Altrnating DM/Player and XP issues [Archive] - Wizards Community

Altrnating DM/Player and XP issues [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Lankin the Mad Mage
03-26-04, 04:05 AM I've recently started a new gaming group with some schoolmates, and two of us decided to alternate as DMs. When I DM, he's a PC and vice versa.

The problem that has arisen is that both of us will always lag behind the rest of the party in levels.

Now, we don't want to make spcial rules that favor ourselves, but what can we do to make sure all the players are of roughly equal power?
Rhys23
03-26-04, 04:47 AM Allow the characters to always remain with the group. Run your PC as an NPC during those periods. Just have the character's persona kind of fall into the background, and let the other players make all the relevant decisions. This way, the DMs' PCs gain experience with the rest of the party.
Mr. VanderMeer
03-26-04, 05:31 AM I seriously dislike alternating DM's on one campaign. Why not each run a different campaign? It is easier to manage and it is more fun.
was_fired
03-26-04, 06:39 AM Don't have PCs as the DM. It removes any tempation to overpower yourself. Instead try to coridate with each other so that one can run a few major NPCs while the other DM runs the game. Since you won't control any for more than a game at a time and they shouldn't go off adventuring with the party there will be no problem.
Lord Crimson
03-26-04, 04:15 PM Originally posted by was_fired
Don't have PCs as the DM. It removes any tempation to overpower yourself. Instead try to coridate with each other so that one can run a few major NPCs while the other DM runs the game. Since you won't control any for more than a game at a time and they shouldn't go off adventuring with the party there will be no problem.

Which will generally make you uninterested in actually playing the game, thus curing you of your urge to trade off with the other DM.

Honestly, I would agree with the other posts. Your best bet is to run separate campaigns. That way, your stories (and magic items) will not interfere with eachother and you can each play a PC in the other DM's game and have him/her remain leveled with the party.
nexus83
03-26-04, 11:58 PM It would be a good idea to play two seperate campaigns, however, it doesn't seem like thats what you are looking for. Go ahead have your pc and dm too (don't linch me yet). Use each other to keep your pc's in check (provided you can't resist the temptation). The only problem with dm pc's is that great temptation to overpower it. You just can't be affraid to hurt your precious dm pc once and awhile and you can't give your character any special knowledge that he wouldn't otherwise have. If you can seperate your thinking and multitask it'll work out fine. I can tell you this from experiance that it can work. Personally I'd be sick of dming if I didn't get to play too and as it is it can be extremely difficult to maintain two campaigns. Most of all don't be affraid of killing of your own character (you can get another or ressurect him later). While dming he's just a permanent npc. You can also use this to an advantage as far as role playing goes. For example: "Suddenly (insert name here) disappears through a gate and no one knows where to!" This could lead to a chain reaction that brings an army to fight an out of control orc tribe or tribes. This would upset players to have their character disappear suddenly, but since your the dm you know he'll be back later. As far as sharing a campaign this can really help out if everyone else wants to play longer than the dm can manage. Bottom line is to go for it, but be warned...you have to keep your character seperate from your dming. You must not give it an advantage over the other players, infact it is more than acceptible to make the regular players slightly better off than the dmpc.
DrMorganes
03-27-04, 12:24 AM I've seen DMPCs go both ways. If you feel both you and your co-DM can handle it, I see no reason not to at least try to run your character as a PC while you run the game. Ask the rest of the troupe to critique how each of you handles this. If the general consensus is that it interferes with the game, then you should try something else.

The most obvious solution has been suggested repeatedly. Separate campaigns solve a HUGE number of problems relating to this issue, and you get to devote all of your attention to making the most of each role.

Another option would be to give your character sheet to another player while you DM. I'd suggest your co-DM here. He dictates what your character does tactically while you can pick up on the roleplaying aspect of things if you desire. This keeps your PC in line with the group in terms of XP while limiting opportunities for you to inadvertantly metagame. In fact, I'd go so far as to have your character fade into the background - essentially becoming a combat drone - while you run the game. Let's face it - as DM you have enough roleplaying opportunities as every single NPC in the world. You can let your PC go for a session, then pick him up again when your co-DM takes over.
Xyplex
03-27-04, 01:13 AM I don't see the problem here ... even if the party was given XP only if they were present at the meeting, why should your character be penalized if you're DMing?

I've brought this up before and it's generally been seen (here at least) as not a good thing ... XP should be consistent for the players ... whether or not they are there at that meeting or not ... my best friend calls it the "having a life outside of D&D rule", because otherwise outside engagements are a punishment in the D&D game ... sure you can catch up 'quickly' if you are of a lower level, but you'll never actually catch up ... you'll always be stung by the time your significant other popped over unexpectedly and you couldn't come to the meeting ... not good karma on either SO side or D&D side.

So if your character isn't in game, then just give them XP on DM feit that you DM, your characters should be allowed to keep up with the party ... don't DMPC ... that's just asking for trouble ... and don't expect to get magic items or wealth or what-have-you ... acquire those in your own time. Best would be to work this out with the other non-DM players ... they'll probably want to bend over backwards to give you whatever support they can.

And I would agree ... seperate campaigns ... although with busy schedules, working a new DM into the act of being a DM, general DM unavailablilty compared with high player availablity ... those could be mitigating factors.
Lankin the Mad Mage
03-27-04, 09:11 AM The separate campaigns is, to put it bluntly, completelyimpossible and more troublethan it's worth.

This is a new group. I'm the only one who has ever RPG'ed before. We started because I told my classmates about D&D and they wanted to try. My co-DM had gotten D&D rulebooks for christmas and knew the basic rules. So we met in recess and started playing.

Me and the co-DM sat down and decided where in my BIG campaign setting we should start, and all the players took a day or so to develop their first PC's. Basically, this is a social event for close friends. Splitting this in two is just silly. Besides, the campaign has been running for a couple of months, and it works out.

We have no problems with co-DM'ing. None of us fall to the temptation of übering up our own PC. When we alternate, we've basically said "He went away to meditate" or "He went to the mountains to learn magic from his dragon mentor".

The only problem is the XP thing. So you think we should just give our PC to the other DM and ask him to use it as a "sidekick"? Hmmm....coul work. Dunno if I can convince him though. OTOH I don't think I'll ever manage to convince him to give out XP for the stuff the other PC's are doing. *sigh*.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Lankin the Mad Mage 03-26-04, 04:05 AM	I've recently started a new gaming group with some schoolmates, and two of us decided to alternate as DMs. When I DM, he's a PC and vice versa. The problem that has arisen is that both of us will always lag behind the rest of the party in levels. Now, we don't want to make spcial rules that favor ourselves, but what can we do to make sure all the players are of roughly equal power?
Rhys23 03-26-04, 04:47 AM	Allow the characters to always remain with the group. Run your PC as an NPC during those periods. Just have the character's persona kind of fall into the background, and let the other players make all the relevant decisions. This way, the DMs' PCs gain experience with the rest of the party.
Mr. VanderMeer 03-26-04, 05:31 AM	I seriously dislike alternating DM's on one campaign. Why not each run a different campaign? It is easier to manage and it is more fun.
was_fired 03-26-04, 06:39 AM	Don't have PCs as the DM. It removes any tempation to overpower yourself. Instead try to coridate with each other so that one can run a few major NPCs while the other DM runs the game. Since you won't control any for more than a game at a time and they shouldn't go off adventuring with the party there will be no problem.
Lord Crimson 03-26-04, 04:15 PM	Originally posted by was_fired Don't have PCs as the DM. It removes any tempation to overpower yourself. Instead try to coridate with each other so that one can run a few major NPCs while the other DM runs the game. Since you won't control any for more than a game at a time and they shouldn't go off adventuring with the party there will be no problem. Which will generally make you uninterested in actually playing the game, thus curing you of your urge to trade off with the other DM. Honestly, I would agree with the other posts. Your best bet is to run separate campaigns. That way, your stories (and magic items) will not interfere with eachother and you can each play a PC in the other DM's game and have him/her remain leveled with the party.
nexus83 03-26-04, 11:58 PM	It would be a good idea to play two seperate campaigns, however, it doesn't seem like thats what you are looking for. Go ahead have your pc and dm too (don't linch me yet). Use each other to keep your pc's in check (provided you can't resist the temptation). The only problem with dm pc's is that great temptation to overpower it. You just can't be affraid to hurt your precious dm pc once and awhile and you can't give your character any special knowledge that he wouldn't otherwise have. If you can seperate your thinking and multitask it'll work out fine. I can tell you this from experiance that it can work. Personally I'd be sick of dming if I didn't get to play too and as it is it can be extremely difficult to maintain two campaigns. Most of all don't be affraid of killing of your own character (you can get another or ressurect him later). While dming he's just a permanent npc. You can also use this to an advantage as far as role playing goes. For example: "Suddenly (insert name here) disappears through a gate and no one knows where to!" This could lead to a chain reaction that brings an army to fight an out of control orc tribe or tribes. This would upset players to have their character disappear suddenly, but since your the dm you know he'll be back later. As far as sharing a campaign this can really help out if everyone else wants to play longer than the dm can manage. Bottom line is to go for it, but be warned...you have to keep your character seperate from your dming. You must not give it an advantage over the other players, infact it is more than acceptible to make the regular players slightly better off than the dmpc.
DrMorganes 03-27-04, 12:24 AM	I've seen DMPCs go both ways. If you feel both you and your co-DM can handle it, I see no reason not to at least try to run your character as a PC while you run the game. Ask the rest of the troupe to critique how each of you handles this. If the general consensus is that it interferes with the game, then you should try something else. The most obvious solution has been suggested repeatedly. Separate campaigns solve a HUGE number of problems relating to this issue, and you get to devote all of your attention to making the most of each role. Another option would be to give your character sheet to another player while you DM. I'd suggest your co-DM here. He dictates what your character does tactically while you can pick up on the roleplaying aspect of things if you desire. This keeps your PC in line with the group in terms of XP while limiting opportunities for you to inadvertantly metagame. In fact, I'd go so far as to have your character fade into the background - essentially becoming a combat drone - while you run the game. Let's face it - as DM you have enough roleplaying opportunities as every single NPC in the world. You can let your PC go for a session, then pick him up again when your co-DM takes over.
Xyplex 03-27-04, 01:13 AM	I don't see the problem here ... even if the party was given XP only if they were present at the meeting, why should your character be penalized if you're DMing? I've brought this up before and it's generally been seen (here at least) as not a good thing ... XP should be consistent for the players ... whether or not they are there at that meeting or not ... my best friend calls it the "having a life outside of D&D rule", because otherwise outside engagements are a punishment in the D&D game ... sure you can catch up 'quickly' if you are of a lower level, but you'll never actually catch up ... you'll always be stung by the time your significant other popped over unexpectedly and you couldn't come to the meeting ... not good karma on either SO side or D&D side. So if your character isn't in game, then just give them XP on DM feit that you DM, your characters should be allowed to keep up with the party ... don't DMPC ... that's just asking for trouble ... and don't expect to get magic items or wealth or what-have-you ... acquire those in your own time. Best would be to work this out with the other non-DM players ... they'll probably want to bend over backwards to give you whatever support they can. And I would agree ... seperate campaigns ... although with busy schedules, working a new DM into the act of being a DM, general DM unavailablilty compared with high player availablity ... those could be mitigating factors.
Lankin the Mad Mage 03-27-04, 09:11 AM	The separate campaigns is, to put it bluntly, completelyimpossible and more troublethan it's worth. This is a new group. I'm the only one who has ever RPG'ed before. We started because I told my classmates about D&D and they wanted to try. My co-DM had gotten D&D rulebooks for christmas and knew the basic rules. So we met in recess and started playing. Me and the co-DM sat down and decided where in my BIG campaign setting we should start, and all the players took a day or so to develop their first PC's. Basically, this is a social event for close friends. Splitting this in two is just silly. Besides, the campaign has been running for a couple of months, and it works out. We have no problems with co-DM'ing. None of us fall to the temptation of übering up our own PC. When we alternate, we've basically said "He went away to meditate" or "He went to the mountains to learn magic from his dragon mentor". The only problem is the XP thing. So you think we should just give our PC to the other DM and ask him to use it as a "sidekick"? Hmmm....coul work. Dunno if I can convince him though. OTOH I don't think I'll ever manage to convince him to give out XP for the stuff the other PC's are doing. sigh.