Post/Author/DateTime	Post
coker159 07-24-07, 06:55 PM	I have had some issues with players in the past wanting to play nothing, but characters from their favorite Anime even when the story or setting didn't permit it. Has anyone else had this problem?
nightside_samurai 07-24-07, 07:00 PM	No because my players aren't 7
High Octane 07-24-07, 07:00 PM	http://dndorks.com/comics/10%2f24%2f2001.aspx Don't knock anime though. A lot of anime characters are good for inspiration. As long as everyone remembers where they are and what they can do in D&D.
coker159 07-24-07, 07:05 PM	I'm not knocking anime, but it's been a recurring problem I've had. Then the main guy I'm taking about gets ****** when he can't do what he's seen on the show. This guy is older than I am too.
Von_Harbringer 07-24-07, 07:10 PM	I think he was referring to Nightside_Samurai.
Solik 07-24-07, 07:23 PM	It sounds to me like your players, or at least some of them, would rather be playing an anime game. Maybe you can compromise? You could play an anime game like BESM or something every other weekend or whatnot? Or, you could introduce elements from some of your player's favorite shows into the game. Reflavor spells or Tome of Battle maneuvers or Power Attack or whatnot to work similar to things he likes. See if you can find a way to make everyone happy. It is, after all, a game played for enjoyment.
Nathan_Talisien 07-24-07, 07:24 PM	It's not just anime fans. The (I think) most often imitated character in any D&D game is probaby a certain well-known Drow Ranger from Faerun. (That becomes pretty ironic if you know this bit of trivia: Robert Salvatore has said in interviews that he has never even made a character sheet for Drizzt, let alone played him in a game.) Everyone has that "so cool" character that they'd love to play, I think. Is there anyone that hasn't thought about a multi-prestige-classed epic Monk who is the One, or a Barbarian/Fighter unarmed combat specialist with a ring of flying that has hair that goes yellow when he rages, or some other combination of things that closely resembles some fictional character? You have to find a way to let them have fun, without letting them go overboard. Say that the anime character is from Dragon Ball Z; in D&D terms, most of the characters from that show would have Strength scores in the high twenties or low thirties. I mean, they can punch someone through a skyscraper. C'mon, now, really. No DM in his right mind would let a player have that kind of power unless they are in an Epic campaign. Try talking to the player reasonably. Most players will be a little let down, but they'll understand and still have fun. The ones that won't, well... you may be back here, asking for help, LOL.
xXOblivionXx 07-24-07, 07:28 PM	As Solik said, it's a game played for enjoyment, so you should try the best you can if those players are willing to cooperate
Vharuck 07-24-07, 07:30 PM	Once, upon my friend's request, I DMed a play-by-post game on an anime fan forum he and some of his college buddies ran. Three of them played, and only one gave me trouble. This one was, according to the private messages of the other two, very young (13 I think) and annoying. I learned that quickly. My friend, John, made a stealthy changeling rogue. I let him know off the bat that, at 1st level, he wasn't going to be sneaking up on an enemy in broad daylight and killing with a single strike so fast nobody could see it. He was cool with this, put some ranks in Tumble, and made the best with what he had. His roommate, Matt, made a kalashtar druid (odd choice, but I liked how he pulled it off). He thoroughly enjoyed his animal companion, an eagle. The third, younger, player (I forget the name, maybe my brain is slowly wiping that memory away) first wanted to play Alucard. Alucard is a vampire. In the end, he played a stat block with no personality and thought that he should be able to do anything he could imagine because it would be "cool." I mean, like jumping over an enemy and striking from behind with no running start at all. At level 1. It's not the anime. Some anime fans are brats. But then again, a portion of every grouping of people are brats. It's inevitable.
Karui_Kage 07-24-07, 07:54 PM	Wasn't there an anime D20 game? I forget what it was called. Play that. The title of this thread bothers me. It's like...duh? I see a new series of threads! "Football fans can be bad D&Ders." "Star Trekkies can be bad D&Ders." "PC Gamers can be bad D&Ders." "Construction workers can be bad D&Ders." culminating with "Anyone can be a bad D&Der." :doh:
dknight100 07-24-07, 08:57 PM	Kurui's pretty much nailed it - its not that anime fans can be bad dnd'ers (not that they should stop dnding, just that they should improve). Pretty much anyone can have inane expectations of what a person can do, at low or high levels. On the anime note though - there isn't really any 'fighting' anime showing at the moment that i am both interested in and following, so if i were to base a character of an anime show i'm watching at the moment, i'd probably wind up rolling a blue-haired monk, Lawful Good, with max ranks in Profession: Butler, or a female bard with no ranks in disguise, yet keeps trying to 'disguise' herself and teach people another language, as her alter ego. Or perhaps someone with blue hair, and max ranks in: Know(Anime) Know (Video games) Know (manga) Know (random stuff from the 80s) and pretty much no useful skills. Not that i would ever, ever make those characters. oh my.
CeilingNinja 07-24-07, 09:05 PM	BESM is designed for anime D20 games. It's a pretty broken system, though.
CryoSilver 07-24-07, 09:11 PM	Sure, I've had a couple players who were playing obvious Rurouni Kenshin/Inuyasha/whatever knock-offs. So what? I've also had to deal with a couple Drizzt clones, a character who rode magical coconuts, and just recently, a Legolas clone. I tend to just roll with it, unless it's seriously disruptive. If it gets too bad, I let my players know by pulling the same crap. After one too many anime-inspired characters, I built a BBEG that was a carbon copy of Darth Vader; a psychic warrior with a brilliant energy bastard sword and black full-plate, who refered to his powers as "the Force." It didn't take long for the player to understand my point.
DyloniusFunk 07-24-07, 09:18 PM	Kurui's pretty much nailed it - its not that anime fans can be bad dnd'ers (not that they should stop dnding, just that they should improve). Pretty much anyone can have inane expectations of what a person can do, at low or high levels. On the anime note though - there isn't really any 'fighting' anime showing at the moment that i am both interested in and following, so if i were to base a character of an anime show i'm watching at the moment, i'd probably wind up rolling a blue-haired monk, Lawful Good, with max ranks in Profession: Butler Hayate The Combat Butler or a female bard with no ranks in disguise, yet keeps trying to 'disguise' herself and teach people another language, as her alter ego. No Clue Or perhaps someone with blue hair, and max ranks in: Know(Anime) Know (Video games) Know (manga) Know (random stuff from the 80s) and pretty much no useful skills. BAWAHAHA Konata from Lucky Star FTW :D Not that i would ever, ever make those characters. oh my. I would love to make a bard who plays electric guit\ar but i don't have a DM who would let me play it
Warpclaw 07-24-07, 09:23 PM	I don't really have a problem with the anime fans, as long as they don't try to carbon copy a particular character, and expect to do all the uber elite things that character can do. If that's their mindset, then they can go play City of Heroes, and leave me alone. The problem I do find, though, is trying to stat the unstat-able. Most anime heroes, even the ones without magic, tend to be able to move much faster than is feasible, like, say, Kenshin. And if you're trying to stat Naruto characters, well that is just plain hard. I mean, come on! From watching that show, even the freakin' children are Epic Level, let alone someone like Jiraiya or Orochimaru.
Vharuck 07-24-07, 10:08 PM	I don't really have a problem with the anime fans, as long as they don't try to carbon copy a particular character, and expect to do all the uber elite things that character can do. If that's their mindset, then they can go play City of Heroes, and leave me alone. The problem I do find, though, is trying to stat the unstat-able. Most anime heroes, even the ones without magic, tend to be able to move much faster than is feasible, like, say, Kenshin. Just make a feat a Monk can take to use bastard swords (aka katanas) in Flurry of Blows. Ta-da! Unarmored, super-fast samurai! And if you're trying to stat Naruto characters, well that is just plain hard. I mean, come on! From watching that show, even the freakin' children are Epic Level, let alone someone like Jiraiya or Orochimaru. The psionics board has a thread that makes a build for almost every Naruto character. And yeah, they're basically all 20th level and still missing a few tricks.
dknight100 07-24-07, 10:21 PM	BAWAHAHA Konata from Lucky Star FTW :D While you're right, i was describing konata, in hindsight i should have made a self obsessed halfling who's either ridiculously bubbly and happy or bitter, twisted and violent. Akira FTW, i pretty much watch Lucky Star for Lucky Channel.
shadzar 07-24-07, 10:26 PM	No because my players aren't 7 QFE i love anime since about the same time i started playing D&D in the early 80's. i never once wanted Thundercats, ok maybe not really anime, but close; or anything else like that in my games. i created a few monsters like smurfs, and even wrote up a pokemon or two when i needed some humorous monsters that would bring back childhood memories for my players, but never wanted to be Goko, Kenshin Himora, Ichigo Kurosaki, Naruto, Inuyasha, Ranma Satome, etc. they just don't belong in the genre. now i did fashion a character after Presto once, and it was rather fun/funny for a bit but did grow old.
sorreahdarkhart 07-24-07, 10:29 PM	Speaking as an anime fan myself, I'd like to say that my character concepts don't come from any anime I watch or read. I'd also like to include that yes, BESM is a far better system for the anime-type RPers than D&D is. But then again, we are ignoring the old days of D&D where humorous situations were almost a regular occurence, and got almost to the four-wall breaking anime style. You can stat any anime character, yes, but they WILL be freaking insane. Taking Kenshin, for example, would definetely have the Weapon Supremacy (katana) feat from PHB2, and that ALONE requires a level 18 Fighter. If you've got a good head on your shoulders for building characters, and you're really good with getting effect X by combining X feat and Y skill, you can certainly stat up an anime character. But, quite simply, it's far too hard to do so. And let's just forget about Alucard. He would take the Libris Mortis a run for it's money. Mainly because he's got tricks and skills from almost every undead creature imaginable. And those Naruto kids? They've been in school most of their time. It's those teachers that made them the epic kids they are. So, those teachers have be, like, HARDCORE or something like that.
temparus2000 07-24-07, 10:30 PM	"Construction workers can be bad D&Ders." just don't say anything about us garbage men D&Ders. Not only do we know where you live, but we know what you throw away, too. :)
Crimson_Concerto 07-24-07, 10:33 PM	No because my players aren't 7Agreed. Also, liking anime has nothing to do with a person's originality. There are people who are fans of other types of entertainment who want to emulate those characters (like wanting to play a Star Wars character for example), and there are Anime fans who are fantastic roleplayers. Heck, one of my favorite players is an anime fanatic, and his characters are always a lot of fun. Anime Fans can be good D&Ders, too.
shadzar 07-24-07, 10:34 PM	And let's just forget about Alucard. NEVER! http://tinypic.com/jaf72f.gif Releasing control art restriction system to level 3 .. level 2 .. situation "A" release level 1! The Cromwell approval is now in effect. Releasing power restriction until the target has been silenced. DM: well the Terresque was killed before initiative was rolled for so...
TheWerg 07-24-07, 10:34 PM	If it gets too bad, I let my players know by pulling the same crap. After one too many anime-inspired characters, I built a BBEG that was a carbon copy of Darth Vader; a psychic warrior with a brilliant energy bastard sword and black full-plate, who refered to his powers as "the Force." It didn't take long for the player to understand my point. "Unk the Barbarian... I am your father." Also, QFT.
Mock26 07-24-07, 10:59 PM	Some people are simply imaginationally challenged. They might not be able to come up with the 1/2 dragon, 1/2 troll, 16/30th halfling, 1/1000000000th pixie, 5/3rds dwarf procrastinator/ninja/pirate/hippy/lawyer/republican/politician/sorcerer/cowgirl on their own. So, they use something else for inspiration, such as the 1,000,000th Drizz't clone, or yet another Gandalf, or Sailor Moon. If they can take that inspiration and use it to create an enjoyable D&D character, then there shouldn't be any problem. If, however, they fail to grasp the reality that they are playing D&D and not Neon Gensis/Ghost in the Shell vs. Team Princess Mononoke and Kiki's Delivery Service, then maybe they simpy are mature enough or imaginative enough to be playing D&D.
shadzar 07-24-07, 11:06 PM	~~~Princess Mononoke and Kiki's Delivery Service, then maybe they simpy are mature enough or imaginative enough to be playing D&D. what no Howl's Moving Castle, Laputa, or Pom Poko in that list? Hiyao Miyazaki does wonderful things for stretching the imagination. so all Studio Ghibli titles are immature, or just those who watch them? :mad: those movies you list have great story elements to them as well as character development and growth. several things that make D&D good.
dknight100 07-24-07, 11:08 PM	Seeing Gandalf and sailor moon in the same sentence just made me thing: Gandalf + Sailor moon = awesome character concept. or what it dreadful character concept....
Mock26 07-24-07, 11:39 PM	what no Howl's Moving Castle, Laputa, or Pom Poko in that list? Howl's Moving Castle, Laputa, and Pom Poko are NOT part of the Core Books. They're from the soon to be released AnimeDungeons&Dragons splat book! EVERYONE knows that! :D
dknight100 07-24-07, 11:46 PM	Seeing Gandalf and sailor moon in the same sentence just made me thing: Gandalf + Sailor moon = awesome character concept. or what it dreadful character concept.... I really regret writing that, now i can't get the mental image of Gandalf cosplaying sailor moon out of my head.
Von_Harbringer 07-25-07, 12:04 AM	I enjoy anime but I am not a fanatic. I do take certian elements and concepts and put them into a game. My two examples are Duke Igthorn (gummi bears) and Trevor Belmont (castlevania). Do I play them exactly like them? No, but do use them for inspiration. Now I'll just kick kick back and drink a tall glass of protoculture. :D
Thecolorblue 07-25-07, 12:08 AM	When trying to get someone into playing a game of D&D, I made the mistake of saying "you can do anything". He tried to make an Ash character from Evil Dead. Shortly after that I gave up.
Mock26 07-25-07, 12:19 AM	I really regret writing that, now i can't get the mental image of Gandalf cosplaying sailor moon out of my head. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg
JMKoontz 07-25-07, 12:21 AM	Anime Fans do not make bad D&Ders. That said, there are some horrible D&Ders who happen to also be anime fans. Conversly, there are also some fantasy wargame fans that are so overly obsessed with realism that they forget about the 'fantasy' aspect of it that makes D&D, and other games like it, fun to some other people. All vagueries aside, this is something of an issue that I am starting to see all too often around here. Anime is not counter to D&D. Neither is 'anime' a good, all inclusive genre title. That which is collected under that umbrella spans many genres of fiction and film-making from childish fantasies designed for toddler and pre-teen youth all the way up through gritty street level drama aimed at a VERY adult population. Unfortunately, the American (and much other western) media has chosen to focus on importing and highly promoting mostly that which is aimed at children aged 6-13 featuring over-the-top action. Mostly this is due to misguided thought processes that animation=children's programming. While it is true that many children and teens (and by default many older persons who realize that 'anime' is not created solely for children but have limited material available for viewing at easy access) come to D&D and other adventure games with misconceptions abotu what their characters can and should be able to do out of the gate, how is this any different from avid "Lord of the Rings" or "Conan" fans that want to emulate their favorite character types. In either case it is a matter of explanning that the intent is to start rather inexperienced and work up to those feats of prowess. In the case of some of these over-the-top action scenes, it may simply be a matter of DM style and description. So the samurai wants to sommersault over the head of his enemy and attack him from behind ... make a tumble check to move through the enemy's space (you might even use the bad guy as a prop in doing so ^_^ ) to wrap up my long-windedness, I know I am not going to change the opinions of this board in general, but is there any hope of ever finding "anime" not used as a dirty word around here?
Eightbitmage 07-25-07, 12:36 AM	http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg In the name of the moon, you shall not pass!!!! I shall punish you!
dknight100 07-25-07, 12:49 AM	>.<
guru7892 07-25-07, 12:54 AM	He tried to make an Ash character from Evil Dead. atleast he didn't make Ash from poke'mon (which Ironicaly, is much easier). although a Vorpal Flaming BoomStick of Undeath bane, disruption, and returning would be pretty fre'kane awesome... I will admit some anime shows are just bad for any sort of realism or D&D play (even if both are opposites). naruto, dragonball, inyuasha, just dont really translate well. but neither do many other types of cinematrography, walker texas ranger sure as hell doesn't, kung fu hussel doesn't, AC360 doesn't translate at all. hell herculese doesn't tanslate well, jason and the argonauts doesnt either, beowulf doesn't stand a chance in hell! many things dont translate to D&D, if you are a fan of them and try to make them in D&D it wont work (often). d&d tries for freedom and balance. many heroes are made in disregard to balance. @ sailor gandalf- I puke a little every time I see that picture
Zephyrus/Sonet 07-25-07, 01:12 AM	I really regret writing that, now i can't get the mental image of Gandalf cosplaying sailor moon out of my head. You've made my day sir.
darkdrgon2136 07-25-07, 01:25 AM	on those few occasions I step from behind the screen, I normally take my inspiration from books, so there is a less chance of me getting caught. To anyone out there who has read the wheel of time books, I have had a Perrin Fighter/druid and a Mat Rogue. i also had a sorceror that was prety similar to Pug from the riftwar books. does this make me a bad player? /rant
High Octane 07-25-07, 01:38 AM	Mock26 you jackass! Now that thing is at the top of the page so everyone clicking this thread will have it rape their eyes until page 3 is made! It BUUUUURNS!
Von_Harbringer 07-25-07, 01:39 AM	I just hope this isn't one of those anti-anime threads. Anyway, it is true that for years cartoon = kids. But that isn't true, Ninja scroll, Akira, Neon Genesis, Ghost in the Shell, and Vampire Hunter D just to name a few are not targeting children. They are very much adult oriented. Most people a little older than myself think cartoons from Japan are Poke mon, Yu-Gi-Oh, or Sailor Moon. From the jist of posts with complaints, they're basically saying "Use your freaking imagination!" or Player: "Can I play a sayian prince, who happens to be a half-dog demon, with chakra abilities, and drives a veritech fighter jet?" :) DM: "No" :ahem: Player: "Why not?" :( DM: "..." :banghead: Post Edit: Remember "the Hobbit" was a children's book.
TheCrawlingSpleen 07-25-07, 02:18 AM	I would love to make a bard who plays electric guit\ar but i don't have a DM who would let me play it And who would that be? Hey, at least it's not a psion/fighter who wields an electric guitar. :D Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with using an anime character as inspiration, so long as you accept that D&D places some restrictions on just what your character can be. Trying to copy Inuyasha into D&D probably won't work, but you might be able to make a tiefling fighter (or samurai, if you prefer) that has a similar feel. Just my :twocents:
Mock26 07-25-07, 02:42 AM	Mock26 you jackass! Now that thing is at the top of the page so everyone clicking this thread will have it rape their eyes until page 3 is made! It BUUUUURNS! :devil: By the way, that is Mr. Jackass to you! :tie: As for the topic of the thread, I completely and totally agree 100% with the title of the thread. Anime Fans can be bad D&Ders. However, the same also applies to Fantasy Fans, and Science Fiction Fans, and Camping Fans, and Renn Faire Fans, and Dog Fans, and Sports Fans, and Cooking Fans, and Nerd Fans, and Ceiling Fans, and everyone else that exists. Any person, regardless of who they are, can be a bad D&D player. Contrary, any person, regardless of who they are, can be a good player, even Anime Fans. I don't think that any one group of people (except maybe narrow minded frat boys :D ) is more likely to produce bad D&D players as is any other group. And just because I can, I repeat what I "said" up above! http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg May your eyes burn with the eternal fire of a thousand pit fiends wielding fire elemental clad mages of fire in a field of lava!
Ace_of_Night 07-25-07, 03:36 AM	First off... *rolls over the floor around the entire room laughing his bottoms off at the sight of Sailor Gandalf* There, that's out of my system. Anyhow, I think anime fans, or fans of whatever, are in no way less able to play D&D. On the contrary, I sometimes get some good plots from Animes (Yes I'm a fan myself, bite me). The ones who are less able are the ones who bring their fandom to the table and want to be their ultimate character. With your logic, D&D fans are also bad D&D players, as I've had a few players who simply "had to be" a dragon, a demon, etc. And not a weak one, noooooo, it had to be at least an adult dragon or a pit fiend.. or a succubus in one case. The player who "needed" to play a dragon even left immediately, as he actually got angry about it and said he wouldn't play if he couldn't get a dragon (The guy really started having a tantrum). I simply told him that's his decision and pointed him to the door. Haven't seen him at the D&D meetings ever since. And not to the slightest of my discomforts I (and many, many others) have had players who want to be like Legolas or Aragorn or Gandalf. And yes, I have at one point made an epic character to be as close to Kurosaki Ichigo as possible, but I've never brought it into play. (Both his good and evil side, for the record). Does that harm the game in any way? No, because when I'm a player and not a DM I'm rational enough to know that it might just be too overpowered. Edit: That was also the first and last time I made a character with a katana, I have something against katana fanboys for some reason. In D&D it's just a freaking sword like any other. Yes in reality, samurai were cool, had cool beliefs about sharing a soul with their katana or something similar.. don't feel like going into all the details at the moment, but in D&D it's a sword. "Use a bastard sword, it's cooler anyway."
dknight100 07-25-07, 04:54 AM	Mock, you should make that your avatar, its awesome.
AvalancheRider 07-25-07, 06:17 AM	Is there anyone that hasn't thought about a multi-prestige-classed epic Monk who is the One, or a Barbarian/Fighter unarmed combat specialist with a ring of flying that has hair that goes yellow when he rages, or some other combination of things that closely resembles some fictional character?::Raises hand.:: :P
Ace_of_Night 07-25-07, 06:37 AM	I hadn't thought of the barbarian unarmed combat specialist yet.. Next time I'm actually a player I need to try it :P Though it seems like it'll never happen again, which makes me both happy and sad. Happy that the players like me as DM, sad that I can't play a character now and then. Maybe I can make an enemy NPC like this? God I'm really thinking about doing this now just for the fun of it.
shadzar 07-25-07, 06:46 AM	In the name of the moon, you shall not pass!!!! I shall punish you! i am not sure which is worse, the picture created, what you said, or when i saw the picture the first thing i thought was Serena the White. :raincloud
MagicMouth 07-25-07, 07:07 AM	Heck, at least half of my group are anime fans, and I follow two animes with great regularity: Naruto and Hellsing. It isn´t a problem. We do, however, frequently make references (IC and OOC) to some of our favorite shows. "Special Paladin Technique: Smite Evil!" "MOUNTAINU HAMMERUH!" (I love my Warforged Warblade :D. That maneuver has become something of a signature move and warcry for him.) The psionics board has a thread that makes a build for almost every Naruto character. And yeah, they're basically all 20th level and still missing a few tricks. A while ago on the Campaign Workshop boards, someone used the Arcane Swordsage variant from Tome of Battle and began listing which spells could be used to simulate the different techniques. I think that is the best solution without coming up with an entirely new system.
Aryxbez 07-25-07, 07:27 AM	I don't think I have had players wanting to use anime ideas for characters, although I think a player in my group wanted to wield a sword like that of Bleach Anime. Otherwise I have had no people wanting to be those Wizards, I mean "NINJA'S" of the Naruto series. Nor of anything DBZ, although one character had the ki feats from the PH2. I like Anime, I just don't like anime that is stupid, repeats, stalls episodes, Action is that of the DBZ series after the Garlic Junior Saga, or the android saga and onward. Pretty much all this high powered crap, which is also a reason I dislike High magic, and therefore Forgotten realms Campaign setting.
Kobold Paladin 07-25-07, 09:37 AM	I think the real problem with trying to make anime style character in D&D is that most of the time in anime, a characters spceial abilities (class features, spell, powers, skill points and feats) scale at a differnt rate with there over all power (HP, BAB). Because of this anime character seem very overpowered compaired to D&D. Basically the way to fix it would be to count all BAB based feat requirement as 6 levels lower and let them combine class features and get them 6 levels lower but keep them with lower survive ability. That doesnt work well with all animes, but ones that the character can still die by being shot it works very well.
tonabricks 07-25-07, 09:50 AM	Had a couple people want to take a joke session in between game breaks. All decided on a sci-fi mashup. Gordon Freeman Vs Predator Vs Space Jockey Vs Cylon Centiurion Vs Jedi Vs Terminator Vs Power Ranger (red) (Died first with lots of sparkles) Had a great time doing completley out thier things. The fun was seeing how diffrent characters attempted to fight each other. It was a one of session. I could see a short session for anime but trying to do a campaign on it will be diffucult if not impossible. And besides I don't want to hear another IT'S OVER NINE THOUSAND !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Paladin_Hiroshi 07-25-07, 05:23 PM	...IT'S OVER 9000!!!!!!!!!!!! (so I heard u liek mukipz) :P ...ahem...sorry about that. I take inspiration from real life, rather than anime or shows. Although, I did once play a fighter/monk who used a katana which did non-lethal damage :rolleyes: I also have a bard with a magic amplified lute, scandinavian looks, and a thick accent. His name? Yngwie J. Malmsteen :P
Karui_Kage 07-25-07, 05:41 PM	Found it. Have them play this: http://www.guardiansorder.com/games/d20/srd/ if they want anime d20.
otakuwolf 07-25-07, 05:49 PM	i had this problem once upon a time and also the reverse. Besm is a great game and as "broken" as it may seem sometimes the plot comes from something else since power isnt the question. an old friend would jump off walls bounce on swords and such. finially i explained that that would be fine if he would tone it down. instead of "i leap 15 ft in the air and ricochet back and forth" i told him to spring bord off the wall at the 3 ft marker and twist and attack. tone them down by explaining d and d is exagerated realism. also i have had d and d players who lacked the over the top style for a besm or exalted game. tell them to think brotherhood of the wolf or pirates of the carrribean not croutching tiger or ninja scroll
Anomen 07-25-07, 06:03 PM	Anime is all based on gross exaggerations of all kinds.Transferring an Anime character into D&D is like giant robots attacking helms deep. Some of the character concepts can be adapted, but most players will probably be disappointed that they don't have the sheer disgusting power of their Anime counterpart. If they want to have that kind of force, they should go play an Anime game, not D&D.
aotrscommander 07-25-07, 06:14 PM	http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg Aaaaaargh! It burns!!!!! That is sick and wrong on So. Many. Levels. dude! Where the hell did I put that liquid anti-nitrogen, I need to clean out the inside of my skull!
Mock26 07-25-07, 06:20 PM	Ain't I a stinker?! :schemes:
DaidojiTaidoru 07-25-07, 07:03 PM	Anime is all based on gross exaggerations of all kinds.Transferring an Anime character into D&D is like giant robots attacking helms deep. Some of the character concepts can be adapted, but most players will probably be disappointed that they don't have the sheer disgusting power of their Anime counterpart. If they want to have that kind of force, they should go play an Anime game, not D&D. Because mid level D&D is ever so realistic. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=12393614&postcount=239) Well I suppose if you picked "Fighting Man" it is but that's another argument. D&D characters past level 5 start leaving Exalted Characters in the dust. The big problem is people who want to play copy characters dislike how they start much weaker and never realize how they can become mind bogglingly stronger then the character they wanted to be like a bit down the line. Also doing so usually requires Charop and reflavoring skills far beyond that of newbies (especially since most clones are melee types). And most people trying to make clone characters are newish. Oh yes, and as part of the futile chorus: Anime is a medium not a genre....
Corpus 07-25-07, 07:11 PM	I was unaware that anime fans could be good D&Ders.
High Octane 07-25-07, 07:19 PM	I was unaware that anime fans could be good D&Ders. That depends on whether they can keep their inappropriate anime out of their characters and only put in appropriate anime or none at all. Record of Lodoss War for example is a good anime to be basing characters off of.
Mock26 07-25-07, 07:33 PM	I was unaware that anime fans could be good D&Ders. As I said in an above post, anyone can potentially be a good D&Der, just as anyone can potentially be a bad D&Der. Just because someone likes Anime does not mean that they are predispositioned to be good or bad at playing D&D. I think that it all comes down to whether or not they are able to keep the anime seperated from the D&D and realize that their D&D character is inspired by the anime character. The time that they will be most likely to run into problems is when they try to run the D&D game as if it were an anime film. But, this can apply to just about everyone, not just fans of anime. And, because I'm mean: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg
Dark Kyosuke 07-25-07, 08:05 PM	First, let me say... This thread is dangerously close to becomming a 4chan thread. And why do I get the feeling I'll be seeing Sailor Gandalf again, in other, unrelated threads...? :raincloud Second, let me say that, yes, anime fans CAN be good D&D players. After all, I am an anime fan (much less than I was once, but still), and I have been told I'm an excellent roleplayer. See, the assumption people make is that anime has no place in D&D. This simply isn't true. It might not have a place in your campaign, but everything, arguably, has a place in the game itself. At one point, I was crafting ideas for an Asian-styled, highly anime-inspired D&D campaign. Why? Well, it was when I thought I'd be able to get players from my comic shop, and most of them are hooked on Naruto (and I thought more than a few were about to pick up Bleach as well). What I learned suprised me: I could achieve many of the desired effects simply by altering the flavor. Very few rules changes were required, as I recall, and as long as I kept in their minds the fact that, no, you're not going to be Naruto right away (if ever!), I felt I could keep it in control and everyone could have a good time. And isn't that what this game is about? Of course, and anyone who has read my posts in the past knows what I'm about to say, that never happened. But still. In my mind, it was proof of concept that "anime-styled" and "serious D&D" were not mutually exclusive. Flash-stepping to the other end of the spectrum, however... I have a few charachter ideas that have been stuck in my head for quite some time. Take, for example, my almost uncontrollable urge to play a female Catfolk... And pick up a maid uniform. Possibly a pair of glasses as well. Yes, that's right: A Megane-ko Catgirl Maid. Possibly with Barbarian levels, wielding a Greatsword that looks suspiciously like an oversized cooking knife. Insane? You have no idea. But it gets better. Or worse, depending on who you ask: Another idea was a half-red dragon... Named Draco-Centaur. She would have to shout "GAO!" while breathing fire, of course. (Only Puyo Puyo fans will understand this... And come to think of it, I also wanted to play Kikimora... Me and my maid obsession...) There must be other ideas, but they escape me right now. Now do I think these ideas are serious? No, not hardly. Do they have a place in most campaigns? No, probably not. Could they be useable, interesting, and fun charachters? Yes, I think they could be. But I wouldn't try to float them past most DMs, simply because of what they might think. But I think they have a place in the game.
temparus2000 07-25-07, 08:10 PM	If people want so badly to make anime characters, why not pick an anime that translates to D+D rather simply? Record of Lodoss War comes to mind.... Even the most powerful characters (Ashrahm, Vagnard, Karla) can be created pretty easily.
High Octane 07-25-07, 08:21 PM	Yes! 3rd page! Thank the gods....
Edymnion 07-25-07, 09:01 PM	I actually find "real" anime fans to be better D&D players than non-anime fans, mainly because the "real" anime (aka, the good stuff, not the crap that gets shown on Fox on saturday mornings) almost always features good character growth and development. It tends to get into the whys of a situation a lot more than american animation does. Aka, the understand that characters need personality and motivation. That said, D&D really is a poor choice for replicating most animes. Mutants & Masterminds 2e is a much better choice, and actually does a better job at anime games than BESM.
dknight100 07-25-07, 09:28 PM	First, let me say... This thread is dangerously close to becomming a 4chan thread. And why do I get the feeling I'll be seeing Sailor Gandalf again, in other, unrelated threads...? :raincloud Its not a 4chan thread till we get the cat meme going, and have the 4chan party van turn up :D Not to mention a few other things i can't really mention on a PG board
haruplue 07-25-07, 10:56 PM	Agreed. Also, liking anime has nothing to do with a person's originality. There are people who are fans of other types of entertainment who want to emulate those characters (like wanting to play a Star Wars character for example), and there are Anime fans who are fantastic roleplayers. Heck, one of my favorite players is an anime fanatic, and his characters are always a lot of fun. Anime Fans can be good D&Ders, too. I agree 100%. My wife has based her D&D character on her character from Conquer Online, but switched certain details so it'll fit in a D&D campaign. I personally play a Duskblade based off Red Mage from Final Fantasy, a friend plays a loud-mouthed Rogue loosely based on Naruto, and another enjoys playing Conan-esque characters (but set in Faerun or Krynn). Inspiration and carbon-copy are two different things and should stay that way.
High Octane 07-25-07, 11:10 PM	I personally play a Duskblade based off Red Mage from Final Fantasy, Does he carry around a d20 and make lots of metagaming comments that no one else understands? http://www.nuklearpower.com/
Vharuck 07-25-07, 11:44 PM	A while ago on the Campaign Workshop boards, someone used the Arcane Swordsage variant from Tome of Battle and began listing which spells could be used to simulate the different techniques. I think that is the best solution without coming up with an entirely new system. I dunno, Psychic Warriors and Lurks (psionic rogue-like class) seem perfect for this. They fight and use a limited pool of energy (power points can be easily called "chakra") to perform awesome techniques.
Kitaki 07-25-07, 11:53 PM	I play with a guy that really likes Naruto and Bleach and has constantly tried to play characters based from one or the other, or both. Fortunatly he has come to the realisation that he can't make a properly balanced character based on those animes as closely as he would like, and has settled to playing the Ninja base class. I myself have made a Swordsage flavored like a Bleach character, but all done within the confines of existing rules.
Shayde 07-26-07, 01:37 AM	I like anime quite a bit, as a DM though the only influence I allow is bizzare hair and eye colors. A lot of what I have seen anime wise is not overpowered per say, but typically epic. As near as I can figure the cast of Dragonball Z was at least level 20 by the time the series STARTED in terms of D&D, Naruto, yeah those kids are definately epic so I'd hate to see how high level their teachers are. And don't get me started on the DragonballZ fiasco a couple of my early players started, I have enough bad examples of overpowered stuff inspired by that show to write a doctoral thesis. Only thing I will share on that is this one time my players spent so much time making plans on how to beat my bbeg, in characer, out loud, in front of said bbeg, that he stood up, walked out the same door the party came in, and locked it behind him. Also it's not Anime that makes players bad at D&D I have had a lot of players who HATED anime that still couldn't handle D&D. In my experience it's not a specific like/dislike for any particular type of entertainment be it video games, anime, or movies. It's more of a pop-culture junkie/sense of entitlement/no desire to work for the cool stuff/want to be super uber right now/would rather pay some guy $300 to level my character in an online video game than actually play it myself/I kick so much butt at ONE game I spend 90 hours a week on that I should be able to kick butt at EVERY game I play even if it is for the first time kind of thing. Hmm..... Sailor Gandalf GAH!!!!!!! I close my eyes and I STILL see it!!!!
TheCrawlingSpleen 07-26-07, 02:00 AM	It's more of a pop-culture junkie/sense of entitlement/no desire to work for the cool stuff/want to be super uber right now/would rather pay some guy $300 to level my character in an online video game than actually play it myself/I kick so much butt at ONE game I spend 90 hours a week on that I should be able to kick butt at EVERY game I play even if it is for the first time kind of thing. :rofl: That has to be the longest descriptive sentence-fragment-string ever.
TheHarrow 07-26-07, 02:04 AM	The manga Ragnarok is a perfect fit for DnD. Heck, it comes with a Player's Guide with stats and everything!
InkBlot 07-26-07, 03:14 AM	If people want so badly to make anime characters, why not pick an anime that translates to D+D rather simply? Record of Lodoss War comes to mind.... Even the most powerful characters (Ashrahm, Vagnard, Karla) can be created pretty easily. Record Of Lodoss War is a D&D game. Literally. The creator of it ran a really good long-running D&D campaign, and wrote a novel about what happened in the game. The novel became so popular it was turned into an anime. Deedlit's player was a guy.
Roxlimn 07-26-07, 03:22 AM	Anime fans can be good D&Ders, but only if they're altruistic or protect the innocent or both. They should also do activities of this sort more than neutral or evil activities. Whether they can kill other people for reasons of expediency and efficiency evidently is debatable. Just kidding. Personally, I think that Mutants and Masterminds and BESM are touted as being better for "representing anime" simply because those systems tend to be generic and inclusive, whereas D&D tends to go for a flavor and setting of its own, different from other settings. Ironically, it's easier to model "anime" into D&D than it is to model classical European fantasy tales, because anime tends to be more varied and therefore some of it is bound to coincide pretty well with D&D standards. Record of Lodoss War is easy. So is Berserk and most fantasy-styled anime. Naruto was rather difficult. Even using Psionics, it tended towards epic level characters, but after ToB, I think that it's possible to create a Naruto-like setting with the Konoha Chunnin being in the mid levels. Spell mechanics really are so much more forgiving than feats. A show like Rurouni Kenshin is eminently doable and Kenshin doesn't even have to be Epic to do it! In fact, going by character power benchmarks Cleric and Druid, Kenshin can't be more than about level 14. After all, he can't instantly teleport to other locations, and his ability to tackle multiple enemies near him in capability is rather limited. He can't jump 200 feet, he can't fly, he can't even levitate. As a D&D character, he would be rather weak. There are several PrCs that do a passable job of emulating Kenshin-type characters, although a low-magic campaign involving primarily fighting characters is going to take a lot of work, whether you're basing it off of anime or live-action movies.
guru7892 07-26-07, 03:29 AM	The manga Ragnarok is a perfect fit for DnD. Heck, it comes with a Player's Guide with stats and everything! on the other hand there is FLCL... where bards kill everything, random crap comes out of your head, and LSD is reality... anime is like any other story, some translate to d&d better than others. (however, most don't translate to d&d very well).
The_other_DM 07-26-07, 03:50 AM	anime is a medium, not a setting. same with live action TV. simply put, anime is the animated way Japanese television tell stories. I generally like anime. not because "it's anime", but because it generally has a story to tell and is able to tell it from start to end in a good 12-24 (maybe 50) episodes, and still have both plot and character development. the longer series like dragonball, naruto, kenshin, bleach, ranma, sailor moon, do have some development, but it is very minimal, and if there is some, it is done VERY SLOWLY, to milk the series ;) . not that those series don't have their own good points, i just get bored from having to watch 100 22 minute episodes. Shayde: the characters started powerful in DBZ because of previous experiences in the original dragonball. yes, DBZ characters are overpowered for D&D starters, but the original Dragonball characters were not overpowered at all when the series began. enough ranting about anime. bad players are bad players regardless on where they take their encouragement from. as a DM you have a few options. 1) live with it for whatever reason 2) tell them to suck it up and make a different character 3) kick the player away from the table 4) arrive to some kind of compromise between party balance and character power 5) ask the other players to amp their PC's to "Anime Stan's" level of awesome. 4 is the best option, but requires the most attention. 3 is the quickest. 1 is the messiest 2 might result in the most whining 5 might result in you getting 3'd by the other, now angry, players
Gareshra 07-26-07, 04:10 AM	"Football fans can be bad D&Ders." "Star Trekkies can be bad D&Ders." "PC Gamers can be bad D&Ders." "Construction workers can be bad D&Ders." culminating with "Anyone can be a bad D&Der." I find that insulting. I'm Trekkie, a hardcore PC gamer, and I do electrical work for my dad for money until I leave for college. I don't consider myself a particularly bad D&Der... =( Then again, I think the problem with said players is when they approach D&D as though it were a PC game or Star Trek. Different game, different approach and rules.
Steely_Dan 07-26-07, 07:17 AM	If it gets too bad, I let my players know by pulling the same crap. After one too many anime-inspired characters, I built a BBEG that was a carbon copy of Darth Vader; a psychic warrior with a brilliant energy bastard sword and black full-plate, who refered to his powers as "the Force." It didn't take long for the player to understand my point. That actually sounds pretty cool, though.
Noria Merfolk Mage 07-26-07, 11:21 AM	I've said it before and I'll say it again: When you play an anime-based character in an RPG setting, you're supposed to play the STYLE of the character, not the powerlevel. If you are playing someone from Dragonball Z, you make a guy who can fly, fire energy blasts, and fights with his fists. You DO NOT attempt to make a character that cracks mountains in half and breaks continents over his knee. If you are only playing a character for his level of broken, you have lost sight of how the game works. Games are collaborative where works of fiction have one point of origin and no real need for "balance". This must be kept in mind while adapting. As an aside, I wouldn't do the DBZ powerup scream at full volume, it's unlikely you have the lung capacity. Changing hair color is ok if you have a justification: Who's to say Tenser's Tranformation doesn't work that way? You DO NOT complain if you find your character is losing in situations he wouldn't in his source material, because this is not the source material. This is the D&D RPG, in your DMs campaign setting. This will be different. The possibility of failure is a nessecary element of the game. Accept change. You MAY NOT demand that other plot elements from your anime of the moment be inserted into the game. If the DM is taking player input in setting up the setting and character plot, that's fine, but ultimately responsibility for this stuff lies with the DM. You signed the social contract when you agreed to play, getting huffy about it after the fact isn't very mature. It is entirely possible to play an anime-based character in a D&D game, but you have to have exactly the same approach as with other, more common character types.
JediJoeH 07-26-07, 12:57 PM	I had some experience with this. I had a player who, in the ultimate campaign of good vs evil, (Half dozen good heroes vs the entire cosmos.) decided that he wanted to be the guy from Berzerk. I've never read it/Seen the Cartoon/Even care. I looked at him and told him the same thing that I told everyone who wanted to play ridiculous characters right off the bat. "You start at level one and can work up to it if you can figure out how to do it within the rules. Now, the campaign ended unfinished by lvl ~9, but he was doing ridiculous damage comparatively because he worked for it. He even had a brush with going evil because he wanted to use an evil sword (that was cursed to slowly corrupt its wielder) instead of his angelic blade. He sat down and had to make a hard decision. Be the guy from Berzerk and fall to evil, or be good and kick more ass. In the end he stayed good and, had the game continued, would have saved the universe from two evil gods and all their minions. A lot of anime fans really just want to do 'epic' things. If you describe even mundane things epically, they should be happy.
MacrossSD 07-26-07, 01:04 PM	I love anime, but I would NEVER do an anime-themed campaign, with the exceptions of ones based on The Slayers, or d20 Future campaigns based on SDF Macross or Mobile Suit Gundam. Outside of those, anime characters are often a draw to munchkin gamers because they are so outrageously overpowered. (did once try to stat up Lum as if she were an D&D character, though...)
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-26-07, 01:48 PM	No because my players aren't 7 Tee hee hee. Beat me to it. ;)
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-26-07, 01:52 PM	"Football fans can be bad D&Ders." "Star Trekkies can be bad D&Ders." "PC Gamers can be bad D&Ders." "Construction workers can be bad D&Ders." True, but one rarely hears of problems with players wanting to run a PC based on David Beckham, Spock, an dual-core gaming rig or a socket wrench.
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-26-07, 02:40 PM	His name? Yngwie J. Malmsteen :P Tee hee hee. I always like the "J", as if he needed it to differentiate himself from all the other Yngwie Malmsteens of the world. :rofl:
graddlin 07-26-07, 03:21 PM	Okay. First and foremost: I am an anime fan. To an extent. I grew up with the original Mobile Suit Gundam and Vampire Hunter D. Oh, and I simply can't forget the time when The Record of Lodos War came out for purchase. That was awesome! However, I have never played a D&D campaign with anime aspects. The quality is just not...mature(?)...enough for me. They are cartoons in the long run that involve, no matter what, cartooney aspects. When I sit down to play a game with my friends, I like to think of their PCs as realistic individuals. Not a bunch of cell-shaded geeks with bad hair and overly large weapons. It's just not what I prefer. Take care, friends.
Paladin_Hiroshi 07-26-07, 05:34 PM	hmmm I'm inspired to try out a few anime to D&D conversions now. I wont be posting the gandalf/sailor moon pic, but... D&D /b/tards, represent! :D (but please keep it on topic as well!) As for my stance on anime in D&D; don't make it too obvious, no name copying IF it's the same character and no....*shudders*....furries. :P
NightHawkFalconis 07-26-07, 05:38 PM	AnimeDungeons&Dragons *points* I LIKE it! XD As for myself, I'm a big anime fan of the shows that AREN'T aired on Fox... and most of them aren't on Adult Swim, either. Hell, most of them haven't even been dubbed in English (some will probably never be). But I REALLY hate the idea of anime characters in D&D... it just strikes me as being really cheesy. But I don't mix that up with inspiration. I can't say I've ever actually had a character inspired by an anime character, but I do often pull inspiration from books I read and other sources. I recently ran a drow rogue who was not unlike Jarlaxle from RA Salvatore's books (and Jarlaxle is WAY cooler than Drizzt... stick up his arse ranger... :D). Most of my groups (I play in one and DM the other) are anime fans. I think only one of the guys in the group I play in isn't so keen on it, but he still watches some of the better shows (Death Note, for example... [/plug]). There's a player in my group who tries to pull anime stunts mid-session... Him: "I jump and do a double-backflip over my enemy's head, then turn around and stab him in the neck." Me: "Uh-huh. Well, let's see. We'll start with a DC 40 Jump check, since you're standing still, followed by a DC 25 Tumble check to pull off the flips in the air while over your enemy's head, and a DC 15 Tumble check to avoid attacks of opportunity. Then we'll see if you score a critical hit on the guy. Since I'm nice, I'll even let you get your puny 3d6 sneak attack damage for the stunt. Oh, and did I mention that you're level 5?" He learned pretty quickly that if it isn't something you could do in real life (with a little stretch of the imagination) OR have the magical ability to (covering my own arse for people who want to complain, "But you can't cast SPELLS in real life, OOooooOOOo, look, I just defeated your entire argument lawlz0rz1111!!!11"), then he shouldn't bother trying. Unless he can make the check :D
Salla 07-26-07, 05:56 PM	I have had some issues with players in the past wanting to play nothing, but characters from their favorite Anime even when the story or setting didn't permit it. Has anyone else had this problem? Yes. For the most part, I just let it slide, though I make sure that they realize that they are bound by their game stats, not by whatever show they drew inspiration from, and that they will not automatically be able to do anything their source-of-inspiration could ... this also goes for any obvious character homage. I only get irate about it when they invoke 'anime physics', such as falling over when there's a bad joke or stupid comment made, or shooting five gallons of blood out of their nose when they see a spare inch of female skin. And no, your artificer may not create a +1 Huge Merciful Maul to keep in her Glove of Storing.
haruplue 07-26-07, 06:06 PM	Does he carry around a d20 and make lots of metagaming comments that no one else understands? http://www.nuklearpower.com/ hahahaha. from Final Fantasy, not 8-bit theater.
Femme_Undead_Lover 07-27-07, 02:00 PM	Many of you are goning to hang me because I defend anime+dnd players... I'm one of them (that's why). When you are playing DnD it's DND and nothing more... if you want something more like ANIME.. you play D20 Anime.... Of course theres always someone that can't make the difference between normal DnD anda a campaign of D20 Anime, or even worse: between DnD and an anime serie... Normally this players are as sweet as a lemon.. but we (I mean WE MASTERS) have to "teach" the boy that you aren't in an "uber-anime-game-where-you-are-an-uber-character"... As long as they know that one thing is DnD and the other is "just anime", I don't find a problem... And also, I think some anime characters are "playable"... or a role model...... BUT IF HE IS PRETTY TOO MUCH OBSESSED... KICK HIM OFF!!!!!
Melchizedek 07-27-07, 04:37 PM	I actually find "real" anime fans to be better D&D players than non-anime fans, mainly because the "real" anime (aka, the good stuff, not the crap that gets shown on Fox on saturday mornings) almost always features good character growth and development. It tends to get into the whys of a situation a lot more than american animation does. Aka, the understand that characters need personality and motivation. Thank you, It's nice to know there are others who have made the same observations. Anime is a medium, not a genre. No one assumes that Smallville is anything like The Colbert Report just because they're both live-action, American-made TV shows. Likewise, it doesn't make sense to lump DragonballZ together with Witch Hunter Robin just because they're both animated, Japanese-made shows. What matters is A) the quality of the show (including the relative power level of the characters and the level of character development/dynamics) and B) whether or not the player can accept that, while his character is based on [whatever show], the campaign setting and plot isn't. And there will always be things that just don't work. For example, whenever you have a player who wants to "clone" an anime character (or character from anything, for that matter) ask yourself one question: Could he/she/it survive a nuclear bomb exploding within five feet? If it takes you more than five seconds to come up with a definite "no", then it's probably a bad idea.
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-27-07, 04:41 PM	Anime is a medium, not a genre. Why do people only trot out this tired old trope to try to put anime's detractors in their place? I have never heard anyone say "but anime is a medium, not a genre" when someone says they are an anime fan. ;) No one assumes that Smallville is anything like The Colbert Report just because they're both live-action, American-made TV shows.n someone says they are an anime fan. ;) Smallville and The Colbert Report are of different genres.
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-27-07, 04:43 PM	I actually find "real" anime fans to be better D&D players than non-anime fans And I have found nothing of the sort. Rather I have found that people who enjoy in-depth characterization and storytelling tend to make better RPers in in-depth characterization and story-based games regardless of their preferred source of said characterization and storytelling in entertainment. The claim that '"real" anime fans to be better D&D players than non-anime fans' is horse-apples.
shadzar 07-27-07, 05:06 PM	Why do people only trot out this tired old trope to try to put anime's detractors in their place? I have never heard anyone say "but anime is a medium, not a genre" whe forgot to finish your sentence? because anime is a medium. anime is simply the japanese word for cartoon. in america and probably other places it has come to mean a type of cartoon or style of cartoon. in any event anime is not a genre. sci-fi, fantasy, etc are genres. anime/cartoons, movies, book are all mediums, respectively film, paper; used to tell stories. likewise you can't tell a story with sci-fi, fantasy, etc cause they are just the settings in which things like anime/cartoon, movie, books take place in. :confused: and i think that neither was trying to make someone an anime detractor, both were saying what i agree to, that anime fans sometiems have more vast imagination than say someone who watches reality TV like big brother, or surviavl, etc. but it doesn't mean that anime elements or characters need to be directly placed into the D&D RPG. tthey usually don't translate well since the universes are different and not eaasily compatible with D&D. And I have found nothing of the sort. Rather I have found that people who enjoy in-depth characterization and storytelling tend to make better RPers in in-depth characterization and story-based games regardless of their preferred source of said characterization and storytelling in entertainment. The claim that '"real" anime fans to be better D&D players than non-anime fans' is horse-apples. sorry to hear those anime fans around you are not playing as well as the ones others of us know. and by real anime it was refering to things other than pokemon, but shows that actually do have that character growth which you speak of. including what people may disagree with me, Naruto, Bleach, Inuyasha, all have some character growth in them, but among others are Samuraii 7, any CLAMP production (exceot card captor sakura), and MANY others that don't air and could never air as saurday morning cartoons. heck D&D the cartoon had little to no character growth since the character kept making the same mistakes and never learned form them.
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-27-07, 05:31 PM	forgot to finish your sentence? No, it was cut off for some reason. Seems obvious, really, when it is cropped in the middle of a word. I've gone back in completed it again. Hopefully it was not too confusing for you the first time 'round. sorry to hear those anime fans around you are not playing as well as the ones others of us know. I said nothing of the sort, I merely rebutted the bull**** claim that "real anime" fans are better RPers than those who are not anime fans. Anime fans can be good or bad RPers, as can non anime-fans. There is nothing intrinsic to either group - "real" or otherwise - that makes them inherently better D&D players.
Aise 07-27-07, 05:37 PM	I love anime, but i wouldn't ever play an anime character. Maybe a character based slightly off of an anime character. Heres your solution, 1) tell them to watch or read lord of the rings and think of something like that. or 2) instead of D&D play BESM (Big Eyes Small Mouth) which is a rpg that is based off of anime.
shadzar 07-27-07, 05:38 PM	No, it was cut off for some reason. Seems obvious, really, when it is cropped in the middle of a word. I've gone back in completed it again. Hopefully it was not too confusing for you the first time 'round. I said nothing of the sort, I merely rebutted the bull**** claim that "real anime" fans are better RPers than those who are not anime fans. Anime fans can be good or bad RPers, as can non anime-fans. There is nothing intrinsic to either group - "real" or otherwise - that makes them inherently better D&D players. ah yeah makes a bit more sense with the completed sentence. as i said the "real" anime fans thing i think was directed at what people call "real" anime vs kiddy shows like pokemon that jsut happen to come from japan. of anime fans vs people who think by default that anime is bad. i may be completely wrong on what was being said there, but those were my interpretations. i never said that anime fans are better than people who dont like anime at RPGs. but i would prefer an anime fan to a sports buff or a politician. :cool:
Roxlimn 07-27-07, 05:48 PM	Anime character are overpowered? Saito is overpowered? Kenshin? The Sailor Warriors? Ash from Pokemon? Conan from Detective Conan? Hikari from Magic Knight Rayearth? I honestly can't see where such a generalization can even be thought of, unless the sum total of one's familiarity with anime series and movies can be counted on one hand. By the same token, Hollywood characters are overpowered. I'm basing this off of my familiarity with the Superman movie series, which surely reflects the content of every Hollywood product ever made.
Mindolin 07-27-07, 05:49 PM	Actually, anime is NOT the japanese word for cartoons. Anime is the American, or at least Western, word for japanese animation. I have done anime based D&D campaigns, and they worked pretty well. Just because you like something does not make you a better role player, not counting theatre of course. The point is that just because you enjoy something does not mean you're a bad D&D player. I am a fan of anime, and yet in my group I am both the best at powergaming and at role playing.
HighPriestMikhal 07-27-07, 06:00 PM	The poseurs (the ones that claim to be anime fans but have never seen anything not on FOX or Cartoon Network) are the real problems. When you've seen the older, good stuff (I mean old, Barefoot Gen, Voltron, Project A-ko, Gall Force, Dirty Pair, Outlander, anything pre-Sailor Moon, basically) you see some great stories and characters. Besides, even we otaku have lives outside of anime. When you've spent at least five years watching the stuff not on network stations or basic cable, then you can harp on it. And for the record, I've been a fan for 23 years (92% of my life). I can say not all anime fans are bad D&Ders. Now, STFU and get your facts right. These players aren't bad because of anime; these idiots would be bad players no matter what.
aotrscommander 07-27-07, 07:35 PM	Anime character are overpowered? *snip* Ash from Pokemon? Ash is freakin' hard man! I mean, he takes regularly lightning bolts that blow up giant (albiet highly explosve) robots and doesn't die!! And when he does die, he just recovers! He's died nearly more times than Optimus Prime! I should note as I usually do, I'm an animation/cartoon fan, rather than an anime fan. Though I will admit Pokemon and Naruto have had a bad influence on me (it's the pyrotechnics you know), though probably far less than Centurions and Transformers. And - as yet - I have failed to base a character off anime. Though Throstnor the Anti-Paladin was in many ways an evil parody of He-Man. And I did run that spoof of He-Man adventure. And I persuaded one of my players to have a Charmander as a familiar. And that player does have a part-saiyan character. (Mind you, that's the the same party as the Vulcan who doesn't believe in magic (who was based on T'Paul) and the Romulan Archmage, so you can guess what that party's like...) Oh, and my favourite character is based on Jubilee.She's the one int he party with the Jedi and the two James Bond-type characters and the Archmage with a Forcelance. On the other hand, I do have a character who is entirely based on the GLA from Command & Conquer Generals. And Judge Caine, who speaks in stilted sentences while removing and putting on his shades and leaning mysteriously. And of course, Big Ron Lane in the western game we're playing. And Gabrielle is one of the PCs in the next adventure I'm DMing. And there was the Dunedain Ranger... Musn't forget the shield-slinging Captain Kobold, defender of Dragon Mountain or Cthulu Juju the Demon Monkey either... Wow. You know, I think I've nearly got more characters (or allowed them in my games) based off something else than not. Huh. It kinds sounds bad when you put it all back to back like that don't it? Well, I do actually have some normal characters, y'know like Hemath Brandimere the nice but dim Paladin, and Sakarn Arcanus the dragon-loving Sorcerer and Invagrion the Neutral Pale Master who keeps his skeleton Bobs in his... portable...hole... ... ... I'll get my cloak.
Salla 07-27-07, 09:08 PM	The question still remains ... why is it when someone says anime sucks, someone trots out 'anime is a medium not a genre' (and, by the way, it is perfectly possible to dislike a genre), and yet, many people say they are 'anime fans' without the same caveat?
Dontgothere 07-27-07, 09:41 PM	Anime fans don't make bad players immature people do.
Taim Kelrathos 07-27-07, 10:34 PM	A show like Rurouni Kenshin is eminently doable and Kenshin doesn't even have to be Epic to do it! In fact, going by character power benchmarks Cleric and Druid, Kenshin can't be more than about level 14. After all, he can't instantly teleport to other locations, and his ability to tackle multiple enemies near him in capability is rather limited. He can't jump 200 feet, he can't fly, he can't even levitate. As a D&D character, he would be rather weak. There are several PrCs that do a passable job of emulating Kenshin-type characters, although a low-magic campaign involving primarily fighting characters is going to take a lot of work, whether you're basing it off of anime or live-action movies. Actually, if you use the Oriental Adventures book making Kenshin is easy. He's, at minimum, Samurai 5/Iiajitsu Master 10. If you want him really fast throw in some Monk levels and the run feat. If you want him really fast, throw in Wild Talent and Speed of Thought for a few more feet of speed. Not that I ever considered playing this character...:blush:
jennibert 07-27-07, 10:43 PM	The biggest anime fan I know is my fiance. He's also the most spectacularly awesome DM I know. The first campaign I played in under him had a main villain who was heavily based (in motives and style) on Karla, the Grey Witch from Record of Lodoss War (which is a fabulous watch for DnD players, BTW...). That villain was so real that one of the players actually dreamed about her. The next campaign was based at a school. This managed to be a combination of Harry Potter, Buffy, and numerous school based anime, but all with adult themes. That makes it sound rather derivitive, and in some ways it was....It was also a freakin' awesome campaign. I still brag on it several years later. (And am attempting to novelize it...though I'll probably never even finish said novel, let alone attempt to publish it, and it's improbable that anyone would do so anyway....) He has previously run a campaign set in the universe of Bubblegum Crisis, a cyberpunk 80's anime with mildly overpowered main characters (except Priss, who was way overpowered). He took a different tack and played a grittier game in the same world....His best friend still claims it as the best campaign he's ever played in, 8-10 years later. That said, I've never played a character based on a character from an anime (though part of me would love to play Lina Inverse, but short of an epic level gestalt game with some special rules to cover the Dragon Slave, I know it's never going to happen). I almost got to play a gestalt Dervish/Psion (Telepath) for a game he was running (I was going to call her Rio, and every name in her back story was a really terrible Firefly joke), but didn't get to. This does not make me a bad D&D player. In fact, I consider the fact that I've largely memorized the basic rules and can retain the names of dozens of NPCs, complete with details about them that sometimes the DM himself doesn't remember, in addition to my joy in hard character choices, to make me a pretty good D&D player. And I'm an anime fan. And speaking of that.... The "anime is a medium, not a genre" thing....Yeah, it is. A medium, I mean. I don't see why not bothering to qualify when I say I'm an anime fan does not make it so. If you asked me, "Do you like anime?" I'd probably just say yes. I just usually don't bother to continue with "well, I like Slayers and Neon Genesis Evangelion and Excel Saga and Fruits Basket but really don't intend to ever see Elfen Lied because it's high on gore factor, and thought Puni Puni Poemi was perhaps the most :censored: up thing I've ever seen." I'd give the same yes if someone asked me "Do you like live-action movies?" Just because someone is more likely to ask you to elaborate on the second rather than the first doesn't make either less of a medium. (Incidentally, the series I listed as ones I like....one massively overpowered fantasy setting, one giant robot show of uber teenage angst, one hyper insane spoof of everything ever, and one very sweet high school drama. To give you an idea of the variety available.)
Mercurius 07-28-07, 12:01 AM	Actually, anime is NOT the japanese word for cartoons. Anime is the American, or at least Western, word for japanese animation. That's not true. At least, not any more. Just watching FLCL or reading any of a dozen magazines in the original nihongo will tell you that the Japanese use "anime" to describe animation just as much as the Western fans do. The Western term was, originally, "Japanimation" (anyone else remember calling it that?). "Anime" came a bit later, and, from what I can tell, is pretty wide-spread in Japan.
JoAT 07-28-07, 12:14 AM	The question still remains ... why is it when someone says anime sucks, someone trots out 'anime is a medium not a genre' (and, by the way, it is perfectly possible to dislike a genre), and yet, many people say they are 'anime fans' without the same caveat? Actually, I think I can answer this question. (Note that the following is not fact, but speculation and opinion, though it'll probably pass) The statement that anime is a medium, not a genre is both true and false. It's true to the extent that anime is not a genre - it covers multiple genres, and much of what can be told falls into it. However, anime has it's own set of specific tropes - elements that make up much of what we see (especially what gets imported to North America). These things include grey morality, complex and in depth plots and characterization, exciting action scenes, an openness to the fantastic and Japanese cultural elements. Not all anime includes all of these elements (and there are others, but these are what come to mind at first), but so very many do that they can be said to be part of what defines anime. By itself, anime is not a medium, but rather an art form that, while incredibly diverse, tends to have enough common elements that one can said to be a fan of that art form (such as first person narrative). It's pretty much limited to storytelling - Reality Anime doesn't exist, nor does Game Show Anime or Anime News. The best comparison is graphic novels and comic books - they're not necessarily about super heroes, but super heroes are the first things that come to mind, and even those comics that aren't about superheroes tend to borrow from those comics that are. The amount of comics about super heroes vs. the amount of comics about dentistry, sexuality or social issues means that a person can generalize and say they're a fan of comics, when they really only mean the guys & girls in spandex (much like anime; for example, I'm a big fan of shows like FMA, while conversely disliking most robot and/or sports shows. At the same time, I quite enjoy the antics of the super-set, while comics in the vein of Manara's work aren't so much fun - I guess I have some fairly low-class tastes ).
TheCrawlingSpleen 07-28-07, 01:11 AM	I persuaded one of my players to have a Charmander as a familiar. And that player does have a part-saiyan character. (Mind you, that's the the same party as the Vulcan who doesn't believe in magic (who was based on T'Paul) and the Romulan Archmage, so you can guess what that party's like...) Oh, and my favourite character is based on Jubilee.She's the one int he party with the Jedi and the two James Bond-type characters and the Archmage with a Forcelance. On the other hand, I do have a character who is entirely based on the GLA from Command & Conquer Generals. And Judge Caine, who speaks in stilted sentences while removing and putting on his shades and leaning mysteriously. And of course, Big Ron Lane in the western game we're playing. And Gabrielle is one of the PCs in the next adventure I'm DMing. And there was the Dunedain Ranger... Musn't forget the shield-slinging Captain Kobold, defender of Dragon Mountain or Cthulu Juju the Demon Monkey either... Wow, and I felt bad for wanting to make an NPC who (personality-wise) would be based on Fllay Allster. Apparently, stranger things have happened. FLCL... where bards kill everything, random crap comes out of your head, and LSD is reality... Funny thing is, someone was trying to stat Haruko a while back as some sort of fighter/mage or fighter/psion with Exotic Weapon Proficiency (guitar). Now that would be a strange encounter for the PC's. :uh-huh:
Rogue Elendae 07-28-07, 04:59 AM	I completely and totally agree 100% with the title of the thread. Anime Fans can be bad D&Ders. However, the same also applies to Fantasy Fans, and Science Fiction Fans, and Camping Fans, and Renn Faire Fans, and Dog Fans, and Sports Fans, and Cooking Fans, and Nerd Fans, and Ceiling Fans, and everyone else that exists. Any person, regardless of who they are, can be a bad D&D player. Contrary, any person, regardless of who they are, can be a good player, even Anime Fans. I don't think that any one group of people (except maybe narrow minded frat boys :D ) is more likely to produce bad D&D players as is any other group. QFT Anyone can be a bad D&D player, be it that they're a rules lawyer, a munchkin, a lousy roleplayer, or in the case the OP is presenting, trying to mimic characters from pre-existing media (in this case, anime, while attempting to also imitate the full extent of the character's abilities, in other cases, the infamous Drizzt Clone). And it doesn't take being an anime fan, or anything. I mean, I can lay claim to much of the above list (let's see...anime fan, Ren Faire fan, dog fan, cooking fan, sci-fi fan, fantasy fan...and I could throw in art history geek, author geek, theatre geek, pro-wrestling smark, etc. on top of that). However, I am passingly good at D&D, because I make an effort to understand there's certain limits I'm playing confined within, and sometimes my ideas of what I'd like go beyond that and must be toned down. It's the people that don't just want to mimic the look or persona/mannerisms of a character from anime or another media/genre (perfectly all right, especially if they're not terribly creative. Just because one person can dream up enough characters of distinctive personalities and appearances to flood a novel series, doesn't mean everyone can, and sometimes taking a basis in something they know can help a person create a distinctive character), but their abilities no matter how improbable/overpowered/game-breaking that can be the problem. And that can happen in any situation. It can happen with the guy that wants to play a Wizard on par with Gandalf, the one who wants to create a wand-waving Harry Potter wizard, or the girl who wants to play a Magic Knight, whatever. Just telling them to play BESM because it's supposedly for anime doesn't change the fact that they want what might not be allowed within the confines of the DM's plot.
matrix_king3 07-28-07, 08:45 AM	I get this problem before. I got a solution for you : let them be. One of my player wanted to be a Cloud-like character. So his sword get a malus of -8(this weapon is two-handed sword for a large creature and he decided to handle it with one hand) and he dont wear any armor. So level 1 his best attack was a -7 attack and he dont have any armor. What a great Fighter. He finaly change his mind.
Mock26 07-28-07, 01:27 PM	Actually, if you use the Oriental Adventures book making Kenshin is easy. He's, at minimum, Samurai 5/Iiajitsu Master 10. If you want him really fast throw in some Monk levels and the run feat. If you want him really fast, throw in Wild Talent and Speed of Thought for a few more feet of speed. Not that I ever considered playing this character...:blush: I thought that the rules for Political Correctness dictate that we no longer use the word Oriental except for when dealing with a certain style of run. Shouldn't we be calling it Asian Adventures? :D ======================================== ====== As for the word anime iteself, while it may now be in common use in Japan, it is almost always spelled like this: アニメ. It is spelled using the katakana syllabary, which is used for words that are not Japanese in origin. So, the spelling alone will tell you that the word, even though in use in Japan, has been borrowed from another country. ======================================== ====== On a side note, does anyone know how many "episodes" were made for Rhea Gall Force?
DaidojiTaidoru 07-28-07, 02:08 PM	The question still remains ... why is it when someone says anime sucks, someone trots out 'anime is a medium not a genre' (and, by the way, it is perfectly possible to dislike a genre), and yet, many people say they are 'anime fans' without the same caveat? Because it's possible to be a fan of a medium. I had a roommate who liked movies. Any type of movie. Movies that only thier directors could love while still laying claim to sanity. I didn't understand until I was halfway through a series that I knew was awful on almost every standpoint and I realized I was somehow still enjoying it. It's similar to the players who seem to disagree with the concept that no gaming is better then bad gaming. It requires a certain sort of love for the medium to suffer through that. Of course the simpler answer is just because someone likes an anime serise and calls themselves an anime fan doesn't mean they have any idea what they're talking about. Which falls under the "50% of your subculture is probably stupid" rule. As for the word anime iteself, while it may now be in common use in Japan, it is almost always spelled like this: アニメ. It is spelled using the katakana syllabary, which is used for words that are not Japanese in origin. So, the spelling alone will tell you that the word, even though in use in Japan, has been borrowed from another country. Japanese is a language that pickpockets words almost as much as English does. It's just they insist on pointing those words out as being stolen.
RuckusFox 07-28-07, 02:10 PM	I know that feeling. We've got this one kid...okay...I don't mind him...but. <.< He brings his iPod where ever he goes. Has the nerve to plug it in and start playing it while I'm reading the start up for the campaign, and names all of his characters off of someone from Bleach or something stupid like that. I think I'm going to kill him...not to mention he always wants to play a Psion and doesn't know how to play it...Note to everyone, you can't put UBER amounts of Psi points into one basic skill and kill everyone. -.-' GRAH!
TheCrawlingSpleen 07-28-07, 06:30 PM	Japanese is a language that pickpockets words almost as much as English does. It's just they insist on pointing those words out as being stolen. Why do so many people insist on acting as though words can be "stolen?" I don't think there's anything wrong with using a word from another language. If a foreign culture introduces you to a concept that your language doesn't have a word for, it makes perfect sense to me to use their word. Heck, you can use words from another language if they're shorter than your way of saying whatever it is you want to say. For instance, we refer to ticks, mites, spiders and scorpions as arachnids. That word has its origin in Greek, but it's a lot better than calling them "things with eight legs, one or two body segments and, usually, chelicerate jaws." For the love of Pete, it's actually kind of nice to hear one's own word integrated into a foreign vocabulary, as it indicates that they actually like it in some way. Integrating languages in this way represents, at least to me, an exchange of knowledge and ideas between cultures, and since the Greeks don't get :censored:'ed whenever they hear an American say he's an arachnophobe, I don't think anyone else should insinuate that people "steal" words either. I'm not trying to be personally hostile to you, Daidoji, so I'm sorry if it came across that way; I just don't like the whole "word theft" concept. Thank you for reading this rant. not to mention he always wants to play a Psion and doesn't know how to play it...Note to everyone, you can't put UBER amounts of Psi points into one basic skill and kill everyone. Do you mean he's putting uber amounts of skill points into one skill (unwise but legal), or uber amounts of power points into one power (illegal)?
TiwazTyrsfist 07-28-07, 07:45 PM	"You want to play an anime Character in my D&D game?" -"Yeah! Anime iz teh Awesome!" "Okay, you may play any main hero character from Record of Lodoss War"
Edymnion 07-28-07, 09:54 PM	Oh yeah, and lets not forget that D&D fans make bad D&D players! They're always copying the silly and overpowered characters like Elminster, and Drizzt, and attacking the darkness. Honestly, D&D fans make some of the worst D&D players I've ever seen! I'll tell you, every last bad D&D player I've ever seen was a D&D fan, so that should tell you something!
Von_Harbringer 07-28-07, 10:40 PM	What I don't like is that this thread is more anti-anime than anything else. As stated before I pull ideas from different sources. Even a lead game developer said at a IGDA meeting "Live life because you can get better ideas for games from real life situations." I think more than anything what is being pointed out is players that watch anime want to play a character with same type of powers (mostly god-like). Getting a personality, attitude, or mimicking a character is one thing, wanting to be the "lead" character and being essentially bullet-proof is another. With that said, who wants to start a campaign based off Bobobo-bo Bo-Bobo. :rolleyes:
Vharuck 07-29-07, 01:57 AM	The poseurs (the ones that claim to be anime fans but have never seen anything not on FOX or Cartoon Network) are the real problems. When you've seen the older, good stuff (I mean old, Barefoot Gen, Voltron, Project A-ko, Gall Force, Dirty Pair, Outlander, anything pre-Sailor Moon, basically) you see some great stories and characters. Besides, even we otaku have lives outside of anime. When you've spent at least five years watching the stuff not on network stations or basic cable, then you can harp on it. And for the record, I've been a fan for 23 years (92% of my life). I can say not all anime fans are bad D&Ders. Now, STFU and get your facts right. These players aren't bad because of anime; these idiots would be bad players no matter what. Normally I close my eyes, wish really hard, and erase all memory of posts like these so that I can pretend they never existed and go about my daily life without that annoying headache, but alas, not tonight. Stop acting so damn elite. And are you really suggesting that Project A-Ko, an anime I watched when 12 because it had big-boobed nudity but didn't wrack my brain for plot, is better than Paranoia Agent, just because the latter was featured on Cartoon Network? Wow.
knuck 07-29-07, 03:37 AM	Anime characters are often melee-oriented filled with spell-like abilities. I mean, melee characters being as cool and powerful as spellcasters? NONSENSE
shadzar 07-29-07, 04:41 AM	With that said, who wants to start a campaign based off Bobobo-bo Bo-Bobo. :rolleyes: :eek: i will play Beauty so i have less obscure rules to deal with and am pretty much invulnerable, so i can just sit back and make puns without having to worry about being attacked or having to attack, all the while being confused by everyone else. ;)
Kursk 07-29-07, 10:06 AM	I have had some issues with players in the past wanting to play nothing, but characters from their favorite Anime even when the story or setting didn't permit it. Has anyone else had this problem? No. I DM for adults.
Reinforcements 07-29-07, 12:01 PM	Funny thing is, someone was trying to stat Haruko a while back as some sort of fighter/mage or fighter/psion with Exotic Weapon Proficiency (guitar). Now that would be a strange encounter for the PC's. :uh-huh: I have to admit, after seeing FLCL for the first time I made a bard character who played a metal-plated citar that was also his weapon. (Attention musicians: I know that probably wouldn't work. Let me dream.) Honestly, I think fantasy anime fits better into D&D than some people think. I'd go so far as to say that you'd have an easier time fitting in something from Final Fantasy or Berserk than you would making a D&D game that was very serious and down-to-earth. It's pretty super-heroic after about level 5.
Roxlimn 07-29-07, 12:19 PM	I'd go further than that. I'd say anime fits into D&D more than classical Western legend and fairy tales fit into D&D. I'd also say that anime fits into D&D better than MOST people think it does.
shadzar 07-29-07, 01:47 PM	the previous two post, as well as... when placing anime characters into D&D you can't expect to get everything from the character into the game without severally warping the rules or making an unbalanced character for the most part.
Kursk 07-29-07, 01:49 PM	It's pretty super-heroic after about level 5. That's why characters like Superman fit the D&D rules better than knights, wizards and the like... :eek:
Roxlimn 07-29-07, 02:19 PM	Cyclops is a perfect fit, actually. Warlock with enhanced unarmed fighting, more powerful Eldritch Blasts, and no spell-like powers.
Ace_of_Night 07-29-07, 02:56 PM	I'd go further than that. I'd say anime fits into D&D more than classical Western legend and fairy tales fit into D&D. I'd also say that anime fits into D&D better than MOST people think it does. Combine this to get the following: "You walk through the forest, as you suddenly see Cinderella running at you with a big mallet. Just before she reaches you, the mad wolf jumps between the party and her, but before he gets anywhere near Cinderella, Arnold Schwarzenegger dressed up as Vincent from Final Fantasy caps him with a bullet. Did I say -a- bullet? This is Arnold after all, he shoots the mutt until his mag is empty. Now you all make a will save, if you fail you succumb to the complete chaos and you'll end up dressing up as a chocobo, singing christmas songs and hugging everyone you see, including Arnold. Unless he has a hidden mag that fits in Vincent's gun. To top it off, there's a fairy flying by telling lies about giving everybody what they wish for, but in the end she's just messing with you and makes everything undone at midnight. Last time you listened to her, you ended up butt-naked at that Otaku Convention at the inn, remember?" There, now does anyone think I'm sane? Edit: Sane or not, my normal campaigns are slightly less... messed up. Or just a lot. ^_^
Roxlimn 07-29-07, 03:22 PM	:rofl: You're crazy sensible.
Reinforcements 07-29-07, 03:26 PM	That's why characters like Superman fit the D&D rules better than knights, wizards and the like... :eek: Well, Superman is on the pretty extreme high end of super-hero power, but yeah, I don't see how a guy with supernatural strength, speed, flight, and eye beams doesn't fit into D&D. Not to mention that there are far better examples of modern American super-heroes who obviously fit easily into D&D - Shining Knight, Dr. Strange, Etrigan, Raven, Azrael. Of course, this is all tongue-in-cheek and beside the point that I think it's pretty obvious that "super-heroic" does not necessarily mean "modern American comic book super-heroes".
_Jayne_Cobb_ 07-30-07, 01:00 PM	i never said that anime fans are better than people who dont like anime at RPGs. You didn't, but Edy did.
Baddum12 02-25-08, 03:30 PM	We have a player in our group that makes carbon copies of his original character. Not sure if it's from a show or movie or comic book, maybe you can help with that. His characters are always some sort of fighting class. Cleric, Paladin (fallen), Fighter, Barbarian. They are always Lawful Evil, and they always take Exotic Weapon Prof. with Bastard Sword, wield it in one hand to use their Improved Unarmed Strike and Deflect Arrows feats. They are always complete jerks to everyone and think that they are the smartest members of whatever party they are in. Anyway... I'm not sure if this has too much to do with the fact that he does this but... he is definitely an anime fan. But moreso, he reads a lot of graphic novels. And he seems to think that the rest of us like to just sit there and listen to him describe everything he's ever read in full detail as if we wanted to know the entire story but just don't have the time to read it. Uh oh! There I go again... close the vitching bents! CLOSE THE VITCHING BENTS!!:eek:
Sinfire Titan 02-25-08, 05:23 PM	The poseurs (the ones that claim to be anime fans but have never seen anything not on FOX or Cartoon Network) are the real problems. When you've seen the older, good stuff (I mean old, Barefoot Gen, Voltron, Project A-ko, Gall Force, Dirty Pair, Outlander, anything pre-Sailor Moon, basically) you see some great stories and characters. Besides, even we otaku have lives outside of anime. When you've spent at least five years watching the stuff not on network stations or basic cable, then you can harp on it. And for the record, I've been a fan for 23 years (92% of my life). I can say not all anime fans are bad D&Ders. Now, STFU and get your facts right. These players aren't bad because of anime; these idiots would be bad players no matter what. That was featured on CN. [/Nitpick] IMO, Anime-based characters only are a problem when the player is immature and doesn't understand the limits of this system. This, coming from a DM who has adapted an entire video game to be DnD-compatible (Skies of Arcadia), and has made a class based on one of Capcom's greatest games (Chaos Legion). If anything, the best people to play anime-based characters are the ones capable of adapting the game itself within the limitations presented. I have a player who wants to play Haseo (.Hack//G.U., for those who don't know). The hardest part of this adaptation was getting Skeith down. Also: We have a player in our group that makes carbon copies of his original character. Not sure if it's from a show or movie or comic book, maybe you can help with that. His characters are always some sort of fighting class. Cleric, Paladin (fallen), Fighter, Barbarian. They are always Lawful Evil, and they always take Exotic Weapon Prof. with Bastard Sword, wield it in one hand to use their Improved Unarmed Strike and Deflect Arrows feats. They are always complete jerks to everyone and think that they are the smartest members of whatever party they are in. Anyway... I'm not sure if this has too much to do with the fact that he does this but... he is definitely an anime fan. But moreso, he reads a lot of graphic novels. And he seems to think that the rest of us like to just sit there and listen to him describe everything he's ever read in full detail as if we wanted to know the entire story but just don't have the time to read it. Uh oh! There I go again... close the vitching bents! CLOSE THE VITCHING BENTS!! You do realize that you just bumped a 5-month old thread, right?
Baddum12 02-25-08, 05:48 PM	You do realize that you just bumped a 5-month old thread, right? GAH CRap!!! Sorry duders.:(
Sinfire Titan 02-25-08, 06:05 PM	GAH CRap!!! Sorry duders.:( Thread Necromancy may be frowned upon, but there have been exceptions (World's Nerfiest Campaign comes to mind).
cloud413 02-25-08, 06:24 PM	I had a character that had the personality of a Final Fantasy character and the looks of Link. But his stats were normal and he didn't have a giant sword.
Jo_Pistachio 02-25-08, 06:41 PM	That depends on whether they can keep their inappropriate anime out of their characters and only put in appropriate anime or none at all. Record of Lodoss War for example is a good anime to be basing characters off of. I find this horribly ironic, as when I was playing in a Lodoss campaign, I rolled up a female elf swordsperson, who (despite being a rogue) had a bad habit of falling into traps (which was not backstory, but rolls). The DM said "So you're playing Deedlit." and I, having never heard of the source material said "What the F*** is a Deedlit?" :rolleyes: Just goes to show how hard not ripping off anime in concept can be.
Etarnon 02-25-08, 07:30 PM	I'm glad our groups have never had this anime rip off problem.
LeeAlucard 02-25-08, 07:57 PM	You know, I managed to mentally scar everybody in my gaming group, just by showing them all that pic of "Gandalf Moon."
Sinfire Titan 02-25-08, 08:09 PM	You know, I managed to mentally scar everybody in my gaming group, just by showing them all that pic of "Gandalf Moon." Then it has served its purpose. Congratulations on giving your players Drain Bamage.
Janzen 02-26-08, 07:35 PM	Anime fans don't make bad players immature people do. Q4E This thread greatly amuses me...other then the picture a few pages back =[ My group of players ( including myself ) are big Anime, Comic Book, and Star Wars fans. Now all of us want to play are fav character in any of those above mention genre but we all know were to draw the line. For example we know it would be too stupid to play a Saiyan that could fly through the air, fire big energy blast from his palms, plus have sudden spiked golden hair and punch through buildings with ease. One of my characters ( Druid ) was based off Ayeka from the Tenchi series and in the same campaign my friend played a Monk named Tenchi. Now they didn't have all the abilities in the show but were D&D-formated to the game.
malignor 02-26-08, 08:49 PM	I'm running, and one of my players is a Blackguard fashioned after Kyo (from Samurai Deeper Kyo)... except for the fact that he wears full plate and rides a Nightmare (his cohort) and has learned the wonders of using spirited charge with a lance instead of a sword... okay, maybe he's only partially inspired by Kyo, via image and attitude. The Ranger named his Wolf companion Shikamaru... though the wolf was an alcoholic with a unique personality... nothing like the original from Naruto. Maybe I can't see the problem because I haven't suffered from it yet.
Jakonen 02-26-08, 11:18 PM	I see Anime characters as an opportunity for inspiration. like just recently i needed an close combat type enemy that could probably start a war all by himself. and i wanted to teach my players a lesson. you don't have to be magical to be kick some serious butt. In enters Guts from Berserk (or rather a character with a similar build.) a Bad ass Melee combatant with only a set of cursed armor for a magical item. he was epic a Fighter 12/Barbarian 7/Frenzied Berserker 5 with 24 str and a Large Greatsword to cleave my players minions (they typically send the hirelings in first.) So in short anime characters can serve for inspirational and educational reasons in D&D. so to those people bashing Anime Inspired character players. i say this to you. At least they're not trying to make the character Cthulhu
Sinfire Titan 02-26-08, 11:51 PM	Q4E This thread greatly amuses me...other then the picture a few pages back =[ My group of players ( including myself ) are big Anime, Comic Book, and Star Wars fans. Now all of us want to play are fav character in any of those above mention genre but we all know were to draw the line. For example we know it would be too stupid to play a Saiyan that could fly through the air, fire big energy blast from his palms, plus have sudden spiked golden hair and punch through buildings with ease. One of my characters ( Druid ) was based off Ayeka from the Tenchi series and in the same campaign my friend played a Monk named Tenchi. Now they didn't have all the abilities in the show but were D&D-formated to the game. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg That? Beats the hell out of TubGirl (Note: Do not Google, for the love of your sanity, DO. NOT. GOOGLE!)
turalisj 02-27-08, 02:17 AM	I'm running, and one of my players is a Blackguard fashioned after Kyo (from Samurai Deeper Kyo)... except for the fact that he wears full plate and rides a Nightmare (his cohort) and has learned the wonders of using spirited charge with a lance instead of a sword... okay, maybe he's only partially inspired by Kyo, via image and attitude. The Ranger named his Wolf companion Shikamaru... though the wolf was an alcoholic with a unique personality... nothing like the original from Naruto. Maybe I can't see the problem because I haven't suffered from it yet. I'm thinking it's only a few people, and this thread seems to be a way to generalize the whole lot of us... I'm a huge anime fan. Most of my characters are inspired by anime/manga characters. However, the inspiration part is about as far as it goes. I'll make any character from a kobold warblade to an elf unholy scion warlock (the last one is partly inspired by inuyasha). Join the PAAA today! (players against anti-anime asses)
Kigan 02-27-08, 03:27 AM	Well, Superman is on the pretty extreme high end of super-hero power, but yeah, I don't see how a guy with supernatural strength, speed, flight, and eye beams doesn't fit into D&D. Superman would have a CR of One million. He does not fit, even divinities would have a hard time copping with him.
Nephlite 02-27-08, 07:12 AM	Superman would have a CR of One million. He does not fit, even divinities would have a hard time copping with him. Please, Superman has no SR or Regeneration. All he has is DR/Epic or Kyptonite. He is weak versus magic (check out those comics or shows when he is pelted with it). Dieties have magic=Superman goes down. My Warlock is nice superman: he has supernastural Strength, speed (after expeditous retreat scrolls), Flight, and eye beam (eldritch blast).
GuyrtheadamantineOne 02-27-08, 10:33 AM	Join the PAAA today! (players against anti-anime asses) I'm in! Seriously, I'm so tired of being called a dork because my inspiration goes beyond this chunk of red-neck rock we live on.
Lincoln Hills 02-27-08, 03:29 PM	...I'm so tired of being called a dork because my inspiration goes beyond this chunk of red-neck rock we live on. You mean... the Earth? Anyway: Yes, I have had a player or two come to the table all set to re-create their favorite Animonster (I don't know who this "Shinji" is, but to judge by the player's performance he must be some kind of jerk in whatever neck of the Animeverse he comes from.) I don't like it, because it strains the suspension of disbelief on which an immersive RPG campaign runs. But I do nothing to stop it, because - let's face it, the PCs are the one part of the universe that the players get to control. As long as the character's created within the rules, and the player's rolling his dice in the open, I can't complain. Well, I do complain, but I don't expect them to change based on those complaints. ;)
turalisj 02-27-08, 04:38 PM	Maybe I should contact every anime fan on the boards that I know (and that would be alot of people) and show them this thread.
themocaw 02-27-08, 05:29 PM	My current bard is an excitable red-headed nineteen year old girl who goes around looking for "evil" to defeat and generally doing a fairly lousy job of it, given that she has low hp and can't seem to roll well for damage. Recently, my DM gave her an enchanted sentient violin that enhances her bardic songs and basically allows her to use Sound Burst as an at-will ability. Unfortunately, the violin is also extremely jealous and refuses to let her use any other weapon or musical instrument, and constantly tries to make her into a lady. She recently had to buy a dress. She was a bit upset at that. She's gotten comparisons to, in no particular order: Ameria from Slayers Lina Inverse from Slayers Kanaria from Rozen Maiden Shayla-Shayla from El-Hazard Her predecessor was also extremely violent and tended to call her God an a--hole and other such things. Anyway, it's not anime fans that are the problem, it's idiots. Any non-idiot would know that an android girl in a maid outfit with a giant sword is not exactly the best character concept for a low-fantasy sword-and-sorcery campaign inspired by Conan, but something like Eberron? Maybe. Consider a warforged who used to be a domestic servant and bodyguard whose employer was killed and now has to go out on the streets and fight as a mercenary. They keep their old apron as a memento of their employer, and basically maxxed out Profession: Maid. Could be a very interesting character if played right. On the other hand, anyone not coming from an Asian-inspired culture who tries to use words like "Sugoi" and "baka" in character gets a -10 stupidity penalty to their die rolls until they make amends.
Sulacu 02-28-08, 02:44 PM	There are a lot of animes out there, with a lot of corresponding genres. Some are practically incompatible with D20 as a whole, because their abilities are blown out of proportion (especially in better known and oft-criticized animes like DBZ, Naruto or Bleach). Bullets ricochet from Goku's body. Ichigo can sunder a mountain with his sword. Naruto changes into a half-fox when he gets emotionally messed up. Alucard has more regeneration than the tarrasque. Lain is practically omnipotent. Inuyasha is too effeminate to look upon and live. The guys from Fist of the North Star can use Quivering Palm not just once per day, but at will, and when they do, people's heads explode, which means their unarmed strike likely has the vorpal quality, too. On the other hand, there are Mangas like Berserk. When I read and watch Berserk, I always feel that a setting like that would be perfect for adaptation to D20 conventions. Sure, Gatsu is a maniac with a sword two times his size, but I can imagine accurate statistics for a guy like him.
Da3mon 02-28-08, 03:46 PM	The guys from Fist of the North Star can use Quivering Palm not just once per day, but at will, and when they do, people's heads explode, which means their unarmed strike likely has the vorpal quality, too. lol.
Khan2000 02-28-08, 04:43 PM	You have to find a way to let them have fun, without letting them go overboard. Say that the anime character is from Dragon Ball Z; in D&D terms, most of the characters from that show would have Strength scores in the high twenties or low thirties. I mean, they can punch someone through a skyscraper. C'mon, now, really. No DM in his right mind would let a player have that kind of power unless they are in an Epic campaign. That must mean I'm in my left mind.:D I'd allow such a thing, but my players know enough that it's okay to cry. (They know if I allow such a thing, they're in for a rough ride.)
AvalancheRider 02-28-08, 06:12 PM	I like how a bunch of die-hard anime fans just came in here, denounced that anime fans can be bad roleplayers, and then immediately began talking about how they have characters who are direct rip-offs of anime characters. :P
turalisj 02-28-08, 06:36 PM	That's because anime and psionic fans have one unique trait in common: we can laugh at ourselves.
AvalancheRider 02-28-08, 07:08 PM	That's because anime and psionic fans have one unique trait in common: we can laugh at ourselves.Hey, then I have something in common with them! I can laugh at them, too. :P (The above is a joke. I enjoy me some anime as well. :D )
Kuroimaken 02-28-08, 08:13 PM	Sorry, double post.
Kuroimaken 02-28-08, 08:24 PM	Thankfully, the thread title didn't say 'are' instead of 'can', or we'd see a total flame war here. And, yeah, anime characters can be... downright impossible to stat. Like, say, how do you stat a Gundam? Or for something more on a human scale, how do you stat Kenshiro from Fist of the North Star? In trying to come up with some stats for him, I've basically come up with this: AC: effectively infinite. No one hits the guy unless they roll a natural 20. His AC is all touch-based and he's never caught flat-footed. Damage: Whenever Kenshiro's to-hit roll goes over the target's AC, he says some stuff like "Hokuto Kutabare, I hit your flinoinger thingie on your armpit, you're already dead in three seconds", and the target explodes in a very over the top fashion. Fort save? What's a fort save? Level: You're kidding, right? Alignment: You're welcome to share in the headache. How do you classify the alignment of someone who -can- render his opponents useless (but prefers to blow them up), breaks promises to bad guys but keeps promises to good guys, gets genuinely ****** when innocents are killed but maims whoever so much as proposes for him to join the bad guys' ranks because of how badass he is? No, seriously. Better yet, let's stat up Guts from Berserk after he got that armor. Kenshin is a JOKE to stat. Seriously. Shishio, however, would be another matter. And don't get me started on Naruto. I hate that anime so friggin' much... There are many, many other much better anime to watch, such as Basilisk. As for the thread itself, here's an idea. In the group I usually play there's usually a bit more rollplay than there is roleplay. So I use it as a testing ground for classes I find interesting and/or powerful. I'm not yet at the point where I can summon the greatest builds ever out of my head. But I find that very often, when we play D&D, whatever character isn't optimized to be a murdering machine with a background gets stuck with not being able to do much. The opposite case, however, happened some time ago when we were going to play with one of the players DMing. I've been hooked up on Romancing Saga for a while, so I figured, "What the hell, I'm making the Minstrel!" Since I never quite understood just what the hell was the Minstrel's backstory in that game, I coughed one up, figuring, which would be the best backstory for a Bard? I don't usually get compliments on how I play my characters, but for him, I did. "You walk through the forest, as you suddenly see Cinderella running at you with a big mallet. Just before she reaches you, the mad wolf jumps between the party and her, but before he gets anywhere near Cinderella, Arnold Schwarzenegger dressed up as Vincent from Final Fantasy caps him with a bullet. Did I say -a- bullet? This is Arnold after all, he shoots the mutt until his mag is empty. Now you all make a will save, if you fail you succumb to the complete chaos and you'll end up dressing up as a chocobo, singing christmas songs and hugging everyone you see, including Arnold. Unless he has a hidden mag that fits in Vincent's gun. To top it off, there's a fairy flying by telling lies about giving everybody what they wish for, but in the end she's just messing with you and makes everything undone at midnight. Last time you listened to her, you ended up butt-naked at that Otaku Convention at the inn, remember?" Looks like someone has been DMing Excel Saga. Where's the Great Will of the Macrocosm, Pedro and Nabeshin, though?
themocaw 02-28-08, 08:25 PM	There's one in every group. You play Vampire, there's always the guy wants to be Lestat or Louis. You play D&D, and someone wants to create Legolas. You play BESM, and they want to be Ryoko. Anyway. My next character in my next D&D campaign is a half-orc pugilist named Trogg who goes around wearing a +1 Gauntlet on one hand and carries a huge backpack filled with one of everything from the PHB. I plan to make his battle cry "TROGG WILL PUNCH YOU NAAAAAO!!!!" Maybe "TROGG SMAAAAASH!" or "TROGG WILL FIST YOU TO DEAAAAATH!" But one trait I do want to give him is his sense of fair play and willingness to box by Queensbury Rules (or the D&D equivalent) should his enemy be willing to settle matters in the ring of honor. Kudos to you if you know where I stole THAT one from XD
calronmoonflower 02-28-08, 09:33 PM	Wow, old thread. I'm surprised that I missed it the first time around. Anyway, anime can translate well into D&D. But it really depends on the concept that you want. And of course anime fans can be bad D&Ders, but they can also can be good D&Ders. It depends more on the person than anything else. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/Mock26/sm.jpg :D http://www.badongo.com/t/640/3040525.jpg (http://www.badongo.com/pic/3040525)
Roxlimn 02-28-08, 11:10 PM	Just what we need, a BIGGER picture of Gandalf Moon. Ugh. Nasty, and yet funny at the same time. Anime is eminently doable. D&D is arguably anime out and out. Kenshin is hard to stat out? I can't see that. He's not a totally broken character in any way. He doesn't insta-kill like skilled enemies. He doesn't teleport. He doesn't raise the dead. He can't even attack people effectively from beyond sword range, and he can't fly. A Large Dragon should be able to defeat him one on one no problem.
turalisj 02-29-08, 12:30 AM	Kenshin is effectivly an epic level warblade with some levels of fighter thrown in there for bonus feats.
RPJesus 02-29-08, 12:43 AM	He also deals nonlethal damage. I want to see Light Yagami and Ryuzaki statted up.
Jo_Pistachio 02-29-08, 12:47 AM	I want to see Light Yagami and Ryuzaki statted up. Both are high int, high knowledge experts. Nothing really beyond human in either innately. Yamagi just happens to have an artifact on him.
RPJesus 02-29-08, 01:00 AM	Yeah I figured. Ryuzaki prolly has high wisdom too. I'd imagine that light has high charisma.
calronmoonflower 02-29-08, 03:25 AM	Anime is eminently doable. D&D is arguably anime out and out. Kenshin is hard to stat out? I can't see that. He's not a totally broken character in any way. He doesn't insta-kill like skilled enemies. He doesn't teleport. He doesn't raise the dead. He can't even attack people effectively from beyond sword range, and he can't fly. A Large Dragon should be able to defeat him one on one no problem. Ok, lets try to see. 1. monk with kung-fu genies for the unarmored AC bonus. 2. human savant take iaijutsu focus as your permanent class skill. 3-20. warblade. Yep, seems easy to me.
Roxlimn 02-29-08, 06:28 AM	Kenshin is quite trivial, actually. Epic level?!?!? The guy should rightfully no more than level 14, possibly as low as level 10. Bear in mind that 15th level Clerics get access to 8th level spells, in addition to all their other advantages. In order for Kenshin to fairly be comparable to that, he ought to have similarly powerful abilities - and he doesn't. 14th level Warblade with a few customizations is probably the easiest way to do it - you'll still have a fair leeway of power excess to justify any potentially powerful customized special ability.
turalisj 02-29-08, 07:37 AM	So you don't think that the succession technique is comparable to strike of perfect clarity?
Roxlimn 02-29-08, 07:54 AM	To be quite frank, no. Amakakeru Ryu no Hirameki assures you of a pretty devastating hit against less skilled or similarly skilled opponents. SoPC needs to hit to be devastating, but even then it's not that good. It's actually a poor benchmark for a 9th level maneuver given what other 9th level maneuvers are capable of acheiving. I would actually compare it to Swooping Dragon Strike, but requiring a Sense Motive check instead of a Jump check - Hiten Mitsurugi is all about reading the opponent so it should be based on Sense Motive. The loss of Dex to AC mimicks the way that the technique renders you unable to avoid the attack - you pretty much have to stand there and take it, unless you have armor of some sort.
Mindolin 02-29-08, 09:41 AM	I think Amakakaru Ryu no Hirameki would need to be a new manuever, as I can't think of any that does what it does. It does an attack, perhaps with an additional few d6 damage, since it's a pretty strong technique. Seems fairly simple. Now here is where it gets complex, as if you miss, you make an additional attack, with the same bonus dice of damage, but the opponent is considered flat-footed for the second strike. Remember, Shishio Makoto was pulled into the strike and couldn't dodge the second hit. And, don't get me wrong, Kenshin is a good anime/manga, before we get any otaku in here talking about how powerful it is, whenever Kenshin used it on an opponent, they were already weakened. Still, he did use it on Hiko Seijuro and knocked him unconcious for a day.
Roxlimn 02-29-08, 10:14 AM	It would also have to have the qualification of having the sword sheathed, since it's an iaijutsu technique. Two attack rolls, take the better is fairly straigtforward as maneuvers go, and it could be no more than that. You could just freely say that both attacks have the defender flatfooted, since the first attack is supposedly so swift that you can't possibly avoid it unless you have prior knowledge of how it works. Flat-footed for both would cover that.
AaronDireBear 02-29-08, 03:13 PM	Kurui's pretty much nailed it - its not that anime fans can be bad dnd'ers (not that they should stop dnding, just that they should improve). Pretty much anyone can have inane expectations of what a person can do, at low or high levels. On the anime note though - there isn't really any 'fighting' anime showing at the moment that i am both interested in and following, so if i were to base a character of an anime show i'm watching at the moment, i'd probably wind up rolling a blue-haired monk, Lawful Good, with max ranks in Profession: Butler, or a female bard with no ranks in disguise, yet keeps trying to 'disguise' herself and teach people another language, as her alter ego. Or perhaps someone with blue hair, and max ranks in: Know(Anime) Know (Video games) Know (manga) Know (random stuff from the 80s) and pretty much no useful skills. Not that i would ever, ever make those characters. oh my. Konata???? I have a player who tries to do the same thing, doing stuff totally out of the rules, and I have to constantly remind him that it isnt BESM, especially not BESM d6. Of course one of my OTHER players has to keep adding an "unfortunately" to that mantra because he hates that dnd has "too many rules"...
twad 02-29-08, 03:25 PM	meh, anybody can be a bad player. Anybody can be a good player. Maybe the thing is that big fans of anime are used to epic stories.. where everything is high acrobatics, impact sparks, loudly screaming their next moves and powerfull metropolis-shattering attacks. (Exalted comes to mind here) Just explain them that all games are not about that, but can be fun anyway.. if one get creative. Heck, in one of my games, one of the most memorable moment is when my players managed to defeat a fleeing big bad boss by throwing a office desk at him, from the fourth story of the building they were in. No big power, just clever use of furniture. Tons of fun.
turalisj 03-01-08, 01:05 AM	meh, anybody can be a bad player. Anybody can be a good player. And anyone can be an average player. For the Hiten Mitsurugy Ryu abilities, perhaps we should just make a new set of martial paths based on anime fighting styles... >.>
Jo_Pistachio 03-01-08, 01:19 AM	meh, anybody can be a bad player. Anybody can be a good player. Maybe the thing is that big fans of anime are used to epic stories.. where everything is high acrobatics, impact sparks, loudly screaming their next moves and powerfull metropolis-shattering attacks. (Exalted comes to mind here) Just explain them that all games are not about that, but can be fun anyway.. if one get creative. Heck, in one of my games, one of the most memorable moment is when my players managed to defeat a fleeing big bad boss by throwing a office desk at him, from the fourth story of the building they were in. No big power, just clever use of furniture. Tons of fun. Actually, this is what I find can be problematic for some, even when they don't drag it into a normal game. I like anime, but I like to think I'm fairly objective about it. I noticed that most characters presented in those shows are actually doable pre epic, unless it's really dumb, like DBZ. Kenshin, Kenshiro, and Ken can all be made to a variable degree using pre-epic D&D rules. Yet a lot of anime fans seem to resent people that think this way. I think their too used to fights between equals, and forget that when they crush that other guys skull with their bare hands, that's what a level 10 melee is doing to level 1 warriors anyway, which most NPCs in a world actually are.
Jakonen 03-14-08, 04:55 PM	Better yet, let's stat up Guts from Berserk after he got that armor. not to disrupt your argument but i think this pretty much stats up Guts Guts Male Human Alignment Chaotic Good Fighter 12/Barbarian 7/Frenzied Berserker 5 Str 24 (+2 prodigy, +1 4th, 8th, 16th, 20th) +7 Dex 16 +3 Con 18 (+1 12th) +4 Int 14 +2 Wis 13 (-1 armor) +1 Cha 12 +1 Hit Points 233, Current 233 AC 23 (10+3 dex+9 armor+1 shield), Touch 13, Flat 20 Init +3 BAB +22/17/12/7, Grapple +29 Speed 30 (base 40, load 0/33, medium armor) Fort +22, Ref +10, Will +9 +34 Melee, Dragonslayer, 3d6+14, 17-20/x2 +21 Ranged, Arm Cannon, 6d6, 20/x2, 10’r Rage: +48 hp, AC 21, Will +11 +36 Melee, Dragonslayer, 3d6+17, 17-20/x2 Frenzy: 2 lethal damage per round, AC 22, Ref +12 +40/40/35/30/25 Melee, Dragonslayer, 3d6+23, 17-20/x2 Rage and Frenzy: +48 hp, 2 lethal damage per round, AC 20, Ref +12, Will +11 +42/42/37/32/27 Melee, Dragonslayer, 3d6+26, 17-20/x2 Special: -Prodigy (Strength): Guts gets +2 to strength and an additional +4 on all strength-based skill and ability checks. (DMG II) -Sacrificial Brand: Guts has been branded with the symbol of sacrifice. Evil outsiders and undead can sense his presence and general direction as long as they are within five hundred feet. Additionally, whenever an evil outsider or undead comes within a hundred feet of Guts for the first time that day, the brand gives off a sharp pain and bleeds profusely, causing him to lose one hit point for every four hit dice the creature possesses (rounding down). • The Dragonslayer, Mastercraft Large Greatsword. o The Dragonslayer is treated as a Holy Ghost Touch weapon for the purposes of bypassing DR and determining whether an attack hits. This is an extraordinary ability. o The Dragonslayer’s size provides a wielder of medium size with a +2 bonus to AC when they fight defensively and cover in the direction of their choice when they take a total defense action. • Berserker Armor, +1 Mithral Full Plate o while wearing the berserker armor, a wielder with the ability to enter a frenzy must make a will save to avoid doing so every round in which they engage in melee combat, even if they take no damage. In addition, they may not enter a rage unless already in a frenzy. o While the wielder is in a frenzy, the berserker armor is treated as a +2 Mithral Full Plate of Medium Fortification that cannot be removed by normal means. The wielder himself gains an additional +6 to strength and dexterity as a well as an immunity to fear, stun, nausea and death from massive damage. However, the damage they take every round is lethal instead of nonlethal, and the frenzy does not end normally as long as there are living or animate creatures within the vicinity. At the end of frenzy, the wielder takes 1 point of permanent wisdom damage. o If the wielder has the deathless frenzy ability and would die at the end of a frenzy due to hit point loss, they instead heal to -9 hp and stabilize while permanently reducing their maximum number of hit points by the same amount. again sorry for the interruption and Anime Fans can go ether way on this, really up to the individual.
Edymnion 03-14-08, 04:58 PM	I noticed that most characters presented in those shows are actually doable pre epic, unless it's really dumb, like DBZ.Actually, most of Dragonball and the Saijin Saga of DBZ are all pre-epic. I'd say Goku doesn't actually go Epic until he goes SSJ. He's just a gestalt Monk//Warlock. His Kamehameha is his Eldritch Blast, the flight is simply Fell Flight, the "afterimage technique" is just Flee the Scene, etc.
Mindolin 03-14-08, 05:50 PM	Here is where we must disagree, Edymnion. I think that DBZ goes Epic with Goku after training under King Kai. I would say that Vegeta is about level 20, with Gohan and Krillian, who would be about equal in power, are about level 12. Nappa might be level 17, and everyone else is below that, maybe have Piccollo be level 15. Sure, Piccollo could beat Nappa at that level, but he had already fought against the Saibamen, using up a portion of his power.
Bloodsoul 03-14-08, 10:40 PM	Suddenly I want to stat out Chi-Chi.. ¬¬ Atleast half of the D&D characters I've made are based on or almost based on some sort of anime-influenced thingy (wow, that didn't turn out as coherent as I had hoped). I've got a paladin based on a character I made in Adventure Quest, a sorcereress based on a character I made in Soulcalibur III, a spirit shaman and a blackguard I made in Dynasty Warriors 5: Empires (though the latter was also influenced by Persian myth), and.. uh.. a Rakshasa named Shere Khan? As of this writing, one of those characters is as powerful as his namesake, one's greatly surpassed her's, and the others are still young'uns, and that's cool. One of the aspects that's endeared me about D&D is the same I've found in some anime; watching young, weak characters grow up to be strong, noble heroes (or plotting ebil-doers becoming BBEGs). My spirit shaman may not be able to rush a base and kill a dozen troops in three seconds, but so what? She's out in the big, wide world having fun, and that's all that's important. ^_^
Mindolin 03-14-08, 11:15 PM	Couldn't have put it better myself, Bloodsoul. The main thing I like about making anime characters grow into their inspiration's power is just that, the story behind the improvements. Anyway, an anime game can be just the same as a normal game, albeit with a difference in HOW things are described. Anyway, for those who want a massive sword, just give them a greataxe and call it a sword. It works perfectly. Chi-Chi is probably a level 4 Fighter/level 2 Expert, or something like that. Not nearly as skilled as the Z Warriors, but still stronger than most humans. Bet she can take out Mr. Satan.
MarthWMaster 03-20-08, 03:57 PM	He also deals nonlethal damage. I want to see Light Yagami and Ryuzaki statted up.I made stats for Light for a d20 Modern game. He's just got a lot of skills and tricks that allow for deception. The notebook doesn't really need stats; as long as you're familiar with the bazillion-and-one rules attached to it.
Edymnion 03-20-08, 04:50 PM	Couldn't have put it better myself, Bloodsoul. The main thing I like about making anime characters grow into their inspiration's power is just that, the story behind the improvements. Anyway, an anime game can be just the same as a normal game, albeit with a difference in HOW things are described. Anyway, for those who want a massive sword, just give them a greataxe and call it a sword. It works perfectly. Chi-Chi is probably a level 4 Fighter/level 2 Expert, or something like that. Not nearly as skilled as the Z Warriors, but still stronger than most humans. Bet she can take out Mr. Satan.Possibly more than that. She's an excellent fighter, like you said, she just doesn't have chi powers. Basically, she's a straight Monk instead of a Gestalt Monk//Warlock, since she's not a PC. But she was roughly Goku's equal in martial arts skills by the end of Dragonball.
MarthWMaster 03-20-08, 05:30 PM	I'm surprised (in a good way) that the title of this thread bothered noone. One of the side-effects of not being able to use avatars of your own on this forum, I think, is that you don't get to see how many D&D players are also otaku. I would guess that that number is actually pretty high. So I'm glad that noone took it personally. :)
Jo_Pistachio 03-21-08, 12:58 AM	Actually, most of Dragonball and the Saijin Saga of DBZ are all pre-epic. I'd say Goku doesn't actually go Epic until he goes SSJ. He's just a gestalt Monk//Warlock. His Kamehameha is his Eldritch Blast, the flight is simply Fell Flight, the "afterimage technique" is just Flee the Scene, etc. Gestalt means > 20 class level abilities, which means close enough for epic as far as I'm concerned. :P High enough that I'm just calling it epic and calling it a day.
GuyrtheadamantineOne 03-21-08, 08:15 AM	I'm surprised (in a good way) that the title of this thread bothered noone. One of the side-effects of not being able to use avatars of your own on this forum, I think, is that you don't get to see how many D&D players are also otaku. I would guess that that number is actually pretty high. So I'm glad that noone took it personally. In fact, many thought the OP's title was a mistake, as his opinion was flawed. Everything he wrote could have been directed to anybody, such as: ''Construction Workers can be bad D&Ders.'' ''Humorists can be bad D&Ders.'' ''Squirrells can be bad D&Ders.'' He decided to aim his gun at Anime Fans instead. So we replied that he should stop DMing 7 years-old kids. Good times.:cool:
Foton-The-Lobotomist 03-21-08, 08:47 AM	I have had some issues with players in the past wanting to play nothing, but characters from their favorite Anime even when the story or setting didn't permit it. Has anyone else had this problem? Yes....its awful. He wants to shout every attack. Thinks he should know every attack because of his backstory..... turned a cleric into a martial artists instead of making a monk cuz he wanted to use fireballs.......ugh
Janzen 03-21-08, 10:37 AM	Not all Anime Fans want to recreate " Goku " in D&D form, For example I could play main characters from animes I seen like Keitaro/Love Hina, recent anime/manga - Tsukune/Rosario + Vampire ( even though later on he turned ghoul =/ ), and normal Tenchi/Tenchi Muyo. All those characters were memorable plus had little to no special abilities. Heck playing a Keitaro-like characters is basically playing a commoner with ****** luck and decent charisma soo people find him entertaining. I'm the definition of " Anime Fan " but I know whats possible and whats completely idiotic. Anyone can be a bad player and anyone can be a great player...putting a label on one group doesn't change that fact.
turalisj 03-21-08, 01:46 PM	Keitaro- Human Commoner1/Expert2/Monk1 (he did get some martial arts training from Seta as I recall....) Has the endurance and die hard feats to represent being thrown through a wall without dying.
Janzen 03-21-08, 02:00 PM	Keitaro- Human Commoner1/Expert2/Monk1 (he did get some martial arts training from Seta as I recall....) Has the endurance and die hard feats to represent being thrown through a wall without dying. Wow I'm impressed =D Its amazing how many times he was sent into the air by Naru & Motoko.
turalisj 03-21-08, 02:27 PM	For stats, 10 str, 8 dex, 18 con (how many times can he take a punch before showing any actual damage?), 14 int, 8 wis, 12 cha. Clumsy, not exactly the best decision maker, but has SOME intelligence, and average strength.
Nephlite 03-21-08, 02:37 PM	Couldn't have put it better myself, Bloodsoul. The main thing I like about making anime characters grow into their inspiration's power is just that, the story behind the improvements. Anyway, an anime game can be just the same as a normal game, albeit with a difference in HOW things are described. Anyway, for those who want a massive sword, just give them a greataxe and call it a sword. It works perfectly. Chi-Chi is probably a level 4 Fighter/level 2 Expert, or something like that. Not nearly as skilled as the Z Warriors, but still stronger than most humans. Bet she can take out Mr. Satan. Her dad is 8 feet tall. She is not a human. Unless she has 1/2 giant bloodine. She could be a 1/2 giant (from XPH) they are meduim. It fits somewhat. That gives more Strength and stuff (she was a match in strength to kid Goku). So she has enormous strength.
themocaw 03-21-08, 02:46 PM	Her dad is 8 feet tall. She is not a human. Unless she has 1/2 giant bloodine. She could be a 1/2 giant (from XPH) they are meduim. It fits somewhat. That gives more Strength and stuff (she was a match in strength to kid Goku). So she has enormous strength. She was most of a match to adult pre-Z Goku too: she made it to the quarter finals in that one Tenkaichi Budokai where they tried to stuff Piccolo into the rice cooker. Seriously, Chichi only seems weak because she's top-notch human strength, and because she later retired to become an insanely shrewish harridan of a wife and mother.
Naderion 03-21-08, 03:08 PM	I like some animes and I love D&D. But I don't want any anime in my D&D! :D There's nothing wrong with making a D&D character inspired by a character concept from an anime, but I don't want my game to assume an anime feeling. Anime is always over-emphasizing emotions and movements so to make them visible with just some few animated lines. That works well on the screen, but completely kills a pnp session if you try to emulate it.
Roxlimn 03-21-08, 07:06 PM	How exactly can you emphasize emotion and movement enough in a PnP session to kill it?
turalisj 03-21-08, 07:12 PM	Because it enforces roleplaying as opposed to rollplaying, and most people don't like that.
themocaw 03-21-08, 08:08 PM	How exactly can you emphasize emotion and movement enough in a PnP session to kill it? When a player talks about speedlines, sweatdrops, face faults, and panty flashes during an actual game that's not particularly anime, well. . . >_>
Bloodsoul 03-21-08, 11:50 PM	She was most of a match to adult pre-Z Goku too: she made it to the quarter finals in that one Tenkaichi Budokai where they tried to stuff Piccolo into the rice cooker. Seriously, Chichi only seems weak because she's top-notch human strength, and because she later retired to become an insanely shrewish harridan of a wife and mother. And in that vein, she also gets one doozy of a Fear DC.
Pudge_is_cute 03-22-08, 07:26 AM	My loli-sized high-elf wizard is based on Marisa Kirisame of Touhou(wiki it). Yeah, I renamed her differently(Ea Solostolares), she act differently in a lot of situations from being lazy, sarcastic yet responsible and good-hearted plus she is like the central character of the campaign somehow(being leader, plus getting lot of attention). But still she has several quirks from the character she is based on like being a complete sore-loser in bets, contests and in social interactions(always a single digit shows up in said situation), using a broom to fly and casting a lot of magic missiles(like having a magic-missile on every spell slot, silenced, maximized, quickened, etc etc). I think a little inspiration or two is not bad but a complete rip-off however is quite not really that good. As long as the said player is not being disruptive or too corny or out of place to the game, there will be no reason for the D,M to boot him/her out.
RPJesus 03-22-08, 02:39 PM	My loli-sized high-elf wizard is based on Marisa Kirisame of Touhou I have a friend who would love you :D. (Prefer Sakuya myself)
Pudge_is_cute 03-22-08, 08:05 PM	I really planned her to be "Patchouli like", buying stat to increase my int in replacement of strenght and con(6 str, 8 con) plus wearing nightgown, but then I remembered how I saw our Sorcerer is grappled to submission by ogre's and even commented on "his beauty"(22 cha). Of course this gave me terrifying images of things I dont want to happen. Plus the fact that Patchouli does not adventure(because of poor health) much has given me enough reason to abandon the idea and decide to go for Marissa instead. :) The part I am just irritatted is when one of taverns in Cormyr serves Ramen for dinner in one of our session.
RPJesus 03-22-08, 08:21 PM	**** Patchouli. Sorry, random in-joke. I don't really have any animosity, but I've decided that I hate her for no adequate reason:D.
Pudge_is_cute 03-22-08, 09:02 PM	**** Patchouli. Sorry, random in-joke. I don't really have any animosity, but I've decided that I hate her for no adequate reason:D. ;_; You cannot hate her.. http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/3791/1206159530987gi0.jpg Plus she has several possible appeals: - Bookworm, Librarian - Serious, Quiet - Too frail-bodied thus protectable - Casual nightgown look - The quiet intellectual type Plus girls unable to run away are the best! Mwahahahaha!! :D Marisa however is more likeable though... :)
RPJesus 03-22-08, 10:29 PM	Well like I said I really have nothing against her, I just find it amusing to say "**** Patchouli" and arbitrarily dislike her (although it's actually not possible to hate some one who has this (http://youtube.com/watch?v=f0tChLB4sD8&feature=related) working in their favor). In case you couldn't tell, I'm a bit weird :D
Jo_Pistachio 03-22-08, 10:35 PM	Sounds like my Kobato build for an anime campaign. Full of bad ideas.