would have a note in its description if it had any automatically destroyed armor of weaponry, though. I don't see it specifically targeting a weapon/shield or somesuch, unless you're, say, using a tower shield for full cover.
NobodyReadsThis 10-09-03, 03:14 PM	Originally posted by Chobemaster I've got to agree with Nobody Reads this, and thereby invalidate his moniker, but affirm his idea. Auuuuugh!!! Gets Invalidated That's 3 posters that have noticed that My SN has changed. ;) Not many have - which is why I have that SN inthe first place. Most posters read the sig and look at the picture without reading the SN.
Xarrith 10-09-03, 04:03 PM	Originally posted by NobodyReadsThis What kind of ooze was it? It should say in the MM description whether or not weapons touching it are destroyed or not. Okay, I found it. Here goes: MM, 3.0, pp. 145-146 Gray Ooze Skip to... Acid (Ex): A gray ooze secretes a digestive acid that quickly dissolves organic material and metal. Any melee hit deals acid damage. The ooze's acidic touch deals 40 points of damage per round to wood or metal objects. Armor or clothing dissolves and becomes useless immediately unless it succeeds at a Reflex save (DC 19). The acid cannot harm stone. A metal or wooden weapon that strikes a gray ooze also dissolves immediately unless it succeeds at a Reflex save (DC 19). My trouble is, I don't know how to do a Reflex save for my clothes and weapons. I also don't know how many hit points my clothes and weapons have. Nor does the DM. We looked, but simply can't seem to locate the proper pages in the DMG. I guess it's me that does the Reflex save for my weapons and clothes. But, that still leaves me with not knowing how many hit points my clothes and weapons had, although I am guessing my clothes were probably toast, I find it hard to imagine that any piece of regular clothing can take "40 points of damage per round" and still remain wearable. Perhaps that is what is meant by "dissolves immediately"--I am meant to understand from that phrase that NO weapons or clothing can withstand the damage? That's what it sounds like, but that's quite the formidable acid for a CR 4 creature, though not outside the realm of my believability. Thanks for your responses so far :) Edited CR7 corrected to CR4.
Joe Gold 10-09-03, 04:36 PM	Originally posted by NobodyReadsThis That's 3 posters that have noticed that My SN has changed. ;) Not many have - which is why I have that SN inthe first place. Most posters read the sig and look at the picture without reading the SN. I noticed, I just don't have the impulsive urge to respond to everything I see. ...wait a second, d'oh.
NobodyReadsThis 10-09-03, 06:06 PM	Originally posted by Xarrith I guess it's me that does the Reflex save for my weapons and clothes. But, that still leaves me with not knowing how many hit points my clothes and weapons had, although I am guessing my clothes were probably toast, I find it hard to imagine that any piece of regular clothing can take "40 points of damage per round" and still remain wearable. Perhaps that is what is meant by "dissolves immediately"--I am meant to understand from that phrase that NO weapons or clothing can withstand the damage? That's what it sounds like, but that's quite the formidable acid for a CR 7 creature, though not outside the realm of my believability. Thanks for your responses so far :) [/B] Ah, now I understand. First of all, as attended objects the character rolls the saves. Unattended have their own saves. Now for the fun stuff - the failed save. Look in the PHB under Breaking an Item. It gives hardness and HP ratings for most common items and materials. Since it is acid damage, subtract the hardness, and that's how much damage the weapon, armor, or material takes. This is from the SRD: Weapon Type (Hardness, HP) Light blade (10, 2) One-handed blade (10, 5) Two-handed blade (10, 10) Light metal-hafted weapon (10, 10) One-handed metal-hafted weapon (10, 20) Two-handed metal-hafted weapon (10, 30) * Light hafted weapon (5, 2) One-handed hafted weapon (5, 5) Two-handed hafted weapon (5, 10) Projectile weapon (5, 5) Armor (see material, Armor Bonus x 5) Buckler (10, 5) Light wooden shield (5, 7) Heavy wooden shield (5, 15) Light steel shield (10, 10) Heavy steel shield (10, 20) Tower shield (5, 20) Magical items add (+2, +10) for each +1 enhancement. Best Guess. This isn't actually on the list so I extrapolated. ;) Armor Material Hardness Paper or cloth 0 Rope 0 Glass 1 Ice 0 Leather or hide 2 Wood 5 Stone 8 Iron or steel 10 Mithral 15 Adamantine 20 Well, that's how ye figure it out. So a weapon takes 30 hp of damage a round normally. There's only a few weapons in the entirety of the system that could possibly withstand more than a single rounds worth of acid damage!!! As for yer armor, that all depends on what kind it is. shrug* I hope this helps ye out as much as it can. I'll include the formula for used to figure out Item damage, okay? Acid and Sonic Damage to Items Damage - Hardness = Damage dealt Fire and Electricity Damage/2 - hardness = damage dealt Cold Damage/4 - hardness = damage dealt.
Xarrith 10-09-03, 06:55 PM	That does indeed help a great deal! Given what I now understand about this gray ooze, I am glad we are on RttToEE. (That one was in Forge of Fury, I think). I believe my character would have been dead altogether, as the ooze successfully grabbed her and sucked her in...I at least envisioned her caught in the ooze. I'm not sure that's what the DM meant though. Regardless of whether she survived it or not, she should certainly have spent the rest of the dungeon crawl as a naked and weaponless halfling. Very glad we didn't understand about the gray ooze Thank you so much for your help :)
Evil Spearman 10-10-03, 03:32 AM	Glad I could help. (This is NRT, but some banning because of other issues has me playing roulette with Screen Names)
bitnine 10-10-03, 12:30 PM	Good catch, I had completely forgot that acid did full damage as well as sonic. That's what I get for working off memory.
Evil Spearman 10-10-03, 12:42 PM	Originally posted by bitnine Good catch, I had completely forgot that acid did full damage as well as sonic. That's what I get for working off memory. I didn't catch it until I went looking for the actual tables myself. In 3.0 they still take half from acid. 3.5 they take full. ;)