Adjudicating Charm [Archive] - Wizards Community

Adjudicating Charm [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Arganis
05-05-06, 12:09 PM There's a lot to be said about how to determine what people will do when charmed. The general consensus is that if you expect an ally in combat you'll be SOL. However, I have a couple general questions to see an idea of how you guys handle the actual charming process.

The rules state that if you succeed a save against a spell with no visible effects, you feel a hostile force or tingle. But, is a PC made aware if they fail a save against an effect? Do they get a funny feeling when charmed?

Consider the following situations:

1) Wizard Bob casts a Silenced Charm Person on Fighter Dan from hiding. Does Dan have any idea?
2) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Fighter Dan while Fighter Dan is watching. Fighter Dan's opinion of Bob changes immediately. Does Fighter Dan feel anything? Does Fighter Dan have a reason to suspect that Bob did something?
3) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Wizard Kevin. Wizard Kevin succeeds his spellcraft check but fails his Will Save. Does Kevin feel anything? Does Kevin retain the knowledge that Bob was casting Charm Person and is he able to deduce that Bob has charmed him? Will his new helpful attitude cause him to give Bob the following advice: "When this wears off your life will be in danger!"?
Tormsskull
05-05-06, 12:38 PM 1) Wizard Bob casts a Silenced Charm Person on Fighter Dan from hiding. Does Dan have any idea?
2) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Fighter Dan while Fighter Dan is watching. Fighter Dan's opinion of Bob changes immediately. Does Fighter Dan feel anything? Does Fighter Dan have a reason to suspect that Bob did something?
3) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Wizard Kevin. Wizard Kevin succeeds his spellcraft check but fails his Will Save. Does Kevin feel anything? Does Kevin retain the knowledge that Bob was casting Charm Person and is he able to deduce that Bob has charmed him? Will his new helpful attitude cause him to give Bob the following advice: "When this wears off your life will be in danger!"?

1.) Dan feels a slight tingle as if he just warded off some kind of malign magical effect, but doesn't know where it originates from.
2.) Fighter Dan isn't hostile towards Wizard Bob before the casting? If so I'd say that Fighter Dan sees Wizard Bob waving his hands, and is not sure of the effects. When Wizard Bob starts to talk to Fighter Dan, Fighter Dan realizes how nice and smart and caring Wizard Bob is.
3.) Wizard Kevin knows that Wizard Bob is casting a charm spell, but gosh darnit, he is just such a nice guy that Wizard Kevin doesn't hold it against him. Wizard Kevin doesn't even think about harming Wizard Bob in the slightest, until the spell wears off :)

When the effects wear off in all situations, I'd assume the affected person knew they were under some kind of mind control magic (otherwise charm person would be higher than 1st level I think).
Kyuketsukiouji
05-05-06, 01:48 PM 1.) Dan feels a slight tingle as if he just warded off some kind of malign magical effect, but doesn't know where it originates from.

Only if Dan makes his saving throw, though.

2.) Fighter Dan isn't hostile towards Wizard Bob before the casting? If so I'd say that Fighter Dan sees Wizard Bob waving his hands, and is not sure of the effects. When Wizard Bob starts to talk to Fighter Dan, Fighter Dan realizes how nice and smart and caring Wizard Bob is.
3.) Wizard Kevin knows that Wizard Bob is casting a charm spell, but gosh darnit, he is just such a nice guy that Wizard Kevin doesn't hold it against him. Wizard Kevin doesn't even think about harming Wizard Bob in the slightest, until the spell wears off :)

When the effects wear off in all situations, I'd assume the affected person knew they were under some kind of mind control magic (otherwise charm person would be higher than 1st level I think).

In case 1, Dan wouldn't know, no. In case 2, there might be doubt, depending on how Dan and Bob acted. In case 3, Bob better run.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Arganis 05-05-06, 12:09 PM	There's a lot to be said about how to determine what people will do when charmed. The general consensus is that if you expect an ally in combat you'll be SOL. However, I have a couple general questions to see an idea of how you guys handle the actual charming process. The rules state that if you succeed a save against a spell with no visible effects, you feel a hostile force or tingle. But, is a PC made aware if they fail a save against an effect? Do they get a funny feeling when charmed? Consider the following situations: 1) Wizard Bob casts a Silenced Charm Person on Fighter Dan from hiding. Does Dan have any idea? 2) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Fighter Dan while Fighter Dan is watching. Fighter Dan's opinion of Bob changes immediately. Does Fighter Dan feel anything? Does Fighter Dan have a reason to suspect that Bob did something? 3) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Wizard Kevin. Wizard Kevin succeeds his spellcraft check but fails his Will Save. Does Kevin feel anything? Does Kevin retain the knowledge that Bob was casting Charm Person and is he able to deduce that Bob has charmed him? Will his new helpful attitude cause him to give Bob the following advice: "When this wears off your life will be in danger!"?
Tormsskull 05-05-06, 12:38 PM	1) Wizard Bob casts a Silenced Charm Person on Fighter Dan from hiding. Does Dan have any idea? 2) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Fighter Dan while Fighter Dan is watching. Fighter Dan's opinion of Bob changes immediately. Does Fighter Dan feel anything? Does Fighter Dan have a reason to suspect that Bob did something? 3) Wizard Bob casts Charm Person on Wizard Kevin. Wizard Kevin succeeds his spellcraft check but fails his Will Save. Does Kevin feel anything? Does Kevin retain the knowledge that Bob was casting Charm Person and is he able to deduce that Bob has charmed him? Will his new helpful attitude cause him to give Bob the following advice: "When this wears off your life will be in danger!"? 1.) Dan feels a slight tingle as if he just warded off some kind of malign magical effect, but doesn't know where it originates from. 2.) Fighter Dan isn't hostile towards Wizard Bob before the casting? If so I'd say that Fighter Dan sees Wizard Bob waving his hands, and is not sure of the effects. When Wizard Bob starts to talk to Fighter Dan, Fighter Dan realizes how nice and smart and caring Wizard Bob is. 3.) Wizard Kevin knows that Wizard Bob is casting a charm spell, but gosh darnit, he is just such a nice guy that Wizard Kevin doesn't hold it against him. Wizard Kevin doesn't even think about harming Wizard Bob in the slightest, until the spell wears off :) When the effects wear off in all situations, I'd assume the affected person knew they were under some kind of mind control magic (otherwise charm person would be higher than 1st level I think).
Kyuketsukiouji 05-05-06, 01:48 PM	1.) Dan feels a slight tingle as if he just warded off some kind of malign magical effect, but doesn't know where it originates from. Only if Dan makes his saving throw, though. 2.) Fighter Dan isn't hostile towards Wizard Bob before the casting? If so I'd say that Fighter Dan sees Wizard Bob waving his hands, and is not sure of the effects. When Wizard Bob starts to talk to Fighter Dan, Fighter Dan realizes how nice and smart and caring Wizard Bob is. 3.) Wizard Kevin knows that Wizard Bob is casting a charm spell, but gosh darnit, he is just such a nice guy that Wizard Kevin doesn't hold it against him. Wizard Kevin doesn't even think about harming Wizard Bob in the slightest, until the spell wears off :) When the effects wear off in all situations, I'd assume the affected person knew they were under some kind of mind control magic (otherwise charm person would be higher than 1st level I think). In case 1, Dan wouldn't know, no. In case 2, there might be doubt, depending on how Dan and Bob acted. In case 3, Bob better run.