Post/Author/DateTime	Post
prawn 03-22-05, 09:18 AM	The search function is down, so I don't know if this has been posted before, but the Israeli Army is refusing to give high security clearance to soldiers who play DnD: from http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3052074,00.html Army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons IDF says players are detached from reality and automatically given a low security clearance By Hanan Greenberg Does the Israel Defense Forces believe incoming recruits and soldiers who play Dungeons and Dragons are unfit for elite units? Ynet has learned that 18-year-olds who tell recruiters they play the popular fantasy game are automatically given low security clearance. “They're detached from reality and suscepitble to influence,” the army says. Fans of the popular roleplaying game had spoken of rumors of this strange policy by the IDF, but now the army has confirmed that it has a negative image of teens who play the game and labels them as problematic in regard to their draft status. So if you like fantasy games, go see the military psychologist. Dungeons and Dragons (also known as D&D) has been a popular roleplaying game for decades and is based on a fantasy world. One player assumes the role of “Dungeon Master,” which entails directing the game and controlling the labyrinth, while the others select from a large selection of characters that includes warriors, magicians, dwarfs and thieves. The game focuses on the results of decisions Brothers in Arms made by the players as determined by the roll of the dice. In a more "active" version of the game, players leave the table and go out, dressed as the characters they assume for the game, along with the requisite equipment of swords (not real) to play outside, usually in the forest or woods. Most D&D players do not don costumes, and participants in such costume games are called "LARPers" (for live-action role playing). 'Simply detached from reality' Thousands of youth and teens in Israel play D&D, fighting dragons and demons using their rich imaginations. The game has also increased in popularity due to the "Lord of the Rings" trilogy. However the IDF does not approve of this unusual hobby and prevents D&D players from being considered for sensitive army positions by labeling them with low security clearance. "We have discovered that some of them are simply detached from reality," a security source told Ynet. Game enthusiasts are aware of their problematic image in the army and prefer to maintain their anonymity. Many of them are from the former Soviet Union, where the game is very popular. In Israel there are thousands of players, between the ages 16 to 35, and include lawyers, high-tech workers and businessmen. Matan, 22, and Igor, a 21-year-old IDF soldier, organize activities for groups of players. Soon hundreds of fans are expected to meet in a forest in the southern part of Israel for a two-day game of pure fantasy. "It's not a game of winners and losers," Matan says, "but rather entry into another world with stories and plot changes." He is aware of the game's problematic reputation, especially in the IDF. The army is not indifferent to the unique hobby and is trying to locate soldiers who in their free time dress up as witches and play in forests. 'The game indicates a weak personality' A security official tells Ynet there are specific criteria for deciding the level of a soldier's security clearance. "One of the tests we do, either by asking soldiers directly or through information provided us, is to ask whether they take part in the game," he says. "If a soldier answers in the affirmative, he is sent to a professional for an evaluation, usually a psychologist." More than half of the soldiers sent for evaluation receive low security clearances, thus preventing them from serving in sensitive IDF positions, he says. Igor says exposing soldiers who play the game could result in the soldiers being sent to a military psychologist or even being kicked out of the army. "Exposing them could also harm their chances at being accepted to other military courses," he says. Matan says he has personally met soldiers whose military career was harmed due to their connection to the game. Most soldiers who play Dungeons and Dragons simply do not admit to it while they are in the army, he says. Why does IDF believe game is dangerous? "These people have a tendency to be influenced by external factors which could cloud their judgment, a military official says. "They may be detached from reality or have a weak personality - elements which lower a person's security clearance, allowing them to serve in the army, but not in sensitive positions." Unsurprisingly, Igor, Matan and thier friends do not approve of this IDF policy. They say the game is only a colorful, non-violent hobby. "Many people who play served in the most classified units," David says. "They are intelligent and any attempt to label them as 'weird' is incorrect and unfair." But in the struggle between the gameplayers and the Defense Minister, the latter wins - or at least this is the case in the real world of the IDF
Paradisio 03-22-05, 09:24 AM	I think I just got more stupid after reding that artickle. If it makes me dangerous to like the game, so be it, I woulnd't want to be in the military anyways. :P
Phrennzy 03-22-05, 09:37 AM	Obviously they've never played.
GiskardR 03-22-05, 09:40 AM	I agree with them! :eek: :eek: :eek: Military work is too stupid and need stupid person. Role players have a too complex and rich personality to be a good soldier of "kill and obey" If Bush would play D&D for a while we'll probably have less war
yeknom 03-22-05, 09:47 AM	I agree with them! :eek: :eek: :eek: Military work is too stupid and need stupid person. Role players have a too complex and rich personality to be a good soldier of "kill and obey" If Bush would play D&D for a while we'll probably have less war Sorry, but I have to disagree and say that military work isn't stupid. A good soldier obeys but so does any other good employee. I served my time playing soldier boy and don't I think anyone should degrade the job (or any other job) until they have done the job themselves. As far as the comment on Chimp, I agree, but would like to add that if Chimp thought a little more about nearly anything we most likely wouldn't be at war.
yeknom 03-22-05, 09:49 AM	The search function is down, so I don't know if this has been posted before, but the Israeli Army is refusing to give high security clearance to soldiers who play DnD: It has been posted several times but it doesn't hurt to post it again.
GiskardR 03-22-05, 09:57 AM	Sorry but I have to disagree that military work isn't stupid. A good soldier obeys but so does any other good employee. I served my time playing soldier boy and don't I think anyone should degrade the job (or any other job) until they have done the job themselves. As far as the comment on Chimp I agree but would like to add that if Chimp thought a little more about nearly anything we most likely wouldn't be at war. I lost one year of my life in the middle of that STUPID place, I know what i'm talking about, i'm not a teenager, i'm a 30 years old worker with a family "A good soldier obeys but so does any other good employee" you say But if the employee do not obeys because of an evil order he become fired, the soldier will be arrested and probably condamned. It's not exactly the same. Too much stupid and orrid think in the history has been done by miltiary. I would like to say to that military guys. "Don't worry! You're not losing anithing! Better fired and poor than militar"
RagnarokBlade 03-22-05, 09:59 AM	FACT:Military personal can not do anything deemed "fun" or "entertaining" because they loose their wits. Because the stress getting to them so they snap and kill 15 co workers is a better alternative. and people wonder why I'm a pacifist.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 10:02 AM	Big deal militarys have been doing this sort of thing since the days of Sparta. The fact is sensitive or creative individuals usually don't make good killing machines. Like all pass times there are psychos who take it over the top and such, and I doubt that they'd be welcome as defense generals. The military always tries to institute new Ideas to try and get better soldiers. This probably wont even be a permenent institution. Since army's like to enchourage friendship between platoon mates (you'll probably fight a lot harder if your best friend is the one pinned down by enemy fire) they might find role playing as a good way to form loyalties between soldiers. Even a way to help reinforce heirarchy. Its more likely they'd play Black Dog rather then DnD and once they're getting into combat they probably wont have the time or the desire to play at all. But it might by an interesting thing to try out.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 10:04 AM	I agree with them! :eek: :eek: :eek: Military work is too stupid and need stupid person. Role players have a too complex and rich personality to be a good soldier of "kill and obey" If Bush would play D&D for a while we'll probably have less war Stupid person eh. Well there's one right here. You can be smart in the military. Especially if your a General. The key is to soldiers aren't suposed to think too much on the battle feild.
GiskardR 03-22-05, 10:08 AM	Stupid person eh. Well there's one right here. You can be smart in the military. Especially if your a General. The key is to soldiers aren't suposed to think too much on the battle feild. Right They're supposed to die
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 10:10 AM	I lost one year of my life in the middle of that STUPID place, I know what i'm talking about, i'm not a teenager, i'm a 30 years old worker with a family "A good soldier obeys but so does any other good employee" you say But if the employee do not obeys because of an evil order he become fired, the soldier will be arrested and probably condamned. It's not exactly the same. Too much stupid and orrid think in the history has been done by miltiary. I would like to say to that military guys. "Don't worry! You're not losing anithing! Better fired and poor than militar" Dude its called finishing the words your typeing its not hard. Your point is sorta good, but the military probably doesn't suck so much durring peace time. For many its the only legal job they can get. What stupid place were you refurring to.
Lord Ian Stark 03-22-05, 10:15 AM	55. Religious beliefs, D&D and "reality" "This is hilarious that the IDF discriminates against D&D players. You live in a country where a large fraction of the people beleive in the literal interpretation of a book that has no scientific basis and yet these people are allowed to control nuclear weapons." Chris Ouellet ROFL. Exactly. It's ok to believe in and live your life by, a book of stories of divine intervention. But wait a minute, if you play a game that does this exact thing, then you are labeled like this, "We have discovered that some of them are simply detached from reality," Wow, congrats on having such a firm grasp on the meaning of reality. What do you think will influence a soldiers' “weak” personality more, someone talking about his real life deity or the one his dwarf character worships? Get a clue. Glad to see the IDF is making such great decisions. What’s next on there disqualifying list, if the soldiers ever played make belief when they were kids? LOL, these talk-backs are great.
Vriishnak 03-22-05, 10:15 AM	Right They're supposed to die Yay, unreasoning bias. Honestly, I seriously doubt anyone here really cares what your views on the concept of military is, so keep it to yourself, please. If you want to discuss the topic, why not limit your comments to the situation at hand, rather than insulting all of the military people here?
prawn 03-22-05, 10:54 AM	Isn't the irony that DnD is basically a second generation wargaming, which exacltly the kind of game that soldiers need to practice to understand tactics?
Melichor 03-22-05, 11:02 AM	The article is a little old, was slash dotted and discussed here a while back. Not the most enlightened view, but it works for the Israeli view of what a soldier should be. Check out this article on the Baghdad Hobby Club: http://www.gamesquarterly.net/issue004/GQM4_33to40.pdf At least half of the gamers I know (card floppers, RPers, grognards) are military or ex-military. None of them are stupid and most are better players than the non-military players. Without regard for the rest of the world, the US military doesn't frown on D&D. Being a gamer hasn't kept me from having a TS clearance and sitting somewhere in the sand just means you have to game more creatively. Thinking that soldiers are 'supposed to die', is one of the biggest dangers for the soldiers....only ignorant civilians and their politicians carry this attitude. Another thought......many times the sensitive and creative individuals are the most vicious of killers. The conceit of the "sensitive, creative and uber-intelligent" gamers always amuses me. And just a last thought, for those people who like to slam on President Bush... Put your gaming hat on, run through a few scenarios with other potentail people in charge, unbiasedly and without all the emotional rhetoric, see if you still feel the same way.
yeknom 03-22-05, 11:03 AM	FACT:Military personal can not do anything deemed "fun" or "entertaining" because they loose their wits. Because the stress getting to them so they snap and kill 15 co workers is a better alternative. and people wonder why I'm a pacifist. When I was in the service I did lots of things that were deemed fun, including gaming. I don't wonder why you are a pacifist, that's your right to be and I respect that. You should respect the choices that other people make.
yeknom 03-22-05, 11:11 AM	I lost one year of my life in the middle of that STUPID place, I know what i'm talking about, i'm not a teenager, i'm a 30 years old worker with a family "A good soldier obeys but so does any other good employee" you say But if the employee do not obeys because of an evil order he become fired, the soldier will be arrested and probably condamned. It's not exactly the same. Too much stupid and orrid think in the history has been done by miltiary. I would like to say to that military guys. "Don't worry! You're not losing anithing! Better fired and poor than militar" What place are you talking about? My time in the military wasn't a walk in the park but I chose to join the Core, I wasn't forced. Disobeying a direct order in the military is not a wise thing to do but you made the choice to join the military and knew (or should have) what you were getting yourself into. NOTE- Disregard that last part if you come from a country where military service is mandatory. I offer my sympathies if you served at a bad time and/or a bad place but that doesn't mean that soldiers in general are stupid. For most being a soldier is a career choice, albeit a potentially dangerous one. Arguments aside I am willing to agree to disagree with you on this subject and respect your opinion, provided you are willing to offer the same courtesy towards me.
Aliquid 03-22-05, 12:30 PM	It has been posted several times but it doesn't hurt to post it again.If I remember correctly... each time it was posted, the thread got locked.....
NeoReavent 03-22-05, 03:43 PM	To everyone here who is a soldier or otherwise I want to raise this one issue, its just a game and the reason so many of you are argueing so hard about this issue has nothing to do the game itself. I happen to be friends with pacifists and soldiers alike who play DnD together all the time and at the end of the day it is still just a game, they do not bring politics into it or even concern themselves with politics in general. I think that DnD is basically a game about choice and the only thing it can teach is consequences to people for choices something that everyone needs to learn because even the words we speak or write have consequences.
Nithendil 03-22-05, 03:56 PM	I recall reading somewhere from someone able to read the native language of the article that it had nothing to do with D&D, but it was a mistranslation regarding LARPing.
LordHell 03-22-05, 04:25 PM	The article is a little old, was slash dotted and discussed here a while back. Not the most enlightened view, but it works for the Israeli view of what a soldier should be. Check out this article on the Baghdad Hobby Club: http://www.gamesquarterly.net/issue004/GQM4_33to40.pdf At least half of the gamers I know (card floppers, RPers, grognards) are military or ex-military. None of them are stupid and most are better players than the non-military players. Without regard for the rest of the world, the US military doesn't frown on D&D. Being a gamer hasn't kept me from having a TS clearance and sitting somewhere in the sand just means you have to game more creatively. Thinking that soldiers are 'supposed to die', is one of the biggest dangers for the soldiers....only ignorant civilians and their politicians carry this attitude. Another thought......many times the sensitive and creative individuals are the most vicious of killers. The conceit of the "sensitive, creative and uber-intelligent" gamers always amuses me. And just a last thought, for those people who like to slam on President Bush... Put your gaming hat on, run through a few scenarios with other potentail people in charge, unbiasedly and without all the emotional rhetoric, see if you still feel the same way. Great post. I have/had a lot of repsect for the IDF - but IF this article is true then I that respect just went down a notch. That is pretty absurdly stupid of them, if I was sent to a shrink because I played D&D - I'd be questioning how good a grasp of reality my employer actually had, because it seems like they're the ones living in a fantasy world of stereotypes. On another note, Ive never heard of LARping or know of anyone who prances around in a forest playing D&D. What do they do? roll the dice out there somewhere and carry around their character sheet?
Phrennzy 03-22-05, 04:52 PM	Maybe they were really just angry because D&D doesn't have any good Mass Combat rules.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:00 PM	Right They're supposed to die and kill don't forget kill.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:07 PM	The article is a little old, was slash dotted and discussed here a while back. Not the most enlightened view, but it works for the Israeli view of what a soldier should be. Check out this article on the Baghdad Hobby Club: http://www.gamesquarterly.net/issue004/GQM4_33to40.pdf At least half of the gamers I know (card floppers, RPers, grognards) are military or ex-military. None of them are stupid and most are better players than the non-military players. Without regard for the rest of the world, the US military doesn't frown on D&D. Being a gamer hasn't kept me from having a TS clearance and sitting somewhere in the sand just means you have to game more creatively. Thinking that soldiers are 'supposed to die', is one of the biggest dangers for the soldiers....only ignorant civilians and their politicians carry this attitude. Another thought......many times the sensitive and creative individuals are the most vicious of killers. The conceit of the "sensitive, creative and uber-intelligent" gamers always amuses me. And just a last thought, for those people who like to slam on President Bush... Put your gaming hat on, run through a few scenarios with other potentail people in charge, unbiasedly and without all the emotional rhetoric, see if you still feel the same way. What that last bit makes little sense. You could be saying a lot of different things. Are you saying you suport Bush's oil trip or are you just saying Bush has a lot of forked tounges wispering in his ear. Creative maby but sensitive implies that you would feel bad about killing. I'm not saying Creative sensitive idividuals can't have a double personality for the battle feild, infact thats exactly what berserkers were like. I'm just saying most of the time a sensitive creative person is not a good killer.
Sarella Starshine 03-22-05, 05:21 PM	On another note, Ive never heard of LARping or know of anyone who prances around in a forest playing D&D. What do they do? roll the dice out there somewhere and carry around their character sheet? there are LARP rules out there that remove the dice from the game, just WtoC does not publish them. i did some LARPing of the white wolf game, vampire: the mascarade (i cant spell). and either you roleplay everything out or you do a contest using papper, rock, sissors to determine the winner of the contest. and yeah, you do carry your character sheet around with you. :) about the entire military thing, my husband spent 20 years in the navy, my brother spent 6 years in the army. me and my sisters are the only one in my family NOT to go to the military (not because our family thought girls were not allowed but because we chose different paths, in fact i wanted to but was deemed unfit). my family and my husband do not support this current war, but they understand that if you are in the military, you have no choice and they wish that it can be resolved very soon.
LordHell 03-22-05, 05:24 PM	What that last bit makes little sense. You could be saying a lot of different things. Are you saying you suport Bush's oil trip or are you just saying Bush has a lot of forked tounges wispering in his ear. I'd love to take this to PM and present you with some clearly missing facts. Please, have the decency to keep your uninformed biased political statements out of a D&D message board.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:26 PM	Coo. I hear a lot of soldiers are unhappy about the war.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:28 PM	I'd love to take this to PM and present you with some clearly missing facts. Please, have the decency to keep your uninformed biased political statements out of a D&D message board. like what. your saying they had wmds. I'd like to hear melchior's response. I don't claim to be a journalist but I haven't heard many good things about the war. I'm a bit suspisious of most news networks since they seem to only talk about "the latest way to help the troops". I'm not sure what biase your talking about. I actually supported the war at first I hated Saddam as much as the next guy. However as the war dragged on I realized that the WMD's weren't showing up. I read on CNN.com that there were no Alquaida links. Then I decided to listen to my friends and now am an avid anti bush person just like so many others. If you really need to give me some vital truth you can contact me at http://p072.ezboard.com/bmythicalrealm. My handle is Patrick the Wise (I know its really dumb but I thought it up when I was like eleven) I don't give out E-mail the Castle Tavern on that site is open for all discusion.
LordHell 03-22-05, 05:29 PM	Coo. I hear a lot of soldiers are unhappy about the war. From Michael Moore? :rolleyes:
LordHell 03-22-05, 05:31 PM	like what. your saying they had wmds. No, Im saying your ignorant comments have completely derailed a thread that had nothing to do with George W. Bush or Iraq, with absolutely no reason to bring either of those topics up. But you and others who think in a similiar fashion just can't help yourselves can you?
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:36 PM	okay not a lot but I'm sure plenty.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:37 PM	No, Im saying your ignorant comments have completely derailed a thread that had nothing to do with George W. Bush or Iraq, with absolutely no reason to bring either of those topics up. But you and others who think in a similiar fashion just can't help yourselves can you? I edited that post with a place you can contact me.
Capt. Pixel 03-22-05, 05:43 PM	Think about it! Would you trust matters of national security with a D&D geek? I sure wouldn't! :rolleyes:
bastet 03-22-05, 05:43 PM	this is interesting because our military stress role playing,(war games ex.) and youd think that the ability to think about decisions, and visualize possible out comes, so necessary in dnd, would be a great aid in more officer related posts. However I can see how a over active imagination required for dnd could be a hindrance in intelligence work. At the same way the problem solving/ability to take on an character would be vital in intelligence, isn’t their an old saying that you have to think like your enemy to defeat them, how ever as a supporter of Israel in most things I feel free to say that in the past the IDF has used the pull equal amounts of bull ****, and hard facts and come to a arbitrary conclusion, I would not be surprised if it turns out they spent millions of dollars to profile hobbies of deserters, and double agents, and or dumb commanders, I would be just as willing to believe that some one in the high commanded was beaten up by larpers as a young kid and has harbored a vendetta for many a long years. Oh I think they messed them selves in releasing this now every one who wants to escape the mandatory draft will show up to the recruiters in pc costume with a bag of dice. :D
aleph_woodenglenn 03-22-05, 05:46 PM	It seems like I already saw this article posted, and that thread got locked...
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:46 PM	umm. They still get in the millitary they just don't reach a very high security clearance.
LordofIllusions 03-22-05, 05:46 PM	The search function is down, so I don't know if this has been posted before, but the Israeli Army is refusing to give high security clearance to soldiers who play DnD: from http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3052074,00.html Army frowns on Dungeons and Dragons IDF says players are detached from reality and automatically given a low security clearance By Hanan Greenberg Does the Israel Defense Forces believe incoming recruits and soldiers who play Dungeons and Dragons are unfit for elite units? Ynet has learned that 18-year-olds who tell recruiters they play the popular fantasy game are automatically given low security clearance. “They're detached from reality and suscepitble to influence,” the army says. Fans of the popular roleplaying game had spoken of rumors of this strange policy by the IDF, but now the army has confirmed that it has a negative image of teens who play the game and labels them as problematic in regard to their draft status. So if you like fantasy games, go see the military psychologist. Dungeons and Dragons (also known as D&D) has been a popular roleplaying game for decades and is based on a fantasy world. One player assumes the role of “Dungeon Master,” which entails directing the game and controlling the labyrinth, while the others select from a large selection of characters that includes warriors, magicians, dwarfs and thieves. The game focuses on the results of decisions Brothers in Arms made by the players as determined by the roll of the dice. In a more "active" version of the game, players leave the table and go out, dressed as the characters they assume for the game, along with the requisite equipment of swords (not real) to play outside, usually in the forest or woods. Most D&D players do not don costumes, and participants in such costume games are called "LARPers" (for live-action role playing). 'Simply detached from reality' Thousands of youth and teens in Israel play D&D, fighting dragons and demons using their rich imaginations. The game has also increased in popularity due to the "Lord of the Rings" trilogy. However the IDF does not approve of this unusual hobby and prevents D&D players from being considered for sensitive army positions by labeling them with low security clearance. "We have discovered that some of them are simply detached from reality," a security source told Ynet. Game enthusiasts are aware of their problematic image in the army and prefer to maintain their anonymity. Many of them are from the former Soviet Union, where the game is very popular. In Israel there are thousands of players, between the ages 16 to 35, and include lawyers, high-tech workers and businessmen. Matan, 22, and Igor, a 21-year-old IDF soldier, organize activities for groups of players. Soon hundreds of fans are expected to meet in a forest in the southern part of Israel for a two-day game of pure fantasy. "It's not a game of winners and losers," Matan says, "but rather entry into another world with stories and plot changes." He is aware of the game's problematic reputation, especially in the IDF. The army is not indifferent to the unique hobby and is trying to locate soldiers who in their free time dress up as witches and play in forests. 'The game indicates a weak personality' A security official tells Ynet there are specific criteria for deciding the level of a soldier's security clearance. "One of the tests we do, either by asking soldiers directly or through information provided us, is to ask whether they take part in the game," he says. "If a soldier answers in the affirmative, he is sent to a professional for an evaluation, usually a psychologist." More than half of the soldiers sent for evaluation receive low security clearances, thus preventing them from serving in sensitive IDF positions, he says. Igor says exposing soldiers who play the game could result in the soldiers being sent to a military psychologist or even being kicked out of the army. "Exposing them could also harm their chances at being accepted to other military courses," he says. Matan says he has personally met soldiers whose military career was harmed due to their connection to the game. Most soldiers who play Dungeons and Dragons simply do not admit to it while they are in the army, he says. Why does IDF believe game is dangerous? "These people have a tendency to be influenced by external factors which could cloud their judgment, a military official says. "They may be detached from reality or have a weak personality - elements which lower a person's security clearance, allowing them to serve in the army, but not in sensitive positions." Unsurprisingly, Igor, Matan and thier friends do not approve of this IDF policy. They say the game is only a colorful, non-violent hobby. "Many people who play served in the most classified units," David says. "They are intelligent and any attempt to label them as 'weird' is incorrect and unfair." But in the struggle between the gameplayers and the Defense Minister, the latter wins - or at least this is the case in the real world of the IDF Lord, I feel so horribly stupid after forcing myself to read that article. But I gotta poke fun anyway: When the "army" starts purchasing my D&D products for me, then I "may" start worrying about their opinions. ~~~
Szat 03-22-05, 05:48 PM	Maybe they were really just angry because D&D doesn't have any good Mass Combat rules. Who ISN'T bothered by D&D's lack of mass combat rules. Soon to be rectified I hear!
Lord Ian Stark 03-22-05, 05:50 PM	Think about it! Would you trust matters of national security with a D&D geek? I sure wouldn't! :rolleyes: that's rediculous. Find any politician and see what he has done during his life. No matter what you can say, "Would you trust matters of national security with a ___ geek?" Where ____ is anything they have done that may be slightly different from the norm. :rolleyes:
LordofIllusions 03-22-05, 05:52 PM	LoL! This joker's name is "Captain Pixel" and he is calling other people geeks. :D ~~~
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 05:53 PM	LoL! This joker's name is "Captain Pixel" and he is calling other people geeks. :D ~~~ Geek is a great and respectable complement to me.
MasterRookie 03-22-05, 06:10 PM	Hmm no posts on that site I game him. I guess this lord hell fellow doesn't want to enlighten me. (yes I am writting this to bug you because you've pinched my curiosity)
allenchan 03-22-05, 06:59 PM	Yea, MOST of the dnd gamers I know are military. And there's been quite a few posters on these forums from servicemen in iraq and the like. :rolleyes:
Bard06 03-22-05, 08:19 PM	Look at me Sig :D :P
Bane 03-22-05, 08:58 PM	Wow. I think almost every post on this thread violates the CoC. Has no one learned from the three previous posts on the same subject? All of which are now locked, by the way.
TheatreRat81 03-22-05, 09:03 PM	Ok, just wanted to throw my 2cp into the hat here. Having both gamed and LARPed with US army, marine and air force personnel (sp?), I can say that both D&D and LARPing (especially LARPing) are really good for soldiers. First off, with D&D, every grunt I played with had levels of fighter or barbarian, and although there were similar builds amongst them, each player character had a clear-cut and well-defined purpose within the party. They all knew their roles and executed them flawlessly and the party would clear modules in record time. They used the RPGA adventures we played to practice their tactics and teamwork capabilities, especially in securing room after room in some of the longer dungeon crawls. LARPing adds a whole other dimension - there's nothing like storming a cabin full of bad guys in the middle of the night and using those tactics for real! The first night our group did this, we hit the game staff so fast they had no idea what hit them. It was definately fun being along for the ride. Since then, the gamestaff has actually taken to reading military tactics manuals and have started using that information on the players. Also, there's another real-world military application for LARPing skills - booby traps. There was a trap rogue at my old game who went off and joined the Marines after 9/11. His signature traps were quite insidious all involved extensively hidden tripwires. Some of his commanding officers heard about his gaming habbits and now he's a booby trap specialist disarming explosives in Iraq. Good thing he's an adrenaline junkie...
Capt. Pixel 03-22-05, 09:05 PM	Geek is a great and respectable complement to me. :D :D :D I think Bastet expressed it best. There are some skills that can be obtained and enhanced by role play, whether or not it's 'sanctioned'. For that matter, I've used role play in management training classes and product redesign exercises. It's a useful tool for moving away from the accepted way of doing things, and for giving one a different perspective than they might normally have. :lightbulb
striderII 03-23-05, 09:16 AM	there are LARP rules out there that remove the dice from the game, just WtoC does not publish them. i did some LARPing of the white wolf game, vampire: the mascarade (i cant spell). and either you roleplay everything out or you do a contest using papper, rock, sissors to determine the winner of the contest. and yeah, you do carry your character sheet around with you. I'll second that...although the new MET system has done away with the rock/paper/scissors element in favor of either a card system (1 through 10...simulates a random roll on a 10-sided die), or a hand system that does the same thing, but slightly more complicated. Although I am strongly in favor of roleplaying out as much as you possibly can, and only resorting to challenges when all else has failed... strider