Aim for the Neck! [Archive] - Wizards Community

Aim for the Neck! [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
grey_omnibus
11-13-04, 11:32 PM Aim for the Neck!

Recently I have been pioneering to introduce the concept of attacking specific bodily locations to my gaming group. Unfortunately this endeavour has recently met complications, the biggest one being that the mechanics may be tedious.

Anyway, here's a summary of the ideas I've thought up so far:

Vitality and Wounds: This system works best if using the vitality and wound point system detailed in the Star Wars roleplaying game and the Unearthed Arcana sourcebook.

Facing: The rules for facing from Unearthed Arcana fit well in determining what body parts are available to attack at any given time.

Bell Curve: This involves rolling 3d6's rather than a d20 (once again, Unearthed Arcana...), and results in an average tending towards 10. This results in a smaller frequency of critical hits, although the vitality rules make a single crit with a longsword near-fatal.

Hit Location

There are ten possible locations for a blow to land when an attack is made. This is determined at random (unless a Called Shot is made - see below) by rolling a d10 and consulting the folowing chart:

10 - Torso*
9 - Right upper arm
8 - Left upper arm
7 - Right lower arm
6 - Left lower arm
5 - Right upper leg
4 - Left upper leg
3 - Right lower leg
2 - Left lower leg
1 - Head
*When a 10 is rolled there is a 50% chance of striking either the upper or lower torso
A hand is considered part of the lower arm, while a foot his considered part of the lower leg.

An attack roll is then made and resolved as normal.

NOTE: The reason why attack locations are determined randomly is because a combatant is constantly changing position after an attack or in response to an opponent's attack. This method merely reflects strikes being made against the location that is currently the most accessible.

Called Shot

It is possible to direct an attack at a specific location, but such an attack incurs penalties because it disrupts the flow of combat. In order to make a called shot, the attacker first rolls to determine the location. He then declares his intended target, and subtracts 2 from is attack roll for each point of difference between locations.

Head-Leg Path: Head, torso, upper leg, lower leg
Head-Arm Path: Head, upper arm, lower arm
Torso-Arm Path: Torso, upper arm, lower arm
Arm-Leg Path: Upper arm, lower arm, upper leg, lower leg

For instance, Regdar rolls a 10 for location (torso) against the orc but wishes to strike him on the lower leg where his armor his lighter. To do so he takes a -4 penalty to the attack roll, because the lower leg is two positions away from the torso.

Striking a Joint

When a called shot is made the attacker may opt to strike a joint adjacent to the targeted location. This is determined after rolling for location but before making the attack roll. Such an attack incurs an additional -2 penalty which stacks with the called shot penalty.

Head: Neck
Torso: Neck/shoulder
Upper Arm: Shoulder/elbow
Lower Arm: Elbow/wrist
Upper leg: Groin/knee
Lower leg: Knee/ankle

When striking a joint the offending weapon's threat range increases by 1.

For instance, Krusk rolls a 6 for location (lower arm) but is aiming for his opponent's neck. He subtracts 4 from his roll because of the location difference, and then subtracts an additional 2 because he is attacking a joint. (Not really a joint, I know, but that's its classification in this context)

The implications of damaging a joint are varied, but I haven't figured them out yet.

Vitality and Wounds

Every character has a number of vitality points equal to their standard hit points, and a number of wound points at each location equal to their Constitution score. Vitality points represent a character's ability to turn lethal blows into grazes and light scratches. Wound points on the other hand, represent a character's ability to withstand true physical damage.

Vitality Points

This is a general score that is reduced by most attacks. Unlike wound points, vitality is not applied separately to each location.

0 Wound Points

When a character has no vitality points or is dealt a critical hit, he begins taking wound damage. When a location has 0 wound points the character must take a Fortitude save equal to the damage dealt. If the save succeeds the location is useless but in tact. If it fails, any of a number of things may occur. I haven't figured what those things are yet, but they will probably involve things like broken bones (bludgeoning), severed limbs (slashing, especially on a joint), or damaged organs (piercing; especially on the torso).

Armor

Under this system armor is divided into its separate parts, so that a character can wear breastplate without encumbering his arm movements, or have armored arms while leaving his torso unencumbered for a higher speed. A neck guard would lessen the chance of a decapitating blow, while a shield would prevent most attacks against the arm that carries it.

Any suggestions?
Yade
11-13-04, 11:41 PM I would consider modifying your called shot section with some information on surprise hits and back stabs. My reason for saying this is that in your intro to called shots you justify the modifiers due to the bustle of combat; if you are not bustling then is the modifier lowered?

Have you read the Hackmaster section on called shots? Aside from it being 2nd ed it is one of the most eloquent and intensely developed called shot system in current games. (it might give you some good ideas, plus it has detailed maps of the human anatomy to help determine the effects of a successful called shot in any given region)

10 - Torso*
9 - Right upper arm
8 - Left upper arm
7 - Right lower arm
6 - Left lower arm
5 - Right upper leg
4 - Left upper leg
3 - Right lower leg
2 - Left lower leg
1 - Head
*When a 10 is rolled there is a 50% chance of striking either the upper or lower torso
A hand is considered part of the lower arm, while a foot his considered part of the lower leg.Consider expanding this to a d12 and leave out the additional rolls for determining torso parts. Within your description you already basically have 12 options. (add upper torso and lower torso in the place of your torso slot and add neck, maybe)

Hope your system works well, you will have to run it for a few sessions to let the players get used to it. Only then can you accurately determine whether you are contributing to the game or hindering. And always remember to make those called shots available for the enemy NPCs. :D
hiryuu
11-13-04, 11:53 PM I use a d20. After all, there's more of a chance you'll hit the torso than anywhere else, and more of a chance of hitting a leg than an arm, and more of a chance of hitting the arms than the head.

For melee attacks, I add +2 to the rolls, and the chart starts out at the bottom (with a 20 for the head). This way, melee characters have a higher chance of hitting the head, uppeer torso, and arms than they do with the legs.

I stole the damage system from Deadlands, really. It's working nicely in my testing scenarios so far (of course, I've gone whole hog on the way damage works). You may wish to try using the d20 for hit location.
lancean
11-14-04, 01:12 AM Why complicate the game though? Won't this slow down play?

Think about it. All too often the whole POINT of attacking in melee combat is to aim for a joint or the head, while the point of defending is to get out of the way or roll with it so the attacker hits something not quite so vital instead. The fact that an attacker succeeded in hitting something vital is what critical hits are all about. Do you need a more detailed system?
hiryuu
11-14-04, 01:16 AM Not really, but it's fun to play with the rules and see how new permutations alter the system.
grey_omnibus
11-14-04, 02:53 AM I intend to use this system in a campaign where straightforward combat isn't very common and characters are more likely to face off in a duel than to take on a horde of screaming goblins, so the rules shouldn't be as tedious as they would in in a full scale war. Our group's already playing a reasonably realistic campaign, but the players want the gritty realism of staggering away after a brutal blow from a greatclub all but shatters their ribcage (don't ask why...).

Consider expanding this to a d12 and leave out the additional rolls for determining torso parts. Within your description you already basically have 12 options. (add upper torso and lower torso in the place of your torso slot and add neck, maybe)

The reason I didn't make the neck a standard location was because I didn't think it was large enough, and it generally requires more precision to land a successful blow (hence the penalty to attack rolls). Without the neck, that would result in a d11, which is impossible, so I scrapped the separate torso thing to bring it down to a d10.

PS: Does anyone know where I can find a comprehensive list of the different components of medieval and japanese armor?
MortalPlague
11-14-04, 04:21 AM The one question you really have to ask yourself is this; why would anybody aim for anything but the head? A -4 for an instant kill? I'd take it. Turnaround is fair play too, so the monsters would do it too. That's why I don't use called shots.

I usually tell my PCs that if they want to do called shots, they can, but monsters will be able to do it too. That stops them in their tracks.
Cantankerous
11-14-04, 07:20 AM I'm with Mortal Plague on this one. In 3.+E called shots are massively unbalancing to the core concepts of the system itself.

Isshia
Shard of Suzail
11-14-04, 11:24 AM I too, agree with mortalplague. The d20 game has always been balanced for cinematic combat feel and introducing this kind of thing really isnt wise. The main problem is that players will very quickly choose a location and stick with it, such as mastering head attacks. Thus, in the end, a rule that was inteded to make combat more interesting only ends up making it more limited.

Similarly, monsters will use the locations too and many monsters, in order to challenge the group of party members, are comparatively more impressive in combat than a single player is. Thus, players will soon die like flies.

With the fact that ray spells and touch spells target like weapons, that means you can blast people`s heads off easily with hefty spells.

With the raw damage being thrown around and high BAB compared to AC, you`ll soon have fatalities rolling in. Couple this with a game built to include magical healing, which now will be rendered innefective and you have a recipe for disaster.

Plus, there will be at least one player who takes up the role of master archer. Soon the party will go the same way, sensing that ranged combat has become much better. Many of your fights, if not all, will now be decided at range with a minimal threat to the party. Classes such as the deepwood sniper will be wheeled out to execute villains from tremendous range.

Similarly, you will have incidents where ranged opponents kill characters before they can even engage.

All these attempts to add "realism" to d and d do just as they intend. In reality, you enter combat and most people involved are rendered crippled or dead unless one side has absolute advantage.

Just stay clear of this kind of house rule. In the hands of players, it only ends up being changed from its original intention. In the hands of even a benevolent gm, it usually ends up killing the party very quickly, or leading to a lack of interesting encounters.
Winter's requiem
11-14-04, 01:25 PM You should determine where the player hits accoding to how much hitpoints the opponent has left, not according to a d10. For example: if the opponent has more than 20 hp he doesn't get hit when he takes damage, (but he looses hitpoints) but instead he dodge the attacks and gets fatigued. When he was under 20 HP he acctually gets hit.

If he has 20-15 HP left he get hit in the arm or the leg.
If he has 14-10 HP left he get hit in the shoulder.
If he has 9-5 HP left he get hit in the tummy.
If he has 4-0 HP left he get hit in the chest, the head or the neak.
If he has -10 or lower his head gets cut of or something.

So if (for example) Tordek has 30 HP, and gets 23 damage, he get hit in the tummy because 30-23=7.

If the players get actually hit every time someone attacks them, they can for example do things like:Tordek the level 20 fighter, with 200 HP, can get hit in his head 50 times and still stand.
zodiki
11-14-04, 01:26 PM If I was going to create a called shot system, I'd add two things:
1) I'd give the attacker a penalty to his AC until his next round and/or give the defender an AoO.
2) I'd give the defender an opposed Reflex save (or BAB whichever is higher) against the attackers BAB to thwart the called shot.

This is closer to how melee combat actually works.

I try to hit your sword arm. You parry.
I try to hit your head. You block it with your weapon or your shield.
I feint going for your head and strike at your leading leg. You shift it out of the way.
I see a vulnerability in your stance, move in closer and aim for the head, you try to lean out of the way.
My morning star impacts on your chest or sword arm (in real combat you are now out-of-action).
Edymnion
11-14-04, 01:33 PM The one question you really have to ask yourself is this; why would anybody aim for anything but the head? A -4 for an instant kill? I'd take it.Really. 3e assumes that your character is trying to hit the most vulnrable spot they can reach every time they swing. Otherwise, what are you aiming for when you're not making a called shot, their pinky finger?I usually tell my PCs that if they want to do called shots, they can, but monsters will be able to do it too. That stops them in their tracks.Yup, there's just something about that band of 20 halfling sorcerers with True Strike, crossbows, a head start, and called shots to the head that REALLY make the players realize that was a bad idea.

Remember, anything the players can do, the monsters can do. Yeah, its all fun and games when you're sniping monsters to death in one shot, but just watch the player's reaction when you tell them that the monster just cleaved their skull in half. No save, no nothing, just roll up a new character. Or that the orc just chopped your arm off. Nothing you can do about it, your character is just maimed for life, or until they can find a regeneration spell (which you'll never find at low levels).

I have actually walked out on a game that the DM insisted on using a "suped up critical table" that essentially had called shot-like effects in it. I don't want that kind of thing happening to my character, and I'm sure as heck not going to put myself in a situation where it not only could happen, but is by all rights manditory that it MUST happen to my character. Uh uh.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
grey_omnibus 11-13-04, 11:32 PM	Aim for the Neck! Recently I have been pioneering to introduce the concept of attacking specific bodily locations to my gaming group. Unfortunately this endeavour has recently met complications, the biggest one being that the mechanics may be tedious. Anyway, here's a summary of the ideas I've thought up so far: Vitality and Wounds: This system works best if using the vitality and wound point system detailed in the Star Wars roleplaying game and the Unearthed Arcana sourcebook. Facing: The rules for facing from Unearthed Arcana fit well in determining what body parts are available to attack at any given time. Bell Curve: This involves rolling 3d6's rather than a d20 (once again, Unearthed Arcana...), and results in an average tending towards 10. This results in a smaller frequency of critical hits, although the vitality rules make a single crit with a longsword near-fatal. Hit Location There are ten possible locations for a blow to land when an attack is made. This is determined at random (unless a Called Shot is made - see below) by rolling a d10 and consulting the folowing chart: 10 - Torso* 9 - Right upper arm 8 - Left upper arm 7 - Right lower arm 6 - Left lower arm 5 - Right upper leg 4 - Left upper leg 3 - Right lower leg 2 - Left lower leg 1 - Head *When a 10 is rolled there is a 50% chance of striking either the upper or lower torso A hand is considered part of the lower arm, while a foot his considered part of the lower leg. An attack roll is then made and resolved as normal. NOTE: The reason why attack locations are determined randomly is because a combatant is constantly changing position after an attack or in response to an opponent's attack. This method merely reflects strikes being made against the location that is currently the most accessible. Called Shot It is possible to direct an attack at a specific location, but such an attack incurs penalties because it disrupts the flow of combat. In order to make a called shot, the attacker first rolls to determine the location. He then declares his intended target, and subtracts 2 from is attack roll for each point of difference between locations. Head-Leg Path: Head, torso, upper leg, lower leg Head-Arm Path: Head, upper arm, lower arm Torso-Arm Path: Torso, upper arm, lower arm Arm-Leg Path: Upper arm, lower arm, upper leg, lower leg For instance, Regdar rolls a 10 for location (torso) against the orc but wishes to strike him on the lower leg where his armor his lighter. To do so he takes a -4 penalty to the attack roll, because the lower leg is two positions away from the torso. Striking a Joint When a called shot is made the attacker may opt to strike a joint adjacent to the targeted location. This is determined after rolling for location but before making the attack roll. Such an attack incurs an additional -2 penalty which stacks with the called shot penalty. Head: Neck Torso: Neck/shoulder Upper Arm: Shoulder/elbow Lower Arm: Elbow/wrist Upper leg: Groin/knee Lower leg: Knee/ankle When striking a joint the offending weapon's threat range increases by 1. For instance, Krusk rolls a 6 for location (lower arm) but is aiming for his opponent's neck. He subtracts 4 from his roll because of the location difference, and then subtracts an additional 2 because he is attacking a joint. (Not really a joint, I know, but that's its classification in this context) The implications of damaging a joint are varied, but I haven't figured them out yet. Vitality and Wounds Every character has a number of vitality points equal to their standard hit points, and a number of wound points at each location equal to their Constitution score. Vitality points represent a character's ability to turn lethal blows into grazes and light scratches. Wound points on the other hand, represent a character's ability to withstand true physical damage. Vitality Points This is a general score that is reduced by most attacks. Unlike wound points, vitality is not applied separately to each location. 0 Wound Points When a character has no vitality points or is dealt a critical hit, he begins taking wound damage. When a location has 0 wound points the character must take a Fortitude save equal to the damage dealt. If the save succeeds the location is useless but in tact. If it fails, any of a number of things may occur. I haven't figured what those things are yet, but they will probably involve things like broken bones (bludgeoning), severed limbs (slashing, especially on a joint), or damaged organs (piercing; especially on the torso). Armor Under this system armor is divided into its separate parts, so that a character can wear breastplate without encumbering his arm movements, or have armored arms while leaving his torso unencumbered for a higher speed. A neck guard would lessen the chance of a decapitating blow, while a shield would prevent most attacks against the arm that carries it. Any suggestions?
Yade 11-13-04, 11:41 PM	I would consider modifying your called shot section with some information on surprise hits and back stabs. My reason for saying this is that in your intro to called shots you justify the modifiers due to the bustle of combat; if you are not bustling then is the modifier lowered? Have you read the Hackmaster section on called shots? Aside from it being 2nd ed it is one of the most eloquent and intensely developed called shot system in current games. (it might give you some good ideas, plus it has detailed maps of the human anatomy to help determine the effects of a successful called shot in any given region) 10 - Torso* 9 - Right upper arm 8 - Left upper arm 7 - Right lower arm 6 - Left lower arm 5 - Right upper leg 4 - Left upper leg 3 - Right lower leg 2 - Left lower leg 1 - Head *When a 10 is rolled there is a 50% chance of striking either the upper or lower torso A hand is considered part of the lower arm, while a foot his considered part of the lower leg.Consider expanding this to a d12 and leave out the additional rolls for determining torso parts. Within your description you already basically have 12 options. (add upper torso and lower torso in the place of your torso slot and add neck, maybe) Hope your system works well, you will have to run it for a few sessions to let the players get used to it. Only then can you accurately determine whether you are contributing to the game or hindering. And always remember to make those called shots available for the enemy NPCs. :D
hiryuu 11-13-04, 11:53 PM	I use a d20. After all, there's more of a chance you'll hit the torso than anywhere else, and more of a chance of hitting a leg than an arm, and more of a chance of hitting the arms than the head. For melee attacks, I add +2 to the rolls, and the chart starts out at the bottom (with a 20 for the head). This way, melee characters have a higher chance of hitting the head, uppeer torso, and arms than they do with the legs. I stole the damage system from Deadlands, really. It's working nicely in my testing scenarios so far (of course, I've gone whole hog on the way damage works). You may wish to try using the d20 for hit location.
lancean 11-14-04, 01:12 AM	Why complicate the game though? Won't this slow down play? Think about it. All too often the whole POINT of attacking in melee combat is to aim for a joint or the head, while the point of defending is to get out of the way or roll with it so the attacker hits something not quite so vital instead. The fact that an attacker succeeded in hitting something vital is what critical hits are all about. Do you need a more detailed system?
hiryuu 11-14-04, 01:16 AM	Not really, but it's fun to play with the rules and see how new permutations alter the system.
grey_omnibus 11-14-04, 02:53 AM	I intend to use this system in a campaign where straightforward combat isn't very common and characters are more likely to face off in a duel than to take on a horde of screaming goblins, so the rules shouldn't be as tedious as they would in in a full scale war. Our group's already playing a reasonably realistic campaign, but the players want the gritty realism of staggering away after a brutal blow from a greatclub all but shatters their ribcage (don't ask why...). Consider expanding this to a d12 and leave out the additional rolls for determining torso parts. Within your description you already basically have 12 options. (add upper torso and lower torso in the place of your torso slot and add neck, maybe) The reason I didn't make the neck a standard location was because I didn't think it was large enough, and it generally requires more precision to land a successful blow (hence the penalty to attack rolls). Without the neck, that would result in a d11, which is impossible, so I scrapped the separate torso thing to bring it down to a d10. PS: Does anyone know where I can find a comprehensive list of the different components of medieval and japanese armor?
MortalPlague 11-14-04, 04:21 AM	The one question you really have to ask yourself is this; why would anybody aim for anything but the head? A -4 for an instant kill? I'd take it. Turnaround is fair play too, so the monsters would do it too. That's why I don't use called shots. I usually tell my PCs that if they want to do called shots, they can, but monsters will be able to do it too. That stops them in their tracks.
Cantankerous 11-14-04, 07:20 AM	I'm with Mortal Plague on this one. In 3.+E called shots are massively unbalancing to the core concepts of the system itself. Isshia
Shard of Suzail 11-14-04, 11:24 AM	I too, agree with mortalplague. The d20 game has always been balanced for cinematic combat feel and introducing this kind of thing really isnt wise. The main problem is that players will very quickly choose a location and stick with it, such as mastering head attacks. Thus, in the end, a rule that was inteded to make combat more interesting only ends up making it more limited. Similarly, monsters will use the locations too and many monsters, in order to challenge the group of party members, are comparatively more impressive in combat than a single player is. Thus, players will soon die like flies. With the fact that ray spells and touch spells target like weapons, that means you can blast people`s heads off easily with hefty spells. With the raw damage being thrown around and high BAB compared to AC, you`ll soon have fatalities rolling in. Couple this with a game built to include magical healing, which now will be rendered innefective and you have a recipe for disaster. Plus, there will be at least one player who takes up the role of master archer. Soon the party will go the same way, sensing that ranged combat has become much better. Many of your fights, if not all, will now be decided at range with a minimal threat to the party. Classes such as the deepwood sniper will be wheeled out to execute villains from tremendous range. Similarly, you will have incidents where ranged opponents kill characters before they can even engage. All these attempts to add "realism" to d and d do just as they intend. In reality, you enter combat and most people involved are rendered crippled or dead unless one side has absolute advantage. Just stay clear of this kind of house rule. In the hands of players, it only ends up being changed from its original intention. In the hands of even a benevolent gm, it usually ends up killing the party very quickly, or leading to a lack of interesting encounters.
Winter's requiem 11-14-04, 01:25 PM	You should determine where the player hits accoding to how much hitpoints the opponent has left, not according to a d10. For example: if the opponent has more than 20 hp he doesn't get hit when he takes damage, (but he looses hitpoints) but instead he dodge the attacks and gets fatigued. When he was under 20 HP he acctually gets hit. If he has 20-15 HP left he get hit in the arm or the leg. If he has 14-10 HP left he get hit in the shoulder. If he has 9-5 HP left he get hit in the tummy. If he has 4-0 HP left he get hit in the chest, the head or the neak. If he has -10 or lower his head gets cut of or something. So if (for example) Tordek has 30 HP, and gets 23 damage, he get hit in the tummy because 30-23=7. If the players get actually hit every time someone attacks them, they can for example do things like:Tordek the level 20 fighter, with 200 HP, can get hit in his head 50 times and still stand.
zodiki 11-14-04, 01:26 PM	If I was going to create a called shot system, I'd add two things: 1) I'd give the attacker a penalty to his AC until his next round and/or give the defender an AoO. 2) I'd give the defender an opposed Reflex save (or BAB whichever is higher) against the attackers BAB to thwart the called shot. This is closer to how melee combat actually works. I try to hit your sword arm. You parry. I try to hit your head. You block it with your weapon or your shield. I feint going for your head and strike at your leading leg. You shift it out of the way. I see a vulnerability in your stance, move in closer and aim for the head, you try to lean out of the way. My morning star impacts on your chest or sword arm (in real combat you are now out-of-action).
Edymnion 11-14-04, 01:33 PM	The one question you really have to ask yourself is this; why would anybody aim for anything but the head? A -4 for an instant kill? I'd take it.Really. 3e assumes that your character is trying to hit the most vulnrable spot they can reach every time they swing. Otherwise, what are you aiming for when you're not making a called shot, their pinky finger?I usually tell my PCs that if they want to do called shots, they can, but monsters will be able to do it too. That stops them in their tracks.Yup, there's just something about that band of 20 halfling sorcerers with True Strike, crossbows, a head start, and called shots to the head that REALLY make the players realize that was a bad idea. Remember, anything the players can do, the monsters can do. Yeah, its all fun and games when you're sniping monsters to death in one shot, but just watch the player's reaction when you tell them that the monster just cleaved their skull in half. No save, no nothing, just roll up a new character. Or that the orc just chopped your arm off. Nothing you can do about it, your character is just maimed for life, or until they can find a regeneration spell (which you'll never find at low levels). I have actually walked out on a game that the DM insisted on using a "suped up critical table" that essentially had called shot-like effects in it. I don't want that kind of thing happening to my character, and I'm sure as heck not going to put myself in a situation where it not only could happen, but is by all rights manditory that it MUST happen to my character. Uh uh.